Mikey, where are you?????

Discussion in 'Substance Abuse' started by KFld, Apr 27, 2007.

  1. KFld

    KFld New Member

    Hey Mikey,
    You haven't responded to your post in a few days and I hope you don't feel we've been too harsh with our responses. Please let us know how things are going. I know sometimes we end up pushing people away because they aren't always ready to hear what what have to say. We are here to listen and support you no matter what you choose to do. We just hope our experiences can help matters before they get any worse.

    Hope to hear from you soon.
     
  2. PonyGirl

    PonyGirl Warrior Parent

    I'm wondering, too, Mikey. Have you & wife had 'the talk' with difficult child? Hope all is well. Ditto what Karen said!

    Peace
     
  3. Mikey

    Mikey Psycho Gorilla Dad

    Still here, just reading and thinking. Right now difficult child is home sick again (pneumonia and asthma-induced bronchitis).

    On one hand, I understand and accept everything that's said here by everyone. On the other hand, though, I guess I'm like my son in that I haven't gone through the pain yet, so I can't truly comprehend the threat.

    And then there's the several therapists, docs, and teachers who are encouraging us to keep the forward progress moving while addressing the drugs because his real problems are emotional and internal, which is causing the dependancy on pot.

    It's very hard to make a choice. I went to a couple of Nar-anon meetings where I got a universal "give him the boot" message. Several folks here have said the same thing. I've also read from others here and in several books that kicking kids out of the house for noncompliance/defiance can actually make things worse for them. Others say it's the best thing you can do.

    :faint:

    And there are days when I could go either way. The problem is that no matter what, the choices we (wife and I) make now will have lasting and permanent impact on my son. And for every tough love story, there's a story of tough love not working (and actually hurting). For every "you can't love them enough" story, there's a story of not doing enough, with serious consequences resulting (upto the loss of a child).

    It's information overload for us, and I feel it's nearly impossible to make a choice about what to do. Not to dismiss anything anyone here has said, but to us it seems that no matter what we do it's a crapshoot. And how it turns out ultimately comes down to what my son does, not what we do.

    So we do the best we can. We preserve what we can for ourselves and the family (including our beloved difficult child). We're starting to stand our ground (to the degree we're able). But we're also trying to keep the door open for the chance that he will make another good decision.

    And we pray a whole, whole lot.

    There's not much else I can say. There may come a day when we have to boot him out, but then again there may come a day when being patient gave us the chance to get though to him when he was ready to listen. What will happen? I don't know. So, when in doubt, I tread water, keep my eyes open, and hope for some sign of which direction to start swimming in. For now, that's all I can do.

    Mikey

    PS: That doesn't mean we aren't going after the pot issue, but I don't think I can be as agressive as some here suggest (yet I may end up being more agressive than others suggest). I guess I'll find out if it's too much (or not enough). Either way, there's enough good and bad with either decision to make me wish I had become a priest when chosing a vocation.
     
  4. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I dont think anyone is saying to boot him out. I know I wasnt saying that. I havent been able to boot mine out and he is 20!

    What I am saying is to stand firm on the rules and consequences.

    Let me tell you Mikey, the hardest thing I have ever done in my life was calling the cops on my kid 2 weeks ago. I had an armed standoff in my yard. My heart was breaking and I was so afraid my son was going to die that day. Literally. When it was all over with I fell to the ground sobbing. I was a limp mess.

    You can have firm rules and consequences for breaking rules without booting a kid out. You sound like a really caring parent who has quite a few nice things in this kids life. You can use those things as leverage. There is a book called The Defiant Child that might be a good read for you.

    You can ground your kid to the house still at this age. Get a CHINS petition if needed. Make him comply. He is still your kid. He has to abide by your rules unless he can convince a court that he is able to support himself and emancipate himself.

    None of this is easy. I wish it was. I wish we had reset switches we could flip on the backs of these kids when they acted like little twits. I imagine my kids switch would need replacing by now...lol.
     
  5. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    We do understand how difficult it is to make decisions. We all
    agree that both parents have to be on the same page...no matter
    what the page says!

    Sad to say I have never known a drug addict who was emotionally
    sound, secure and self-confident. Using drugs is not a choice
    made by healthy people. From experience I sadly know that if
    you have a kid with diagnosed mental health issues "the system"
    doesn't give a rats behind "why" he/she had pot in the car or on
    their person. The local judge actually told our boy following
    extreme brain surgery with two titanium plates replacing bones
    gone from his skull...and visible stitches 3/4's of the way down
    his head!..."I don't believe your brain surgery is any excuse
    for being with people in possession of marijuana. It was YOUR
    choice."

    It's mindboggling. Sending supportive thoughts your way...NOT
    critical thoughts...but fact based. You'll have support here no
    matter what choices you make. DDD
     
  6. jbrain

    jbrain Member

    Hi Mikey,
    so glad you responded so we know you are still there! I too don't think anyone was saying boot him out--after all, he is underage, you can't do that anyway. I think we all just feel strongly that he needs to be held accountable for his actions and that he is a master of manipulation and all the folks advising you don't seem to see that--in fact, your therapist seems to be encouraging it! I think he has everyone snowed--my dtr certainly did. I agree that the pot smoking probably is due to the underlying issue--the thing is, just because he has underlying emotional issues shouldn't mean he gets to call the shots. He seems to have a huge entitlement issue and I think everyone tiptoeing around worrying about his emotional issues is only feeding into that. He has figured out the game--his doing well in school is of utmost importance to you--it is the weapon he can use to pretty much flaunt his power in your face. I don't think that will change til he takes ownership of his life. I wish I was a better writer, am frustrated that I can't seem to communicate what I want to say in a clearer way! Maybe someone else will do better.

    I guess my viewpoint is that the pot smoking may not be a big issue--he doesn't really sound like a "stoner", only a wanna be stoner. I think the issue is that you are in a power struggle and until you let go and let him decide he owns his life nothing can really change. Right now he can't admit that his education is important to him because it is so important to you--you have taken over what belongs to him. When your own life is your priority and he sees this he may be able to care about his own. Make any sense? I doubt it but I tried! I have gone through this with both my dtrs so I'm trying to share what I've learned.

    Hang in with us--we all care!

    Jane
     
  7. Ephchap

    Ephchap Active Member

    Mikey,

    I guess that means you really haven't been reading or understanding what anyone here has been suggesting. There's not one person on here that I recall that suggested booting your son out.

    You cannot throw him out of your home, but you can let him know, in no uncertain terms, that you will not allow him to live there while drugging, and especially the in your face drugging. Whether that means forcing treatment, residential, calling the police or whatever - he needs to know that you will not accept that behavior and that you will follow through.

    You keep saying that you didn't feel the hurt or the pain, and therefore, you're not ready to do anything about it.

    I'm sorry, but I truly do not understand that statement at all. Haven't felt the pain? Your son was cooking up marijuana desserts in your kitchen knowing your wife was coming home, and that doesn't inflict pain or hurt, knowing he's rubbing your face in it?

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> while addressing the drugs because his real problems are emotional and internal, which is causing the dependancy on pot.
    </div></div>
    So now you agree that he has a dependency on pot? You're making progress. :smile:

    What do you mean by emotional and internal? His ADD? Whatever the diagnosis, it does not excuse the drugging, anymore than it did in my son's case, as he turned to pot when the symptoms of his obsessive compulsive disorder began to emerge. That sure didn't make a whit of difference to the judge who fined him and found him guilty of an adult felony because of the drugs when he was barely 17. Many of our kids reached for drugs to self-medicate or because of emotional issues. That does not excuse it or justify it.

    Tough love is tough. Of course, it's tougher watching your child self-destruct before your eyes. I knew that my son was going to end up dead or in jail because of the drugging. For me, the choice was simple ... and no, I didn't boot my son out. I spent weeks calling and knocking on doors until I found a program that could help him and gave him his choice - that or I turn him over to the police.

    I wish you and your family nothing but the best, and truly hope that things work out.

    Deb

     
  8. SunnyFlorida

    SunnyFlorida Active Member

    I understood you perfectly Jbrain :bravo:

    Haven't been around much lately Mikey so I'm not catching on that you haven't been 'round much either.

    Are you wimping out on us? :smile: Hope not....it's great having you here.

    That is why this site is so wonderful. You can hear other people's point of view, chew on it for a while then decide what's right for your family.

    There are many kids who smoke pot, may not be a good idea, but they do. It's when the pot gets in the way of moving forward or when the pot triggers a negative response, or when the choices one is making while using are interfering with rational choices one would make when not using.....that's where the trouble is.

    Second guessers? there's tons of us here. Many of us think on a daily basis, should we have done this, what if we had done that. We've come to find out...that's a killer thing to do and most certainly causes more stress in one's life than one wants to have.

    You've got a plan, stick to it. If after a certain period of time evaluate. If its working great, if not then its time to try something else. You and wife will find your own personal line in the sand. When difficult child crosses that line...then you'll know.

    In the meantime.....hope you stick around and become an "oldie"
     
  9. judi

    judi Active Member

    Mikey - the great thing about this site is that you take what you can use, look at other options and figure out what works for you.

    I am probably the one that said sometimes it does come down to kicking them to the curb. We have been there done that with our son. You are totally right that it does have lasting effects. However, smoking pot in my house put my career and professional license on the line and that's a line I won't allow to be crossed. My son had been warned repeatedly. Smoking dope in his bedroom was the last straw for me.

    We all have a line in the sand.
     
  10. Sunlight

    Sunlight Active Member

    lol about the priest comment.

    the good thing is you are being educated about a lot of possibilities and choices. after you gather the info, you will make your own decisions based on the other stuff you know that we dont know.

    like deb, I had my locked up to save his life. no choices left.

    no stone was left unturned up to that point, I did all anyone could do and more. it was killing me.

    my son had all the time and chances, all the love and money spent on him, all the opportuities for change and he chose not to....because he chose to self medicate with illegal drugs instead of using the psychology and pharmacology that I was willing to seek out for him. legal stuff.

    hang in there and keep learning. keep praying you too you wanna be priest.

    from Janet...a former member of the Future Nuns of America club. (and I am not kidding that is true!)My one nephew always calls me "mother Teresa"
     
  11. rejectedmom

    rejectedmom New Member

    Hi Mikey, Glad youare hanging around. Believe it or not most of us here have been exactly where you are now. There is no ideal stand out choice in all this just one big grey area. I'm a big things first kind of person but thaat doesn't mean that you cannot address little things to build up report and trust and them take on the bigger issues. I would suggest discussing a time table for this with your therapist just to make sure that you and she are in agreement. Other than that you have a wealth of advice to muddle through. Just remember things change and not for the better when they become legal aged. you have alot less leverage and consequences are bigger in the adult penal system. -RM
     
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