he's playing with fire

GoingNorth

Crazy Cat Lady
Thanks for posting this, Sig. Not being Christian, I am not aware of faith-based resources.

Worried, I hope I didn't sound too harsh in my post. It was meant in kindness, but I tend sometimes to be too blunt.
 

DammitJanet

Well-Known Member
I didnt think you were blunt GN.

I dont like the 12 step programs for myself. I have been to several of them and have not had good luck with any. I do think if you have a strong religious bent it might work better.
 

BusynMember

Well-Known Member
Personally, I think since one can say "I'm an atheist" anyone should be allowed to share what helps them. This poster is not trying to convert any of us.

I would call myself spiritual, but certainly not religious and I have gotten tons out of 12 Step. I had atheists in my group too. You don't need to make these sources religious unless you want to. in my opinion they are still good common sense.

The National Alliance for the Mentally Ill is not faith based at all. Neither are therapists who work for the county. I've gone to all of them.

The main message, whether tied to a certain religion or none is all, seems to come down to "Take care of yourself. Work on what you can control. Understand and accept that you can not change anyone else other than yourself." I have really not heard anyone tell me that I can do anything else and I'm glad because otherwise I'd be trying to change a grown up person who would not change and, at the same time, probably I'd neglect my other loved ones and I'd have no life of my own apart from trying to fix everyone around me whom I thought needed help. Even if you took God out of my favorite prayer, I believe it would make the same good sense:

"Grant me the SERENITY to accept the things I can not change,
The COURAGE to change the things I can,
And the WISDOM to know the difference."
 

DammitJanet

Well-Known Member
No one told this poster she couldnt post what helped her though if you read through our terms of services that is in there. I will repeat that I dont think GN was blunt. I assume you are referring to her as saying she is atheist. I dont remember that for a fact but maybe its so. I am not atheist but I dont particularly align myself with any organized religion and I will admit it bother's me when anyone starts spouting off quotes from the bible because I know we have members on this board who are from all different religions. Hence the reason we dont get into religious discussions.

One of the reasons - among many- that I am not fond of 12 step programs is the fact that they go on about a higher power. Sure they tell you that higher power could be anything including the fridge in the corner. That sort of tongue in cheek response did bother me. However that was not my main reason for not liking them. I have told my reasons before and I dont feel like getting into it again. I dont tell other's they shouldnt go just because I dont. One way doesnt make one of us better than the other. We just have different ways of coping.

Remember if you think someone has crossed the line to use the ability to report a post and one of us will check it out.
 

BusynMember

Well-Known Member
I'm not a Christian. It doesn't bother me when somebody talks about Buddhism, Christianity, or just non-sectarian ways of coping.
My post simply meant that, no matter what language the message is in (Buddhist, muslim, Jewish, Christian, humanist), the message to us is pretty much the same...you can't control it, you have to take care of yourself or you'll go crazy, and the only one you really do have any power over is yourself.
I was not aware you can't quote the Bible of your choice here. Personally, I am unfamiliar with the Bible so I don't really recognize the quotes. Didn't mean to make a big deal out of it. My main message was that, with all the different types of help I have gone for, the message has always been the same. "Let go, take care of you."
I have no problem with people of any faith or who have none. That is a very individual journey that we all take, just like the one we walk regarding our difficult children.
Janet, if you were talking to me about somebody having crossed the line, I don't believe anybody has.
 

Woriedmom

Member
Oh my goodness... I didn't mean in anyway to offend anyone, I only placed a very short paragraph of where I find my main source of comfort in all that I'm going through. As midwestmom says ...it all boils down to the same thing..."letting go", none of us has the ability to control these drug addicts...doesn't matter if they're our children even though that makes it the toughest part of all, for me anyway . Sig, I thank you very much for those articles...I've read several of them, I can relate to them. GN, I did not think you were harsh, I do appreciate you caring about my feelings. Basically, it doesn't make any difference what religion or belief a person has if any at all. Drugs can take over any persons life. No one is immune to it, it's like blood...regardless of race it all runs red.
I'm new in all this, finally came to realization that I do have a co-dependency problem. Only when a person recognize they have a problem can they begin to fix it, I like comfort in knowing that there is no damage that can't be repaired....there will be scars of course, but only once it is healed.

If we can move past that ...I do need some advice, I'm till trying to separate my controlling husband from my son
( his step-son...so he reminds me all the time). Um...should be concerned that because my husband never gave him any real love that this would have anything to do with my son choosing his lifestyle. Just so everyone knows...I married my husband in 2009 , my son was already almost 17 yrs. old so. My husband has never shown him any real love, only rules. says he showed my son love by allowing him to live with us despite him getting caught with weed and giving him warnings. Although there are books out here to help with our drug addict children...I mean adults, I can't find any that discuss when your kid doesn't get love from a parent...and in my opinion every boy needs a father.
I know I'm dealing with 2 separate issues here...one being my husband and my 20 yr. pot smoking son, is it even possible to keep these 2 problems separate?
 

toughlovin

Well-Known Member
I think the step relationships are complicated. I think you and your husband need to get some help looking at the roles of each of you in regards to your son. It sounds like your husband wants to step into the authoritarian parent role who sets some rules for your son.... but given that your son was 17 when you got married your son is not going to see him in that role.

And your husband may not love your son... he came into his life in a major way when there were already issues. We all love our difficult children partly because we knew them when they were small and that love grew and although at times now we might not like them very much we have a lot of history. So your husband is not going to feel about your son the way you do.

So I think you and your husband need to get some good therapy to clarify the issues between you and figure out roles and boundaries. I think it is imperiative that you do this and I hope your husband will agree to it.

TL


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Woriedmom

Member
Toughlovin, I just realized I used your username this morning before my husband went to work, he said to me "It's called toughlove"... I replied with " exactly, and where's your love?" . He said "thanks for starting my day off great"
( sarcastically speaking of course). No, I'm afraid my husband will never go to any counseling about anything for that matter. I don't know what I'm going to do. :torn: I keep telling my husband that I need to stay angry at my son but when he interferes somehow my anger turns at him. It's almost as if because I know that my husband is making choices out of anger and not love I want him to stay out of it. Boy, after reading that sentence I can see where it sounds really selfish of me. yicks

PS... I will add that my husband always refers to my son as "your son" he doesn't even say his name anymore.How cold is that?
 

BusynMember

Well-Known Member
WorriedMom, what difference does it make if your son got no love from one parent NOW? He can always get therapy for THAT, but he needs to get off the drugs. It doesn't matter why he's on them and i doubt he is on drugs because of simply a lack of parent since, nowadays, your son is livilng a sad but common life's issue. The drugs need to come first. You can not undo the past. None of us can, hon. Our adult kids, regardless of the reason, will not heal if they take drugs. There are many resources to help sober people with family issues, but one has to be clean in order to benefit.

I hate to tell more "my life" stories, but my mom hated me. She left me and disinherited me. She didn't even send my kids birthday cards. I was non-existent to her. I never had love from her and did need therapy for this. However, I chose not to drown my pain with drugs...I knew it wouldn't help. Many adopted kids don't use drugs and they were abandoned any way you look at it. Your son has chosen to mire any pain his has, for any reason he has it, in drugs which will only make things worse for him.

It is only when your mind is clear that you are able to heal your past wounds. I personally have read many books, MANY books, that indicate kids who grow up without a father figure are way more apt to take drugs. So there you go. It was a contribution. But he made that choice to deal with it that way and his only way out is to get clean.

How many kids live with their bio. or original adoptive fathers these days?

My oldest three saw a divorce, plus two were adopted. Double whammy. 36 did not use recreational drugs, but does drink every day and has prescription drugs that make me cringe. Scott never even tried a cigratte. Worried Mom, this child, who was adopted at age six from Hong Kong, used finding a wife of his heritage and his extreme religious beliefs to deal with the pain he felt of his abandonment and, worse, the fact that he lived in a cold orphanage until he was six years old. That was his way of dealing with it plus overachieving. He has his own business and makes in the millions. But he does not see us. That is another way he copes. Not healthy in every respect, and I miss him, but his lifestyle choices to blunt his pain. My youngest did take drugs after our divorce.

My younger two, both adopted, grew up in a stable home where we loved each other and neither got into any trouble at all and seem very happy. So I do think the dad/divorce/he left the kid mattered to my first three kids and the intact, loving family mucho empowered my youngest two.

So what? At least 50% of our kids in the US will live at some time with no bio. father and probably a new stepfather. Although the percentage is higher when the dad leaves, you can't time machine history. Your son needs to work on getting clean so he can join the others who lost a father and go into therapy and try to heal and be healthy.

It is not productive to try to figure out the why of it. Try to do what you do to help yourself. You will never know 100% why your son takes drugs. Maybe his bio. gather is prone to drug addiction and that makes your son prone to it also. Maybe he got in with bad peers and couldn't say no. Big problem with many of our difficult children. They do not have a lot of resiliency.

Keep trying to take care of yourself and if you religion helps you, by all means USE IT!!!!!!!!!

Hugs for your hurting mommy heart. I know you will get better as time goes on. Time is your friend. Do you have a therapist?
 

Nancy

Well-Known Member
Worried it's a shame that your husband does not have the feelings for your son that one would hope, he should have considered that when he asked you to marry him. However, that is no reason for your son to blame his problems on your husband but it is a good excuse I guess. It would be wonderful if your son could find a counselor that would help him deal with the issues that are interferring with him finding healthy outlets. There are many people who grow up with distant parents, they don't all turn to drugs.

If it were me, and you can only do what you feel comfortable with, I would tell my husband that if he can't support me then he should stay out of the discipline of my child. It is so important that the parents stick together when dealign with drug issues because kids will use this to further tear them apart.

I know we sometimes sound like a broken record here but I hope you can find some support for you whether that is al-anon or families anonymous or a counselor or community support group. You will be surprised that when you change so do those around you.
 

Childofmine

one day at a time
It is often said in 12-step meetings: Don't let whether or not you believe in God become a barrier. You simply have to believe in something greater than yourself.

The Universe, Nature, the group itself, the doorknob, goodness, mercy, whatever.

If you break down the 12 steps and even take the God part out of them if you so choose, they are simply a wonderful way to live life.

I am a Christian, and I see God as my Higher Power, in the interest of full disclosure.

I have heard people say that some 90% of people who are in recovery have done it with 12-step. There are some, and I know there are some on this board, who know of people who have done it without 12-step so that is definitely possible.

The point of my post is this: You don't have to believe in God to participate in 12-step.
 
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