Am I just naive or what? (Sorta political but not really)

Discussion in 'The Watercooler' started by muttmeister, Apr 2, 2010.

  1. muttmeister

    muttmeister Well-Known Member

    As some of you know,my life has been a real zoo lately. I sat down a couple of days ago to read email and in with everything else was one from a semi-friend. It was political; showed a current political figure supposedly doing something awful; text made it seem even worse. This was about the third thing of this kind I'd gotten lately and it really hit me wrong. I immediately went to Snopes to check it out and found that it was not true. So I hit reply all and sent the snopes address.

    I honestly thought that the people there would be glad to know it was not true. I don't care which side you are on, if you are anti-anybody, you can surely find enough true things to tell about them with out passing on lies. It seems to me that passing on that kind of stuff just makes you look foolish and damages your argument.

    Well, you'd think I suggested bombing the capitol or something. People were really offended and act like I attacked them personally. Granted, I should have just deleted it and forgot about it but my patience is pretty much gone right now given everything else that is going on in my life.

    Has something happened at Snopes to change its status? I always believed they were non political and non partisan. I know I've seen things there in defense of people on both the conservative and the liberal sides and I've seen things there detrimental to people on both the conservative and liberal sides. I've seen Snopes quoted in places like the New York Times and Time magazine and I'm also pretty sure I've heard people like Rush Limbaugh and Glen Beck use it as a source too.

    Have we reached the point that people believe it is OK to just make up anything or send on anything, even if it is not true, as long as it is detrimental to the other side?

    I have purposely not identified what I was sent, who it was about, or which "side" I am on. Let's keep it that way, as I hear a lot of vitriol on both sides. I'm more interested in your take on what's happening to us as a nation. If this is going to be accepted by one or both sides, I think the days of our government working are fast coming to an end.:(
  2. DaisyFace

    DaisyFace Love me...Love me not


    I agree with you. There has been a lot of un-necessary venom lately.

    Whatever happened to just wanting what was best for us as a nation? as a people? or heck, for our neighborhood?
  3. AnnieO

    AnnieO Shooting from the Hip

    I had the same thing happen to me a while back. At work no less! Someone sent everyone - EVERYONE - one of those things and I checked it out. Let the guy who sent it know what I found. I got written up for insubordination. I no longer bother at work...
  4. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    husband and I click delete when we see emails from the so called politicos. Sad to say, but true, being bombarded with that type of email has caused major gaps in family and friends who "used to be" favored correspondents.
    It's so sad, in my humble opinion. DDD
  5. trinityroyal

    trinityroyal Well-Known Member

    There are some people who have so much of themselves personally invested in their political views that they become completely unreasonable when challenged. It seems that a factual, logical challenge is even worse for people in this camp because they can't mount an effective argument against it. Because you debunked their story with facts, it put them in the position of having to admit either that their side was wrong, or that the other side has merit. I find that people are increasingly unwilling to give the opposite side any credit, regardless of what the opposite side is.

    I have found myself just not discussing politics at all with broad swaths of people. I have fairly firm and settled views about things, but I'm not willing to put friendship at risk over them so I'd rather just keep it to myself.

    DDD, I agree with you. It is very sad.


  6. skeeter

    skeeter New Member

    I've decided to focus more on local issues than federal. We do a lot of volunteering in the community, and know a lot of local politicians. We have our "pet" issues, and these politicians know that and have asked us to speak on these at committee and town meetings. Politicians of both major parties, by the way (and our third, local party).

    Federal politics (no matter what party) has left me feeling it's all the same.

    What really sickens me is the "no matter what" or one issue type of thinking. The world is not black and white, but many shades of gray. No matter how strongly you feel about an issue, there are often many, many sides to it. Issues I believed in strongly when I was younger I now see in a different light. I can say I may not think the way you do, but I can see how you might come to that conclusion, and I don't think either us is right OR wrong.

    I ignore emails from several people. It got so bad with one that when she sent me something that wasn't political I missed it. When she questioned me on it, I told her I never open her emails, so if it really is something I need to respond to, put it in the subject line.
  7. donna723

    donna723 Well-Known Member

    I pretty much delete all those emails too now. And there's a lot of them!

    My family has been advocates of one political party for generations, and I used to be too. Then I became more of an 'independent', and now I don't often agree with my relatives political views ... but they are out of state and don't really know that. And I haven't told them either because I'm not all that in to politics and I see no need to get in to it with them. But I've been really appalled at some of the emails passed along by my otherwise knowledgeable, intelligent family members - the kind that spread all the rumors, all the misrepresentations mixed with outright lies. It just seems like we are becoming so polarized lately - so much hate out there and so many people so eager to pass it around! I just hit "Delete" and forget it.
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2010
  8. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    I don't know about Snopes (I've only heard about it), but I agree whole-heartedly with your thinking regarding trashing political figures in this manner. I have no problem with people having their own opinions and advocating for their preference, which is healthy in my humble opinion and our form of government, but I agree that it crosses lines and makes us all look bad to stoop to levels of lies and stupid altered photos and such.
  9. muttmeister

    muttmeister Well-Known Member

    That is exactly what I'm talking about. I may not agree with your OPINION but I will defend to the death your right to have it and talk about it out loud; but I really resent your sending me LIES DISGUISED AS FACTS. We studied fact and opinion whan I taught school from first grade on. I guess these people missed that.
  10. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Yep- I think that's when it reaches the line of slander and harassment.
  11. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    I am wholeheartedly disgusted with politics on many levels. On the federal and state level there are so many scandals, and many of them seem to be stuff that, to me, relate mostly to issues between husband and wife. I get the arguments about lying and cheating on a broader level, but I do NOT want to hear the details, much less have my 10yo hear them from the mouths of his friends at school. When did this kind of issue become appropriate to discuss around elementary school kids?

    I HATE the 'spin' that most, if not all issues get from both parties. It seems impossible to know what the TRUTH is. I hate the kind of email you got, and hate the response your email got even more. Snopes IS non-partisan. Many people seem to think being wrong is a major insult, instead of what happens to every one of us at least once on most days.

    I am sorry you were attacked for sharing the truth.

    To err is human, to forgive, divine.

    So many people forget the first part.
  12. mstang67chic

    mstang67chic Going Green

    I don't get into politics much and I probably should pay more attention but that's just me. I remember though, seeing reports on the news of, I believe, some of the first "tea parties" or something similar and it left me gaping at the tv. People weren't protesting, they were screaming! Some of them were so worked up they appeared to be spitting, some I honestly thought would pop a vein in their head it was so bad. What gets me about this type of thing is that a lot of time these people may have very genuine concerns but their actions and attitudes make them appear as far left/right and people right them off. Or....they are basing their opinions on what others tell them and don't bother looking for themselves.

    I recently read a non-partisan article about some of the current issues. The author was talking about how people were riled up about a particular area of this topic and rightly so had their information been correct. But....their information was received from politicians who had twisted the wording and/or left out vital parts of an explanation of the wording so that it seemed to be one thing when that wasn't at all the truth. That's probably why I don't pay attention to politics anymore. There's always been "creative" explanations in politics but lately it has really seemed to just disentigrate into classless, back stabbing, name calling irresponsible behavior all around.
  13. busywend

    busywend Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I personally am concerned about the media representation of both parties. I guess it has been so all along, but when I hear that a particular station (all of the big ones) has a political bias, that just seems wrong to me. Isn't it a reporters duty to report all the facts and let the listener come to their own feelings on it? If they report only a portion of the facts or part of a story....we are left with a false conclusion.
    Any email I get I take with a grain of salt. Snopes or not. But, I always thought if I saw it on the news....I could believe it. But, if it is slanted one way, it is not the true story.

    I don't know, it certainly is concerning. One silver lining I see is there are a whole bunch more people learning about our government than ever before. That is a good thing in my opinion.
  14. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    What is really getting to me- and this my be a point that others were getting to- is that in our state government at least, there is a LOT of incompetency, waste, and total lack of commen sense- and in our local jurisdiction as well. But the stooping to the lowest levels to degrade these people invalidates so much that the general public writes it all off and that results in the truly disgusting issues and management being overlooked by the public, so they just keep on going. It's been with certain people of both parties from what I can tell.
  15. DazedandConfused

    DazedandConfused Active Member

    Well, I have strong opinions on such, so I will keep this tame as possible. I certainly don't want to cause anyone grief because I tend to be a centrist and a pragmatist when it comes to politcal issues

    It saddens me to see the polarization of the citizens of this country. Plus, everyone needs to be careful about judging the government, and society in general, based on what they see and hear on the news. It's news because it's USUAL. That's what makes it news;). One doesn't hear about the positive and good stuff because it doesn't sell and it doesn't get ratings; scandels and sexual dalliances sell. This lends to a very skewed view of people, society, and government. I know government agencies, and people that work for them, that bust their rears trying to do more with less and all the while people make hurtful comments about how lazy, wasteful, and incompetent they are.

    Another thing is that one of the concepts this country was founded on was the ability to compromise (James Madison kepted a detailed account of the writing of the Constitution and let me tell you the US wouldn't exist if nobody was willing to bend) and it seems that too many people want their way or no way at all.

    As far as unsolicited political emails; people don't send those to me because I'm politely blunt and if it misrepresents an issue or person, I have no problem countering them. A cousin of mine wrote this LONG FB status diatrible when a well-known political figure passed away. It was shockingly hateful and inappropriate for FB in my opinion. So, I commented back, not necessarily disagreeing, but nonetheless, my comment was deleted and it started a little family "incident" ;). I think this extended family member that wrote this lives in such an insulated world that it was shocking to him that someone would dare disagree. The irony is that this person is ex-military and served to protect MY freedom of speech yet he was the one couldn't handle someone questioning him and exercising theirs. I find it rather fascinating.

    So, no, you are not naive. You did someone *I* would have done and I would have told them that I find it to be my DUTY as an American citizen to set the record straight:tongue:. Otherwise, they have the freedom to remove me from their email forward list.

    by the way: Snopes is a GREAT site for this sort of thing. Also, Witzend posted about on here and now it is one of my favorite sites.
  16. DazedandConfused

    DazedandConfused Active Member

    Oh my, that's a lawsuit if I ever saw one. What a jerk!
  17. KTMom91

    KTMom91 Well-Known Member

    I am also amazed at the irrational anger people are demonstrating these days re: political issues. Miss KT and I went to our local Tea Party so she could take pictures for her photo class - the assignment was to attend a large gathering, and that seemed like it would have a lot of interesting photo-ops. many angry people, so much screaming, so much mis-information that I was stunned. I'm not overly political, except for firmly believing that if you don't vote, you can't complain, and I normally have no trouble speaking my mind, but that was a mob mentality, and it was pretty scary.

    Trouble is, it's the screamers that get the press, and so many people take the screaming as gospel.
  18. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    It's so bad that I very nearly didn't respond to the post. I'm all for informed decisions and righteous anger. Anger built upon lies is wrong. Sadly, the liars are very good through practice at shouting the truth down. I used to do the snopes thing. Then I started doing the snopes + "I wouldn't tell you this if I didn't care but don't ever send me that garbage again." Then I started telling people that my e-mail had changed and blocking their e-mail. I'm more comfortable doing it now than I have been for a while. KT, I hope you were able to use this conversation opportunity with difficult child?
  19. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    Ironically, Mutt, that exact scenario is whe caused me to change my vote in the last election. I could not believe a man running for public office had penned suc comments, so I proceeded to check out, first thru Snopes, then by reading the actual articles the candidate had supposedly written these flagrant statements in...

    And I changed my vote.

    Whatever happened to respect for elected officials, too? I thought, once the vote was over and counted and the majority won, our job became to support the people elected by the masses...not continue to wage a pissing war because "your guy" didn't win...
  20. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    Yay, Shari! You made me smile today!