Can they be anymore indirect?

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by klmno, Dec 27, 2011.

  1. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    To refresh, placement was up in the air, then I was told it was 'cast in stone', then I called super about the hostile situation between PO and myself over the way all this was handled and had gone back and forth, super said she might reconsider placement but would want a videoconfeerence with all parties involved including difficult child, fine, then she calls 2 days later and tells me she had decided she'd have videoconference with difficult child first without me then would bring me in (now how is that 'everyone getting together'?) so she sets up videoconference which is sscheduled for tomorrow- about 3 weeks out from when this first was discussed. I told her at that point that if the VC was really being set up just to get me to buy into GH that it wasn't necessary for me to be there because now it was sounding different from her intent to review placement. She said she was ttrying to leave a small window open for reconsideration. Then attny told me to call super and give permission for them to talk to attny- during that converstaion super told me she had then decided that reentry lady wouldn'typical teen need to be at videoconference so then it wouldd justt be super, po, and difficult child with me bein g pulled in at `the end.

    After attny spoke to po, attny made it sound to me that GH placement was cast in stone. I told her what super said about purpose of videoconference being reconsideration and final deecision. Attny then said "oh yeaah, that's right but you'll (me) be there so you can participate". difficult child told me reentry lady came to talk to him with a 2nd person in the room who only observed and that reentry lady said her being there didn't necessarily mean difficult child was going to gh. But difficult child said that reentry lady made it sound like I had been lieing- I asked him if he meant that they think I'm lying to them or if they were trying to convince him that I was lying to him and he said he didn't know. One thing I have figured out- csu people don't really want the parent and kid to be that close and trusting of each other- they want to be the people that the kid and parent are talking to instead of the parent and kid talking to each other. They will purposely cause the parent and kid to doubt each other- like interrogators do with witnesses and suspects.

    PO just called to remind me of VC tomorrow 'to get difficult child's perspective and get everyonoe on same page". I asked if I needed to be there because it was my understanding that this was set up to make final determination but now it sounds like it's cast in stone. He said it had always been written that difficult child was going to gh. I said ok, then I don't see reason for me to be there. He said "wait, he'd check super's notes", then returns and says she had just written that she waanted to talk to difficult child and he said they were aware of how I felt about everything but they felt the need to get everyone together about 'all that had transpired regarding difficult child's placement and get his perspective". OK what has transpired? Well, he says that originally I was concerned about difficult child coming home then I went back and forth with it due to all the services needed. Well, I asked, is the decision cast in stone or not and why can't someone just say what it is- better yet, can someone just send it to me in writing? Oh, that's what the VC is for tomorrow. Do I have to be there? He sayss he's just callling to remind me of it in case I'd like to join. I said thank you and it was certainly their perogative to speak to difficult child whenever they felt the need to and we hung up.

    Then he ccalled back to say the 30 day prior to release meeting that is required between Department of Juvenile Justice and them and difficult child is also scheduled for tomorrow. OK, thank you, and we hung up.

    Am I the only one thinking that the GH placement is cast in stone and the rest is lip service but for whatever reason, they are trying to leave me and difficult child a ray of possibility otherwise like they did for the past 3 weeks?

    But you see how PO makes it sound like they are asking for our perspectives- before it was mine and now it's difficult child's- but doG forbid, one should actually give them a perspective because we see how that's interpretted. And since they are all about them having the authority and them making all the deicsions, why not just tell us what they are and be done with it? This is nothing more than the same BS I was led to believe about the face to face meeting with PO, super, and reentry lady- it isn't to get my thoughts or anyone's perspective, it's about them trying to get us to do the bobblehead "OR ELSE".
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2011
  2. TeDo

    TeDo Guest

    I think you have a VERY good read on it. I think their minds were made up and are only trying to pacify you and make it look like they're reconsidering. I've been thinking that since you first brought the situation up here and the following posts about it. It sounds to me like they are playing "mind games" with you. I am sooooo sorry.
  3. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Right now I'm so annoyed with them I can't imagine showing up tomorrow. If I don't I'm sure they'll tell difficult child they were going to reconsider but I'm not there so they won't. If I do, they'll confront me about drawing a line with him and them in front of difficult child and say that's why they are ordering GH. It's all about convincing difficult child that it's my fault. Just like when he was committed to Department of Juvenile Justice the first time. But you know, they remind me of difficult child. He says he wouldn't have done ABC if I hadn't done, whatever, so HIS actions are MY fault. Nope-

    And when the parent gets to a point of hating and not trusting the people in csu- oh well that's a parent who is defiant and resents authority and that's proabably how the kid became a delinquent.

    I guess I could go just so difficult child knows I'm not bailing on him and if I have a chance to say anything, just reiterate that I would love for difficult child to come home however, due to past experiences I feel the need to draw a line and establish firmer boundaries with both difficult child and those in csu about what I can and cannot do and what I'm not willing to try again because of previous outcomes. That doesn't mean I don't respect their authority to order whatever they want, they have that perogative, but I have the perogative of drawing a line on what I'm going to do or not going to do when it's in my home and the stakes are as high as my safety and difficult child's well-being and future. This is what tics them off though and then they retaliate in any way they can.

    I've tried the bobblehead approach though and look at the outcome for difficult child and my lives over the past 5 years.

    I have to get a shower and get to DMV. I was looking for necessary paperwork when PO called and now I'm all sidetracked. They ruin my day so easily.
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2011
  4. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    Obviously the choice is yours. on the other hand I think you should go for difficult child's sake and yours. I know it will likely be stressful for you but an absentee parent does not send the message of caring involvement. Yeah I know about the past and the probable future but perhaps you can take a list of specific questions that you want addressed about length of placement, visitation, additional family therapy etc. and since it will be video recorded there will be no way to misrepresent your interests. Hugs DDD
  5. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    They don't have those answers, DDD- that will all be determined by people at the GH. I could ask, like I did when this was first brought up, but I wouldn't be able to believe what they tell me because before PO told me it was all the things I asked for- as listed in my previous thred- only to find out that was not what it was from reentry lady. Reentry lady has already said difficult child would probably be there 8 mos or longer- see previous thread for details. Anything else I or attny has asked about gets a "oh, yeah, we can look into that possibility but we'll have to do ABC" so it's made to sound positive and hopeful but then goes nowhere. The more questions asked, the more lip service and BS rec'd, then I get "it's their choice not mine and they'll do what they want". They want a bobblehead. I went into the face to face mtg with reentry lady with a typed up list of concerns and questions and ideas because I'd been told that mtg was for the same thing as they are describing this one and looko at how that turned out. I was accused of trying to take over and write the treatment plan and repetitively told they had authority to order whatever they wanted. Now, I asked today what those orders were and I heard that they will discuss that tomorrow after getting difficult child's perspective- the same thing they told me before at my mtg with reentry lady.
  6. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    As I're call. I just felt that difficult child would be better off knowing that you did take time to come to the meeting even if you just have to sit and listen to their junk. Maybe, not. DDD
  7. exhausted

    exhausted Active Member

    My heart aches for you-I have tears in my eyes because it brings back so much!

    You need to go. No matter how in "the bag" you think the whole thing is! You need to express your whole frustration in front all parties at the same time. I would state, " So everyone hears it from the horses mouth, I want you, difficult child, to know how much I love you despite our hardships. I want you to know how much I want you home, healthy, and for us to have a good relationship. I felt that could be best accomplished for both our sakes (and we are the important parties here), by having some court ordered guidelines for you and some professional therapy to deal with issues. I wanted a solid reentry plan that included our reunification-not another long term seperation. Despite all my effort, they have continued to think that GH was best plan and that somehow their programs, run by nonpreofessional or noncertified staff were the best idea. I am so sorry son, that is not what I believe is best and I have made it clear to every individual here. I have been forced to spend money to get legal counsel because I was so concerned about the plan. I have felt undervalued as the mother who knows you the best. I have felt that I did not matter in this process and that they misunderstand and misinterpret me at every turn. I have no evidence that this has changed. I am here to object to the recommended measures and to show you I love you. No matter what, I want you to know that I am on your team and I want you in my life." This is the very least! Please don't let them win without you stating this!
  8. DaisyFace

    DaisyFace Love me...Love me not


    I think you should go....if only to make it more difficult for them to talk about you behind your back...
  9. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    thank you- you all have good points. DDD, I meant that I don't think it's a good idea to go in with questions or a list of anything- obviously, they don't care. But true, I think this is nothing more than more BS. However, with the required meeting with Department of Juvenile Justice involved and difficult child's behavior counselor being involved, it could end up being focused more on that even if that wasn't the super's initial plan.

    I think I'll call attny this later afternoon if I haven't heard from her before then and see if she can go with me to make sure it gets on the table that while they have the authority to order what they want and they might be doing this because I had concerns about difficult child coming straight home with the same plan as last year (which is exactly how all this started) or with services that have already been tried and proven to fail, I did NOT advocate for difficult child to go to a long term program or advocate against reunification.

    I resent the pee out of them trying to convey to difficult child otherwise. We all know if I'd advocaterd for that, they would have been ordering something different than what they are.

    If the attny isn't interested in doing more than what she's already done- which is advocate for difficult child to get the local school district but in reality has done nothing more than relay the same lip service I got from these people because they told her the same thing, then she's fired. Honestly, why do i need to pay someone to call me ans say "they said that might be a possibility but theyl'll have to have a mtg with so-and-so"?
  10. buddy

    buddy New Member

    exhausted, that really says it well. It says the important points without the details that will get them off course. what do you think klmno? I agree that you should go even if you only want to tell difficult child you love him and tried your best for a better plan, despite what they are telling him. If you dont, then you have no idea what they will say and they can triangulate you even more. Once you two get more private time in the future, you can let him know the details, show him posts from here if it helps. He will understand eventually but dont let them come between you any more than they already are trying to do .....

    My heart just breaks for you and for him. They robbed the last of his childhood from him and did not morally do the right thing. This clearly is all about power and money and I am so sorry they are putting you through this. HUGS
  11. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    OK- but what's with them wanting to talk to difficult child before I get in there- that's when they are going to tell him how they are making this decision because "of my concerns" which implies that this is what I advocated for? I'm hoping attny can sit in on that- if the point is that I won't be there to make difficult child feel pressured to say what I want him to say- he wouldn't know this attny from Adam.
  12. buddy

    buddy New Member

    true, I was thinking the attny would have to be at least you could know...but then if you can get a chance to say that short but comprehensive statement? I suppose they will lose the connection at that point...technical difficulties or something. Sorry,not making a joke but I have no faith at all in these folks and I am so glad you want to do something about the system. Wont probably help now, but your son will see you fight and realize you did it all on his behalf and in the end I hope we have the "your difficult child's name" bill or law or whatever, to mandate a team approach like an in the IEP process but of course it would have to be IF the parent wants to be involved then they must allow it as an equal member once their time is served especially. this adding a long sentence (though they will say it is therapeutic ) is for the birds.
  13. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    Who knows? They could have any number of reasons for structuring the meeting the way they are. It really doesn't matter what their motives are...good, bad or indifferent. They are in the driver's seat and you'll be the alert passenger. Eventually you'll know all about it I'm sure. DDD
  14. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Buddy, I'm sure my efforts to get something changed in the system won't help my son. My goal really is to get more awareness in the public so it's not an automatic response to blame the parents but to focus more on what might really help, have more accountability for csu people so they can't do things like order a parole/treeatment plan without reading a file and finding out what lead to illegal activity in the first place since it's their job to order services that decrease chances of recidivism for each kid they are overseeing, and to have standards established such as if they are claiming they are giving therapy, the "therapist" needs to be a licensed MH prof. If i could get that much accomplished it would be a miracle but a benefit to all of society, not just the delinquents and their families, I believe. And I believe it would cost less than the $100,000+ per year they spend for each incarcerated kid in this state.
  15. buddy

    buddy New Member

    totally agree. I still think that since you and difficult child will be mother and son for a long time, the benefit to him will be that you are doing it because of what you have experienced and wanted to go better for him. If he grows past some of the difficult child-ness, over the years he might see why and how you got to the point of trying to make things better for all.
  16. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Attny finally called back- she said reentry lady hadn't returned her call (this was to find out terms of GH) but that she'd spoken with PO this morning and PO told her that final decision hadn't been made but they were leaning toward reentry program and he thought the gh placement was 3-6 mos. Nope- that's not what reentry lady had told me. Attney said she knew that and had a call into the director of gh to find out. OK- well- if PO meant to order something 3-6 mos but in fact has turned everything over to a reentry program that is a long term placement, can that be addressed? She doesn't know yet. OK- that was follow up from last week's issue.

    Todays' issue about VC tomorrow and reentry lady seeing difficult child last week then PO calling me this morning acting like everything was cast in stone, etc was discussed. Also, for reference about how I got to this cynuical attitude and why I had to draw a line with csu and not give blanket commitment re services, I described a couple of incidences that had transpired in the past with Pos and their 'services' that were ordered and how they went to difficult child and told difficult child it was my fault and now they are telling difficult child that due to my concerns, they are ordering this long term gh- ok, she seems to finally be getting it. She said it wouldn't be right for them to lead difficult child that their decision was my fault and she will try to be at VC tomorrow and help sort thru some of this and hopefully will get clarification about gh requirements beforehand so they can be put on the table with PO and super there, but if nothing else, she says she thinks she can get it out while difficult child is on VC that I never advocated for him to get a long term gh placement or that he'd never return home.