Food stamps for fast food - REALLY???????

[flutterby]

So spending hundreds of millions of dollars of taxpayer money drug testing welfare recipients when it is showing right out the shoot that 98% are passing is the right thing to do. I think that's called spending a buck to save a penny. I live in the wrong damn country. What is wrong with a society that can criticize and demonize the poor while BofA, Exon, Boeing, GE and many, many more corporations raked in billions in profit, and paid no to little (as in 1.1% of their profit) in taxes, and many got tax refunds in the hundreds of millions. I can get the breakdown. I guess the poor are just an easy target.

Step - children's income is not counted until they are 18 and out of high school.

And when I was working and struggling to make ends meet while not qualifying for foodstamps, medicaid, or reduced lunches? I didn't have things like a cellphone and credit card debt when I was struggling to buy my kids' lunch and pay $200+ a month in insurance copays. I made $40,000 a year, plus child support. If I couldn't survive on that then I needed to rethink my finances and priorities.

 

[flutterby]

And corporations like BofA and Citibank that paid little to no taxes and got huge tax refunds? We had to bail them out for creating this mess in the first place. We need to direct our anger at the true fraudsters - corporate welfare.

 

[AnnieO]

Heather, if that's the case I'm reapplying. That is NOT what I was told! Though we're fine now, and I really won't...

 

[flutterby]

Step, I know firsthand that children's income doesn't count unless they are 18 AND out of high school. My son was working and they knew that and told me what I just stated.

 

[DammitJanet]

I could go and get the federal guidelines or tell you were to get them for different programs...but...the rules are different for different things. Heather is right for medicaid and Food stamps and cash assistance...a child's income is not counted as income in a "household" if they are under 18 and attending school. It all depends. Now for free lunches, it does depend. If a family receives any sort of assistance such as TANF, SSI, FS, or if the child is a foster child, then the family is approved automatically for free lunch, otherwise then they do have to count the entire family income and compare it to I believe it is 170% of the poverty level. Dont quote me on the percentage though.

In medicaid in my situation, I am not considered in the same household as Tony because we arent married and that was something that I actually thought about years ago and deliberately didnt get married. Only my income is counted.

And yes, I got very irritated when I was a caseworker and all those clients came in wearing fancy clothes that I couldnt afford with their kids in Air Jordans and dripping in gold (fake or not I have no clue). They were living in public housing, getting somewhere around 300 to 400 a month in cash, 600 or more in FS, their utilities paid, and probably have a boyfriend or two giving them cash on the side. Meanwhile I was working 50 hours a week to keep them in their benefits and bringing home 1100 a month if that and I had to pay for my own insurance and copays while they didnt have to pay anything for medication or copays. yeah sometimes I got irritated but I knew I was there for the people that werent dripping in gold and air jordans. I had more people who werent scamming than were...honestly.

 

[flutterby]

You know, I probably don't look "poor enough". I have nice clothes, but a limited supply. I have 2 pair of jeans, 2 pairs of capris, and about 4 or 5 shirts for summer and 4 or 5 for winter. But they are nice. I also have $100 shoes - 3 pairs that I've had for 3 years. Because of the bursitis in my SI joint, hips, knees, and the achilles tendonitis and plantar fasciaitis, those are the only shoes I can wear that limit my pain. However, my mom bought those clothes and shoes for me. But why should I feel the need to explain that? It's really no one else's business. She is also paying my rent and cable bill while I wait on the SSDI process. Otherwise I would be in the street. The cash assistance that people are "raking in"? In Ohio, for 2 people it's $375 a month, and if you get child support they take it. I get child support of $374 a month so there is no point in cash assistance. I also have nice "real" jewelry that I've had for years because I wasn't always poor. And my daughter has a nice cellphone (I have a tracfone that you get free for poor people that has 64 minutes put on it a month). However, it is on her brother's plan, he bought the phone for her, and pays the $10 a month it costs to add her line.

Would it make people happy if I dressed like I lived in a shack? If my son didn't add his sister to his phone plan? You can get some good finds at Goodwill. I've gotten namebrand clothes with the tags still on them for $2.50. Hell, I just donated 14 bags of shoes and clothes - some with tags, some shoes never worn - that I have no hope of ever getting into again. We have agencies here that provide free shoes and school supplies to needy families who sign up prior to the start of a school year. I've seen kids get nice shoes from there. People donate and some donate nicely. When I was working, my employer adopted a family every year at Christmas. We didn't buy them cheap stuff.

If you don't buy the right kind of food at the grocery store it's a problem. People are critical if you buy junk, and they're critical if you buy organic, or if you buy the expensive 96% fat free ground beef - you're wasting the food stamp money. Then people are critical because you don't look "poor enough". One news station did a segment where they denounced the poor people in today's society because, one example they used, 99.6% of "poor" (and they used quotes) people own a refrigerator. 25% own a microwave. Wow. I wonder how many have running water.

But you know what? The politician's plan has worked. Everyone is worked up over alleged abuse of the welfare system by poor people, taking their attention away from all of the waste, fraud, and corruption elsewhere that is costing this country billions of dollars.

 

[InsaneCdn]

It doesn't matter what kind of help you need... $$, therapist, medications.
If you do all that is in your power, the "right things", then you end up being "not needy enough". The ones who don't do anything for themselves? well... they need the help, right?

But that does NOT mean that I do not need help too.

Budgetting, knowing how to find the "good" stuff at thrift stores, learning the skills the therapist is teaching, etc. Having done all that, though... is never quite enough. I can repair jeans so you can't tell they were repaired (depending on the problem, of course). I can sew - with thrift-store fabric - and have some really neat things in the house, like matching curtains and place mats in the kitchen (for a grand total of $10 in supplies). You will have the things you are good at, too.

But sometimes it just is NOT enough. And no, I do not believe that you need to look like trash and live in trash, to be "poor enough".

 

[flutterby]

The ones who don't do anything for themselves? well... they need the help, right?

That's the problem right there - the line of thought that those who need help need it because they aren't doing anything for themselves. In this economy, 1 in 4 children is living in poverty. The number of people living in poverty today hasn't been seen since the Great Depression. Find a job? Where? Corporations are sitting on more cash on hand than at any time in the last 50 years, but they aren't creating jobs. At least not here. I'm sure they're creating plenty in India, China, and Cambodia. And what about the companies that advertise that only those who are "currently or recently employed need apply"?

BofA that had billions and profits and got a tax refund just announced the plan on laying off somewhere between 10,000 and 24,000 employees. GE that had billions in profit and got a tax refund is shipping 1,500 jobs overseas. And the employees they are keeping here? They are cutting their wages. Several hundred thousand government employees have lost their jobs. There are more people looking for work than there are jobs available. Many of these people are finding themselves poor and in need of government assistance for the first time in their lives. And the number of under-employed is staggering. People with college degrees working at Speedway for minimum wage. These people have families. Minimum wage is not a living wage. They would still qualify for food stamps and medicaid.

 

[ctmom05]

Allowing food stamps to be used at fast food restaurants is allowing folks to be less accountable.

 

[DDD]

It's a war between the "haves" and havenots" because the "middlers" are disappearing. Where are they? They are slipping into the "havenots" at an astounding rate. How I wish it was possible to believe that instead of dogma the tenets of religion could be practiced....world religions have alot of commonality in regard to how people should behave and treat others. Sigh! DDD

 

[DammitJanet]

I still think there could be a way to see the pro's and con's of the now allowing FS's to be used to buy hot foods. I have a huge feeling this has come about due to the fact that we have so many people becoming homeless due to foreclosures and now middle class families ending up living in their cars and not having anyway to cook. Not just the average homeless person that comes to mind when you think of one...you know, shopping cart homeless person.

Forever we have had shopping cart homeless folks and you couldnt buy hot foods with food stamps but suddenly we have a national crisis with foreclosures and a huge increase of people getting FS and more folks ending up homeless and living either in shelters or in their cars and now they are going to allow this new way of using FS's, it makes me curious.

 

[DaisyFace]

Janet--

You may be on to something there. I know there have been all kinds of "tent cities" popping up....both in cities and rural wooded areas.

Government sure does not want to add any programs to help these folks....but making FS rules a bit more "lax" as to what they can be spent on? THAT they might do...

 

[keista]

Flutterby, I hear what you are saying, and I agree. NO, you don't have to "look poor" (in my case sound poor - since I'm well spoken and intelligent, ppl have a hard time believing how poor I really am)

Generally I don't qualify for even food stamps because I *gasp* keep my money in a savings account. I make most of my money in Nov-Jan, and stash it in a bank, and take my "paychecks" from that. Unfortunately, it's considered "assets" despite the fact that I have to make it last the whole year. If I spent it frivolously, then I would qualify sooner, but then really would not have enough to live on. Yes, I get frustrated, and jump to judgement (I really do try not to because I know EVERYONE has their individual circumstances) because the system is so frustrating.


Regarding the drug testing. Yeah, 98% are passing the drug test. Guess what that means? It means this so called "entitlement program" IS working, it IS helping the ppl who it is designed to help! So, you ppl who what to cut that instead of "raising" corporate taxes, what are you beatching about? This so called "entitlement program" IS CLEAN. Small flaws just like with anything else. NOW lets focus on getting corporate America to pay their fair share for making their millions on the backs of the poor and middle class. I do NOT have a problem with trying to "clean up" these programs to prove a point. The point that if we ever did get rid of them, Corporate America (and America as a viable nation) would crumble.

I saw this very interesting piece a few weeks ago. http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7376848n&tag=contentMain;contentBody

This easily explains why some European countries' citizens seem to live "high on the hog" with their government programs. US companies set up "headquarters" elsewhere just to pay lower taxes. These countries get the benefit of American corporate $$$, but don't have the added population to support resulting in more $$$ per capita for them and less for US. What "everyone" doesn't get is that if these corporations ALL kept their money in the US and ALL paid their fair legitimate share of taxes, the resulting actual tax liability might indeed be LOWER. It's a vicious cycle, and a vicious system that needs to be fixed. And again I have NO problem implementing reasonable 'fixes' in any facet of the economy if I see logic in it.

by the way, my latest "favorite" person is the guy who hangs outside the CVS begging ppl to use his SNAP (food stamps) card in exchange for cash. He's smart. He's never there during SNAP telephone business hours, so no one can report him. Yes, I do get frustrated because almost on a daily basis I witness the abuse. The countless ppl who need and use these services responsibly, I don't see, but I know they are there, and when I see abuse, all I think is that those services could be used by someone else who truly needs them, but just missed the cutoff mark, because there are not enough funds to go around.

 

[DammitJanet]

Keista...you are losing money bigtime. Take that money out of the bank, bury it in the back yard. You arent earning near enough money in interest these days that you would get in food stamps. What is the interest rate these days- 0%? I think my bank had an * in the place that it showed the interest rates so we wouldnt ask! Heck, even if I am locked in at the 1.7 that I was getting in my poor basic savings account which has about 80 bucks, that wouldnt come close to the amount of FS a person could get a month. If all they are denying you on is assets, get rid of the assets. Just my advice.

 

[HaoZi]

Janet is right, forget the account and get a safe deposit box instead. There's plenty of people with access to cash that never mention it, and the deposit box is also a safe place to keep those important papers you don't want to risk ex getting his hands on in some way (and a perfect excuse to have one!).

 

[hearts and roses]

Keista...you are losing money bigtime. Take that money out of the bank, bury it in the back yard. You arent earning near enough money in interest these days that you would get in food stamps. What is the interest rate these days- 0%? I think my bank had an * in the place that it showed the interest rates so we wouldnt ask! Heck, even if I am locked in at the 1.7 that I was getting in my poor basic savings account which has about 80 bucks, that wouldnt come close to the amount of FS a person could get a month. If all they are denying you on is assets, get rid of the assets. Just my advice.

. While I have to agree with Janets logic, that is just the thing that would be considered fraud. Hiding assets so you can collect welfare, any kind of welfare, is fraud. And that is what so many recipients have learned to do. Instead of giving someone 'just enough' or, in most cases, barely enough, to get by...give them an opportunity, and give the tools, to learn fiscal responsibility, so they can be a success; teach them skills they can use in the real world, not just working for min wage...so they don't have to learn how to cheat the system or skirt the guidelines. I mean really, look at history-1945, 1965, 1985, 2005 and growing. Each one of those points in time either our country or a huge group of it's population were in financial crisis, usually relative to a social change, a war, presidential administration change or all three.

 

[keista]

Janet, at least here in FL, ppl could buy hot foods with FS for years already. They changed it after the 3 hurricanes, and never changed it back (at least I don't think they changed it back because the convenince store purchases I witness include hot foods)

Now if this change had come strictly from the govt's own "thought process" like it did for the hurricanes, it would be easier to get behind the idea. Problem is it came from corporate lobbying to try and increase profits. A better program would be to give restaurants incentives to donate leftover food instead of throwing it all out. I met a homeless man who dives into KFC's dumpster on a nightly basis to pull out all the FRESHLY cooked chicken that gets thrown out. Why don't these places donate the food to soup kitchens or ppl asking for them? Because even if it's donated, they are LEGALLY responsible for the food and if something goes "wrong" they can LEGALLY be sued. So, they would much rather throw away and waste this food instead of risking a law suit. And ppl still go hungry.

I'm not looking to judge ppl. I know what motivates a Mom to take her kids to McDonald's for a 'splurge' even if she can ill afford it. I get that we all need a treat now and then. I see these things, heck, I do these things. However, with this situation, I just see another example of corporate America looking to make more $$$ on the backs of the ppl they are actively trying to evade supporting (ie, not paying their fair share of taxes and lobbing to cut these programs instead).

 

[keista]

. While I have to agree with Janets logic, that is just the thing that would be considered fraud. Hiding assets so you can collect welfare, any kind of welfare, is fraud. And that is what so many recipients have learned to do. Instead of giving someone 'just enough' or, in most cases, barely enough, to get by...give them an opportunity, and give the tools, to learn fiscal responsibility, so they can be a success; teach them skills they can use in the real world, not just working for min wage...so they don't have to learn how to cheat the system or skirt the guidelines. I mean really, look at history-1945, 1965, 1985, 2005 and growing. Each one of those points in time either our country or a huge group of it's population were in financial crisis, usually relative to a social change, a war, presidential administration change or all three.

That's exactly how I feel. I am honest to a fault. Often makes it difficult to fill out forms as well. However, since reading this thread, I did realize that this year was a bad year, and that savings wasn't there and might look into applying for FS. Recovering from the stupid transmission repair is proving very difficult.

 

[HaoZi]

Having worked at convenience stores in FL, this was going on before those 'canes, it was all in how the registers were programmed and who was running them. Where I worked you input the amount of the item, then what it was (cigs, non-tax food, general taxable stuff, etc). You weren't supposed to code a ready food product as non-taxable - think those sandwiches that you heat up at the store. If they heated them before paying, it was taxable prepared food, if they paid first and THEN heated it, it was non-taxable and covered by food stamps. Not to say there weren't/aren't clerks that will ring stuff up as non-tax food on systems that are programmed like this, there certainly are, and plenty of it is done that way, too.

 

[HaoZi]

The other thing you can do is use that money to pay many of the bills up in advance, you're allowed (I think) $2k in assets. I had a friend that was advised to do that (by the agency) to dump her assets because it was the only way she was going to get assistance for her Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) daughter (medical assistance that was needed ASAP) after her ex got booted from his job and stopped paying support and kid's medical was lost.