It would probably be stupid

Discussion in 'The Watercooler' started by klmno, Apr 5, 2009.

  1. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    for me to get another dog right now, huh?

    They are pure bread german shepherd dogs but no papers, so they will come down on price. They are 4 1/2 weeks old right now, are going to get their first vet check and shots this week. They have been kept with Momma indoors, clearly well-loved/fed, socialized with Momma's owner's kids and are half-way trained to potty on papers. (The pups used the papers right in front of me- 3 different ones- I was shocked!) They have adorable personalities and are currently being weaned to wet food.

    Besides the obvious down-side of costs and time for training, the upside is that I have time while difficult child is not home- although I have plenty of other things I also need to do. I like the idea of having a large dog along with my 2 little house dogs and would like to get obedience training, and then maybe agility training, if I got one. Of course, it would be spayed/neutuered.

    I visited- Momma was there, along with all pups and the two family lap dogs. It was clearly not a puppy mill, but a typical family home. Dad lives in another state and is not related to Mom- I saw photos of him. They said this is the first time they have bred. I tend to believe that because they have obviously turned over their entire family room to Momma and pups while going through this.
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2009
  2. ML

    ML Guest

    I love German Sherherds! We always had one growing up. I don't know, maybe it would be a good distraction for you. I'm leaning towards saying "go for it". Hugs and Love, ML
  3. donna723

    donna723 Well-Known Member

    I hate to rain on your parade ... but this is where the term, "backyard breeder" comes from, and it's usually better to avoid them.

    If you do decide to get a puppy from this litter, it should be at least 8 weeks old, preferably 9 or 10 weeks, before you take it away from it's mother. Even if they're weaned and starting potty training, those extra few weeks with the mother and littermates is very important for their socialization. They learn a lot from being part of a litter. And Shepherds are prone to some inherited genetic defects (bad hips, etc.) that can be extremely expensive to treat. I'd want a medical history on the mom and dad, and to make sure they aren't handing down any temperment problems.
  4. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Thanks, ML! Donna, they aren't parting with the pups yet- they are letting potential owners look at them and put a deposit on one if they want it. They are writing the name of the new owner on the collar if someone does that. If the owner tells them what they are going to name the pup, they are calling the pup by that name. They said when I first called that they are keeping them all until they are 8 weeks old.

    I asked about hips and they said the Momma has no hip problems and that neither does Dad. They said they used to own Dad themselves but he is much bigger and more active and they chose to get him to a farm so he could get more energy out. I'd like proof of health on them, but I'm not sure how to get it. Maybe I could asked for their vet's name and call their vet??? Also, they told me that it was the west GSD's (the ones with the lower back-side) that tend to have hip problems. Is that true?

    My lap dogs- one is pure bred but no papers (I never turned them in). The other is a rescue dog and might be a mix but probably not. The thing is, I don't want to support puppy mills and actually prefer to get a rescue dog when possible. I have no interest in breeding- although if my male wasn't neutered, I probably would have breed these two once. Anyway, it is a strong consideration to wait a while on this, then if a GSD pup or young one becomes available at a rescue group or something, to go that route. Truthfully, I am more leary of that when considering a larger dog and when thinking about getting one for purposes they are bred for, like being trained for certain things.
  5. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful

    I'd ask for the vets number and then you can ask how they care for Momma and their other pets. It's a reasonable request and not all that uncommon.

    All purebreds come with their own set of health concerns. I wouldn't worry about those except to make sure you're well aware of what they are and that you personally would be able to deal with them.

    I don't have a problem with so called "backyard breeders". I've gotten many a great dog that way, both pure and mixed. Especially if they came from a loving family. You just need to check them out well before buying.

    They are darling babies. Remind me of my Molly girl as a baby and I had to do some quick telling myself I don't need another furbaby right now. lol

    Make certain this is something you can handle. There is all that pottying and chewing and training to consider.

  6. Jena

    Jena New Member

    hi! Yes do what everyone else said about the vets and stuff. Yet i'm voting go go go!! Go get your puppy.

    Yes coming from a woman who wanted to buy a horse 3 mos. ago. LOL

    seriously though i vote YES.
  7. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Thanks- I'm mulling it over. I want to make sure that I can commit to this without "cheating" the other responsibilities that I already have. My lap dogs do very well with other dogs and sniffed me like crazy while wagging their tails when I came home. difficult child and I had gotten a dog from the spca a few years ago to give to my mom- he was at our house for several days and our dogs got along well with him and loved playing with him. However, there did come a point where they wanted to make sure they weren't going to have to sacrafice anything. LOL! So, I will mull this over before taking any action.

    I have to say, I have gotten several pups in the past and I was extremely impressed with what I saw. When I went in, the parents were on their way in the house so a young female daughter took me to the family room. They had a child's gate up to keep Momma and pups in. The Momma immediately jumped on the gate and started a low growl. She could have stepped over this gate but didn't. I figured it was understandable that she'd be protective of her pups but wondered how much I needed to fear her. The teen daughter just took her by the collar, told her calmly to hush, it's ok, and lead her to a different room. The pups were typical bouncing, playful, trying-to-nurse babes who tired out and slept every so often.

    My biggest concern was whether or not they were putting them on dog food to soon- even wet "dry" food. The man said that he went ahead and started setting it down to them this past week because they had already grown their teeth in (I can verify that) and that Momma was starting to feel some pain and have less patience with them. He said they still have full access to Momma but he sets food out for them 2-3 times a day for a few mins.

    It is a big commitment and I do want to be more comfortable than I am tonight with it. I told them I would have to decide between male and female. They have one female left that isn't all black- she has a little tan on her legs and belly and was friendly but not quite as active as a couple of others. I thought a female would be preferable. Anyway, then they have a male with a little more marking- maybe a little more sable than tan, but not much. And he is Mr. Personality! He is very tempting and bigger than the others- they said he was first born. The photo of the Dad shows a huge dog- beautiful- and looks like a police dog. He might have more of a plush coat- or maybe it's just that he hadn't shed his winter coat yet. So, although the male is tempting right now, I'm thinking about how this assertive personality might not be as cute when he's 70+ lbs and full grown. As far as markings, who knows how they will actually look a year from now.

    If I am still seriously considering this tomorrow, I will call and ask for vet's number to check them out. If anyone has any other ideas about checking stuff, please throw them out. I just don't want to offend the owners.
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2009
  8. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    I don't think you owuld offend the owners. They want to know that their babies are going to good, conscientious, caring owners who have thoroughly committed to this.

    Be SURE you can take care of all the grooming the dog will need. Shepherds have thick coats that shed and need lots of grooming.

    You also need to look at your budget. Can you financially afford the vet bills, any grooming bills, feeding and other expenses a dog needs? Can you afford a crate if you are going to crate train?
  9. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    This is the kind of stuff I'm mulling over. Financially, things are tough right now. I know they always won't be this way and whenever I've gotten a pup it's always been when it seems financially horrible. But, my dogs have always gotten their shots, preventative medications, etc. Still, I am debating whether or not this is a good idea right now. I do have more time right now, so that is helpful. I have a crate that would be suitable for probabably another mo or two, then it would outgrow it. Some dogs can be trained in that amount of time- so that all depends. I have a room with a vinyl flooring that can be closed from the rest of the house.

    Even with health checks, you never know and that has me leary, too. My lap dogs are the first lhasa apsos I've had and I heard bad health issues about them, but they are middle-aged now and have had no health problems so far. I think that's the best we can hope for- they all will show signs of deterioration as they get old. on the other hand, I had a dog once that cost a lot, was pure bred with papers from a very reputable breeder and had show dogs in the line. It became diabetic at age 3yo and I gave it urine tests and insulin shots for 7 years after he spent a week in vet hospital on the verge of a coma. So, yeah, all those things need to be weighed.

    Right now I'm leaning toward not getting one. But when I woke up this morning (actually I was awake half the night), I was feeling like I would be a LOT more comfortable with a trained large dog in the house- whether difficult child is here or not. Ideally, I would get a dog while difficult child is not here and I would go thru obedience training with it and it would know that I'm the "leader of the pack". If difficult child comes home and is reasonable, it would be great if he would do agility training with the dog.
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2009
  10. muttmeister

    muttmeister Well-Known Member

    Yes, you have to consider all of the things people have mentioned but I keep thinking that, on CBS Sunday Morning (one of my favoarite shows) today Ben Stein had a piece on dogs and he said, "No matter what your problem is, the answer is a dog."
    If you can surmount all of the other stuff, another dog sounds like a great idea.
  11. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    LOL! There is probably truth in that philosophy!

    Maybe someone can help me out with this one- I'm not sure if it would be a big problem or an easy way to "even" things out. My lap dogs are obviously used to their routine and having priviledges, etc. OK- they are spoiled. They get on furniture and sleep in our beds- but they are about 20 lbs. The rules would be different for any large dog brought here to live. However, GSD's, as well as other herders, need a "job". If I got one, there would have to be time I spent with it during transition and training that my lap dogs would not be a part of. on the other hand, the GSD would not be sleeping in my bed and getting some things that the lap dogs do. Then, after maturity, the GSD could lay on the floor in the living room in front of the fireplace, but not on my lap on the sofa. The lap dogs could still snuggle on the sofa. The GSD would have more outside time, and there would be times I (or difficult child) would be outside throwing a stick for the dog to go fetch but the lap dogs would be in the house.

    Is that a setup for disaster or can that work?
  12. timer lady

    timer lady Queen of Hearts

    Not stupid ~ just a need to fill a void.

    As Sally ages & looks closer to death, I look at other dogs knowing in my brain I cannot do this; in my heart I'd love a puppy.
    For me bringing another dog in the house is just not a responsible move. My motives would be pure ~ my follow through would likely be disrupted by my health, my difficult children & financial issues.

    With difficult child gone I know that feeling of needing to fill that void. Something, someone to care for ~ to nurture. Especially since it's so difficult to nurture our difficult children.

    I'd be concerned if difficult child is released suddenly (for whatever reason) or if he comes home & has little to no improvement. I'd be concerned for your dogs already with-o adding another to the mix.

    in my humble opinion, wait until difficult child is an adult & is permanently out of your home. You have a full time job or a better handle financially then get your puppy.

  13. hearts and roses

    hearts and roses Mind Reader

    If you decide to do it, please see if the baby can stay with her momma until he/she is at least 10-12 weeks old. Those extra weeks make a huge difference in the puppy's personality. I know it seems hard to believe, but it's true. At 8 weeks they may be physically independent of the mom, but they still need the nurturing and security of their pack - those extra weeks will establish and strengthen the pups sense of self. You want them to feel secure or they will end up being skittish and insecure in new places and around new people.

    We adopted our Sophie at 12 weeks - came to learn that she was taken from her mom at 7.5 weeks!! Much too soon. She's always been very skittish, hasn't learned dog socialization very well and barks at everything. Nala, on the other hand, was able to live with her brother until she was 5 months old. She is a secure dog and very good with everyone. And then there is Izzy. easy child bought her from a 'backyard breeder' at 9 weeks but didn't pick her up until she was 13 weeks old and because she was still with her mom and some other familiar dogs, she loves being part of the pack - she was instantly at ease around our already existing dogs.

    Best of luck - I love German Shephards, but I'm allergic to them!!
  14. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    I'm with Linda. Wait until your life has settled. Wait until difficult child is home to share in the excitement of adding a new family member. Chances are he would not be overjoyed at the thought of being left out of the excitement at home.

    Also, you are trying to get your house cleaned up for resale. There are alot of things that need doing over time. Should you get the chance to sell and relocate, having an extra pet would make the transition harder. Plus, as a retired Realtor, I can guarantee that pets do not enhance the value of your property with prospective purchasers. The house may be "just what they want" but if they are not pet lovers..forget it. If they love cats and hate dogs..forget it. If they have allergies..forget it.

    I understand wanting something joyful and new in your life. That's a great sign you are making progress. on the other hand, I don't think it's in your best interests right now. Of course ;) it IS YOUR life! DDD
  15. eekysign

    eekysign New Member

    Ditto to all of this. Thanks to DDD for typing exactly what I would have typed and saving me the trouble. :tongue:

    A friend of mine went away to college. Her Mom got a dog. Her brother went away to college. Her Mom got another dog. When both kids graduated from college (and would never be living at home again), her parents adopted two chinese little girls. The parents are in their 60's now, and the little girls are 5-6ish.

    Replacing missing loved ones seems unhealthy, and trading chaotic difficult child life for chaotic brand-new puppy life might be just trying to fill the hole of "wow, I've got a lot of time on my hands and I don't know what to do with it". I think we all become used to "the drama" after a while. If the drama disappears, we try to fill it with different drama!
  16. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    OK, I'm waiting- I think. Mainly because of the question of moving. Once that is resolved, I'll reconsider. I really would feel more comfortable with a deterrent to break-ins by teens though. Waiting until difficult child comes home (assuming he does) kind of defeats one of the purposes though, so I don't want to do that. Thanks for everyone's input! Also, I want to give the lap dogs a little extra attention for a while since they had it rough for the last few mos difficult child was home, too.
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2009
  17. Star*

    Star* call 911

    Every spring - I get PUPPY LUST. I've been stuck in doors, I'm adjusting to the new daylight savings bs, My doors and windows are open and I feel fresh air and my mind wanders to puppies.....

    A dog is a huge responsibility as you know with your other two. A german shepherd (while stunning and OMG I love them) is a BIG dog. Some places will not allow a big dog when you move. Some counties include shepherds as a vicious breed.

    Why don't you get on and check for shepherds in your area that are needing a foster home. You can pick - male, female - etc. and see if maybe there isn't an older dog (sometimes theyhave puppies in rescues) that can hang with you for a "specified" amount of time.

    Sometimes there is a click - other times NOT. doctor, our foster/rescue recently got a home and I can tell you that 4 dogs was WAY too much and 3 dogs is a TON of work - I think on my resume I put pooper scooper as a second job. lol

    Just a thought - and you could check craigslist in your area for shelters that are kill shelters and rescue someone from the gas chamber or euthanization. THAT is awesome to know you saved a life.

  18. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Star, I checked petfinder and our rescue groups. Also, I called the spca- they didn't have any. I agree about the fostering and have done that before when the humkane society got jammed full- I couldn't provide a forever home at the time but fostered a border collie for close to 2 mos at no cost to them. It is a good thing to do for many reasons. (They eventually found a home on a horse farm for the border collie- which was ideal for hiim.)

    In this case, though, I'm not just considering this for emotional reasons- but the home situation is a VERY good point- I've been a home owner for so long that I'm not used to having to worry about "what's allowed" as far as pets. Being that I'm considering moving right now, I do have to resolve that question first.

    And by the way- where on earth did you find that avatar?? LOL!!

    ETA: Our local rescue groups go to the "kill" shelters and screen for adoptable dogs and take them out. Since I learned that, I stay away from the pound and so forth- I would not be able to handle going in there and walking aaway. I tried it a long time ago. I came home with a Momma and 6 nursing babes who had 1 day left to live.
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2009
  19. Star*

    Star* call 911 (because I love dogs and think maybe you could /should consider this) I remember you telling me you and difficult child volunteered at local shelters. I was very proud of him.

    My Avatar? OMG rofl. When I found her? I thought it looked a little like Pootie with her Hanna Montana wig on. Now THAT is a funny picture, but I can't find which disc I put it on.

    When I do I'll swap it out.......