Just talked to my Dad

Discussion in 'The Watercooler' started by susiestar, Jun 10, 2010.

  1. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    My dad called just as I was looking for him in my contact list. Great minds think alike I guess.

    I apologized for hurting them, told him we would bring our house keys to them and would try to make amends for anything we did to hurt them or ruin their home.

    He said that unless he or mom said it that we should ignore it. I asked if he was sure because I was told he and mom were getting to old to handle things and that gfgbro was apparently supposed to be contacted to see if it was okay for us to call or visit them.

    He is NOT happy. Part because I was crying by them, part because he doesn't want to be in the middle of the nonsense. He HATES when I cry. I did NOT do it on purpose, I am still pretty emotional about all of this.

    He did make a really rude noise about gfgbro being in charge of supervising them. He will not be happy when I won't let the kids be around gfgbro, but we will deal with that later.

    At least now I am positive that the locks were not changed because they asked gfgbro to do it. I was pretty sure they didn't but I am never totally sure what gfgbro will tell my mom and talk her into doing.

    One thing I did find pretty interesting. Gfgbro has never returned anything mechanical in the shape he borrowed it in. Not since his teens. We returned my dad's car in immaculate condition. Bro made a GIANT deal out of "having" to spend a couple of hours cleaning it after we borrowed it because we would have trashed it.

    husband did NOT air the tires because they were properly inflated. Gfgbro is notorious for greatly overfilling tires when he checks them. He has had at least one tire blow up like a steel belted balloon as he filled it up. When Dad drove it yesterday, after gfgbro had driven it, one of the tires had a 3" bubble on it!! He was glad that their luggage got sent somewhere else because it would have added enough pressure to cause a blowout while they were driving.

    Once again my dad comments that there are always problems with a car after gfgbro uses it. He even asked if we had added air. gfgbro will NEVER do anything is you tell him it needs to happen. So telling him to carefully add air so you do not over-inflate the tire and weaken it means he will fill it up to double the recommended pressure and then let it out. I wish I was joking about that. I really really do.

    I promise in a few days I will quit rambling. This is one of the hardest things I have ever needed to do. Goes against a lifetime of training and will probably make my parents very sad that they cannot have the entire family at their bdays or Christmas.

    Help me not waffle. I am weak about this.
  2. JJJ

    JJJ Active Member

    Be strong! You know you are making the right decision. Your parents will still see your kids and they are all old enough to know that celebrating on a specific day is not as important as celebrating.
  3. ML

    ML Guest

    We are here for you, Susie. And I'm proud of you, I know this isn't easy.
  4. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    Am here! You have my number if you need to ramble some more!
  5. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    I love you all so much!!! I actually looked up the number for the National Domestic Violence Hotline and called. My mother makes a point of telling us that we are not using words and phrases correctly if we use terms like emotionally abusive or domestic violence. She goes out of her way to try to get us to admit that it isn't really that because we don't know the "true" and "correct" meaning of the terms.

    I have gotten so used to her using "cite your source" because it comes up every time I hint that gfgbro has acted badly toward us.

    I laid it all out. The things I have and am doing wrong. What I am doing to try to fix or change those things. What we do and don't say around him because we don't want to upset him. What the kids say and do that he says are rude and/or disrespectful.

    I told her how he acts toward us. How he waits until my mom is not in eyesight or hearing distance.

    Of course the person said that this is clear cut abuse. What we are doing does NOT deserve that. She also said that the pressure that we get to go to counseling with bro to "work it out" is totally unreasonable and another form of abuse.

    I know my head says it. I know y'all say it. And we are absolutely correct. It feels awful to have to plan strategy to talk about it with my mother and father. with-out the planning and getting reinforcements from "unbiased" sources my mother will never ever settle down about this. She will take quite a while as it is, but with the therapists and "experts" agreeing with me there is at least a 50% chance that she will accept things by Christmas.

    I did not call because I didn't trust you to tell me the truth. It was just another way to make sure I have every i dotted and every t crossed. My mother respects logical arguments above almost anything else.
  6. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    Next time your mother asks you to cite your reference, tell her to check it out for herself since she clearly would rather call you a liar (by refusing to accept your definition) than independently verify it.

    So tell her you don't have to justify a thing; you got your information (anonymously, so she doesn't have to worry about the good family name) from the National Domestic Violence Hotline. So if she disagrees with the definition, she can argue with them, not you. Stay out of it, don't engage in the debate with her. because by her trying to engage you, she is doing bro's work in continuing the abuse (whether she is aware she is a tool of bro, or not).

    of course, what she wants you to do is cite your reference so she can say, "What would THEY know?" scoffingly. Again, this is standard abuse tactics. She has become an abuser as well as an abuse enabler; bro has very successfully modelled her on him. Unless it was the other way around? I suspect she's very passive aggressive, which in a parent can create an overtly abusive child.

    So if she scoffs, tell her that their credentials on this are beyond question as far as you are concerned and if she wants to challenge this, she can go with you to listen to you state the case, so she can hear what you say and challenge anything in their presence, in order to make sure that what you explain is the true picture according to her. Tell her she can do this, or shut up about it and accept that you have a right to your own opinion and to also protect yourself from further hurt as you have been advised to do.

    If, on the other hand, she agrees to go with you while you talk to them, or even you telephone them while they are on speaker so they can hear both sides and so can she, at least she is being exposed to the Hotline and their professional expertise. And maybe that is going to be the beginning of her finally getting her own support.

    One way or another, it should help you win - call her bluff, or tell her to back off. But she is wrong to tell you how to think.

  7. flutterby

    flutterby Fly away!

    Susie, I'm so sorry that you are going through this. It's bad enough what your brother is doing, but it's extremely painful that you aren't believed by your mother.

    If I read things correctly, your mom is pushing you to go to counseling with your brother? It would be better for you and your mother to go to counseling. She needs to hear how this is effecting you. And I mean really hear it, Know what I mean??

  8. donna723

    donna723 Well-Known Member

    Susie, I agree with Heather. You could make an appointment to speak with someone from a local domestic violence group and have them tell her the exact same thing!

    Some people just don't get it! Maybe referring to it as domestic 'violence' is the reason - I don't know. I remember years ago when my (then) mother-in-law was still alive and I told her that my husband (her son) was very abusive towards me. She gave me a really dirty look and said, "Now you KNOW that he's never hit you!" No, he didn't, because he knew I would call the police and he would lose his job. And because that would have ruined his carefully crafted 'image' that he tried so hard to cultivate with the kids. But he made my life so miserable and hopeless that I came very close to suicide many times and didn't see any other way out. The only thing that kept me from doing it was knowing that if I did it, the kids would be left alone with him!

    Whether it's verbal, emotional or physical, it's abuse all the same. The tactics are the same - the lying, twisting facts, the manipulation, the hurtful intentions. And the damages they cause to the family are just as severe and just as long lasting as physical abuse. My husband was trying to 'punish' me for his own problems that he caused himself by blaming me and trying to destroy my relationship with my children to hurt me. Your brother is trying to do the same thing by attempting to destroy your relationship with your parents. And your mother is looking at it just like my mother in law used to - the old "sticks and stones" theory, but "words" can hurt you just as much if not more than actual physical violence. "Words" can ruin relationships and destroy families too. A good domestic violence counselor should be able to explain it to her where she will understand and it will make sense to her. I hope you can convince her to talk to someone. Hang in there, Susie. Sending lots of hugs.
  9. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    I got bullied a lot at school. The adults in my life, from teachers to parents to adult siblings, all quoted at me that I needed to say, "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me."
    So I did say it to the bullies. Then they said, "Sticks and stones, eh?" and began to collect rocks to throw at me.

    I thought then, and after tat incident really firmly believed (even if the adults in my life refused to accept it) that it is the stupidest thing you can ever tell someone, who is dealing with any form of abuse, especially if it is "just" verbal.

    At least when the abuse becomes physical, you know the line has been crossed. But when it stays verbal, it's too easy to blame yourself for having incited it, or for "making a fuss about nothing".

    The "sticks and stones" phrase gets trotted out by people who want an easy way out of having to support you with your problems - they don't care, and so think that expression justifies their apathy.

    It's like the people who quote the Bible when they say, "Am I my brother's keeper?" to justify non-involvement; forgetting that although it is in the Bible, it is a quote by Cain when he is asked where his brother Abel is, whom he has murdered. Yes, you ARE your brother's keeper, when you are the one who killed him!