Feeling sick over what difficult child has said...

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Andrea Danielle, Jan 12, 2007.

  1. Andrea Danielle

    Andrea Danielle New Member

    Last night in the car, our 5 year old difficult child announced to us that when he is 8 he is going to be put in jail because he will "take" someone and murder them. We asked him a few questions about his murderous plan, he didn't tell us who he was planning to murder or why. He then started talking about his escape plan and how he would get out through a window. In case you are wondering, he watches very little TV and only very G rated things, I scrutinize everything before letting him watch it.

    He seems to be developing this image of himself being in jail in the future, he has mentioned it many times. Last week he told me that he thinks some day he will hurt me so badly that the police will put him in jail - this was after he hit me in the face during one of his rages. He has also asked his dad if he would get him out of jail by melting the bars with fire.

    I just feel like crying today, I should be working but just want to cry over what he thinks is in his future and pray that it is only his imagination and not a sign of what is to come!

    :9-07tears: :9-07tears: :9-07tears:

    Andrea
     
  2. tiredmommy

    tiredmommy Site Moderator

    Andrea-
    Call his psychiatrist, he may need a medication tweak.
     
  3. Andrea Danielle

    Andrea Danielle New Member

    Thanks TM but he has started any medications yet. We have been too chicken, but it seems more and more like we have no choice.
     
  4. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    If he's talking about killing someone, even though he's too young, I'd call psychiatrist and I'd give him the medications. He really sounds as if he needs them. If he has bipolar, he will need medications all his life. He probably feels way out of control and is scared of himself.
     
  5. Janna

    Janna New Member

    Aww, Andrea, I'm so sorry :9-07tears:

    I have no advice, haven't really had to deal with that with Dylan. A few times before we started the Lithium he stated he was going to kill our dog, but since he's been on the medications, no other incidents.

    I hope things get better. Sending hugs.

    Janna
     
  6. Lothlorien

    Lothlorien Active Member Staff Member

    That is pretty extreme for such a young one. I'd get him into the doctor too. I'm sorry things are this extreme. sending hugs.
     
  7. pepperidge

    pepperidge New Member

    You know, I think one possible interpretation is less that he wants to kill someone and more that he feels very guilty and bad and remorseful about what he does when he rages. I think I would make very sure that he knows that you love him--all of him--and that you are doing all that you can to help him control those rages. Unfortunately, one of the hardest things to put back together when the rages stop is the child's self esteem. So if they are bad, I think medications might be very helpful.

    sorry--it hurts to see your kid in such pain.
     
  8. busywend

    busywend Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Time to get the psychiatrist informed of this type of talk. It has to be scary for such a small one to think these things. Even if it does not seem like it is scary for him. At the very least he will soon realize he is different from others.
     
  9. SearchingForRainbows

    SearchingForRainbows Active Member

    Andrea, So sorry you are going through this!!! Before difficult child 1 began medication, he had extremely out-of-control violent rages. Once his dose of trileptal was high enough, the intensity of his anger diminished. He still refuses to do anything he does not want to do but, at least, he is no longer violent. I definitely would speak to his psychiatrist as the others have said. I don't really have any answers. All I know is that medication has been a blessing for difficult child 1 and for us. Hope things get better soon!!!WFEN
     
  10. kris

    kris New Member

    <font color="blue">oh, andrea. i know this is heartbreaking for you.

    i think now is the time to take the bull by the horns & start the medications. i'm give you the age old argument....if he had diabetes would you hesitate to start him on insulin in spite of the side effects. or if he had heart disease??

    i don't think this is about his future. it's about the here & now. i think he is asking you & husband to protect him from anger & thoughts that scare the beejeebus out of him. one very clear way is to get him on a solid medication regimen.

    deep breath....now dive.

    kris </font>
     
  11. Hanging-On

    Hanging-On New Member

    My difficult child use to talk like that. He's 7 yrs old now, and it's been in the last 2 yrs. I don't know if he out grew it, the medications stopped it, and the hospital stay he jsut had. I just wanted you to know that it may and can stop, but I think you have to be proactive I start thinking about what will help him, vs the evils of doctors, medications, and hospitals. I was very weary before too, but I see a huge difference now since he's actually gotten good professional help. Hope this helps.
     
  12. flutterbee

    flutterbee Guest

    [ QUOTE ]
    You know, I think one possible interpretation is less that he wants to kill someone and more that he feels very guilty and bad and remorseful about what he does when he rages.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That's exactly what I was thinking. Those kind of out of control feelings/rages must surely be scary for anyone experiencing them - especially a child.
     
  13. Star*

    Star* call 911........call 911

    AD,

    Hi there. Isn't it nice to have a place to come and type the words: My son hit me in the face and my son tells me how he is going to kill me in the future and no one flips out of the boat and swims to shore? Know why? been there done that, took the medications, saw the doctor, still in counseling, still taking medications, still seeing the doctor & still tweaking. For us it's been eleven years.

    There are those here that could tell you stories about their four year olds (back when) that would make your son's story seem very insignifigant, but since each child is different no one here can say for certain "Ah yes Andrea your son for certain will murder someone without medications or he won't ever do that if he doesn't have medications." That choice is yours as a parent.

    And (sadly) at five you must be sitting there thinking "medications?" "What about his liver, his heart, his spleen." with perfect reason for alarm. Anti-psychotics are pretty heavy duty, imagine the fear most of us here with older kids faced when there wasn't any research on the effects of these medications on children and a doctor handed them to us. My son is now 16 and has been on 64 medications. Has it helped? Some. Has it cured him? No. Did I ever expect a pill to? Sure. Was I wrong about that? Yes. Pills don't cure children with mental illnesses. They assist the brain of the child to get a calmer perspective on day to day activities so a behavior specialist can work with the child and the family to formulate a plan and goals for correcting behavior. I wish someone had told me this years ago.

    So what's the sense in considering medication? What's the sense in considering crutches when you break a foot? About the same difference. It's a help, not a cure. If you break a foot you still need to see the doctor, have therapy, and be monitored.

    As far as him hitting you in the face? WOW! Now there is a behavior that needs to be corrected NOW and never EVER repeated. But how? I'm curious what your psychologist said for him to do the next time he had a rage? If you don't give him a coping technique to replace the bad behavior with the next time he rages what's he supposed to do? How will you address this? Do you think it would be helpful to get schooled in therapeutic holds? It was a life saver for my nose and face. difficult child is 16 and still being restrained by people when he rages so it does work to keep the child and staff safe. Him crying after a rage and saying "I'll never do it again" is not helpful. He doesn't want to be 'bad', you dont' want him to behave 'bad', but I don't hear (read) anyone teaching him a way to cope with this anger. I'd probably attack that first with a psychologist, and get some family therapy.

    My DF had SUCH a FIT when difficult child's psychiatrist suggested 2 sessions a week. OMG you would have thought someone said "May I have your hunting rifle for life please?" Like it was a death sentence. THe first 1 hour session was for difficult child alone. This worked on CBT or cognitive behavior therapy. "RE-mapping" his brain for good behavior. It's not easy, it takes years, and it's hard. The second session for 1 hour was for the family. Mostly for us to go in and say things like "OMG you won't BEEEEEEEELIEVE what this kid did this week....and then for the parents who did NOT want to even go to therapy.....we blah balh blah for over 45 minutes...and GOOD GOD what a release. Then the last 15 minutes was a "What to work on the next week plan" and after 3 years of this...it's just starting to be a natural thing to not react, or yell, or freak out, and we are BOTH MUCH better parents for difficult child and have a better relationship with each other. difficult children LIVE to conquer and divide....slow and methodical your relationship goes right in the crapper. And you don't even know it. Therapy helped us all. Now we call it date night. Sounds nerdy, but it's been a no miss date for us, then a little dinner, more communication....and easier living at home.

    Didn't mean to drag on....but have much to say when it comes to parents who are on the fence about so many things. It's a scary dang world we live in. And we love our kids, no doubt about that. Some days I didn't like my kid. Wow - really don't miss saying that every day. But if I were back where you are with a 5 year old that I had and mine by the way DID want to kill me, and I did NOT take him to the hospital. (was still with dysfunctional bio dad) but at age 6 when he tried to kill the neighbor boy with a hay scythe? YUP.....we went to the ER, got an evaluation, went in the state mental hospital, got on medications and it's been Mr. Toads wild ride ever since.

    Hugs for your indecisions
    Star
     
  14. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    I don't want to upset people who have had to deal with terrifying situations, but I have a different view. While I do agree that you should tell the therapist, you need to handle this sort of thing as it crops up. And if you react with shock, horror and fear, you could be giving him some power - "wow, if I say these things I get attention. They're scared of me when I talk like this and I like how that feels, especially when I'm angry."

    I would respond in two ways:

    1) Comment on how unusual an idea this is and how it would make a good story, he could be a famous write. Why not write it down? (hopefully - you will get more details on how his mind is working, as well as maybe deflect him down a different purpose path);

    and

    2) When he says things like, "Maybe dad would come and melt the bars with fire to get me out," you respond with, "I'm sorry, dear, but if you're in jail because you broke the law, we must obey the law or we'll be in jail too. We can't get you out of jail if you've been put there for being bad - then we would be bad too."

    If you treat this as hypothetical and expand the discussion with him, you may find out more about where this is really coming from. It may make it easier to identify the problem; the degree of the problem; and to get help early. Draw him out if you can.

    And yes, let him know that you love him. You love his inventiveness and his ingenuity. You love his gentleness and kindness. Let him know that people do get angry sometimes but we have to learn to control that anger. We each make other people angry too, and if they reacted violently to every little thing we did, the world would be too violent a place to safely raise children.

    With encouraging him to write stories, you are hopefully trying to help him find the border between fantasy and reality. And if it turns out that he really does have a talent, that could also help by giving him a positive focus.

    I'm not saying there could not be a serious problem, only that sometimes as parents we need to think laterally in our coping from day to day.

    It's only an idea, it may not work. But I hope it does.

    Marg
     
  15. Andrea Danielle

    Andrea Danielle New Member

    I am overwhelmed by the amount of thoughtful advice I get here on this board - and yes, thank goodness I have a place where I can write about what he says and does and know that it won't frighten anyone. These are certainly not stories I can share with my friends at work!

    I have heard such amazing insights. I have a lot to think about. It brings me to tears reading your posts, you are all much more knowledgable than any therapist I can imagine, you have lived it!

    Thank you! Big hugs to all of you who have shared your insights.

    Andrea
     
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