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Am I Over-Reacting?
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<blockquote data-quote="Marguerite" data-source="post: 231750" data-attributes="member: 1991"><p>Daisy, are you over-reacting? Yes, and no. OK, my views could be due to cultural differences here.</p><p></p><p>First, I do believe you are right to be concerned. I also agree, the deception is the biggest problem here. And yes, you do have a right to know where your child is, and who with, at all times.</p><p></p><p>BUT - you need to temper this with the knowledge that she IS getting older, typical teen stuff is going to get in the way and if you try to over-control her world then she will do just what she is doing now (ie what she wants, and lie about it). That is a VERY bad pattern to allow.</p><p></p><p>So what I suggest - let her know that you are aware she is being deceitful, and THAT is the crime here. You want her safe and therefore you MUST at least know who she is with. In the same way, YOU need to keep HER informed of where YOU will be and when you will be back. This is a common courtesy rule which applies in our home to all household members, regardless of age. husband will always ring me if he's held up on the way home from work (trains running late; bad weather; need to stop and get fuel). Siimilarly, if I go out shopping instead of staying home all day, I let husband know even though, with him at work, it's no skin off his noe. But he might want me to get something that he hasn't yet put on the shopping list, for example. Or there could be some other reason for him knowing. It also means that if something goes wrong then he is able to come to the rescue more accurately.</p><p></p><p>So rather than getting loudly angry with your daughter, I wouldsit down and work on a solution. I see your son's point of view - getting to school late is annoying, it can get you into trouble, I've sat in a school office and listened to a teacher interrogating students going to the office for a late pass, and can really understand what would make kids tell fantastic lies in order to prevent being in that situation. I'm an adult, and I wanted to stand up and lie to this woman! (Ironically, I was waiting for a meeting with the acting principal, who had beenso adamant about the meeting beginning at 9 am that I had been forced to pay money I could ill-afford to put difficult child 3 into before school care, in order to make the meeting - and the deputy was running late, so late I needn't have paid for the child care after all. I was sorely tempted to interrogate the acting principal using the same techniques).</p><p></p><p>Anyway, I think you need to sort out what is happening, above all else. Get to know the person driving your daughter, let them know your ground rules ("we tell each other where we will be, with whom and when we will be home") and make it clear that while you are grateful for their help especially while the bus route is such a mess, you DO need to be informed and they may not have realised this.</p><p></p><p>I don't think you need to ground her. She will be mortified enough at being caught, and the inevitable loss of trust is its own punishment. She needs to know this - next time she says she's gonig somewhere, it will take much more convincing than usual, for you to believe her.</p><p></p><p>At 13, she beleives she can now make her own adult decisions. It goeswith being a 13 year old girl. And frankly, taking out your parental concerns, I think it wascreative of her, to find someone she felt safe with to give her a lift to school instead of the risk of being late. To make her decision on the basis of another girl she knows also being in the car - that was good decision, FOR A 13 YEAR OLD GIRL. From a parental point of view, not good enough. She needs to know that her choices are not a safety guarantee - the other girl could have been foolish and accepted a lift from either a stranger, or a predator she happens to know as a friend. Being together is no guarantee of protection - to help her get THIS message, sit with her and Google "Ivan Milat", the "backpacker murderer". Young adults, either singly or with friend or partner, were vanishing while on holiday. Milat was not necessarily just a stranger who picked up hitchhikers, he often made friends with them first so they didn't feel they were accepting a lift from a stranger. And they undoubtedly felt, "My friend is with me, I am safe."</p><p></p><p>The only reason Milat got caught, is someone got away. And even then, the information nearly got lost and more people died before that knowledge came to light.</p><p></p><p>The reason the guy killed so many people - nobody knew where these people were, not exactly. They weren't expected at a certain time or even on a certain date. As a result, hours, days and weeks were able to pass during which the crime could be committed, the killer cover his tracks and tidy up.</p><p></p><p>It's an ADULT thing as well as good common sense, to let people know your whereabouts. mother in law sometimes catches our village shopping bus. There are two shopping bus days a week. One day before Christmas, she met up with me while I was out and about so she could return later. What I didn't know, was she had failed to let the bus driver (or any other passengers) know that she was doing this. As a result the shopping bus return was held up, while the shopping centre was searched to see if somewhere was a little old lady fallen, or carted off to hospital.</p><p></p><p>mother in law getting a lift home with me was no skin off the bus driver's nose, he just needed to know for commonsense and safety reasons. She's an adult, all she had to do was tell someone so they wouldn't worry and could continue on.</p><p></p><p>In the same way, we tell one another our movements.</p><p></p><p>So if your daughter wants Occupational Therapist (OT) get a lift instead of catch the bus, then what she SHOULD do is let you know, and make sure you have the contact information of these people. If your house rules also require that you have already met these people, then so be it. They shouldalso have your phone number, in the event of a problem - a nosebleed, perhaps, that has them take her to the emergency room.</p><p></p><p>We live in a small village, I could be driving home and see someone struggling with a heavy bag in the rain (assuming it ever rains!) and give them a lift. Yes, I sometimes give a lift to a school student I happen to know, even if their family doesn't know, as long as the alternative is they would be walking home. I used to meet my kids at the boat when the got back to the village, and was often asked by my kids, "Can you give so-and-so a lift?" In this case with no schoolbus, I had no problem. And like cadydid, I would make sure the child was home and te parents knew this and knew it was me, in case there was a problem. </p><p>Here is where there are cultural differences. Often the favour would get returned and my kids would get a lift home, but not if they knew I was expecting to meet the boat. They generally would use their mobile phones to let me know what boat they were on, and if they needed a lift. My kids never got a lift from anyone I didn't know. However, I did give a lift a couple of times to the son of my stalker, but only when I knew he would otherwise be walking. He's a nice kid, my argument was not with him but with his father. That time I did not stick around to talk to them! I just dropped him off at his gate and watched until he was inside. He was 17 at the time and a latchkey kid, so generally his parents weren't home anyway.</p><p></p><p>However, I never offer a lift to a child I don't know well and whose parents don't know me.</p><p></p><p>Not everybody lives by these rules or even understands tem. if you make yourself known to your daughter's friend's parent, then you will be undoubtedly setting aside any misunderstandings on your parenting rules. </p><p></p><p>difficult child 3 often likes to visit friends in the neighbourhood. He always tells me where he's going. If he goes to visit Friend A and they're not home or just going out, he usually tries Friend B next. But he always lets me know, because he knows the rules. If I've gone shopping and he's finished his schoolwork before I get back, he either rings me to let me know or he leaves a note.</p><p></p><p>So in summary - I think your rules are good and she needs to stick to them, or at leats discuss changes with you before she just goes and does her own thing. BUT - you may need to relax a little and certainly not get angry at the lifts to school. But yes, the lies need to be dealt with. She should feel confident enough with you to discuss relaxing the rules or finding some alternative, because if the alternative is she lies and is then totally out of your jurisdiction, where do you stand as a parent?</p><p></p><p>Marg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Marguerite, post: 231750, member: 1991"] Daisy, are you over-reacting? Yes, and no. OK, my views could be due to cultural differences here. First, I do believe you are right to be concerned. I also agree, the deception is the biggest problem here. And yes, you do have a right to know where your child is, and who with, at all times. BUT - you need to temper this with the knowledge that she IS getting older, typical teen stuff is going to get in the way and if you try to over-control her world then she will do just what she is doing now (ie what she wants, and lie about it). That is a VERY bad pattern to allow. So what I suggest - let her know that you are aware she is being deceitful, and THAT is the crime here. You want her safe and therefore you MUST at least know who she is with. In the same way, YOU need to keep HER informed of where YOU will be and when you will be back. This is a common courtesy rule which applies in our home to all household members, regardless of age. husband will always ring me if he's held up on the way home from work (trains running late; bad weather; need to stop and get fuel). Siimilarly, if I go out shopping instead of staying home all day, I let husband know even though, with him at work, it's no skin off his noe. But he might want me to get something that he hasn't yet put on the shopping list, for example. Or there could be some other reason for him knowing. It also means that if something goes wrong then he is able to come to the rescue more accurately. So rather than getting loudly angry with your daughter, I wouldsit down and work on a solution. I see your son's point of view - getting to school late is annoying, it can get you into trouble, I've sat in a school office and listened to a teacher interrogating students going to the office for a late pass, and can really understand what would make kids tell fantastic lies in order to prevent being in that situation. I'm an adult, and I wanted to stand up and lie to this woman! (Ironically, I was waiting for a meeting with the acting principal, who had beenso adamant about the meeting beginning at 9 am that I had been forced to pay money I could ill-afford to put difficult child 3 into before school care, in order to make the meeting - and the deputy was running late, so late I needn't have paid for the child care after all. I was sorely tempted to interrogate the acting principal using the same techniques). Anyway, I think you need to sort out what is happening, above all else. Get to know the person driving your daughter, let them know your ground rules ("we tell each other where we will be, with whom and when we will be home") and make it clear that while you are grateful for their help especially while the bus route is such a mess, you DO need to be informed and they may not have realised this. I don't think you need to ground her. She will be mortified enough at being caught, and the inevitable loss of trust is its own punishment. She needs to know this - next time she says she's gonig somewhere, it will take much more convincing than usual, for you to believe her. At 13, she beleives she can now make her own adult decisions. It goeswith being a 13 year old girl. And frankly, taking out your parental concerns, I think it wascreative of her, to find someone she felt safe with to give her a lift to school instead of the risk of being late. To make her decision on the basis of another girl she knows also being in the car - that was good decision, FOR A 13 YEAR OLD GIRL. From a parental point of view, not good enough. She needs to know that her choices are not a safety guarantee - the other girl could have been foolish and accepted a lift from either a stranger, or a predator she happens to know as a friend. Being together is no guarantee of protection - to help her get THIS message, sit with her and Google "Ivan Milat", the "backpacker murderer". Young adults, either singly or with friend or partner, were vanishing while on holiday. Milat was not necessarily just a stranger who picked up hitchhikers, he often made friends with them first so they didn't feel they were accepting a lift from a stranger. And they undoubtedly felt, "My friend is with me, I am safe." The only reason Milat got caught, is someone got away. And even then, the information nearly got lost and more people died before that knowledge came to light. The reason the guy killed so many people - nobody knew where these people were, not exactly. They weren't expected at a certain time or even on a certain date. As a result, hours, days and weeks were able to pass during which the crime could be committed, the killer cover his tracks and tidy up. It's an ADULT thing as well as good common sense, to let people know your whereabouts. mother in law sometimes catches our village shopping bus. There are two shopping bus days a week. One day before Christmas, she met up with me while I was out and about so she could return later. What I didn't know, was she had failed to let the bus driver (or any other passengers) know that she was doing this. As a result the shopping bus return was held up, while the shopping centre was searched to see if somewhere was a little old lady fallen, or carted off to hospital. mother in law getting a lift home with me was no skin off the bus driver's nose, he just needed to know for commonsense and safety reasons. She's an adult, all she had to do was tell someone so they wouldn't worry and could continue on. In the same way, we tell one another our movements. So if your daughter wants Occupational Therapist (OT) get a lift instead of catch the bus, then what she SHOULD do is let you know, and make sure you have the contact information of these people. If your house rules also require that you have already met these people, then so be it. They shouldalso have your phone number, in the event of a problem - a nosebleed, perhaps, that has them take her to the emergency room. We live in a small village, I could be driving home and see someone struggling with a heavy bag in the rain (assuming it ever rains!) and give them a lift. Yes, I sometimes give a lift to a school student I happen to know, even if their family doesn't know, as long as the alternative is they would be walking home. I used to meet my kids at the boat when the got back to the village, and was often asked by my kids, "Can you give so-and-so a lift?" In this case with no schoolbus, I had no problem. And like cadydid, I would make sure the child was home and te parents knew this and knew it was me, in case there was a problem. Here is where there are cultural differences. Often the favour would get returned and my kids would get a lift home, but not if they knew I was expecting to meet the boat. They generally would use their mobile phones to let me know what boat they were on, and if they needed a lift. My kids never got a lift from anyone I didn't know. However, I did give a lift a couple of times to the son of my stalker, but only when I knew he would otherwise be walking. He's a nice kid, my argument was not with him but with his father. That time I did not stick around to talk to them! I just dropped him off at his gate and watched until he was inside. He was 17 at the time and a latchkey kid, so generally his parents weren't home anyway. However, I never offer a lift to a child I don't know well and whose parents don't know me. Not everybody lives by these rules or even understands tem. if you make yourself known to your daughter's friend's parent, then you will be undoubtedly setting aside any misunderstandings on your parenting rules. difficult child 3 often likes to visit friends in the neighbourhood. He always tells me where he's going. If he goes to visit Friend A and they're not home or just going out, he usually tries Friend B next. But he always lets me know, because he knows the rules. If I've gone shopping and he's finished his schoolwork before I get back, he either rings me to let me know or he leaves a note. So in summary - I think your rules are good and she needs to stick to them, or at leats discuss changes with you before she just goes and does her own thing. BUT - you may need to relax a little and certainly not get angry at the lifts to school. But yes, the lies need to be dealt with. She should feel confident enough with you to discuss relaxing the rules or finding some alternative, because if the alternative is she lies and is then totally out of your jurisdiction, where do you stand as a parent? Marg [/QUOTE]
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