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Canceling Christmas...has anyone done this?
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<blockquote data-quote="Marguerite" data-source="post: 106509" data-attributes="member: 1991"><p>I think you need to avoid any possibility of this being seen as vengeance. Children, especially very young children and very difficult child children, are very immediate. Christmas is still too far away for the lack of Christmas cheer to connect with bad behaviour. All they will see is an adult who has control over their lives, exerting that control for its own sake.</p><p></p><p>I agree you need to do something about the disrespect, but for now, they see it as a game. Your reactions are a part of that game and they keep playing, not knowing any better. </p><p></p><p>Is anything you do, stopping this behaviour? No? Then might I tentatively suggest that you shouldn't be engaging in a battle in which you are not winning?</p><p></p><p>My alternative suggestion for managing this - totally ignore their existence while they are being rude to you. At their age they rely on you for a great deal, especially food. I suggest that to make this more immediate, you plan a special meal for you and whoever IS behaving in the house, maybe a favourite of yours that the kids don't like. (make sure, on the quiet, that you have some food available for them; something basic).</p><p></p><p>Then go ahead and lovingly prepare your meal, with just enough serves for the good people. The bad ones can look after themselves, don't make them take a bath or shower, don't make them get into their pyjamas, don't do anything (except make sure they aren't diving into a crate of glass off the top of the cupboard). Act as if you are alone in the house and they are somewhere else.</p><p></p><p>I suspect it won't get too far. You need to stay totally calm through this, do not engage at all in any of their insults. You need to be a star quality actor. </p><p></p><p>They do need you. They rely on you far more than you realise and perhaps a lot more than they care to admit. Right now, they are relying on you to play their silly little name-calling game, you have become a source of naughty amusement to them. So if you stop playing and totally ignore them, as they realise that their evening routine has been forgotten at first they may get excited. "We can go to bed without changing out of our day clothes!"</p><p>Let them. It won't feel right and they won't sleep well.</p><p>But food is the big clincher. As mothers, they take for granted that we will be there to feed them, whatever happens. But a mother only feeds her own chicks, she doesn't feed the noisy, scolding, marauding hooligans from the nest in the next tree.</p><p></p><p>If your children speak to you politely, answer politely. But if they are rude to you, walk away from them. Leave the room. Go read a book, put your feet up. Make a point of relaxing. Go and do some gardening. Sing to yourself. Put on some music of your choice, maybe, something you know is not their taste.</p><p></p><p>It could get ugly for a while, but keep cool. When you sit down to eat your dinner, make a point of acting as if you are alone and enjoying a nice meal. Read a book while you eat. About this time, the game will stop being fun for them. I suspect easy child will crack first, and as soon as you get an apology for the name-calling, produce a meal. Nothing fancy, because you need time to prepare a nice meal and you have been on strike all afternoon. If you CAN give them something they like that is quick and easy, then do it. But only after they voluntarily apologise. If they apologise, relent. But don't lecture. Your point should by now have been made more effective by your silence.</p><p></p><p>If there is still a stand-off - get yourself ready for bed. Shower. Change. Follow your evening routine. Turn out the lights. If they turn the lights back on, turn them off. If they continue, then go to the fuse box and remove the fuses from the light circuits.</p><p></p><p>If you absolutely HAVE to engage, for example if they grab your legs and don't let you move, you say, "Who are you? You don't live in this house. I don't know who you are, you are strangers to me." (Yes, I know this is another game, but this is YOUR game, on your terms).</p><p>Of course they will clamour, "You are our mother! I am your child!"</p><p>Which is your perfect cue to say, "MY CHILD IS LOVING, KIND AND GENTLE. MY CHILD DOES NOT CALL ME MEAN WORDS. I WANT MY CHILD HOME, BUT MY CHILD HAS GONE AWAY."</p><p></p><p>You make a point of loving/hating THE BEHAVIOUR, but at this age they don't always connect. This can be the fastest way for them to get the message.</p><p></p><p>If your child then comes back and gets upset, apologises for being rude etc, then you can say, "I am so glad you are back. I missed you while you were gone, the other children that were here were not very kind."</p><p></p><p>Whatever you do with discipline, you need to make it firm, immediate and effective. Do not keep making threats which you take ages to carry out. Therefore, do not make threats you are not prepared to carry out. Better yet, if you can do this without making threats at all - great.</p><p></p><p>I remember getting my mouth soaped out. My mother made extra sure to get the message across, by dragging the soap against my teeth, so soap piled up behind my teeth in lumps and stayed in my mouth. I have absolutely no recollection of what I said to her. I do know she threatened soaping for 'bad language' (such as saying 'shut up' even to my sisters) and only carried it out after what she felt was extreme provocation. But if I had been that bad, why can I only remember the punishment, and not the crime? For a punishment to be effective, you need to be able to connect it back to the crime. Otherwise, you will keep making the same mistake over and over.</p><p></p><p>Your child may remember the soaping, but not why. This means (sorry!) that the soaping was ineffective as punishment, even though it was immediate.</p><p></p><p>Too often we think of parenting and discipline in terms of punishment. The aim gets lost. And the aim is to teach them that this behaviour is unacceptable. </p><p>With a difficult child and with a very young child, we can't expect perfection, even though that may be our long-term goal. You need to understand the child and where they are coming from; difficult child 3 sometimes says appalling things purely as the result of extreme anxiety; I wait until he is less anxious and then tell him that his behaviour before was hurtful. This is what works best for us. If I react badly to bad words spoken out of anxiety, then all I am doing is escalating the anxiety and making the behaviour worse. By letting him calm down first, I am giving him the chance to learn self-control.</p><p></p><p>We need to choose our battles and fight them well. If we can turn a battle into diplomacy, so much the better.</p><p></p><p>Marg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Marguerite, post: 106509, member: 1991"] I think you need to avoid any possibility of this being seen as vengeance. Children, especially very young children and very difficult child children, are very immediate. Christmas is still too far away for the lack of Christmas cheer to connect with bad behaviour. All they will see is an adult who has control over their lives, exerting that control for its own sake. I agree you need to do something about the disrespect, but for now, they see it as a game. Your reactions are a part of that game and they keep playing, not knowing any better. Is anything you do, stopping this behaviour? No? Then might I tentatively suggest that you shouldn't be engaging in a battle in which you are not winning? My alternative suggestion for managing this - totally ignore their existence while they are being rude to you. At their age they rely on you for a great deal, especially food. I suggest that to make this more immediate, you plan a special meal for you and whoever IS behaving in the house, maybe a favourite of yours that the kids don't like. (make sure, on the quiet, that you have some food available for them; something basic). Then go ahead and lovingly prepare your meal, with just enough serves for the good people. The bad ones can look after themselves, don't make them take a bath or shower, don't make them get into their pyjamas, don't do anything (except make sure they aren't diving into a crate of glass off the top of the cupboard). Act as if you are alone in the house and they are somewhere else. I suspect it won't get too far. You need to stay totally calm through this, do not engage at all in any of their insults. You need to be a star quality actor. They do need you. They rely on you far more than you realise and perhaps a lot more than they care to admit. Right now, they are relying on you to play their silly little name-calling game, you have become a source of naughty amusement to them. So if you stop playing and totally ignore them, as they realise that their evening routine has been forgotten at first they may get excited. "We can go to bed without changing out of our day clothes!" Let them. It won't feel right and they won't sleep well. But food is the big clincher. As mothers, they take for granted that we will be there to feed them, whatever happens. But a mother only feeds her own chicks, she doesn't feed the noisy, scolding, marauding hooligans from the nest in the next tree. If your children speak to you politely, answer politely. But if they are rude to you, walk away from them. Leave the room. Go read a book, put your feet up. Make a point of relaxing. Go and do some gardening. Sing to yourself. Put on some music of your choice, maybe, something you know is not their taste. It could get ugly for a while, but keep cool. When you sit down to eat your dinner, make a point of acting as if you are alone and enjoying a nice meal. Read a book while you eat. About this time, the game will stop being fun for them. I suspect easy child will crack first, and as soon as you get an apology for the name-calling, produce a meal. Nothing fancy, because you need time to prepare a nice meal and you have been on strike all afternoon. If you CAN give them something they like that is quick and easy, then do it. But only after they voluntarily apologise. If they apologise, relent. But don't lecture. Your point should by now have been made more effective by your silence. If there is still a stand-off - get yourself ready for bed. Shower. Change. Follow your evening routine. Turn out the lights. If they turn the lights back on, turn them off. If they continue, then go to the fuse box and remove the fuses from the light circuits. If you absolutely HAVE to engage, for example if they grab your legs and don't let you move, you say, "Who are you? You don't live in this house. I don't know who you are, you are strangers to me." (Yes, I know this is another game, but this is YOUR game, on your terms). Of course they will clamour, "You are our mother! I am your child!" Which is your perfect cue to say, "MY CHILD IS LOVING, KIND AND GENTLE. MY CHILD DOES NOT CALL ME MEAN WORDS. I WANT MY CHILD HOME, BUT MY CHILD HAS GONE AWAY." You make a point of loving/hating THE BEHAVIOUR, but at this age they don't always connect. This can be the fastest way for them to get the message. If your child then comes back and gets upset, apologises for being rude etc, then you can say, "I am so glad you are back. I missed you while you were gone, the other children that were here were not very kind." Whatever you do with discipline, you need to make it firm, immediate and effective. Do not keep making threats which you take ages to carry out. Therefore, do not make threats you are not prepared to carry out. Better yet, if you can do this without making threats at all - great. I remember getting my mouth soaped out. My mother made extra sure to get the message across, by dragging the soap against my teeth, so soap piled up behind my teeth in lumps and stayed in my mouth. I have absolutely no recollection of what I said to her. I do know she threatened soaping for 'bad language' (such as saying 'shut up' even to my sisters) and only carried it out after what she felt was extreme provocation. But if I had been that bad, why can I only remember the punishment, and not the crime? For a punishment to be effective, you need to be able to connect it back to the crime. Otherwise, you will keep making the same mistake over and over. Your child may remember the soaping, but not why. This means (sorry!) that the soaping was ineffective as punishment, even though it was immediate. Too often we think of parenting and discipline in terms of punishment. The aim gets lost. And the aim is to teach them that this behaviour is unacceptable. With a difficult child and with a very young child, we can't expect perfection, even though that may be our long-term goal. You need to understand the child and where they are coming from; difficult child 3 sometimes says appalling things purely as the result of extreme anxiety; I wait until he is less anxious and then tell him that his behaviour before was hurtful. This is what works best for us. If I react badly to bad words spoken out of anxiety, then all I am doing is escalating the anxiety and making the behaviour worse. By letting him calm down first, I am giving him the chance to learn self-control. We need to choose our battles and fight them well. If we can turn a battle into diplomacy, so much the better. Marg [/QUOTE]
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