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<blockquote data-quote="buddy" data-source="post: 511958" data-attributes="member: 12886"><p>No, you sound like you have a really good staff in terms of care and involvement but an IEP is an Individualized Education Program and it is a mandated plan for special education if a child qualifies under certain federal disability areas. Some schools are really good at working with kids with special needs regardless of being in special education. The problem is...and I am just going to say this and HOPE that you will NOT have to travel this road...but you can always get off if things dont go this way... (many people have to fight for years and are not given ALL of the help they need). So what happens with a child like yours who does really well following adult directions especially when young and things are put at his level, who has these "gifts" in areas and kind of dont fit into any category perfectly.... they often do ok at the beginning and year after year as social demands increase, more need for independent work increases, more corrections (most things are wonderful no matter how they do in grade K and even grade one right??)... then they start to show their limits. Frustrations mount and kids get labeled as behavior challenges when really there are these underlying issues that are driving them to distraction (or over attention in some situations). </p><p></p><p>Special Education costs money, it is mandated and they must follow certain rules and you have rights and responsibilities too. </p><p></p><p>Yes, the schools also do free evaluations and many are wonderful. Some, especially for kids who are not so obvious as to their needs or who have complex needs, can be not complete enough so getting the private data is good for you to have to back up what you are saying. The school mandate is clear... the disability must affect their school performance. So, even if a child has CP for example, they would not necessarily have an IEP unless there is some reason they were impaired enough to not be able to do what the other kids in school could do including interaction with others, getting around the building, learning in ways the gen. ed. kids were learning etc. In the medical arena, the testing can lead to private therapies which can focus on any developmental challenges. As long as they fell within a certain score that insurance says qualifies them (or if you are willing to pay). So both have limits and both have benefits. </p><p></p><p>I do both for my son, have since he was little. I am a school speech pathologist and have always encouraged people to have outside therapy if their child had any significant developmental issue.... in school we tie it to more current school academic and social goals where in the medical community they can focus more on some of the underlying issues. Does that make sense? It can be TOTALLY frustrating. </p><p></p><p>This is just an impression from what you are writing... I imagine your son like many students I have had so I am clearly biased and could be WAY off the mark so really just take this for what it is worth...</p><p></p><p>When you talk about lining up cars, having them disrupted leading to a fit....that is a story TONS of us with kids with autism can tell. Some kids call them parking lots. Some kids line up little plastic animals, or other figures...some like trains. some like airplanes. Does your son have an area of interest he is especially focused on?? That he notices everywhere or maybe can't miss a tv show about?? You also mentioned the visual strengths and a large group of people with autism are VERY visual, and indeed many autism teaching methods focus on using low verbal and high visual input. My son saw his first Nascar race when about 7 or 8 and he memorized every number and name the first race. He sees words and signs and his brain captures the information. Does this abiity help him in school?... only if the teachers use this as a teaching tool, so in general...not so much. But for some kids it can be a great tool to help them learn. The adhd stuff, well many teachers I work with, especially those who also have Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) kids of their own say that they think adhd should be added as a possible symptom of autism because these kids for multiple reasons (not always the same as primary adhd kids) have trouble with hyperactivity, attention, aggression, and also they may show symptoms that match ODD and Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD). </p><p></p><p>You also mentioned the sensory things... huge red flag. even if no autism, those kinds of symptoms are really debilitating for some kids and they can be more intense at different times in their lives. </p><p></p><p>When you say he has friends, does he do back and forth imaginative play with them? Or is it more playing side by side with shared toys.... or doing the same kinds of scripts over and over? That would be a clue but again...no one symptom has to be there or not be there. Does he do better with adults than kids? </p><p></p><p>There is this whole group of kids who fall (for now, the criteria in the DSM are changing but the kids will still be there, sigh) into a category of Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) (the medical word used for Autism Spectrum Disorder) which is Pervasive Developmental Disorder. When docs do the diagnosis for Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) they put them into a group... either autistic, Rett's syndrome, Asperger's Syndrome, etc... and the final category is Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD)-not otherwise specified which means not otherwise specified...those are kids who have a little of this, a little of that, but dont really meet criteria to be fully called Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) (or Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD)). In the schools the criteria is similar but the educational category is called Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) and there are some different words used in the groups of characteristics that they have to show to qualify for programming. FOr some kids it is easier to be qualified as Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) in the schools and for some it is much harder... depends on the kid, the professionals, the school, the district and the state!--HOw is that for frustrating??? (really the same is often true for many sp ed. categories, just really hard to get services for some kids).</p><p></p><p>That all said, when you say that his dad maybe had Bipolar, that could be a huge red flag for a mood disorder instead or too. THen again (stop my brain now please, sorry....) IT could be that your ex was also somewhere on the spectrum, in a mild/high functioning way and those are the symptoms you were having a hard time living with...</p><p></p><p>People with autism who actually function fairly well in life still may have :</p><p>black and white thinking</p><p>rigid rules about what to do or not to do</p><p>a hard time taking the perspective or feeling for another person (but not that it is NOT there, just may be less than most neuro typical people can do)</p><p>a hard time with change in plans or routines</p><p>they may go on and on about a subject even when people around are really not interested, they may not pick up the clues and may do this repeatedly when you see them.</p><p>may not interpret tone of voice or facial expressions well, may have not great eye contact and may have a speaking manner that is not quite as full of inflection as others.</p><p>BIG reactions to things that others would think are not such a big deal/ may totally miss out on reacting to things that people around them feel is a big deal. (and their opinions are THE opinions)</p><p>Anxiety... a big issue</p><p></p><p>Does any of that sound like your ex? Certainly not meant to be a symptom checklist, just some things in my experience that people will even say about themselves once they realize they have a child with autistic issues. And some of the things that pop into mind when I am around older teens and adults with autism-like or Asperger's issues.</p><p> </p><p>So, here is why I took the time to write this... MANY people are told NO WAY this kid is autistic (heck even my kid was once and he had already had the diagnosis since age 2!)....especially if they have some skills for interaction, have ok eye contact and can discuss some imaginative things (but people dont dig enough to see it may be more rote or scripted but they may also just do ok in that area). Many general professionals just do not understand or really embrace the whole "spectrum" concept of autism. And in some cases they are right to hold off. But in others, it may rob you of a chance for early intervention. IF they are unwilling to go there, then finding out the specific issues like you have... including sensory issues etc... still can be addressed. Knowing his learning style is visual then you can (with an IEP) have accommodations that specifically say that things need to be presented to him visually to help him learn and to work on his behaviors through visual means (often kids with these issues are TOLD thru verbal means to stop, and given a bunch of emphatic directions which just increases their level of disorganization and makes the behaviors worse). </p><p></p><p>SD by the way...means school district. </p><p></p><p>Do you have any autism specialty clinics where you could see if his insurance would pay for that specific evaluation? (there are protocols just to look at Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) and that could help you sort this out since you have so many other pieces)</p><p></p><p>OK clearly this is an area I am a little more comfortable with so again, to be clear I am not saying you ARE dealing with this... just presenting you with some of the issues and pit falls many people have faced in hopes that you can avoid years of heart ache if you ever do feel this is something to be investigated further.</p><p></p><p>Many parents here have other experiences (I am hoping they will share with you their experiences with ADHD and some of the co-morbid conditions that might help you account for what is going on)....and I will leave it to them to bombard you as I just did (smile!) because if they have lived it they can help you understand more. Same for people who have kids with mood disorders.</p><p></p><p>OK, I wrote a book, so I will stop. Good sites for Special Education. rules include </p><p></p><p>writeslaw <a href="http://www.wrightslaw.com/info/child.find.index.htm" target="_blank">http://www.wrightslaw.com/info/child.find.index.htm</a></p><p></p><p>PACER (this is based in MN but they do national outreach and there are many other states with organizations like this. the sp ed rules are FEDERALLY mandated so many are similar but states can interpret some and choose to have higher standards than the feds...just not LOWER standards) <a href="http://www.pacer.org/" target="_blank">http://www.pacer.org/</a></p><p></p><p>If you just google IEP or Individual Education Program and your state then you might find more resources. About.com has some good info too.</p><p></p><p>HUGS and sorry I went on and on... LOL, maybe a little Asperger's in me??</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="buddy, post: 511958, member: 12886"] No, you sound like you have a really good staff in terms of care and involvement but an IEP is an Individualized Education Program and it is a mandated plan for special education if a child qualifies under certain federal disability areas. Some schools are really good at working with kids with special needs regardless of being in special education. The problem is...and I am just going to say this and HOPE that you will NOT have to travel this road...but you can always get off if things dont go this way... (many people have to fight for years and are not given ALL of the help they need). So what happens with a child like yours who does really well following adult directions especially when young and things are put at his level, who has these "gifts" in areas and kind of dont fit into any category perfectly.... they often do ok at the beginning and year after year as social demands increase, more need for independent work increases, more corrections (most things are wonderful no matter how they do in grade K and even grade one right??)... then they start to show their limits. Frustrations mount and kids get labeled as behavior challenges when really there are these underlying issues that are driving them to distraction (or over attention in some situations). Special Education costs money, it is mandated and they must follow certain rules and you have rights and responsibilities too. Yes, the schools also do free evaluations and many are wonderful. Some, especially for kids who are not so obvious as to their needs or who have complex needs, can be not complete enough so getting the private data is good for you to have to back up what you are saying. The school mandate is clear... the disability must affect their school performance. So, even if a child has CP for example, they would not necessarily have an IEP unless there is some reason they were impaired enough to not be able to do what the other kids in school could do including interaction with others, getting around the building, learning in ways the gen. ed. kids were learning etc. In the medical arena, the testing can lead to private therapies which can focus on any developmental challenges. As long as they fell within a certain score that insurance says qualifies them (or if you are willing to pay). So both have limits and both have benefits. I do both for my son, have since he was little. I am a school speech pathologist and have always encouraged people to have outside therapy if their child had any significant developmental issue.... in school we tie it to more current school academic and social goals where in the medical community they can focus more on some of the underlying issues. Does that make sense? It can be TOTALLY frustrating. This is just an impression from what you are writing... I imagine your son like many students I have had so I am clearly biased and could be WAY off the mark so really just take this for what it is worth... When you talk about lining up cars, having them disrupted leading to a fit....that is a story TONS of us with kids with autism can tell. Some kids call them parking lots. Some kids line up little plastic animals, or other figures...some like trains. some like airplanes. Does your son have an area of interest he is especially focused on?? That he notices everywhere or maybe can't miss a tv show about?? You also mentioned the visual strengths and a large group of people with autism are VERY visual, and indeed many autism teaching methods focus on using low verbal and high visual input. My son saw his first Nascar race when about 7 or 8 and he memorized every number and name the first race. He sees words and signs and his brain captures the information. Does this abiity help him in school?... only if the teachers use this as a teaching tool, so in general...not so much. But for some kids it can be a great tool to help them learn. The adhd stuff, well many teachers I work with, especially those who also have Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) kids of their own say that they think adhd should be added as a possible symptom of autism because these kids for multiple reasons (not always the same as primary adhd kids) have trouble with hyperactivity, attention, aggression, and also they may show symptoms that match ODD and Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD). You also mentioned the sensory things... huge red flag. even if no autism, those kinds of symptoms are really debilitating for some kids and they can be more intense at different times in their lives. When you say he has friends, does he do back and forth imaginative play with them? Or is it more playing side by side with shared toys.... or doing the same kinds of scripts over and over? That would be a clue but again...no one symptom has to be there or not be there. Does he do better with adults than kids? There is this whole group of kids who fall (for now, the criteria in the DSM are changing but the kids will still be there, sigh) into a category of Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) (the medical word used for Autism Spectrum Disorder) which is Pervasive Developmental Disorder. When docs do the diagnosis for Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) they put them into a group... either autistic, Rett's syndrome, Asperger's Syndrome, etc... and the final category is Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD)-not otherwise specified which means not otherwise specified...those are kids who have a little of this, a little of that, but dont really meet criteria to be fully called Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD) (or Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD)). In the schools the criteria is similar but the educational category is called Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) and there are some different words used in the groups of characteristics that they have to show to qualify for programming. FOr some kids it is easier to be qualified as Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) in the schools and for some it is much harder... depends on the kid, the professionals, the school, the district and the state!--HOw is that for frustrating??? (really the same is often true for many sp ed. categories, just really hard to get services for some kids). That all said, when you say that his dad maybe had Bipolar, that could be a huge red flag for a mood disorder instead or too. THen again (stop my brain now please, sorry....) IT could be that your ex was also somewhere on the spectrum, in a mild/high functioning way and those are the symptoms you were having a hard time living with... People with autism who actually function fairly well in life still may have : black and white thinking rigid rules about what to do or not to do a hard time taking the perspective or feeling for another person (but not that it is NOT there, just may be less than most neuro typical people can do) a hard time with change in plans or routines they may go on and on about a subject even when people around are really not interested, they may not pick up the clues and may do this repeatedly when you see them. may not interpret tone of voice or facial expressions well, may have not great eye contact and may have a speaking manner that is not quite as full of inflection as others. BIG reactions to things that others would think are not such a big deal/ may totally miss out on reacting to things that people around them feel is a big deal. (and their opinions are THE opinions) Anxiety... a big issue Does any of that sound like your ex? Certainly not meant to be a symptom checklist, just some things in my experience that people will even say about themselves once they realize they have a child with autistic issues. And some of the things that pop into mind when I am around older teens and adults with autism-like or Asperger's issues. So, here is why I took the time to write this... MANY people are told NO WAY this kid is autistic (heck even my kid was once and he had already had the diagnosis since age 2!)....especially if they have some skills for interaction, have ok eye contact and can discuss some imaginative things (but people dont dig enough to see it may be more rote or scripted but they may also just do ok in that area). Many general professionals just do not understand or really embrace the whole "spectrum" concept of autism. And in some cases they are right to hold off. But in others, it may rob you of a chance for early intervention. IF they are unwilling to go there, then finding out the specific issues like you have... including sensory issues etc... still can be addressed. Knowing his learning style is visual then you can (with an IEP) have accommodations that specifically say that things need to be presented to him visually to help him learn and to work on his behaviors through visual means (often kids with these issues are TOLD thru verbal means to stop, and given a bunch of emphatic directions which just increases their level of disorganization and makes the behaviors worse). SD by the way...means school district. Do you have any autism specialty clinics where you could see if his insurance would pay for that specific evaluation? (there are protocols just to look at Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) and that could help you sort this out since you have so many other pieces) OK clearly this is an area I am a little more comfortable with so again, to be clear I am not saying you ARE dealing with this... just presenting you with some of the issues and pit falls many people have faced in hopes that you can avoid years of heart ache if you ever do feel this is something to be investigated further. Many parents here have other experiences (I am hoping they will share with you their experiences with ADHD and some of the co-morbid conditions that might help you account for what is going on)....and I will leave it to them to bombard you as I just did (smile!) because if they have lived it they can help you understand more. Same for people who have kids with mood disorders. OK, I wrote a book, so I will stop. Good sites for Special Education. rules include writeslaw [URL]http://www.wrightslaw.com/info/child.find.index.htm[/URL] PACER (this is based in MN but they do national outreach and there are many other states with organizations like this. the sp ed rules are FEDERALLY mandated so many are similar but states can interpret some and choose to have higher standards than the feds...just not LOWER standards) [URL]http://www.pacer.org/[/URL] If you just google IEP or Individual Education Program and your state then you might find more resources. About.com has some good info too. HUGS and sorry I went on and on... LOL, maybe a little Asperger's in me?? [/QUOTE]
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