I tho't parenting would be fun

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Patrice, Jul 15, 2009.

  1. Patrice

    Patrice Patrice

    My eight year old son was diagnosed with ADHD in first grade by pediatrician. Last year, after second grade, his therapist suggested a psychological evaluation which said he also had depression and should have follow-up with psychiatrist. Long story short... I went to his therapist today, for a private appointment, to get assistance with goals for his new 504 plan and all she told me (after almost 2 years of seeing her) is that he's a spoiled brat, annoying and has ODD who needs no accomodations because she doesn't believe he (or anyone else for that matter) has ADHD. My husband says dump her and find someone else, but I'm struggling with starting over again (after two previous therapists) just because I don't like her. I feel like, for the past three years, I have been spinning in circles trying to get someone to help me, and she does try, but her bluntness that I am the cause of his bad behavior has taken a toll on my own sanity. I came to this site for the first time today, looking for other people who have struggled every day with being a good parent. We all want good things for our children, but wanting and getting are not the same thing. So, I begin again with my terror of going into this meeting for a 504 feeling unprepared and wondering if I am doing the right thing looking for accomodations at all (is therapist right?) I'm treying not be an enabler of his poor behavior, but I just want him to be successful in school since I know he's capable, just not performing. Help!:whiteflag:
  2. AnnieO

    AnnieO Shooting from the Hip

    Welcome to our little corner!

    First off, my stepson was diagnosis'd with ADHD in 2nd grade and now we know that it's probably NOT. Also not ODD, either.

    A pediatrician can Rx pills, but unless they are specialists, I would be very wary of one the diagnosis's a child with ADHD. Boys are hyper. This is normal for them.

    However... may I suggest - what a lot of people will - to set up a neuropsychologist for him? It sounds to me like there's a bit more going on here.

    Aside from all that, could you give us some more background? For instance, if there are any psychological issues/addictions/etc.in the child's background, divorce, medical, and so on?

    And... Would you set up a signature so we get a snapshot of who you are? I helps. (It's under User CP, Edit Signature - and you can see my example here.)

    I'm not the most experienced person on this board by a long shot. Others will be along who know a LOT more than I do. But I definitely welcome you!

    PS - His bad behavior isn't your fault. You're trying to HELP, for goodness' sake. Sure, there may be things you need to change, but there's more to this. Trust me.
  3. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Ok...let me say Welcome. And let me say...Drop that therapist...Fast!

    First of all, yes there is ADHD, I have a son who is now 25 who has ADHD and has had it all his life. For her to say it doesnt occur is simply hogwash. She is a lunatic. I have to wonder where she got her degree...a box of cracker jacks?

    Now onto the more important task of helping your child. While your pediatrician can be helpful in noticing the more noticable traits of ADHD, they arent the best diagnosticians for this disorder. Back when my son was first diagnosed that was the only doctor we had and my pediatrician was great. He really kept himself abreast of all the information out there on disorder so he could help his patients. Now there are better ways for parents to go. You can go to a child an adolescent psychiatrist, a neurolgist, a childrens hospital for a multi-disciplanary evaluation, and a neuro-psychologist for an exam. Any of these can get you started on the road to helping you help your child. I would urge you to make appointments with one or two of these to get a first and second opinion to see what they think.

    Normally little boys dont want to be bad. They may be active and lively and want to have fun more than they want to sit still in a classroom. That can be normal. It isnt normal to be so miserable everyday that they cant stay in their seats and they are in trouble everyday and they are constantly defiant.

    I hope you can get some help and hope here.

    My son is now 25 and is what I would consider successful in his life. He went through a tour in the Marines, is married, has one child and one on the way, has a good job that he loves and fits his ADHD personality and owns his home. I think that is doing well.
  4. DaisyFace

    DaisyFace Love me...Love me not


    Welcome to the board! I know that it is frustrating to feel that you have to start again with a new therapist because it feels as though all that time and effort you have already spent will have been wasted...

    Unfortunately, if you have a therapist who is NOT on your side, is not on your child's side, and does not even believe in ADHD--then your time and effort has already been wasted with this woman ....don't spend another moment or another dime on her "expertise".

    Have to run....I'm sure others will come along with more suggestions soon.

  5. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Hi there and welcome.

    Drop that therapist like a steaming hot potato. Has she tested him? Has ANYBODY tested him? Has he seen a neuropsychologist?

    I would never go back to her and sign up for a neuropsychologist evaluation in which all disorders will be tested for--takes 6-10 hours and is very intensive. Chances are that if he is having serious behavioral issues he has more than ADHD and ODD is kind of trashcan diagnosis (at least most of us think so) and unhelpful.

    Good heavens, I can't believe some of the the therapists...grrrrrrrrr. :mad: Kids don't act like that because they are spoiled. Most of us spoil our kids.
  6. Patrice

    Patrice Patrice

    Thanks for the BIG welcome... I truly have felt for the past year that the only thing left to do was give up with a white flag above my head.

    My son was diagnosed, initially by pediatrician, but last year I had a psychological evaluation done by by a licenced psychologist at the request of this therapist :rolleyes: (about a three hour test) which came back with a diagnosis of ADHD and depression. I have requested a new test be given next month which is scheduled. His new psychiatrist who specializes in children with ADHD wants a complete psychological battery, which she will be doing prior to the 504 meeting. I'm not sure what the difference is between this and a neurophysch. I have made the decision to find a new therapist, if for no other reason that if you're not on Team Brendan, get out of the game. It's frustrating trying to find someone though. I'm thinking perhaps a man rather than a woman. Any tho'Tourette's Syndrome on whether this has been useful to anyone else. The thing that bugs me is that he is a very good kid and seems to be making an effort at home, but school frustrates him. He's not particularly hyper. As a teacher myself, I've seen hyper! He's not even the worst kid in his class. The amount of work and pressure of it gets worse every year. His second grade teacher was FROM HELL and last year, although she was a great teacher, expected too much of the kids. He shuts down when he becomes overwhelmed (classic ADHD). He can't take what's in his head and write it down fast enough for everyone. He's failing math and reading for this reason. He can't pass their timed tests. We had a student services plan in place (a school district plan) but it was not followed through on, so I've insisted on a more formal 504 which will be settled within the first two weeks of school. He's wasted so much time already in school. I wish I could home school him. That's what we're doing over the summer and it's not easy but we're progressing.
    Thanks again for making me feel like this is truly a place where I will be welcome.
  7. graceupongrace

    graceupongrace New Member

    Hi, Patrice.

    I agree with the others -- dump that therapist. She will not be helpful to you or your son. ADHD is real. Trust me; my son has it and I've lived with it for years. But it tends to be over-diagnosed by pediatricians who aren't really qualified in that area. I also believe ODD is real -- but in the sense that it describes a constellation of symptoms. It is definitely not a stand-alone condition and does not indicate a specific course of treatment.

    A thorough evaluation is really important. We did ours with a pediatric & adolescent psychiatrist; many here go the neuropsychologist route. The diagnosis takes time, and will likely evolve over time, as will the treatment.

    You've found a warm and welcoming place to bring your concerns & frustations. I often see things in others' posts that I can apply to my situation. I not only have gotten answers here; I've learned some important new questions!
  8. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    Patrice, first off WELCOME!!! You will find LOTS of help and support here. we are NOT doctors or nurses or therapists. We ARE parents just like you who just want to give our children the tools they need to survive. we have been right where you are. or we are there now.

    Now comes my warning: This will probably be a long reply. I am terribly wordy, but I have good info! Of course you need to take what will work for you and ignore the rest.

    Get RID of that therapist (therapist). She is WORSE than useless. Who has any idea what kind of garbage she has filled your difficult child (Gift from God - the child who brought you here) with, esp with the "no adhd" pile of doodoo she plopped on you. ADHD is a medically accepted diagnosis - it is accepted by the psychiatrists, the psychologists (and other therapists - all called tdocs), and the educational community. My MOTHER is on ritalin for inattentive ADHD. My bro is on strattera for regular ADHD. My son has been through many of the medications and is on strattera for ADHD. The therapist you saw is a fool, an idiot, and just plain old incompetent and MEAN. If she felt this way why didn't she tell you at the first meeting so you could know she is delusional and go find someone else?

    Nuff said on her. Now on to neuropsychs. neuropsychologist stands for neuropsychologist - a therapist with special training on how the mind impacts behavior. A GOOD neuropsychologist exam will include several 3-4 hour sessions of testing and then a wait time of several weeks to a month and then a meeting to go over the written evaluation of the testing. This report can be shared with other psychiatrists and tdocs and teachers or whomever you choose to share it with. You can talk to your insurance company or call around to children's hospitals and other tdocs adn psychiatrists to find a neuropsychologist. Or google it.

    I have some book suggestions for you. I strongly recommend you at least skim them. I chose to purchase them but your library may have some of them. You can order them through amazon by clicking at the link on the side of the page (which will help support this site), or by going to another bookstore (real or online) or even by checking online used book sellers.

    The Explosive Child by Ross Greene is one that almost all of us have found invaluable. Love and Logic parenting (check out the various books at www.loveandlogic.com - they have one that deals specifically with special needs kids as well as free audio downloads and other stuff), The Out of Sync Child and The Out of Sync Child Has Fun both by Carol Kranowitz and The Bipolar Child by Papalous.

    Love and Logic and The Explosive Child can apply to any of our kids. I use both of them. I really like L&L because my husband "gets it" so we can be on the same page. The Out of Sync Child books are about sensory integration disorder (Sensory Integration Disorder (SID)). Sensory Integration Disorder (SID) is when the brain does not handle sensory input in the way normal brains do. There are a lot of therapies for this, including brushing therapy which actually can rewire the brain, sort of. It is show to create new pathways for the brain to handle the input. The HAs Fun book is packed with activities that are fun and help provide the sensory stimulation a child needs. You need an Occupational Therapist (Occupational Therapist (OT)) to evaluate him for this. Don't try to figure out brushing therapy by yourself. When done incorrectly it can cause real problems for the child.

    MOST, if not ALL of our kids are diagnosis'd ADHD and/or ODD at first. I would say most have a LOT more going on than that. Many of the disorders look alike. Diagnosing (dxing) the problems our kids have is far more complicated than handling things like colds and strep throat and chicken pox. It is probably as much art and science and this is why our kids can spend years on the wrong treatments before we figure out what is going on. This is why a pediatrician should NOT diagnosis or treat things like ADHD. It just takes so much more than they can handle to be on top of all of these problems.

    I recommended the Bipolar Child book because you can read it and think if it may or may not be your child. Because MANY of the psychiatric medications can cause a person with bipolar to cycle, it is suggested that parents try to rule it out before many medications are added. Stimulants (like ritalin and adderal and vyvanse and daytrana) and antidepressants (the SSRI/SNRI ones like strattera and prozac and zoloft as well as the older ones like amitryptiline) can each cause these problems. And manic states are OFTEN mistaken for ADHD. MANY of us have made that mistake.

    Speaking of mistakes, no matter what else you do, be nice to yourself. If you wouldn't tell someone else out loud what you say, don't think it about yourself. You didn't wake up and say "Hmmm. Wonder how bad I can mess my kid up today?" so don't beat yourself up for mistakes. Apologize if appropriate and try not to do it again. It is ALL we can do.

    Well, that is my long winded Hello! I hope that you find the help and support you need here. Ditch that therapist and find a new one - what she will do (if she hasn't done it already) is convince your child he is "bad" because SHE has a delusion that ADHD isn't "real". Yup. A DELUSION. Cause that is what it is when science has PROVEN that something exists and you insist it doesn't. It is like saying gravity doesn't exist, or the earth is flat.

    SOME of the testing the schools will do. They have Occupational Therapist (OT)'s and psychologist. But these people are paid by the school and they ONLY evaluate how things will affect academics. NOT how they affect the rest of his life. Schools do NOT want to spend $$ on accomodations so frequently their experts will say the child doesn't have a problem when clearly he does. So it is best to line up your own experts as much as is possible.

    Hugs, sweetie, we will help you through this.
  9. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    Oh - I know I wrote a book before, but this MUST be said.

    SKIP THE 504 AND GET AN IEP!! You will probably have enough data after the testing to qualify for an IEP. Go over to the Special Education forum and ask them about the difference between the 504 and the IEP. Mainly the 504 has NO legal authority. The IEP is backed by federal LAW. It has FAR more protections and they go into place as soon as you send the written request for the evaluation for IEP and last until the IEP team (including YOU and an advocate if you would like one) decides he doesn't qualify for one.

    The request MUST be sent by certified mail, signature required. Return receipt is also a good idea. Don't take the "easy" road and deliver it yourself or just ask a teacher/principal about it. THe request establishes a timeline that the evaluations must be done in, and it puts those protections into place. If you deliver the letter or make a verbal request there is no way to guarantee that the protections are in place. The school will then ignore teh request or wait as long as they want and you have NO way to push them to be done sooner.

    Just wanted to add that.
  10. KTMom91

    KTMom91 Well-Known Member

    Just wanted to add my welcome!
  11. Mandy

    Mandy Parent In Training


    Well since he had a diagnosis of ADHD and depression from a psychologist that actually administred tests... I would forget what that therapist said and find a new one!!

    I also 2nd reading all of those great books Susie mentioned! They are great and I have read most of them myself.

    You will get some great advice here, so you came to the right place! We have some veteran parents on here with difficult child's that are a wonderful source of information:D
  12. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    Hi Patrice, welcome.
    I am so sorry the therapist is a flake.
    So, the psychiatrist said depression and the therapist said spoiled brat? Hmm. What is wrong with-this picture?

    I don't know specifically which actions she considered enabling or spoiling. Could you be more specific? (But I'll probably disagree with-her no matter what, LOL!)
  13. daralex

    daralex Clinging onto my sanity

    The check's in the mail
    I love you
    It's your fault your kid is bad
    parenting is fun

    All things we've heard that are a bunch of cr**!

    I agree as well - dump the doctor!!

    Things are hard enough as it is without a doctor in your corner. You are beginning the battle. You will find out how strong you are as I think we all have. I'm glad you found us!!
  14. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    You missed one, Dara:
    "I already cleaned my room."