difficult child's lying

[Kjs]

has gotten out of hand. During the school year, I would ask every day, "did you do your homework" difficult child would say "yep it's done" or else "didn't have any" Only to find out at mid-quarter he hasn't been doing homework.

Then for his birthday in December he got a really nice cell phone. First Bill was way out of this world high. Asked him if he purchased music. Nope. Called the company, and yes, he had been purchasing music. I asked if he knew he did. Yep. Asks you if you want to purchase, then you have to confirm your purchase.

Then he was playing an online game. He took my credit card and was purchasing items for this game. Denied that too until I called the number.

Then he got XBOX 360 for xmas. I noticed on my bank statement every month charges for Microsoft. Microsoft and XBOX didn't click then. Asked both boys if they downloaded anything from Microsoft. NOpe. Neither of them. This past bank statement it acutally said Microsoft - XBOX LIVE. So I called. Yep, he's purchasing points. THREE times a month.
Charges for 12.50 (2x's) and 6:25 (2x's). The past month it was one charge of 25. Confronted difficult child. Yes he did but didn't tell me when I asked because he didn't want me to be mad.
I chewed him out and asked him WHY he would lie when he knew I would get the bill. The credit card number is set in that game since we pay a membership fee.

I told him each time, If you EVER charge another thing I will permanently remove that option. Then even if I would give permission you couldn't do it. He has never downloaded anything else since on his phone. Same conversation with Runescape game. Never did that again. Now had same conversation with XBOX. And again with what he did at the waterpark.

Went to the waterpark this past week. He asked if he could purchase a drink (slushi) and charge it to the room. I asked how much he said 2.50. I asked him how many he bought. just his or his friends too. No, just one.
Second day, I ASKED him if he charged anything to the room. His answer, "NO, not today..yesterday" Got the checkout bill in the morning. Not only did he charge drinks to the room SEVERAL times a day, he also bought drinks for his friend at the tune of $4.50 per drink. NOT 2.50. So, I was angry. His response again was he didn't want me to get mad. WEll, now I am SUPER mad. On top of that he ditched me the entire time. I spent three days not speaking because I was alone. If I went to the waterpark and found him (after hours of looking) they would go outside. If I went outside, they went inside. If they went to the room and I went to the room then they would leave and go play games.
I told his friend to bring money, but he didn't. Went downtown one day and was going to ride the jet boats. I couldn't leave his friend there, so I didn't go so they could both go. And difficult child tells friend "my mom doesn't like these things" No...I LOVE those things. Just cannot afford for three of us to do it.
Last day we were leaving early. Only couldn't find them for hours. When I did I told them where my seat was, by the pool. He said he would be right over. Three hours later I left to find him again. Inside playing ping pong. I was upset for the three hour wait. So they leave and go outside. I go get my clothes from the car. Come back and could not find them for two more hours. And that is ok. My fault. According to him it is ALL my fault. And his father says not a word to him.

Get home and husband asks what's wrong. I tell him. And he yells at ME. Because I told difficult child he wasn't going anywhere.

I spent three days picking up every mess these two boys made. Then go home and pick up all there messes again. We went to a huge giant waterpark and I got to go on three water rides with him. ONLY because I heard his friend tell him he should really go on a ride with his mom.

He tells me he has friends that are in gangs and do drugs. I told him he will not be hanging out with them. He says he WILL if they are nice to him.

I told him he deliberately stole from his parents. He doesn't see it that way. If you take money with no permission...and lie about it you are being disrespectful and mean and stealing.

He doens't think it is a big deal. And I am out of line for being angry. And totally out of line if I make him stay home.

He is a slob and thinks anything he wants he can get. Right at this moment I can say he is an ungrateful spoiled brat.

 

[witzend]

He's being a nit-picker. You said no more money for Microsoft, he spends money on Runescape. No more money for Runescape, he spends money on drinks. etc...

I think the answer here is "no more money." Period. Cancel the credit stuff he has access for, and call the credit card companies and ask for new cards with new numbers. Then lock them up and never give them to him again. It's a hassle, but if you want to buy him a soda, give him a buck. On payday we get $20 in ones out of the bank to pay the neighbor kid to walk the dogs. Sometimes we use it in two weeks, sometimes we don't. But it's not coming out of anyone's budget, and no one is surprised when it's gone.

by the way, I'm with you. He's being an ungrateful spoiled brat. And I wouldn't take him and his friends to the waterpark anymore either. Take yourself someplace nice with husband instead. difficult child can eat a microwave meal that night.

 

[BusynMember]

I'll tell ya, I wouldn't be buying him any more nice presents.

 

[Baffled]

I feel your pain. I also have a spoiled brat. Just can't seem to correct mine either. Not sure what to do myself. He's 2 days out of psychiatric hospital and our rules are written down and the consequences are written down and I'm trying to stick by my guns, but he's already trying to manipulate me and I'm so depressed right now I don't know what to do with myself. I have taken away his cell phone and his computer. He knows that he will soon be at a boarding school if the commotion keeps up, but in 2 days I don't see much change yet.

 

[CrazyinVA]

You should also be able to contact the cell phone company and have them remove any ability he has to download music, ringtones, etc.. you can even block texts if necessary. IF you even let him have the phone, that is!

I agree, it's time to completely limit anything he's given, ever. He's proven over and over he can't be trusted.

Lots of what he's doing (telling you his friends are doing drugs, etc.) is pushing your buttons.. take a deep breath there try not to react much. It takes practice, I know!

HUGS.

 

[trinityroyal]

Kjs,

First of all, {{{HUGS}}}. Sorry that you had to put up with that during what was supposed to be a holiday trip for you.

Now, as for difficult child.
I agree with the others that he is being an ungrateful spoiled brat. I am also concerned that husband isn't backing you up on this, and instead seems to be siding with difficult child.

I think that the "do to get" principle might be in order.
No more nice presents until difficult child shows that he can earn them and respect the rules about using them. Furthermore, confiscation of nice things that he's been abusing.

When my difficult child started surfing the internet and downloading ringtones on his cellphone, we blocked that option so he could no longer do so. Credit cards were all under lock and key.

I would remove the credit card number from his XBOX. He's shown that he can't be trusted not to abuse the privilege, so he doesn't get the privilege. If he needs his phone for safety then let him hang onto it, otherwise the phone would be gone too.

It's a long, hard road, and it seems that lying is one of the hardest habits to break with our difficult children. They just don't see how destructive it is.

(I really feel your pain on this one. I've just arrived home from a visit to difficult child's Residential Treatment Center (RTC) where his one-on-one caregiver and I just finished tossing his room and I found a bunch of things of mine, DHs and others that were stolen from the house last time he visited. When confronted, I was met with bare-faced lies, even though I was holding the things in my hands at the time.)

Trinity

 

[Andy]

As I was reading, I was trying to figure out how old your difficult child was - by his actions, I was guessing 15 - 17. Was I ever surprised that this is a 13 yr old!

I would call the credit card company and tell them that you did not authorize those charges. The companies that allowed a 13 yr old to use the card can eat those charges. If they don't have anything in place to make sure the person is an adult then they can take the loss. Then have the current numbers cancelled and new numbers issued.

When you go places, you should be able to declare that NOTHING gets charged to your account unless you or husband makes the charge in person.

Your difficult child has started a bad habit of spending that will get you into financial trouble. His behavior of paying for everything for his friends is putting him into a more vulnerable position for drug using friends. Of course they are going to treat him nice and soon they will be asking for cash to purchase their drugs.

I would cancel all the computer games (even if you can not get your money back) difficult child should not have access to what you didn't give him permission to purchase.

Does your difficult child have a MySpace or Facebook account? Is there a way to block access on the home computers to that? Those are very bad for young teenagers to get involved in. Very dangerous. I feel that your difficult child would get into a lot of icky stuff through those.

 

[klmno]

One of the very first signs that my difficult child is becoming unstable is lying and stealing money (could be $1 laying around the house or a debit card to get a soda- then return the debit card) He never does this at any other period.

 

[Andy]

P.S. If you have a regular cell phone, switch it to a track phone. With regular phone charges can rack to no end but with a track phone you can put a limited amount on and once those minutes are gone, that is it.

Have consequences for if he does not answer when you call him or tell you the truth about where he is. The consequence is a tighter curfew.

Call him from your cell phone so he will not know if you are home or out looking for him when you call.

He will absolutely hate for you to show up where he is hanging with friends so go ahead and pick him up if he is not home on time. If you are not where you belong when you belong, I get to come get you and I don't care if you are embarased when I pull you away from your friends. You can avoid this by being home on time. (I have done this with easy child)

 

[DazedandConfused]

I often wonder if I'm a wierdo, because I would LOVE to go three days without having to speak to anyone! ESPECIALLY MY difficult children! I would not have expected to go on any rides with a 13 year old. Especially, if they brought a friend with them. I've been to a gigantic water park with my kids a when Daughter was 13. She was off having a blast most of the time.

As far as the STEALING of money from you; charging points, drinks to rooms, etc. It's stealing. Period. Okay, so maybe he doesn't get it. I would be cutting off ANY ACCESS TO ANY $$$. Get rid of the membership. Of course, "charging" anything, including rooms, is over. Bring some small bills to give to him. Dole as needed, and ONLY as needed.

I'm not sure what cell provider you use, but Sprint allows the account administrator (in my case, ME) to block any downloading, song and ring tone purchasing, and only allow CALLING (Watch those minutes) to be done to a particular phone on my plan. See what your son's plan offers. I know I had a few issues with Daughter D/L various whatevers to her cell. I took the darn thing. It's mostly a convenience for me, anyway. The last time I took it, it was nearly a year. She knows I mean it. I don't care if she "understands" (not anymore, anyway), it's GONE.

Son, who just turned 12, has this thing about using the word "jack" ("jack" as in car-jack as in STEALING). He made a comment the other day about how he was, "so gonna jack that" in front of me. "Oh really, Son? Kiss Wii, your cell, your BRAND NEW BIRTHDAY BIKE THAT DAD SPECIAL ORDERED, bye-bye, adios, and are-E-vouwa!"

Son's response?

You're gonna love it.

A very indignant "Whyyyyeeeeeeee?"

Whatever. I just don't explain anymore. My head is just too darn bloodly from the very hard brick wall of that head of his. You do A, B is gonna happen.

Both of my difficult children have used, " I didn't tell you because, A. You would have said 'no', anyway", or B. "I knew you were going to get mad".

So, okay, instead of being "mad", I'm furious and outraged. Furious and Outraged mets outs out much stiffer consequences than a simple Mad.

In short, stop explaining. Do. Let him whine, complain, or whatever. It's a lot cheaper than what you are experiencing now.

 

[TerryJ2]

So sorry, Kjs. How frustrating.
That's why we periodically have to strip our son's rm, take away TV privileges, etc. The more you give the more they take.

 

[gcvmom]

Well, I'm on your side with this too

difficult child needs a shorter leash until he can prove he is capable of handling the responsibilities that come with being trustworthy. Clearly, he is not trustworthy right now. Does he need things explicitly defined for each situation he is in? Do you think he really doesn't get it or is he truly being dishonest? Either way, I think a short, short leash (like your hand on the scruff of his neck) is in order for a long time.


husband needs to get on the same page as you, or you are headed for much bigger problems down the road.

 

[KTMom91]

I'm in agreement with the shorter leash. We had to do that with Miss KT as well. Eventually, it sunk in, and there was improvement.

 

[butterflydreams]

Ugh! I so know what you are talking about regarding the games. My difficult child loves Runescape and he likes to purchase items. He will ask me to buy Runescape Gold (the money used in the game). I used to be able to just use a credit card, but now the only way for me to purchase is PayPal. A while ago, difficult child wanted to use part of his allowance to buy some, I went in and purchased like $20 worth with PayPal, well I NEVER thought he would go in then and do a purchase without asking me, but he did. A few days later, he asked if he could use more of his allowance to buy this other thing for the game, I went to go in there and found that there had been a $100 charge that had been charged and then the charge was reversed! At first he denied knowing anything about it, then he confessed that he "accidentally" hit purchase. I was fuming! He did not get the other thing he wanted from there and I went in and removed the card from PayPal so that it couldn't happen again.

As far as for XBox live, the only way he will get time is by a pre-purchased card, I will not do the automatic monthly charge for it nor will I load my credit card in there.

Also, with cell phone, I had the same problem with him downloading music - I found it on the bill after he went inpatient last time. I was not happy at all, I did call and had the ability to download anything blocked from his phone. I am also going to be canceling his phone as soon as the agreement is up in Sept. IF I get him another phone, it will be prepaid, or I am considering canceling all of ours and going with Cricket or MetroPCS or some other plan like that, problem is my daughter and I are not near the end of our contracts so I would have to pay an early termination fee. I just have to decide if I would be saving enough.

I can't stand the lying and the deceptiveness. I see some of the same stuff with my difficult child and he is 12.

Christy

 

[Kjs]

My problem here is husband says nothing. Silent. If I try to punish difficult child, husband sides with him. It is so wrong. Then husband will yell at me.
If I tell difficult child he cannot go anywhere - husband will let him. The thing I do is take the keyboard, mouse and game controllers to work with me!

I cannot block anything on his cell phone. easy child and difficult child are on the same account. I was told if I block one it blocks both. So, if I block anything easy child will also be blocked.

XBOX LIVE - I purchased a 1 year subscription when he got it for xmas. The card number must be in there somewhere. I did talk to Microsoft, they offered no solution.

difficult child gets so mad at me for asking what he is doing, going, what he did. husband asks nothing. Lets him come and go (gives him rides where ever) husband does not support me at all. He says he does, but his support is "go ask your mother".

difficult child says he lies because he doesn't want me to get mad. He KNOWS I will find out. Then I am not suppose to be made because it "happened in the past. It's over".

I have made difficult child take drug tests just because. All have been clean.

I just do not know how to get husband to see what is going on. As far as going anywhere with husband. I'Learning Disability (LD) rather go alone.

Is it normal for boys this age to not want anything to do with their mothers?

 

[susiestar]

First of all, HUGS!!!

I think it is time to drag your husband to some counselling. It is the ONLY way y'all are going to survive the teen years with-o really messing each other up. He has already messed up your feelings.

As husband has left this all up to you: TAKE AAWAY THE PHONE, THE ACCESS TO ANYTHING HE CAN CHARGE, THE XBOX, THE RUNESCAPE, EVERYTHING!!

Just lock them up or get rid of them. Take them to Gamestop and sell the dang things.

It will end the hassles in a major way. difficult child will be furious. BUT he has majorly abused his mother, which means he should not have any of these things.

As for going on a trip to a waterpark with mom and a friend, I hate to tell you this but I can't think of a teenage boy that WOULD spend the time with his mom. I think your son was very rude, disappearing when you told him to be somewhere. THAT is something I would address. But your expectation that he would go on the rides with you is not realistic from what I have seen of 13yos. Think back to what you were like at 13. Mom is the MOST embarrassing thing, and I think it is worse for boys when a friend is there. If you wanted him to spend time with you then you should have left the friend at home.

I am sorry.

difficult child has had the habit of buying things for his friends in the past, hasn't he? I think it is somehting you are only going to stop by removing his access to money until he grows up some more. Maybe it should be addressed wtih a therapist?

I really do think it is time to remove all the things he has abused from the house. He will eventually get the idea that taking $$ from mom won't be allowed.

Hugs,

susie

 

[janebrain]

Hi,
agreeing with Susie 100 percent. Also, yes, it was unrealistic for you to expect a 13 year old boy to go on rides with you. Your very presence is likely to be embarrassing to him for about the next 4 or 5 years. I remember my easy child son giving me instructions when I came to watch him play in an intermural basketball game when he was about that age. I was not to wave to him, not cheer for him, not acknowledge him in any way. I actually got quite a kick out of it. Do not take it personally, teenagers do not want their peers to know they actually have parents.

I think the more you give him the more he will try to take. Also, the nicer I was to my difficult child dtr the meaner she was to me. If I gave her an inch she took a mile. I worried way too much back then that she would hate me. Yes, she did hate me but she especially hated me when I was a wimp. She quit hating me when she got out on her own--she couldn't appreciate me til then.

I'm sorry husband is not backing you up. You really need someone to support you through being the tough mom and also with a boy they really need a man with a backbone and the confidence to be able to tell them no. Your husband is being a terrible role model for your son and tacitly approving of his disrespect towards women.

Sorry, hugs to you,
Jane

 

[Christy]

difficult child can't be trusted at this point. Cancel or change all your accounts. Take away computer, xbox, cell phone, etc. No fun outings. Be sure husband and you are on the same page and lay down the law so to speak. He has no regard for consequences and can't be trusted to make the right choice so you must take away the opportunity.

It sounds to me like you are trying to do fun things and build a positive relationship with your son but he is taking advantage of you. It is wonderful when we can be both a friend and parent to our child but there are times when you must be the authority and this is one of those times.

Good Luck
Christy

 

[DammitJanet]

Ok...my two cents after raising 3 boys. Maybe my boys were strange but they did like us as teens but I still wouldnt have expected them to ride many rides with us at a water park. Especially if a friend was available. We went to a combo amusement park/water park around that age and let them loose but to check in with us at least every two hours. Not a problem in the least.

I would never under any circumstances allow a 13 year old to charge anything to my room...or my card. They make good old fashioned cash for that.

You can change the credit card number on the xbox. Get a prepaid credit card and use that. Go to walmart and get one. And since he cant stop himself from abusing your money...take the cell. I had an awful time with Cory and phones when he was that age. We didnt have cells back then but he charged up over 2K in regular house phone charges. I was livid because I had to have a phone for my job. My house phone still has every block known to mankind on it. If you cant or dont want to take the cell phone...why do either of the phones need the ability to download anything on them? Phones really are just for talking on! Maybe you can have the unlimited texting put on but block everything else. No one needs to be downloading games and music if its going to cost someone else.

 

[Kjs]

difficult child and his friends never seemed to mind parents before. Actually he will hug me in front of friends - and they hug their parents infront of difficult child and me. His last words of every single
phone call regardless if it is arguing ...are I love you.
He says that to me when I leave the house for work even if his friends are there.

I just don't understand why he feels he has to be with someone, doing something every minute of every day. And why he lies.

husband allows everything. That is the hardest part. We both work hard, I work 2 jobs during school year, and I work crappy hours (midnight to noon) yet both boys think they can have whatever they want when they want it. We are not that way. Just don't get it. He didn't just get xbox or cell phone for nothing. They were birthday gift and xmas gift. And the ONLY gift. The computer is so very old and so very slow.

the boy that went to the waterpark with us has no mother. She passed away five years ago. I didn't ask how. But I heard him tell difficult child "you should go on some rides with your mom". They were on the balcony and I had the window open.

And no excuses for difficult child, he is totally disrespectful, ungrateful and acting like a spoiled brat. But ALL his friends have cell phones, XBOX, PS2 or 3. All have season passes to six flags.
All have computers and some have their own laptops. Yet most parents are divorced, most live in apartments. And most parents drive new vehicles. (we don't. FAR from it) I missed something somewhere. Cause we struggle to put gas in the car!