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Family of Origin
Hey, Cedar, or anyone interested in FOO (Family of Origin) issues. Cedar, WHY NOW???
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<blockquote data-quote="BusynMember" data-source="post: 660299" data-attributes="member: 1550"><p>I wanted to write about a difference I see between your dysfunctional FOO, Cedar, and my dysfunctional FOO. And Copa, I think yours was more like mine, but you'll have to let us know.</p><p></p><p>Cedar, in spite of the hate, the backbiting, the nastiness, and the facade, your FOO was a bit enmeshed, it seems. You talked things over (translation gossipped meanly regarding mother and Sis) and were together a lot for family holidays. Please correct me if I'm wrong. That being said, if it is or was so, perhaps that is why you have more of a problem taking your identity back from them and making it your own, without them. Maybe that's why you long so much for a nice FOO. I mean, we all do, but I think you long for it the most of the three of us. And I think it is harder for you to look at your family and see that it's toxic because you really wanted them to be nice.</p><p></p><p>"If I'm just good enough, mommy will love me and sister will approve of me."</p><p></p><p>That's because of your kind heart.</p><p></p><p>I was meaner, I think.</p><p></p><p>I did try to be good, as far as not having sex, not using drugs, and not getting drunk in my teens. I wanted desperately to be good because I felt I was bad, (due to being told I was bad, selfish, lazy, etc. etc. etc.). But, if I'm honest, I mostly was my idea at the time of "good" for <em><strong>me.</strong></em> I wanted to respect myself. I wanted to be different from my peers who I saw as out of control and self-destructive. So I both did it because I knew mommy thought good girls didn't drug, have sex or drink, but I did it more because I wanted to be good and I adapted her belief system.</p><p></p><p>I really had no hope that my family would ever be normal. I wasn't sure what normal was, but I know it wasn't us.</p><p></p><p>I remember one night I was visiting my high school best friend who really had cool loving parents. Of course, my mother didn't agree. She thought they were "stuck up" and didn't watch their daughter closely enough. As if SHE watched what *I* did at all unless I cut my hair or dated a gentile. But that's neither hear nor there.</p><p></p><p>Many of my friends were younger than me and this one was 1 1/2 years my junior. I was seventeen and she was fifteen and she was sitting on her fathers lap, hugging him. Later, she told me she's a daddy's girl.</p><p></p><p>In my twisted mind, I found this very shocking. It never crossed my mind that any daughter could feel that attached to her father. My father was never home. I never sat on his lap...ever. It blew my mind in a way that tells me my ideas of parents and children was very skewed. I never said anything to her, but I thought they were both weird at the time.</p><p></p><p>I wish I could have been a daddy's girl when I was fifteen. He sat and talked to her and was always there for her, and she was close to her mom too. That also puzzled me. Her parents would sit with us in their huge family room and talk to us. I wondered why my friend even wanted her parents around when she was with her friends. I could tell they were nice people, but it was a concept I could not grasp. Parents and kids liking to hang together and talk. It was beyond what I was able to understand.</p><p></p><p>From the time I hit high school until I married and got out, all I wanted to do was be out of my parents house and somewhere out there...haha. A play on my nickname. I did not want to be home. I did not want to hear the fights. I did not want my mother to yell at me. I did not want my father to say things to my friends that embarrassed me that he thought were funny. I wanted to be gone as much as I could.</p><p></p><p>I had to get married and know HIS family to see w hat a nice family does and how they act. No, they aren't perfect. Yes, there are misunderstandings, although they aren't the Talk of the Town. But when times are tough they are there with love. They enjoy being together on holidays. They really love one another.</p><p></p><p>And this is what we did not have.</p><p></p><p>Only my dysfunctional FOO was not particularly enmeshed. Except that my mother did talk for hours on the phone to HER mother, my grandmother. And told her everything. EVERYTHING.</p><p></p><p>"There are no secrets in a family."</p><p></p><p>Like the day I got my period. How embarassed I felt. I didn't want to have it. Then I heard my mother, talking in a rare phone call to my father at his store and saying, "Hahaha! Our little girl just got her period! Can you bring home some Kotex?" (He owned a pharmacy).</p><p></p><p>Yep, I'm sure that made my father's day.</p><p></p><p>So, backing up, mother and grandma were enmeshed and remained so until my grandmother's death. However, they had a rather rocky relationship though because my grandmother, who I talked to every day, pretty much told me everything she said to her and told her everything I said to my mother. I remember the one time in her life my grandmother bought me a new clothes washer. Sure enough, Mother found out.</p><p></p><p>"YOU SELFISH GIRL! YOU DON'T TAKE ANYTHING FROM YOUR GRANDMOTHER! TAKE, TAKE, TAKE! That's all your do is take! How awful of you."</p><p></p><p>We were never allowed to accept anything offered to us, I guess, as this was the only time my grandmother offered to buy me something I desperately needed and I let her. So I was selfish. Why?</p><p></p><p>"You told her it was broke! YOU KNEW SHE'D BUY YOU ANOTHER ONE!"</p><p></p><p>Oh, really? I told her almost everything. We were like friends. She had never bought me anything before that. I was as shocked as anyone when she offered, but I really couldn't say no. Ok, I didn't want to go to the laundromat, and first husband was very cheap and that was his solution, so I *didn't* say no. I guess I could have and then been more honorable. But I accepted it.</p><p></p><p>Shame, shame!!!</p><p></p><p>The grandmother/me/mother emeshment was kind of odd. I was not enmeshed with my mother at all. I barely spoke to her as she was very unpleasant. But my grandmother brought us together by sharing everything we didn't want shared with one another.</p><p></p><p>"Your mother is so mean when she takes me shopping." (Grandmother)</p><p></p><p>So I'd get angry because I loved my grandmother. "Let ME take you. I won't get angry." And I didn't.</p><p></p><p>Battle over grandma?</p><p></p><p>Mother issues with my own mother?</p><p></p><p>Daughter vs. mother?</p><p></p><p>Her disowning me because I let grandmother buy me a washing machine she could well afford (and was very proud of that fact) and did not give her $5000 to only one of my children?</p><p></p><p>I think so.</p><p></p><p>So we were tied together in a strange way, but mother and I were not enmeshed. I truly enjoyed talkling to my grandmother. She was usually so very kind to me and we laughed like kids. We talked about our fvorite soap operas and everything else. But the one catch was, she'd tell my mother and I was always vulnerble to a nasty call from my mother, back when she still did call me, telling me what I did "baaaaaaaaaaaaad" this time.</p><p></p><p>I was not enmeshed with brother or sister.</p><p></p><p>We were not really enmeshed.</p><p></p><p>A few days ago, the family issue came up when I was talking to my hubby. He laughed and said, "Yeah, maybe you wish you had a nicer sister, but you can't MISS having a sister because you never had one. You and her would talk for six months then be off contact for years." He then chuckled as he talked about the cops, the e-mails, and how upset she got me. "You don't have a sister to miss, SWOT."</p><p></p><p>He's right. In my mind I probably think I was talking more often to her than I actually was. He's probably right that 2/3rds of our twenty years together were spent with me and Sissy not speaking.</p><p></p><p>My made family is not enmeshed either. That is so unhealthy.</p><p></p><p>Anyway, just my .02 again. I hope you are having a nice evening. And I'm waving to you too, Copa <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /> Hope you are well!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="BusynMember, post: 660299, member: 1550"] I wanted to write about a difference I see between your dysfunctional FOO, Cedar, and my dysfunctional FOO. And Copa, I think yours was more like mine, but you'll have to let us know. Cedar, in spite of the hate, the backbiting, the nastiness, and the facade, your FOO was a bit enmeshed, it seems. You talked things over (translation gossipped meanly regarding mother and Sis) and were together a lot for family holidays. Please correct me if I'm wrong. That being said, if it is or was so, perhaps that is why you have more of a problem taking your identity back from them and making it your own, without them. Maybe that's why you long so much for a nice FOO. I mean, we all do, but I think you long for it the most of the three of us. And I think it is harder for you to look at your family and see that it's toxic because you really wanted them to be nice. "If I'm just good enough, mommy will love me and sister will approve of me." That's because of your kind heart. I was meaner, I think. I did try to be good, as far as not having sex, not using drugs, and not getting drunk in my teens. I wanted desperately to be good because I felt I was bad, (due to being told I was bad, selfish, lazy, etc. etc. etc.). But, if I'm honest, I mostly was my idea at the time of "good" for [I][B]me.[/B][/I] I wanted to respect myself. I wanted to be different from my peers who I saw as out of control and self-destructive. So I both did it because I knew mommy thought good girls didn't drug, have sex or drink, but I did it more because I wanted to be good and I adapted her belief system. I really had no hope that my family would ever be normal. I wasn't sure what normal was, but I know it wasn't us. I remember one night I was visiting my high school best friend who really had cool loving parents. Of course, my mother didn't agree. She thought they were "stuck up" and didn't watch their daughter closely enough. As if SHE watched what *I* did at all unless I cut my hair or dated a gentile. But that's neither hear nor there. Many of my friends were younger than me and this one was 1 1/2 years my junior. I was seventeen and she was fifteen and she was sitting on her fathers lap, hugging him. Later, she told me she's a daddy's girl. In my twisted mind, I found this very shocking. It never crossed my mind that any daughter could feel that attached to her father. My father was never home. I never sat on his lap...ever. It blew my mind in a way that tells me my ideas of parents and children was very skewed. I never said anything to her, but I thought they were both weird at the time. I wish I could have been a daddy's girl when I was fifteen. He sat and talked to her and was always there for her, and she was close to her mom too. That also puzzled me. Her parents would sit with us in their huge family room and talk to us. I wondered why my friend even wanted her parents around when she was with her friends. I could tell they were nice people, but it was a concept I could not grasp. Parents and kids liking to hang together and talk. It was beyond what I was able to understand. From the time I hit high school until I married and got out, all I wanted to do was be out of my parents house and somewhere out there...haha. A play on my nickname. I did not want to be home. I did not want to hear the fights. I did not want my mother to yell at me. I did not want my father to say things to my friends that embarrassed me that he thought were funny. I wanted to be gone as much as I could. I had to get married and know HIS family to see w hat a nice family does and how they act. No, they aren't perfect. Yes, there are misunderstandings, although they aren't the Talk of the Town. But when times are tough they are there with love. They enjoy being together on holidays. They really love one another. And this is what we did not have. Only my dysfunctional FOO was not particularly enmeshed. Except that my mother did talk for hours on the phone to HER mother, my grandmother. And told her everything. EVERYTHING. "There are no secrets in a family." Like the day I got my period. How embarassed I felt. I didn't want to have it. Then I heard my mother, talking in a rare phone call to my father at his store and saying, "Hahaha! Our little girl just got her period! Can you bring home some Kotex?" (He owned a pharmacy). Yep, I'm sure that made my father's day. So, backing up, mother and grandma were enmeshed and remained so until my grandmother's death. However, they had a rather rocky relationship though because my grandmother, who I talked to every day, pretty much told me everything she said to her and told her everything I said to my mother. I remember the one time in her life my grandmother bought me a new clothes washer. Sure enough, Mother found out. "YOU SELFISH GIRL! YOU DON'T TAKE ANYTHING FROM YOUR GRANDMOTHER! TAKE, TAKE, TAKE! That's all your do is take! How awful of you." We were never allowed to accept anything offered to us, I guess, as this was the only time my grandmother offered to buy me something I desperately needed and I let her. So I was selfish. Why? "You told her it was broke! YOU KNEW SHE'D BUY YOU ANOTHER ONE!" Oh, really? I told her almost everything. We were like friends. She had never bought me anything before that. I was as shocked as anyone when she offered, but I really couldn't say no. Ok, I didn't want to go to the laundromat, and first husband was very cheap and that was his solution, so I *didn't* say no. I guess I could have and then been more honorable. But I accepted it. Shame, shame!!! The grandmother/me/mother emeshment was kind of odd. I was not enmeshed with my mother at all. I barely spoke to her as she was very unpleasant. But my grandmother brought us together by sharing everything we didn't want shared with one another. "Your mother is so mean when she takes me shopping." (Grandmother) So I'd get angry because I loved my grandmother. "Let ME take you. I won't get angry." And I didn't. Battle over grandma? Mother issues with my own mother? Daughter vs. mother? Her disowning me because I let grandmother buy me a washing machine she could well afford (and was very proud of that fact) and did not give her $5000 to only one of my children? I think so. So we were tied together in a strange way, but mother and I were not enmeshed. I truly enjoyed talkling to my grandmother. She was usually so very kind to me and we laughed like kids. We talked about our fvorite soap operas and everything else. But the one catch was, she'd tell my mother and I was always vulnerble to a nasty call from my mother, back when she still did call me, telling me what I did "baaaaaaaaaaaaad" this time. I was not enmeshed with brother or sister. We were not really enmeshed. A few days ago, the family issue came up when I was talking to my hubby. He laughed and said, "Yeah, maybe you wish you had a nicer sister, but you can't MISS having a sister because you never had one. You and her would talk for six months then be off contact for years." He then chuckled as he talked about the cops, the e-mails, and how upset she got me. "You don't have a sister to miss, SWOT." He's right. In my mind I probably think I was talking more often to her than I actually was. He's probably right that 2/3rds of our twenty years together were spent with me and Sissy not speaking. My made family is not enmeshed either. That is so unhealthy. Anyway, just my .02 again. I hope you are having a nice evening. And I'm waving to you too, Copa :) Hope you are well! [/QUOTE]
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Hey, Cedar, or anyone interested in FOO (Family of Origin) issues. Cedar, WHY NOW???
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