Childrens Questions = Trouble for difficult child parents

[Hound dog]

That's right. Kayla is asking questions.

She spent a week with Nichole. Seems every time Nichole turned around she was questioning her.

Why did we leave and go back to Mo?

Why did Mom come here in the first place when I was a baby?

Why did she come here this time??

Being the child of a difficult child parent...........this is not a good sign and usually does not work out well for the parent (s). It shows the child is going over things / events / what they've been told and it simply is not adding up. It is the beginning of the child seeing their parent (s) more as a person than a parent. For most people this doesn't happen until much later in life, if it ever does. When this happens in childhood, it is a sign there is something pretty wrong with the parents........whether it be gfgdom, abuse.....whatever. It begins to happen when the child has an opportunity to see that what goes on in their life / home does not go on in other peoples lives / homes. Kayla over the past year has spent a LOT of time away from home, both with family and friends. The first real chance for her to get a glimpse into the private lives of others.

Nichole handled it well. She told her that she didn't know why to any of those questions and that Kayla needed to ask / talk it over with her mom. Kayla still tried to get answers from Nichole but Nichole kept telling her that only her parents had those answers. In truth.......we still don't know the why ourselves to the first two at least.

I know one reason for the last question.......cps was after them, and I strongly suspect she had visions of a warm family reunion with everyone falling all over themselves to help / please / show their love for her and the kids. Katie just is too into soap opera type drama not to believe the latter wasn't at least a fantasy even if she really didn't expect that to happen.

But as to Katie's actual reasons for any of those things........we've never gotten a real answer. Lots of avoidance, but no answer. I only know cps was after them because M let it slip during conversation.

 

[tiredmommy]

I feel for Kayla. I was maybe a little younger than she is now when I realized just how dysfunctional my family life was. The good news is that it didn't hurt to come to that realization, it was more like a light bulb turned on and I was able to be more conscious about how I behaved. It's a good sign because it shows she just might make it out of her childhood okay.

 

[DammitJanet]

I agree with TM. I was in middle school when I started spending a lot of time with my best friend and I got to see that all mother's werent like mine.

 

[Hound dog]

Yes. I agree.

I was about Kayla's age when I started doing it. For me, it was a good thing. It saved me from much of the drama, craziness, and misery my siblings have and still do go through because they've just begun the process. It saved me from taking a nose dive straight into major gfgdom. Don't get me wrong........I was a difficult child in my younger days about some things......but on some important issues I had a firm standard set in my mind from this process and I never wavered from it. My own children greatly benefited from the process as their lives were as vastly different (stable, normal and boring) from mine.

For my mother though, it didn't go so well. I had little respect for her from age 12-40 (when I began to accept her for the person she is, not who I'd like her to be) I respected her only due to what my grandmother taught me and it only went so far. We clashed, and we clashed often. Her opinions had no weight, no effect. I know for her it was miserable because she could not figure out why she could not control me, guilt me into behaving the way she felt I should behave. I was the only child that didn't act like her child, Know what I mean??

This is a good sign for Kayla, yes. It means she is beginning to see the reality that is her parents and her home life. She may still go through some difficult child stuff as she works through old issues, I don't know because there is a large chunk of their lives I know next to nothing about. But it does increase the odds of not following in the foot steps of her parents.

This weekend we discussed college. While I didn't discourage her, I made sure she was informed about trade schools and the fact those jobs paid as well or better than college jobs and there was a greater demand for those skills. Kayla tells me she wants to be a dancer and an artist. I told her that is wonderful, but they have to eat too. I explained that those dreams are great to have and she should go for it, but to make certain first she has a marketable job skill to keep a roof over her head and food in her stomach while she goes after those dreams. Then I hugged her and told her they were called "starving artists" for a reason. lol

Kayla is obviously dyslexic. Nichole had her reading and writing much of the weekend while watching her do so. Since we all know Kayla will never make it to an evaluation for help in school.......Nichole has started giving her tips on things she did to cope and make it easier. Some things I taught her to do, other things she came up with on her own.

Katie and M are in for some rocky years ahead.

 

[DDD]

Hound, did you ever get an update on her friend's family? Could that be the "trigger" behind the new questions? I have thought of her often hoping she was unaware of the abnormalities in that family. DDD

 

[InsaneCdn]

Kayla tells me she wants to be a dancer and an artist.

But she CAN be... as long as she's prepared to use her artist skills for commercial uses. There's some good jobs out there that require "artist" skills... drafting, interior decorating, graphic arts, commercial photography, etc. She needs to start learning about all the ways "artists" hold down real jobs in our world.

 

[Hound dog]

DDD

Charges were for under age 12, not a teen. This is not her first offense. She was convicted a few times before and served time. Evidently she was not registered......because I watch that.

And yes, this incident most likely triggered her questions.

Due to Katie's response..........and M's lack of response (does he even know about it??) it's throwing up red flags. Hard to believe Katie is the concerned parent when she told Kayla she could go to Tennesee with this child. Uh, I don't think so. I think Nana is going to have to have a talk with Katie........or ring her idiotic neck, one or the other. omg

Why those red flags are up, at this point I'm not sure..........not really fair to call them red flags, more like red neon signs. Not saying either Katie or M knew or had anything to do with this mother's behavior. But something is up.

I will talk with Kayla as soon as I have the opportunity. Unfortunately I've been through this before and know how to go about it without planting ideas. Kayla is claiming ignorance. I find the chances of her being unaware slim considering the amount of time she spent in that home with this mother. Know what I mean?? I just hope to heaven she was not a victim. So far as we know right now, she wasn't. Not that that necessarily means anything.

 

[DDD]

Good luck, Hound. DDD

PS: Katie didn't by chance encourage her to take a sibling with her when she went to visit, did she? GFGmom always has tried to get rid of more than one kid when possible.
Ugh!

 

[Hound dog]

Oh, well, good grief. That hadn't yet occurred to me, but then I'm tired much of the time these days. Yes, Katie would not have been able to push them out the door fast enough if someone was willing to take them. *sigh* But as far as I am aware, they didn't go along with her. Kayla has never mentioned it, nor have the boys. Not that that necessarily means anything either....they just might not yet have blurted it out.

I did take notice that Alex has a new obsession with "boobies". Granted, he is 12 and that is pretty normal. What is not normal is that Alex will walk up to strangers who are "blessed" and asked them to lift up their shirts so he can see their boobies. Now being developmentally delayed and not with it socially......ok, maybe. Except even Travis understood that people don't just do certain things. M thought it was great. (doesn't surprise me) And all Katie said to the boy was that he was 12 and should not be thinking/acting that way yet. It was Nana that had to tell him that if you walk up to a female and you're obvious about gawking at her chest, or ask such a thing, the best you can hope for is to be slapped, that the behavior is inappropriate. omg Once I said that (and only after I said it) did Katie climb on board.

Not saying this is related, as due to Alex's age it likely isn't necessarily. I'm no prude when it comes to sex and my kids have always talked about it at home openly, doesn't bother me. But while M's reaction what somewhat a normal reaction I see in adult males (usually followed with "boy that will get you slapped"), Katie's reaction is what got me. Just saying you're 12 you shouldn't be acting/thinking that way is not what I'd expect out of a parent, she should've been explaining why it was inappropriate or whatever. Kayla, oddly, had absolutely nothing to say on the subject. When normally she would've been all over that in your typical sibling moment. Maybe that threw up the flag on this more so than M and Katie.

I do have a side note here. Kayla missed a LOT of school last year due to "missing the bus". I'd already told Katie if she didn't make the bus to call me and I'd take her. Saturday though while I told Kayla Nana would be taking her regardless, I would be certain to make her life utterly miserable because Nana would have to be dragged out of bed not long after I'd gone to sleep. So, she'd better make darn sure she gets out the door in time each morning. School is too important, and we've been talking to her a lot about that here recently. Although Alex has moved up to Jr High, so I'm pretty sure M will be at the bus stop, which will mean Kayla will be at the bus stop. lol

 

[susiestar]

Katie was going to have to face these questions at some point, in my opinion. This situation with the friend's mother has likely caused them to come earlier, but they are inevitable. If for no other reason than Katie sees how Aubrey and the boys live and she knows it isn't the way she does.

Nichole handled the questions beautifully.

As for Alex, well, my biggest issue with his latest object of fascination is Katie's reaction to it. While no one wants to acknowledge it, it is not that uncommon around people who are delayed and who have parents who do not work to set solid rules in place for this type of thing.

I hope and pray they have not been harmed by that woman. I am not 100% sure about Katie being at fault for letting her kids go to the sleepover when she did not have every bit of info on the parents. My folks did not have close relationships with all my friends, but I still went on sleepovers after my mom talked to the other girl's mom. Knowing parents is NOT as reliable as you might think. Sexual abuse is always hidden until such time as a new victim can be attaacked and manipulated to keep quiet. OFTEN the pedophile grooms the parents as well. It would be ASTONISHINGLY easy to groom Katie to the point where she would never believe anything happened even if she saw it. Some of that is genetic (Aspie traits), some the need for attention (Oh you poor thing, let me take Kayla and Alex for a few days to help you out!) and some is simply that I doubt she has very good radar for these kinds of creeps or the confidence to stand up to one of them unless it was blatant and she was afraid of what you would do/say about it or what her sisters would say.

She IS making progress though. It isn't as easy to see it from where you are, but from here? WOW! So many steps already taken to become a more responsible adult and parent.

This is just something to think about. Of course I am outside looking in, so if I am off base I am sorry. Some people are just unable to see the warning signs and some need to be taught more explicitly than others, just like other social skills.

We have an old neighbor who's daughter was abused this way by her father. He got arrested when the daughter's friend told her mom after a sleepover. Most of the community was shocked. While the family was nuts at home (the dad used to shoot at moles underground), and some of us got a very bad feeling around them, they were well respected in town. She was a nurse (lost license because she got charged too), the mom a retired nurse (also got charged), and I don't know what the dad did because I would not speak with him but he seemed very well respected around town. They had LOTS of kids spend the night with the family, and until a friend told her parents what was going on, no one would EVER have believed this.

So this is NOT totally Katie's fault. I am willing to spend good money betting her biomom never took the time to teach her to trust her instincts or the red flags that you or I might see. There are a LOT of people who are not careless with their children in ANY way who end up with a child who has been violated or exposed to sexual abuse due to not knowing the dark secrets of another family. Katie does need to learn to heed those warnings, but she is doing a lot better.

 

[Hound dog]

Susie, Katie and M have made remarkable progress. And it's not that I necessarily believe the situation with this bff's mom as being katie's fault.

I've lived sexual abuse, trust me, I know how it works. What is ticking me off is that is isn't causing kaite to re-examine the parents/environments of Kayla's other friends homes and that she is approving a trip to another state with the bff who's mother was a child molester. I know these children have been placed with family, I don't know who that family is at this point.............but I do know that molestation tends to run in families as that is often how it goes from one generation to the next. If the children are with the father........Katie knows squat about the man.......if they are with other family........she knows squat about them. Know what I mean??

I also know to trust my instincts when it comes to this sort of thing and I've as yet to be wrong.

There is an underlying current we've picked up on as we've pulled the entire family back into the extended family fold, so to speak. It reveals itself more as they become more comfortable. Katie, while she plays the helpless victim in any other aspect of life, is a tyrant within her own home with her own family. Now that this is confirmed.........other things in the past simply do not fall into place any longer.

I had realized that before this incident with the bff's mother happened. I was just waiting and watching. About all you can do with no tangible evidence of anything.

Back when Kayla was 8 a very disturbing photo of her was posted online. I don't know who did it, but I know the excuses as to how that photo was taken and posted are totally bogus. I've always known it, but with nothing else to go on my hands are tied. I know how photos have to be loaded onto myspace and fb and I have a better idea of M's reading level. He would've required help to post photos, at least until he caught on to the process. (he never posted photos often, it was a once in a great while event) Like I said, I don't know who posted or snapped that photo of Kayla, but I do know Katie's reaction to it was totally abnormal. Now I know exactly how abnormal because she is the dominant in the household, not M as she likes to portray. When it came to the photos of M online and when I copied them and took them to police......it was Katie who disposed of the computer with the ****ing evidence. (and yes, I now know she did for certain)

Just because Katie and M are making progress doesn't mean I'm naive enough to forget those things.

But I do however find it mighty coincidental the one friend Kayla practically lived with for a year or more has a mother as a molester. Could easily be coincidence, true, and I'm keeping an open mind.

However what I didn't know until just a short while ago is that Nichole casually asked Kayla why she was suddenly grounded from this bff's house (about 2 months prior to what happened). Nichole noted that Kayla would not meet her gaze and avoided answering completely. Obviously it is not the reasons Katie gave me. This is also totally out of character for Kayla.

I"m not saying it's all on Katie (whatever it is) or it's all on M, or it's both of them...........or whatever, right now I don't know. I'm just saying in this area things never added up, and now it is even more pronounced that we know the family dynamic.

Honestly? Kayla may never open up, and unless the boys were to let something slip.....we may never know what is going on behind closed doors. But if there is the slightest chance I can find out, you can be certain that I will eventually.

I can say I do suspect physical abuse might still be going on, perhaps not on the same level as when they were younger........and I have a feeling it might not be something that is done when M is around. I have good reason to suspect, just no physical evidence to act on it either.

I love Katie and I'm proud of the progress she's made and I hope it continues. But one issue really doesn't have much to do with the other. I'm more realistic than that. Know what I mean??