All teachers fired!!!

Discussion in 'The Watercooler' started by klmno, Feb 23, 2010.

  1. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Have you heard about this school that fired all 88 of it's teachers? They said they did it because the students are failing and the teachers aren't willing to do anything more. The teachers of course have their side- like already working long hours in an under-priviledged school zone and getting paid lower salaries and saying that over the past couple of years, average grades have improved.

    I hate that this happened but think this radical move might shake some people up- although I don't really think leaaving all these teachers unemployed is the answer. It's the higher ups and those in control that need to be shaken up. Hopefully, this will lead to that.
  2. ML

    ML Guest

    Oh boy. They sure do expect a lot out of our teachers. We pay them next to nothing, place increasing demands upon them to do more with less and then fire them when the outcomes are poor? I will NOT be encouraging anyone I know to go into the teaching profession, that's for sure.
  3. flutterby

    flutterby Fly away!

    Of course it's all the teachers' fault and has nothing to do with lack of resources.

    Seriously? All 88 teachers are bad? Wow. If that's the case, they really need to be looking at who's doing the hiring and maybe fire that person.


    I see a lawsuit coming.
  4. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    This approach has always confused me. There are always middle management people who give bad reviews to employees that they don't like. Doesn't that indicate that they don't manage their employees well? That they don't do well in crisis? That they don't adapt their departments to take everyone's strengths and weaknesses into consideration?
  5. Lothlorien

    Lothlorien Active Member Staff Member

    There are some really great teachers in Missy's school. The teacher she has now is absolutely wonderful. The teacher that Mighty Mouse has is fantastic too. However, there are some really bad teachers in our school, too. Unfortunately, the teachers' union in NJ is All Mighty Powerful. I, personally, would like to see the union disbanded and start over from scratch. They won't hire new teachers for more than two years, because once they've been on for three, they are "in for life." I've seen some really wonderful teachers fall through the cracks, because of this policy, but the rotten teachers are kept on, because they are tenured. Then the superintendents make a super salary, while our kids' teachers ask the parents to sent paper towels, tissues, wipes, etc, because the school doesn't have the money in the budget.

    I don't know what the deal is with this particular school or this particular state or union, but I know it's seriously broken in my state.
  6. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful

    You know what? No matter how utterly poor husband and I have been, we've always supported the school levi's. (well, except for the 2nd one to build news schools after the board spent the 1st one's money on something totally insane) Teachers are under paid and over worked and mostly unappreciated. I'll support a levi every time that gives them a better salary or gives the kids better supplies ect.

    That said........somehow they have got to find a way to keep the good dedicated teachers in place while weeding out the bulk of bad ones. As bad as our schools here are, we have some excellent teachers.......if we don't lose them to more competitive salaries elsewhere. But the bad ones.........OMG are they horrible........and honestly.......they are most likely why the state is threatening to take over our school system.

    Unions can be such a good thing. But when they get to powerful they stop being a good thing and become a handicapp. While the union helps with salary and also plays a huge role in keeping bad teachers in place.

    I just can't stand people who whine about the schools........yet flat out refuse to vote for a levi because it will make their taxes go up. sheesh

    88 teachers in one school?? A bit of overkill and not impressive. So? Who hired those 88 teachers and why isn't their head on the chopping block??
  7. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    I remember sending tissues and such with M to school to be part of the "collective" that they were going to share. They still never had anything to wipe your nose on!
  8. flutterby

    flutterby Fly away!

    easy child got extra credit points last year for bring in boxes of tissues. Helped him pass. LOL
  9. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    I could say a lot that Loth said. It was on difficult child's supply list to bring soap, tissues, and paper towels for every year in elementary school. But I wouldn't give you a dime for the principal and most the teachers in that school. That's why I'm advising someone else here to stand up now while she has a good shot.

    Anyway, I don't know as much about the school district politics as I wish I did but I heard that "bad" teachers sstarted getting in the system after the No Child Left Behind went into effect. I don't know if that's just a political spin- I do believe that our kids needed more attention in getting thru school because too many were (and still are) slipping thru the cracks. But like many wonderful ideas and policies and laws, by the time they get delegated to the lower person on the totem pole and the way they play out in reality doesn't always make things better. difficult child has had a few really great teachers, a few that I thought were ok, and some that I didn't think should ever be teaching any student. What I'd heard from someon in the school district is that because of the policies that went into effect as a result of localities getting funding for No Child Left Behind, they aren't allowed to fire teachers so easily or pay incentives the same as they used to in order to keep the really good ones, who really go above and beyond. Apparently it has to do with the standard of learneings test instead of merit based that determines a teachers retention and raise- and we parents know that those tests alone aren't necessarily indicative of our child's ability or knowledge, much less how well a teacher did. So the good ones leave many times and the bad ones stay. And with a teacher shortage, localities will hire almost anyone and usually they're right out of school with no experience.

    With this particular story, they said on tv that it's a community problem (then why fire every teacher as a solution??), but that somehow teachers might be able to get their job back if they did something- but I didn't catch that part.

    Anyway- these 88 teachers were supposedly every single teacher in the school. I wonder what they plan on doing the rest of the week to teach the kids in class. LOL! And yeah- poor management of money...ohh don't get me started!!

    I am in the minority about one thing though- the teachers I've known have been paid a reasonable amount given their work hours and paid time off and benefits. I'm sorry, but many college educated people don't get that much and when you look at what they get if they are there for ten years, plus the job security...well, I just don't pity that part so much. We all aren't going to get paid as much as a dr. What bothers me about it is the scale they have set in concrete- so the teachers who deserve to make more than those who barely do the minimum and really don't care or get it, have to get paid the same. I believe in equality, but I believe that a person's efforts and expertise should be rewarded, too.
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2010
  10. AnnieO

    AnnieO Shooting from the Hip

    Thinking here that something is very, very wrong with that school district.

    This morning on the way to work I was thinking about 2 teachers I had in middle school. These were 20+ years ago but I remember them very clearly. They shaped a lot of who I am now.

    I wish I could say thank you. I might have to contact the school and see what I can do.

    Teachers are, for the most part, underpaid and must buy a lot of supplies themselves. And then... We end up sending in plastic bags, paper towels, dry-erase markers... I KNOW the kids don't use Sharpies in 3rd grade!

    So this being the case... The teachers may have been undertrained to handle issues. Again this comes back to the person (people) who did the hiring.
  11. hearts and roses

    hearts and roses Mind Reader

    Wow, I wonder how they think firing all 88 teachers is going to improve their district.

    I've never liked tenure for the sheer fact that it's difficult to get rid of a dud teacher. on the other hand, our district has lost some really great teachers for various reasons, including poor administration, low wages, and non-compliant or uncooperative parents.

    Based on my experience in our district, I think it's the parents that really need to be stepping up to the plate here, not only by voting for well deserved raises, but also in disciplining their children at home so our teachers don't have to waste valuable class time! Also, the administrations are often stuck in a difficult situation dealing with bum teachers who are just hanging in their till retirement, making it difficult to lure better teachers to the district - at least this has been the case in our district. In recent years (too late to benefit my kids of course!), our district has brought in younger, local administrators and teachers - I am hoping that whenever I vote yes on the annual school budget (even though my kids are out), it's a good investment in our town. I do wonder sometimes.

    I think a lawsuit will be forthcoming as well!
  12. LittleDudesMom

    LittleDudesMom Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I share some of the same ideas at Witz on this one.

    Additionally, No Child Left Behind has nothing to do with bad teachers getting hired or being retained. In every profession there are those who are "less qualified", "not as good", and are "in wrong position". It's just the same with teachers - some are really not qualified, some are better or worse than others, while still others made a mistake in their choice of career!

    One of the reasons we have managers and supervisors in private industry is to oversee the "worker bees". We pay one of our employees more, not because he does a better job than anyone else, but because we pay him to be our eyes and ears in the field. The same applies to the teaching profession. School administrators are the field supervisors. Administrators have a lot of power when it comes to the hiring and firing of teahers - don't let anyone fool you into thinking they don't. A strong PTA also has power. The School Board has power. The superidenant has power. I've seen a principal reassigned to a "downtown administrative position" because of a strong group of parents who took their concerns to the board. I have also seen teachers let go by a principal because the "best interests of the kids" was not being maintained by keeping her on.

    There are always going to be bad teachers just like their are bad accountants, plumbers and artists. It's a fact of life.

    What makes the difference are tuned in and involved parents and a strong school administration.

    I would like to know what town those 88 teachers that were fired worked in and what happened to the administrators at the school. It is beyond comprehension that all 88 teachers were bad. It's statistically unbelievable.

  13. DaisyFace

    DaisyFace Love me...Love me not


    When I read the title I admit that I was hoping it was the staff that Shari has been dealing with for poor Wee...

    Other than that, I'd suspect the firing was a kind of a stunt. Whether designed to attract media attention (possibly to argue for more funding) or affect contract negotiations--it's hard to say.
  14. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I agree with both Sharon and Daisyface.

    I am going to have to go search for this one.
  15. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    RI school district. Very small district. Only one square mile. Very poor.

    Federal govt gave them 4 bad choices because of the performance of the school. I dont think they made the right choice though.
  16. AnnieO

    AnnieO Shooting from the Hip

    How does a district THAT SMALL need THAT MANY TEACHERS to begin with? How many people can you jam into one square mile?

    OK I didn't read the article - can't get to it right now - BUT.

    And I know how this works - we don't HAVE a superintendent right now. Ugh!
  17. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Well, that is just the high school I think. And I can see that many teachers.

    "At one square mile, Central Falls is the state's smallest and one of its poorest communities.

    It has also ranked in the lowest 5 percent of districts in the state year after year meaning the federal government gave Superintendent Frances Gallo 4 choices:
    - Shut the school
    - have it taken over as a charter school
    - follow a transformation model,
    including longer school days and teachers eating lunch with students
    - or what's called a turn around plan, fire all the teachers at the end of the year.

    After the union didn't sign off on option three, she went with option four.

    "I thought I moved substantially away from my initial design and request and apparently it wasn't good enough," Superintendent Dr. Frances Gallo said.

    "We don't take lightly that our scores are low. Everyone acknowledges that we have work to do,"Central Falls Teachers' Union President Jane Sessums said.

    But despite recent improvement, those numbers are alarming - only 7 percent of high school kids are proficient in math standards and 52 percent drop out before graduation."
  18. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    WOW...that is a huge drop out rate. I thought we had a huge drop out rate and just went to search for it online and our rate is only about 9 to 10 percent and we have the highest rate in the state.
  19. Star*

    Star* call 911

    Anymore when someone mentions being a teacher? The first thoughts that go through my mind aren't about how wonderful, caring educators are appreciated.

    The thoughts the cross my mind are: Dangerous daily job. Lack of parental involvement to the point of utter exhaustion. Unable to discipline in your own classroom. Disrespect and no back up. Getting worse year after year. Complete shame in pay scale.

    Regarding the above firing of 88 teachers? It seems to me that consolidation is in the air. They shut down several schools here in Northern SC and consolidated many districts to form GLEAMS. They supposedly get more grant monies, and have better learning scores (although SC is still in the bottom 5) I'm thinking this district is considering consolidating. They will rent/sell the current grade schools out, profit from that, less pay for 88 teachers and save money.

    As far as paying for supplies that are unnecessary? I wrote notes stating when the lesson that needed those supplies was being taught? Send me an outline and I would provide the necessary tools required. I never got an outline or a request for supplies not really needed.
  20. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Schools are still getting built. I can attest to that.

    That is what Tony has spent the better part of the last several years building...schools, hospitals and drug stores. He just did a large school in Charleston. Couple of years ago they did a school in Horry County.