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<blockquote data-quote="Marguerite" data-source="post: 374134" data-attributes="member: 1991"><p>Welcome.</p><p></p><p>I can hear people thinking, and I suspect a lot of you who know me can hear me thinking, too. Loudly.</p><p></p><p>A few comments - eye contact is an interesting one but increasingly, I think too much emphasis can be placed on this. A child who doesn't make a lot of eye contact, especially with people he doesn't know so well, is more likely to easily get a Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) diagnosis of some kind. But a child who DOES make eye contact shouldn't get it ruled out too fast.</p><p></p><p>IF your son has Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) in some form (I would suspect Asperger's, since there clearly is no language delay) then I would suspect it to be very high-functioning. However, it is possible to be high-functioning and still have moderate to severe impairment. There can also be more severe impairment in areas that have not yet become an issue. For example, a lot of kids with Asperger's go totally under the radar until their teens because they can manage academically while the schoolwork is fairly concrete. It is when it becomes more interpretive that the kid can academically slam into a brick wall and suddenly struggle.</p><p></p><p>What you need, is to get him a neuropsychologist evaluation. Also, Explosive Child is a great book, it will help.</p><p></p><p>But the first thing you need, is to forget standard parenting. This is not a kid you can try to control with discipline. Instead of you being the one to say, "Do this, go here, go there," you need to lead him and support him. This is a kid whose intense need for control can be directed into self-discipline at a much earlier age.</p><p></p><p>Aspie kids tend to be very law-abiding, but it is the law as they understand it. For example, he believed that he was entitled to go to the museum, it was promised and should not have been taken away. So he was taking steps to make sure it happened. Punishments are not a good idea with these kids. Instead, natural consequences are the way to go, because it is more logical and therefore more likely to be understood and accepted. If you had said, "Tomorrow we will go to the museum," and when he misbehaved (hit his sister, or whatever) you then said, "OK, no museum, you can't be good," in his eyes there is no reason for you to withdraw this other than you imposing your will on him, just because you can. However, if you said to him, I know I said we were going to the museum but instead we have to take your sister to the doctor, because you hit her and she has a bad lump on her head," then that is logical consequences.</p><p></p><p>Another important rule is to not withdraw privileges once earned. For example, if you said to him, "You were such a good boy this week, you have earned a trip to the museum," then that trip stands. A classic example was in the movie "The Black Balloon" where the autistic boy earns stars on his sticker chart fort good behaviour. But when he misbehaves (runs away for fun, in his underwear, then when he needs to use the bathroom he goes into the nearest house as if it is his own) his mother takes away two stars. The problem with this, is it connects the punishment with previous good behaviour and negates that good behaviour. BUT - this is, so often, what we do. A lot of the time when we punish our kids, we do it when we are angry and frustrated with the child. The child (especially a bright one, who are also often more focussed on trying to understand what the rules are) will rapidly connect your anger with your method of punishing, and see this (often rightly) as your frustration bering given an outlet. as a result, the Aspie child will see this as a valid coping strategy for frustration, and will also try to punish YOU when HE is frustrated. He may be punishing his sister for causing his frustration.</p><p></p><p>So what do you do?</p><p>You stop punishing out of your own frustration. Make any punishment a natural consequence ("You knocked over the milk jug, so there is no milk for anybody to drink"). Get away from crime and punishment, from action and blame. Sometimes it's not about blame. Sometimes bad things happen to good people and Aspies need to learn this.</p><p></p><p>The brighter the Aspie, the faster they learn. This is not always a good thing, because they learn the wrong way first, generally, and it is very difficult to unlearn it. Blame is a very fast lesson to learn, and as parents trying more traditional parenting methods, we inadvertently teach blame too well. We then have a child who, when something bad happens to them, goes looking for who to blame. </p><p></p><p>Another important aspect of Asperger's is much more apparent in the younger ones - lack of theory of mind. They DO learn this, but it takes longer and its absence causes some interesting and often confusing phenomena. This includes apparent lack of respect (it is subtly different and should not be punished as lack of respect or you perpetuate the problem) and also the tendency to act as if everyone else knows exactly what he is thinking or wanting.</p><p></p><p>I'll give you an example from a few years ago:</p><p></p><p>difficult child 3 was about 12 years old when he had to have a ganglion removed from his wrist. It required surgery under general anaesthetic. We had quite a few hurdles which I won't go into here. But we were at the hospital to see the surgeon to discuss test results etc. Now, difficult child 3's habit when we go to any doctor, is to make a bee-line for the toybox. The first thing he does is rummage around the books. He seeks out books he knows and has read before and although he began reading fluently in infancy, at 12 he still was not moving beyond the same books. He also preferred to read aloud. So rather than sit there in a waiting room with people we didn't know, listening to difficult child 3 reading Sesame Street or Spot books over and over, aloud, I said to him, "Why don't you read a book to the baby?"</p><p>There was a baby in the room, about six months old, and beginning to fuss. Boredom, I suspected. </p><p>difficult child 3 loved the idea and by this stage had collected all the different Spot books he could find. He went over to the baby and held them up. "Baby, which book would you like me to read?"</p><p>The baby aimlessly waved a hand, but stopped fussing. difficult child 3 took the random wave as an indication. "You want me to read this one? OK." And he began to read aloud. He showed the book to the baby (a good sign he is beginning to understand theory of mind at some level) and read to the baby as I used to read to him; trying to engage him. </p><p>"Where is Spot? Is he under the table? Can you see where Spot is?"</p><p>I was surprised difficult child 3 didn't get frustrated at the baby for not responding intelligibly, I did help out and said, "He doesn't talk yet, difficult child 3." But difficult child 3 didn't understand that. Remember - 12 years old and otherwise highly intelligent. Genius level.</p><p></p><p>My point is - a kid who doesn't have theory of mind properly, is a kid who instinctively believes that all minds are connected; if difficult child 3 wants juice and not milk, then of course I should know this automatically.</p><p></p><p>Once we were able to explain to difficult child 3 about his diagnosis, he began to understand. We also told him in a way that was not judgemental nor was it saying, "This is a handicap." For us, autism is simply a different way of brain functioning. It may bring problems at times, but there are gifts to compensate. What you do is begin with the child. Start by being where the child is, get into his head and use what is there to allow him to be himself. Don't try to change what is such an integral part of him. If he needs to stimulant to soothe his anxiety, then let him. But he can learn over time, to choose stimulant behaviours that are more socially acceptable (quieter noises; textures that are more understandable; other ways of adapting or coping).</p><p></p><p>Autism in the house can be frustrating, but it can also be exciting. Write down the interesting stuff and the fun stuff as well as the problem stuff. Diarising is valuable in so many ways.</p><p></p><p>Now of course I can't diagnose. None of us can here. But I strongly recommend you use Asperger's as a working hypothesis, until you know otherwise. You can't go too far wrong, and it might make a big improvement in how you cope with him.</p><p></p><p>I've only given you a tiny sample. There is so much more and not just from me.</p><p></p><p>Two final points for you:</p><p></p><p>1) Your child (whatever his diagnosis) is clearly highly intelligent and extremely logical. A highly intelligent child can also get bored easily and frankly, from my own experience, needs constant vigilance to ensure sufficient intellectual stimulation. I remember easy child's teachers saying, "I have to keep throwing more work at her! And harder work - she's still in Grade 1 but she's working at Grade 4 level already!" If they did not keep this up, she became disruptive. And that was a easy child!</p><p></p><p>2) Children do not choose to be naughty; instead, that generally want to please you. A law-abiding child even more so, wants to please you. A child who is having difficulty understanding the social rules (and who is therefore trying to mentally work out what they are for himself) is even more so trying to work out how to be like everyone else. High intelligence means he is also highly adaptable. Put the two together and it makes diagnosis a lot trickier; not because the child deliberately is hiding symptoms, but because he is trying always to be like everyone else, and is using every ounce of his intellect to achieve this. But he is motivated to be good. If he is not good, there is a good reason (from his point of view). Instead of punishing, try to find out where he went wrong (from his point of view) and role-play with him what he should have done. The aim of discipline is to teach him to get it right next time. If role-play and explanation works better, then you don't need to punish. Really. </p><p></p><p>This can take a bit to wrap your head around. But this diagnosis can be good news.</p><p></p><p>Welcome to the site. </p><p></p><p>Marg</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Marguerite, post: 374134, member: 1991"] Welcome. I can hear people thinking, and I suspect a lot of you who know me can hear me thinking, too. Loudly. A few comments - eye contact is an interesting one but increasingly, I think too much emphasis can be placed on this. A child who doesn't make a lot of eye contact, especially with people he doesn't know so well, is more likely to easily get a Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) diagnosis of some kind. But a child who DOES make eye contact shouldn't get it ruled out too fast. IF your son has Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) in some form (I would suspect Asperger's, since there clearly is no language delay) then I would suspect it to be very high-functioning. However, it is possible to be high-functioning and still have moderate to severe impairment. There can also be more severe impairment in areas that have not yet become an issue. For example, a lot of kids with Asperger's go totally under the radar until their teens because they can manage academically while the schoolwork is fairly concrete. It is when it becomes more interpretive that the kid can academically slam into a brick wall and suddenly struggle. What you need, is to get him a neuropsychologist evaluation. Also, Explosive Child is a great book, it will help. But the first thing you need, is to forget standard parenting. This is not a kid you can try to control with discipline. Instead of you being the one to say, "Do this, go here, go there," you need to lead him and support him. This is a kid whose intense need for control can be directed into self-discipline at a much earlier age. Aspie kids tend to be very law-abiding, but it is the law as they understand it. For example, he believed that he was entitled to go to the museum, it was promised and should not have been taken away. So he was taking steps to make sure it happened. Punishments are not a good idea with these kids. Instead, natural consequences are the way to go, because it is more logical and therefore more likely to be understood and accepted. If you had said, "Tomorrow we will go to the museum," and when he misbehaved (hit his sister, or whatever) you then said, "OK, no museum, you can't be good," in his eyes there is no reason for you to withdraw this other than you imposing your will on him, just because you can. However, if you said to him, I know I said we were going to the museum but instead we have to take your sister to the doctor, because you hit her and she has a bad lump on her head," then that is logical consequences. Another important rule is to not withdraw privileges once earned. For example, if you said to him, "You were such a good boy this week, you have earned a trip to the museum," then that trip stands. A classic example was in the movie "The Black Balloon" where the autistic boy earns stars on his sticker chart fort good behaviour. But when he misbehaves (runs away for fun, in his underwear, then when he needs to use the bathroom he goes into the nearest house as if it is his own) his mother takes away two stars. The problem with this, is it connects the punishment with previous good behaviour and negates that good behaviour. BUT - this is, so often, what we do. A lot of the time when we punish our kids, we do it when we are angry and frustrated with the child. The child (especially a bright one, who are also often more focussed on trying to understand what the rules are) will rapidly connect your anger with your method of punishing, and see this (often rightly) as your frustration bering given an outlet. as a result, the Aspie child will see this as a valid coping strategy for frustration, and will also try to punish YOU when HE is frustrated. He may be punishing his sister for causing his frustration. So what do you do? You stop punishing out of your own frustration. Make any punishment a natural consequence ("You knocked over the milk jug, so there is no milk for anybody to drink"). Get away from crime and punishment, from action and blame. Sometimes it's not about blame. Sometimes bad things happen to good people and Aspies need to learn this. The brighter the Aspie, the faster they learn. This is not always a good thing, because they learn the wrong way first, generally, and it is very difficult to unlearn it. Blame is a very fast lesson to learn, and as parents trying more traditional parenting methods, we inadvertently teach blame too well. We then have a child who, when something bad happens to them, goes looking for who to blame. Another important aspect of Asperger's is much more apparent in the younger ones - lack of theory of mind. They DO learn this, but it takes longer and its absence causes some interesting and often confusing phenomena. This includes apparent lack of respect (it is subtly different and should not be punished as lack of respect or you perpetuate the problem) and also the tendency to act as if everyone else knows exactly what he is thinking or wanting. I'll give you an example from a few years ago: difficult child 3 was about 12 years old when he had to have a ganglion removed from his wrist. It required surgery under general anaesthetic. We had quite a few hurdles which I won't go into here. But we were at the hospital to see the surgeon to discuss test results etc. Now, difficult child 3's habit when we go to any doctor, is to make a bee-line for the toybox. The first thing he does is rummage around the books. He seeks out books he knows and has read before and although he began reading fluently in infancy, at 12 he still was not moving beyond the same books. He also preferred to read aloud. So rather than sit there in a waiting room with people we didn't know, listening to difficult child 3 reading Sesame Street or Spot books over and over, aloud, I said to him, "Why don't you read a book to the baby?" There was a baby in the room, about six months old, and beginning to fuss. Boredom, I suspected. difficult child 3 loved the idea and by this stage had collected all the different Spot books he could find. He went over to the baby and held them up. "Baby, which book would you like me to read?" The baby aimlessly waved a hand, but stopped fussing. difficult child 3 took the random wave as an indication. "You want me to read this one? OK." And he began to read aloud. He showed the book to the baby (a good sign he is beginning to understand theory of mind at some level) and read to the baby as I used to read to him; trying to engage him. "Where is Spot? Is he under the table? Can you see where Spot is?" I was surprised difficult child 3 didn't get frustrated at the baby for not responding intelligibly, I did help out and said, "He doesn't talk yet, difficult child 3." But difficult child 3 didn't understand that. Remember - 12 years old and otherwise highly intelligent. Genius level. My point is - a kid who doesn't have theory of mind properly, is a kid who instinctively believes that all minds are connected; if difficult child 3 wants juice and not milk, then of course I should know this automatically. Once we were able to explain to difficult child 3 about his diagnosis, he began to understand. We also told him in a way that was not judgemental nor was it saying, "This is a handicap." For us, autism is simply a different way of brain functioning. It may bring problems at times, but there are gifts to compensate. What you do is begin with the child. Start by being where the child is, get into his head and use what is there to allow him to be himself. Don't try to change what is such an integral part of him. If he needs to stimulant to soothe his anxiety, then let him. But he can learn over time, to choose stimulant behaviours that are more socially acceptable (quieter noises; textures that are more understandable; other ways of adapting or coping). Autism in the house can be frustrating, but it can also be exciting. Write down the interesting stuff and the fun stuff as well as the problem stuff. Diarising is valuable in so many ways. Now of course I can't diagnose. None of us can here. But I strongly recommend you use Asperger's as a working hypothesis, until you know otherwise. You can't go too far wrong, and it might make a big improvement in how you cope with him. I've only given you a tiny sample. There is so much more and not just from me. Two final points for you: 1) Your child (whatever his diagnosis) is clearly highly intelligent and extremely logical. A highly intelligent child can also get bored easily and frankly, from my own experience, needs constant vigilance to ensure sufficient intellectual stimulation. I remember easy child's teachers saying, "I have to keep throwing more work at her! And harder work - she's still in Grade 1 but she's working at Grade 4 level already!" If they did not keep this up, she became disruptive. And that was a easy child! 2) Children do not choose to be naughty; instead, that generally want to please you. A law-abiding child even more so, wants to please you. A child who is having difficulty understanding the social rules (and who is therefore trying to mentally work out what they are for himself) is even more so trying to work out how to be like everyone else. High intelligence means he is also highly adaptable. Put the two together and it makes diagnosis a lot trickier; not because the child deliberately is hiding symptoms, but because he is trying always to be like everyone else, and is using every ounce of his intellect to achieve this. But he is motivated to be good. If he is not good, there is a good reason (from his point of view). Instead of punishing, try to find out where he went wrong (from his point of view) and role-play with him what he should have done. The aim of discipline is to teach him to get it right next time. If role-play and explanation works better, then you don't need to punish. Really. This can take a bit to wrap your head around. But this diagnosis can be good news. Welcome to the site. Marg [/QUOTE]
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