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Family of Origin
Hey, Cedar, or anyone interested in FOO (Family of Origin) issues. Cedar, WHY NOW???
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<blockquote data-quote="Copabanana" data-source="post: 661577" data-attributes="member: 18958"><p>This is from Lil and Jabber's thread.</p><p></p><p>I agree with you on this.</p><p></p><p>Healthy families communicate.</p><p>Unhealthy families see opportunity.</p><p>And seek to take advantage of the other in the unfortunate situation in which they find themselves. And heap on more.</p><p></p><p>I am struck at how generalized are the behaviors of our children.</p><p></p><p>This seems to be near universal:</p><p></p><p>Our Difficult Child</p><p></p><p>Does not understand or care how behaviors are experienced and perceived by others.</p><p>Nor does s/he care about the consequences of said behavior or feel responsibility for them.</p><p></p><p>Thus does not take responsibility to change their behaviors. </p><p></p><p>Rather they see the effects as the responsibility of others, in fact caused by others.</p><p></p><p>And insist that change needs to come from others not them.</p><p></p><p>This takes the form of:</p><p></p><p>Disparaging others, including the victim of the behavior itself, for overreacting.</p><p></p><p>And minimizing or even denying the upsetting behaviors themselves.</p><p></p><p>And if their terms are not accepted, they leave or do something similar.</p><p></p><p>Sounds like our mothers and sisters in relation to us, doesn't it Cedar?</p><p></p><p>M over and over again has said how struck he is that my son's attitudes and behaviors are so like those of my Mother and sister, even though there is no genetic relationship. </p><p></p><p>I do not like where I am going with this because I do not want to accept that my son is like my family.</p><p></p><p>No. I do not think so. I think they think they are loving. And to the extent that they are able, they do love.</p><p></p><p> I do not think they say they love us to set us up. At least in my family they don't. They say the words. And they believe themselves. And they may feel pretty when they say them. They lie to themselves as well as to us. They say I love you like they say thank you. It is hardly more than that.</p><p></p><p>Again I do not think they use love to bait the trap. At least in my family, I know my Mother loved me in the way she could.</p><p></p><p>I see it this way: We need love. We have nobody else. We have no way to know then that healthy parental love is something different than our parents' love. We fool ourselves. We do want love.</p><p>We are stuck.</p><p></p><p>I think it is us that bait the trap. We figure out: This is what they want. This behavior will generate more loving responses. This behavior leads to more cruel and hysterical responses.</p><p></p><p>I am good when I __.</p><p>I am bad when I ___.</p><p>Yes. If I were a better baby or girl...I could make it so Mama did not fall apart, get hysterical or lose control.</p><p></p><p>Hence, my reaction to my Mother's screams when she was at the Board and Care Home after I had told her she had to leave my house. Because while she was here, I had regressed 60 years and had become the tiny child that lived and died based upon her reactions.</p><p></p><p>To keep her happy I was at her beck and call 24 hours a day. And M would not let it go on. He stopped it and told me No more. It was his authority that permitted me to have a voice. I do not think I could have spoken for myself with my Mother in this circumstance.</p><p>Yes. The responsibility is limitless, bottomless. There is no way to accept the sense it does not work. Because the responsibility is always to try more, do more. Because it is always your fault to fix it. Your responsibility to clean up.</p><p></p><p>Hence my reactions to my son's moods and distress.</p><p>Virtually all children will use this dynamic in order to maintain the illusion of control over their lives.</p><p></p><p>It would be too horrible for them to accept that they live in a world that is so arbitrary and so cruel...and there is no escape from it....and nobody else to help them....so they invent the illusion that they control it.</p><p></p><p>That if they try really hard to do what Mommy wants...</p><p>If they could only do it perfectly and never fail....</p><p>If I am a good girl, Mommy will love me.</p><p></p><p>But she does not love me because I am a dirty little girl.</p><p>She does not love me because I make mistakes.</p><p>She does not love me because I got mad. Or cried.</p><p></p><p>I think in the Stockholm Syndrome which I have never studied the same dynamic is at work. There is an identification with the aggressor, the parent, in order to feel some control over a situation where they have none at all, the victim comes to love the kidnapper, and thus to please them.</p><p></p><p>Hi Cedar.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Copabanana, post: 661577, member: 18958"] This is from Lil and Jabber's thread. I agree with you on this. Healthy families communicate. Unhealthy families see opportunity. And seek to take advantage of the other in the unfortunate situation in which they find themselves. And heap on more. I am struck at how generalized are the behaviors of our children. This seems to be near universal: Our Difficult Child Does not understand or care how behaviors are experienced and perceived by others. Nor does s/he care about the consequences of said behavior or feel responsibility for them. Thus does not take responsibility to change their behaviors. Rather they see the effects as the responsibility of others, in fact caused by others. And insist that change needs to come from others not them. This takes the form of: Disparaging others, including the victim of the behavior itself, for overreacting. And minimizing or even denying the upsetting behaviors themselves. And if their terms are not accepted, they leave or do something similar. Sounds like our mothers and sisters in relation to us, doesn't it Cedar? M over and over again has said how struck he is that my son's attitudes and behaviors are so like those of my Mother and sister, even though there is no genetic relationship. I do not like where I am going with this because I do not want to accept that my son is like my family. No. I do not think so. I think they think they are loving. And to the extent that they are able, they do love. I do not think they say they love us to set us up. At least in my family they don't. They say the words. And they believe themselves. And they may feel pretty when they say them. They lie to themselves as well as to us. They say I love you like they say thank you. It is hardly more than that. Again I do not think they use love to bait the trap. At least in my family, I know my Mother loved me in the way she could. I see it this way: We need love. We have nobody else. We have no way to know then that healthy parental love is something different than our parents' love. We fool ourselves. We do want love. We are stuck. I think it is us that bait the trap. We figure out: This is what they want. This behavior will generate more loving responses. This behavior leads to more cruel and hysterical responses. I am good when I __. I am bad when I ___. Yes. If I were a better baby or girl...I could make it so Mama did not fall apart, get hysterical or lose control. Hence, my reaction to my Mother's screams when she was at the Board and Care Home after I had told her she had to leave my house. Because while she was here, I had regressed 60 years and had become the tiny child that lived and died based upon her reactions. To keep her happy I was at her beck and call 24 hours a day. And M would not let it go on. He stopped it and told me No more. It was his authority that permitted me to have a voice. I do not think I could have spoken for myself with my Mother in this circumstance. Yes. The responsibility is limitless, bottomless. There is no way to accept the sense it does not work. Because the responsibility is always to try more, do more. Because it is always your fault to fix it. Your responsibility to clean up. Hence my reactions to my son's moods and distress. Virtually all children will use this dynamic in order to maintain the illusion of control over their lives. It would be too horrible for them to accept that they live in a world that is so arbitrary and so cruel...and there is no escape from it....and nobody else to help them....so they invent the illusion that they control it. That if they try really hard to do what Mommy wants... If they could only do it perfectly and never fail.... If I am a good girl, Mommy will love me. But she does not love me because I am a dirty little girl. She does not love me because I make mistakes. She does not love me because I got mad. Or cried. I think in the Stockholm Syndrome which I have never studied the same dynamic is at work. There is an identification with the aggressor, the parent, in order to feel some control over a situation where they have none at all, the victim comes to love the kidnapper, and thus to please them. Hi Cedar. [/QUOTE]
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Hey, Cedar, or anyone interested in FOO (Family of Origin) issues. Cedar, WHY NOW???
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