Huge Families..The Duggars and The Bates...how do they do it?

[DDD]

I've watched the Duggars quite a few times and "met" their friends the Bates family. Obviously they are both deeply religious and devoted to their families. on the other hand I can't get how they afford to live so nicely with nineteen kids, no advanced education and (I don't think) family money. I have no criticism for either family but economically it just doesn't seem feasible that they can earn enough money doing guest appearances to support themselves. I'm curious. DDD

 

[Hound dog]

I get the impression with the Duggars that the father has his own business that seems to do really well. It also appears that for the most part Mom sews most of the kids' clothes. (I could be wrong I have only watched a few and found myself turned off). I know they shop at Aldi's, because you can see the bags on the show. And she makes really cheap simple bulk meals from what shows I've seen.......simple/bulk as in I dunno how those kids are growing properly. They have the enormous house they have now, because they built it themselves with no outside help whatsoever which made it tons cheaper. (they actually had any child old enough to hold a tool helping)

Only criticism I have with the Duggars (I dunno who the Bates are) is that mom seems obsessed with babies (under 1 yr) then literally passes the child off onto an older sibling to be cared for......as in totally.....as in eating, bathing, changing, laundry ect The only children she cares for personally, are the babies under 1 yr. She said so herself and seemed proud of it. Now having grown up in a large family, yes older sibs helped with younger, that was a given, and chores were just the way it was and no one questioned it. But no way in hades did we do all the care of our sibs. Eek! Well, no wonder she keeps popping babies out. omg If she truly had to do all or even most of the work involved she'd have stopped long long ago.

To each their own, I guess. But I have strong feelings that many of not the majority of her children will NOT be following in their mother's footsteps.

And my god what are they going to do with that house when those kids are all grown and gone??? If they sold it, who on earth would want it?

 

[Hound dog]

Oh, and now I'm certain they're getting a hefty profit from their show, which is probably why they agreed to it. Lord knows they're getting vacations paid for all over the darn world.

 

[witzend]

They conscript their girl children as child rearing slaves.

 

[Tiapet]

I just saw a blip about the Bates here last night on ABC's nightline. They apparently live right here outside of Knoxville. The local news has never had anything on them what so ever in the year I've lived here (including newspaper) so they must not be such a big deal or at least left to their own by the locals. The piece was about how the new show they are doing , like the Duggars, sent them "all expense paid" to NYC. They gave them 6 hotel rooms but they are only using 5 and of them they really are only using 3 of them because they feel they don't need them and are use to living like that anyway. It's "excess" to them. They are devotely southern baptist. The father has a "modest" tree business or landscaping business (can't recall clearly now) that they live off off. Mom homeschools the younger ones and a couple of the older ones are about to head off to college. They live in a 5 bedroom house though they didn't say that it was built for or that they built it themselves. They have no cable or internet, no luxuries at all

If you go here. and then look at the right for "bates family" you will see the video link to the story.

 

[DammitJanet]

I would be in the loony bin if I had that many kids. Look at what octomom is doing now? everything from semi-porn to octoloans. Thats right, you can get an octoloan...lol. I think the max is 1400 dollars...lmao...or maybe it is 800...dont know, I was in such shock I didnt pay attention to the amount.

 

[Kathy813]

They are far more than conservative southern baptist. They are members of the Quiverfull movement who believe that they are raising an army for God and reject any form of birth control to allow the largest possible families they can have.. They follow a man name Gothard who has very strict rules on gender roles, clothes, and reproductive rights. He forbids any form of birth control and would like to see that become the law of the land. You can google him to find out more.

The girls are basically slaves who raise their younger siblings and do all of the housework. They are raised with no options in life other than to wait for the man that Daddy picks for them so they can become wives and mothers of a large brood of children just like their mothers. They are not allowed to aspire to anything other the role of wife and mother. Oprah offered to fund the college educations for the four oldest Duggar girls and the Duggars turned them down. The parents thought that there was no need for higher education for girls since their roles are to be a "helpmeet' to their husbands who are the "headship" of the family.

Erin Bates has been allowed to take a few college music classes but she has to have a chaperone with her at all times even though it is at a very conservative fundamentalist college. The families that follow Gothard really don't believe in higher education for any of their children. The boys are encouraged to start businesses like car lots or towing businesses. I think they are afraid they will be exposed to the outside world and realize how much they are missing.

It's all very scary (although fascinating) when you look into it. I think it is a cult.

~Kathy

 

[DDD]

Good Grief, Kathy. You and I are friends and I trust your input but that is "wow". I've been assuming that the Duggar girls will hook up with the Bates boys but had no infor on the common denominator of one religious leader. Yikes.DDD

 

[Marcie Mac]

Hmmmm and not a difficult child among them

Marcie

 

[mstang67chic]

There is a man where I work who belongs to the same church as the Duggars and, so I hear, his family is friends with the Duggars. They have 13 children so far, mostly girls. They have to have other income because I can't see his salary supporting 15 people. Although, after 10 kids, you don't pay taxes so I'm sure that helps some but it still can't add up to a lot given the size of his family. One thing though...his (i'm guessing) oldest daughter has been working with us as summer help. Instead of the long skirts or dresses I've seen her sisters wear at company outings, she wears pants, capris, and a few dresses that are short enough I'm surprised she's allowed to wear them at work. While her hair is still past her shoulders, it's relatively short, she wears makeup and jewelry. I don't know him well enough to ask anything but I have seen him in the lunch room looking at her outfits with an "unspoke" eye roll that Dad's seem to perfect. You can tell he's not happy but she's of age so.....

 

[Kathy813]

They don't get a chance to be difficult child's. They have no contact with anyone other than their families or other families that think just like them. There is no chance for exposure to drugs or unsavory friends. They are homeschooled to limit exposure to the outside world and the Internet access is severely restricted and monitored. They are not allowed to have their own opinions on anything and always have a sibling with them to chaperone. Their "servant hearts" are drilled (and in some cases beaten) into them at early ages.

I have done a lot of research on the fundamentalist culture and have been shocked at what I have learned. None of this is shown on Nineteen Kids and Counting since it would turn off the mainstream audience.There are websites dedicated to the Duggars and other fundamentalist families that have exposed all of this.

Google Blanket Training and Michael Pearl. Blanket training involves putting an infant on a blanket and holding out a toy and then swatting the infant's hand when he/she reaches for the toy. You continue to do this until the infant learns not to move off the blanket. Michael Pearl is a Christian fundamentalist pastor, missionary, evangelist and book author. He is best known for his controversial book, written with his wife Debi Pearl, entitled To Train Up A Child. In the book, Pearl advocates beating children with a plumbing line. Michelle has admitted to Blanket Training and there used to be a link to the Pearl book on the Duggar website before they got the TLC show.

When I first started watching the show, I used to marvel at how well behaved the children were. Now it seems much more sinister to me.

~Kathy

 

[Kathy813]

Many of the fundamentalist families have had one child (or more) break away from the family beliefs. I am hoping that at least some of the Duggar girls escape and go to college and meet a nice man that they actually get to kiss before they get married.

~Kathy

 

[DDD]

Their son married a Florida girl from a small family. Don't know how they hooked up but they do seem to be on the same path. Both the Duggars and the Bates built their own homes...at least I saw a show where the Duggar family traveled to help the Bates finish their new place. I also saw two of the Duggar teens travel out of the country with other teens who were not so conservative.

Very interesting, Kathy. I thought they were Southern Baptists. I'll read about it. DDD

 

[DDD]

I had known, but forgotten, that Jim Bob Duggar was in the House of Representatives in Arkansas. Maybe that's where the money came from, lol. He also sold real estate. They are listed as Baptist by the way on their web site and on Wipedia. DDD

 

[Kathy813]

They call themselves Southern Baptist but have church in their homes and it is not what most people would call traditional Southern Baptist. Jim Bob made his money in real estate and selling used cars. However, they lived in a very small house and didn't have much until picked up by TLC. The big house was built after they started making money on their television series. The trips are paid for by TLC. Their lives have dramatically changed since becoming famous. Even their home sewed frumpers (frumpy jumpers) have been replaced by more stylish name brand clothes. The girls are still not allowed to wear pants or sleeveless tops and and are made to wear "modest" swimwear.

The Bates also lived in a very small house until becoming involved with TLC. TLC filmed episodes of the Duggars helping the Bates build the house. The Bates have admited having to borrow money from their oldest son Lawson to buy food at times. They also do not have health care and have said that they just go to the emergency room for their health care. I guess the rest of us pay for it although I am sure that they are against the affordable health care act.

Most of the fundamentalists in the Quiverfull movement do not live that well. One of Anna's sisters lives in a pop-up trailer with her husband and seven kids. Josh met Anna at an ATI (Gothard) gathering in Texas. They were not allowed to be alone or kiss until after they were married. They were allowed to hold hands but even that is not allowed by some of the even more hard-core ATI followers.

You are seeing a very sanitized view of the Duggars and Bates on those shows.

 

[DDD]

OMG....I literally will say a prayer for Anna's sister. Yikes. DDD

 

[JJJ]

Being Catholic, I know several families with 7-10 children and it really only works well when they are all PCs. Toss a difficult child into the mix and it becomes very, very difficult.

 

[InsaneCdn]

I've been trying to find the right words, because reactions to this situation have a certain bias.

On one hand... really, is it a problem for the girls to not wear pants? not have access to all sorts of technology?
Lots of cultures, all over the world, don't believe in early dating, nor in uncontrolled relationships. Lots of cultures proscribe all sorts of behaviours including dress. Western-style dating doesn't necessarily produce stable relationships. There are many variations... some more inherently fair than others. Personally, I still find a fully-arranged marriage tough to swallow; I do believe the individuals need to be involved in the process. I know some very strict sects in our parts where there is NO dating, but it's a fairly tight-knit community, and they all know each other from group functions. And even in that environment, the young woman has the right to turn down any suitor, even if her parents approve. We need to be careful not to judge others by what we perceive to be a "common" standard, because it may not be as common as we think.

But. The parenting style IS a problem. The enforced submission training means that these kids either "follow the plan" or they rebel. But if they rebel, they do not have the skills they need to survive in the "real" world, and often end up in abusive relationships. The lack of normal parental bond is an issue. I've been around large families, too - some are because of culture, some are a matter of religion, some just want a big family. And yes, the older ones help out, but... parenting isn't handed off. The parents are "the" parents, and do their best to develop a strong personal bond with every kid.

 

[Kathy813]

Insane, it is a problem if the girls are given no choices in the matter. And yes, I have a big problem with cultures where girls are considered property to be handed in marriage from one male to another.

The Saudis would defend their treatment of women as cultural or religious. That doesn't make it right. I have no problem judging a culture where women are covered head-to-toe in burkas and are not allowed to drive, vote, or leave the house without a male chaperone. If we substituted blacks in for women in the same sentence people would be outraged. For some reason, it is okay for women to be subjugated in the guise of cultural or religious differences.

I guess my bias is showing.

 

[InsaneCdn]

Insane, it is a problem if the girls are given no choices in the matter. And yes, I have a big problem with cultures where girls are considered property to be handed in marriage from one male to another.



Read more: http://www.conductdisorders.com/for...ars-bates-how-do-they-do-49895/#ixzz23Occy24x​

Just to clarify... I did not say I agreed with THIS part of their culture.
The point was more along the lines of lighter stuff, like dress-codes.

Even in some of the non-dating cultures we have around us where I live, the girl still has rights - as in, the right to refuse. It doesn't matter what her parents think, they cannot force her into marriage. That has got to be the absolute minimum, in my books.