Mom of son with- suicide rap: new post-new question

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Arttillygirl, Apr 13, 2007.

  1. Arttillygirl

    Arttillygirl New Member

    Gosh I had hoped we found the answer. Tonight we had storms and I had the kids, my difficult child 15 from previous posts, and my easy child 12, turn off the computers.

    We left for an event and my difficult child called and said he needed the password to get back on. I said no, more storms were coming (tornados with hail had passed but severe thunderstorms were still coming-possibly powersurging our computers) so no computer. They had both been on for 1 1/2 hrs and that seemed enough anyway. I thought better of it and decided it was actually safer to have him happy while we were away than otherwise. Well as I called from the car (not 5 minutes away) my daughter said "come home please, he hit me 4 times because I wouldn't give him my password" Her password, for some reason, works for the internet but I didn't know that he knew that. I hadn't had a chance to change it before we left.

    It didn't seem so awful when we got there but she had locked herself in the bathroom and was afraid. We are thinking about having him pay for our tickets $50 to the event we had to miss due to him, but we're not sure. (He makes about $100 a week mowing). He did admit being in the wrong but that she exaggerated (he admitted shoving). I tried to be calm and even took my husband in the other room when he began using sarcasm to regroup. I said "You seemed to be a happy person not so long ago, why do you have so much anger? I feel we have bent over backwards for you and that you are not trying" He disagreed we had done very much "I don't have internet in my room!" (The psychiatrist recommended we stick to that even though I have spyware) "But you can see everyting I do" he said (due to spyware). I said I couldn't trust him to not get on at 2am. (Not to mention I have a life and don't want to spy on 3 computers). He teared up and left the room (not all bad) but when I opened his door for him to put his pet away he cursed at me. He did that last week too. We had made up a contract about no language, and a few others for him to have the privileges he thought we were restrictive to keep him from.

    Yesterday he posted some rap videos that use very bad language on his MYSPACE and he knows I won't like it. He invited all these rappers to be his "friends". I have told him MYSPACE is for 15-16 year old friends in the metroplex (after I found he was communicating with a 30 yr old in another state). I was rethinking that one when he posted them against my wishes anyway.

    I just feel like things are not working. The psychatrist said to give it 3-4 weeks for the Zoloft. Tonight I was reading Parent in Control and he recommends:"Get rid of your children's tapes and CDs of music supporting their negative peer cultures. If you won't protect your children against negative influences, who will?" Should we?
    I know the majority on this forum said no.

    We just feel like we are in the twilight zone. This time last year the only thing he was interested in was Weird Al, now he posts that if he can't "make it in music there's no point" or something to that effect and seems almost brainwashed by this stuff. I also feel he is getting good at using anger to get what he wants. I am seriously considering quitting our internet service to our home. That would solve his obsession with Rap artists but I think the lack of social would hit him very very hard.
    ANy thoughts, wise people?
     
  2. timer lady

    timer lady Queen of Hearts

    I'm not above banning that type of music in my home. I cannot control what goes on outside of my home but I don't need to listen to it here.

    As to internet access - I have a computer set up in our dining room (not pretty but in plain sight to adults) that kt can use. wm has no internet access in group home.

    With all the predators & such out there - I'd use a common area for internet access whether a difficult child or easy child. My tweedles definitely need guidance when it comes to the internet.

    My sister, as a last resort cancelled internet in her home because of choices her daughters were making.

    This is a tough call.
     
  3. slsh

    slsh member since 1999

    Violence is my hot button. Regardless of whether difficult child hit your easy child, shoved her, or just terrorized her verbally, it was a violent attack if she had to lock herself in the bathroom. Completely unacceptable. There needs to be, in my humble opinion, a very firm line drawn in the sand that there will *not* be a repeat ever again. If husband terrorized you to the point of hiding in the bathroom, what would you do? easy child has the right to be safe in her own home. Quite frankly, I don't care if my kid is depressed, manic, whatever - he does not have the right to terrorize the rest of us, period. He is accountable for his behaviors unless he's flat out psychotic.

    Re: the music. Literally just went thru this yesterday. Put a *lot* of thought into how to handle it. Our issue isn't rap, it's Black/Death metal. But, I totally understand the obsessive thinking. My difficult child seems to just be consumed by it. If it weren't for the obsession, I could probably let it slide, kind of don't ask, don't tell. But it is coloring his entire life, along with- some other not so great influences. We put our foot down yesterday - it all stops, now. Rule has *always* been that if grades are good and attitude is decent, we'd let the other stuff go as long as it's not illegal, dangerous, etc. However, grades bite, attitude is that nasty one of entitlement and general irritation, and he's just not doing what he is supposed to be doing right now. Plus, he's not willing to do what he is supposed to be doing, even to regain access to his music, black clothes, and Magic. Fine - makes my job easy. Is he ticked? You better believe it. But also, in some really weird way, I think he's relieved too. Can't put my finger on it, but after a 2 hour discussion yesterday where we continued to point out that the vileness that he's listening to is influencing his overall self, I think he kind of heard us. We've taken the choice away for now.

    Right now, I'm tired of trying to balance his wants. We've also tried to accommodate him but for every inch, he wants 10 miles (kind of like your difficult child's poor sob story about not having internet in his room - egads). Unless and until there is a dramatic improvement in attitude, in effort, in grades, in school behaviors, it's *my* rules and my discretion, period. Do to get.

    Of course, his response was we could only keep him in Residential Treatment Center (RTC) until he's 21, and he's perfectly happy to wait until then. I don't know whether to laugh or cry... but it's his choice.
     
  4. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    Regarding easy child feeling unsafe - whether he just shoved her, or it was something more - the thing is, if SHE felt unsafe, then he was behaving inappropriately. End of story.

    I'm not sure what the book is, saying to remove all negative influences in the form of tapes & DVDs - that is very subjective. Years ago it was The Beatles, rock & roll and Elvis that our parents wanted to ban. And if you ban it, will he just go elsewhere? At least at home you know where he is. Whatever your point of view on this, you will ALWAYS be able to find a book somewhere that tells you that what you want to do is right. Whether those books are helpful in the long run or not - I'm no expert. Maybe reading a range of books from a range of backgrounds would give you some more choices.

    The internet should not be his social gateway to the world. If it is, it's unhealthy because it is NOT balanced social interaction. He needs to have access to people's voices an facial expressions as part of the social interaction package. He does NOT need the internet to breathe.

    Marg
     
  5. Arttillygirl

    Arttillygirl New Member

    I am thinking now of just returning to dial up. Lord I wish we'd never gotten high speed, it was the beginning of all of this!
    Then he can have internet in his room (if I can find a program that shuts it off automatically at 11:30 or something). Chatting is what they like to do and I understand that.

    That way he cannot surf for objectionable videos at least and that makes the internet less attractive and maybe we wont' have to fight about it.
     
  6. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    I know it is hard, but try to be patient. These behaviors are
    not likely to disappear within a short period. Hugs. DDD
     
  7. skeeter

    skeeter New Member

    NL, while he's not done anything on the internet that I disapprove of, does not have a computer in his room. He looks at a labtop while sitting next to me. That's because he will become hyper-focused on anything, TV, computer, whatever, with a screen. He is also limited to one hour a day.

    If he DID have one in his room, we have the main hub in our room, so I'd just take it off line after bedtime or whatever to prevent him from getting on at inappropriate times.
     
  8. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Violence is a No, no matter what. Tell him next time he shoves anyone its a call to the cops.

    I wouldnt put that computer back in his room for love nor money.

    You can take the router offline at whatever time you want anyway. Just ask a techie person or post back here and we can help you set it up.
     
  9. Arttillygirl

    Arttillygirl New Member

    Is that right! That would be awesome. I don't know how, can you set me up?

    Won't do anything right now, know for certain he's having suicidal thoughts. As with anyone suicidal, he's not thinking clearly. When the medications kick in we will discuss but I'd love to be armed with the knowledge of how to do that beforehand.
    THanks everyone.
    B
     
  10. Just keep swimming

    Just keep swimming New Member

    Hi,

    Another one here that absolutely will not tolerate violence of any kind. Spoken, acted upon, what have you, it will not happen in my home. We had spent several years afraid of our 5/6 yo and it took me to figure out that this had to stop, was "my line in the sand" so to speak.

    That aside, internet access is allowed only in the kitchen and I am sitting there over difficult child's "too old for her own good" shoulder watching/reading everything she does. Sorry, but privacy has it's boundaries, in my not so humble opinion. I did this for easy child 1 and easy child 2 as well. They also did not have phones in their rooms or cell phones. I didn't have them growing up and survived just fine talking at appropriate hours, etc.

    Sorry for the tangent, but I feel for you girl!

    As far as the music is concerned, I didn't allow my kids to buy CD's that I didn't approve of, and now that they are old enough to make their own choices, they are listening to the classic rock stations that we listen to! LOL!!!

    Best of luck!

    Hugs,
    Vickie
     
  11. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I will have my son come look at this post in a bit and try to explain all this router stuff.
     
  12. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Oh I can so relate. It was two years ago when I took the computer out of the kitchen and put it in our bedroom, password protected it, and allowed her on only when I was there to supervise. That is where the computer still is although just last month I hooked up our old one in the rec room in the basement, password protected it and let her on at times when her homework is done or she has friends over. I have spyware on all the computers and I know her passwords to email and myspace and I check regularly.

    I would never under any circumstances allow her to have a computer in her room.

    I refused to live in fear in my own home of what my difficult child would do if I instituted rules she didn't like. That's not to say I was never afraid because I was, but I didn't let it stop me from making decisions that I thought were in her best interest. That included deleting two myspaces that she created because she was inviting people she didn't know to be her friends and deleting her buddy list on several occassions.

    She did not get a cell phone until this past June when she turned 15, and then it was with the understanding that it would be disconnected at the first sign of misuse. We had tried to give her one the year before and took it away when she used it all hours of the night and lied about where she was.

    My difficult child would hit her sister also so we were literally prisoners in our own home so we could protect her. We did not go anywhere for several years because we couldn't leave them home alone. My easy child knew to call the police if she was ever alone with difficult child and felt afraid.

    It sucks, it's no way to live, but we did it and eventually we are now at the point where she has built up enough trust so we can go out socially and trust she will be OK. But you know that didn;t happen until she went to detention and crawled her way back to a decent life.

    If your son is under the care of a psychiatrist I would follow his guidance and let him assess your son's depression. My difficult child tried to use self harm several times to get what she wanted. I was lucky we had a good therapist who was able to tell me she was not a threat. Of course we have to take their threats seriously but don't let him think he can use that against you or to get his way.

    Nancy
     
  13. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful

    When my kids were that age there was only 1 computer in the house. It was mine. To use it they had to be able to convince me it was absolutely necessary. (rare that they could) It wasn't there for their entertainment. It was set up in the diningroom.

    I had a problem when T got to big for his britches and would sneak on my computer to view porn in the middle of the night. I'm far from a prude, but the stuff he was stumbling across made playboy seem "modest". (gag me) Not to mention those sights have trojans and spyware out the ying yang. Which is how I caught him each time. By the 3rd time he was completely banned from computer usage at home. husband set me up with passwords, and I took the keyboard/mouse to bed with me each night. It stood at that til he was 18 and got a computer for graduation.

    We had major difficult child drama, believe me. And I swear I heard every bogus excuse in the world from him trying to convince me to let him o/l. We stuck to our guns and rode out the storm.

    If you've made up your mind about the rules, you need to stick to them. If you cave due to difficult child behavior, ie tantrums and such, it shows him that being nasty and mean gets him what he wants. If he gets violent, call the police or haul him to the ER. You don't have to tolerate that sort of abuse.

    I do want to mention that zoloft made T more aggressive, edgy to the max. It progressed to him attempting to strangle his sister. (T is not usually an agressive person at all) If you've been seeing a more agitated state since the zoloft you should tell the psychiatrist. Not everyone can take it.

    Hugs.
     
  14. Arttillygirl

    Arttillygirl New Member

    Well it's getting worse. I dont think it's the zoloft, it's only been a week. My husband is just really trying. Took him to a football game Monday night, easy child and I had a dream nite.
    As my last post, I met with some teachers yesterday, he's not horriblly off track so I thought that was positive.

    Last night he wanted to purchase some RAP music videos. Two were not horrid but the third just ticked me off. Why does he want to wallow in some ghetto world where the people just have no choices? The gold teeth and bling and crotch grabbing and lyrics that were not understandable because of so many bleeps?

    Anyway. In the back of my mind I was thinking of the dark things he'd posted on his myspace for all the world to see and we tried to talk to him. How can we allow this music if he seems to be getting more negative? husband thought I was out of line with our "courting" him as our pastor suggested. I am so tired of not calling a spade a spade. I read the writings of the shooter in VA and they were no more hate filled than my son's. After husband read them he agreed. We went to talk to him and got no where. We said we wouldn't continue to pay for myspace (internet) if he was going to post blurbs like that. (One said he was glad anna nicole was dead for ex.)

    This morning I looked at his chatting and he was plotting to run away with a girl he met on myspace through a friend. (That's his life now-just as I feared.) He had some choice words about us. Esp. not having the computer in his room. He suggested that he didn't want to leave his friends but just "teach us a lesson". He asked her to tap on his window any night.
    Guess the alarms on the windows make sense about now.
    She wanted him to call her but he said we wouldn't let him talk to someone we didn't know and if we did it had to be in a public area, not his room with the door shut. (I admit that was husband's rule and it's pretty extreme. But in this case I am glad he insisted on it.) I checked the phone, they never did talk to each other but I guess it goes in my bedroom at night now.

    I feel like we are sitting on a time bomb.
    Any reactions anyone?
     
  15. Liahona

    Liahona Active Member

    What do his docs say about this behavior? You need some help this sounds like a crisis.
     
  16. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member Staff Member

    My heart goes out to you. This is a good example of what limited help is out there for our troubled youth. Just as in Va with the young man who did the shooting and the professors who tried to get him help, but not much help was available. And here you are a parent who is obviously screaming for help and can't get it.

    My husband and I were talking about this last night. With everything we have gone through with difficult child there was a time she was associating with some kids who could have been that shooter in Va. We know of a neighbor boy right now who seems very disturbed and his myspace is very dark and violent. I would not be surprised to hear he was involved in a violent situation some day. What can we do. I wondered last night if this Va young man's parents ever thought this could happen. I would have to say that there were times when I thought my difficult child could have done something terrible, so they probably are not surprised, and yet what could they do?

    When my difficult child was writing her very disturbing notes two years ago the therapist was not concerned. Obviously those involved with the Va shooter wish they had taken his behavior more seriously, but yet what can be done if the person does not want help and they are not in enough danger to be involuntarily commited.

    I'm sorry, none of this helps you. I know many do not get alarmed at the violent games, movies, songs, writings that our young people engage in. I was more than alarmed. I knew my difficult child could not be involved in those things without it doing great damage to her.

    We just stuck to our rules, no computer in closed areas, no violent games, tv shows, music, and we cut off computer access when her computer chatter was a concern.

    If you don't feel he is responding to the medications or therapy perhaps it's time to find another therapist. We knew when that time came and we tried many different therapists in search for one that could help. I just want to encourage you to keep looking for help, don't give up, your son will escalate things because you are putting controls in place and he doesn't like it. He will try to push back but if there is anything I learned it's that in the end our difficult child understood we wouldn't give in. She did run away several times. Perhaps your son will try that. Make sure you monitor who he is talking to and have a plan in place if he does run. We called the police each time. It's important to think ahead to what might happen so you aren't reacting in crisis mode.

    I'm sorry but this may get worse before it gets better.

    Nancy
     
  17. Sunlight

    Sunlight Active Member

    ant has met many lonely vulnerable girls on myspace. his pics on it of himself have his pants down all but showing his privates. the girls are just as bad.

    we have always had only one computer. it is in my room and when I go to bed, you are off it. ant does not live here anymore but he goes to the library to get online.

    your son needs you to be a good monitor of your home. nothing wrong with your censorship. I tossed lots of mags, CDs and the like that I am insulted by.
     
  18. Big Bad Kitty

    Big Bad Kitty lolcat

    (((hugs))) to you. I know what you are going through.

    My older daughter was a easy child until she turned 15. Then she was running away, stealing cars, doing drugs, you name it. We were in and out of the police station and the courthouse constantly. Nobody would help. Eventually, when she was just 17, a cop told us to just let her run. It was the hardest thing I ever did. I USED to drive all over town looking for her. Then I took the cops advice and reported her missing, in my car (stolen). She got picked up, but was not in the car at the time. She was busted for a curfew violation. At that point, when they brought her home, I was given the opportunity to say I did not want her there, so I threw her out.

    Best decision I ever made. Also the toughest. She went crying to her boyfriend's mom about what a horrible mother I was, and she let her stay there.

    Well that lasted about 2 months, until she saw difficult child's true colors. difficult child & her boyfriend went around staying here & there (burning bridges as they went) until they finally got "responsible" enough to rent a room. They have been there a few months. While I still do not care for difficult child's lifestyle (or her boyfriend), I am glad to see that she is taking care of her own stuff at least. It was very tough to toss her out on her :censored2:, but that is what it took.

    I realize that your difficult child is younger, and I do not know if that is an option for you. Hugs and prayers to you.
     
  19. Arttillygirl

    Arttillygirl New Member

    The psychologist wants to meet with- us seperately.
    He said a residential treatment might be in his future.
    Is there like a summer program that could get him turned around that anyone recommends-not somewhere that he could just meet other angry youths?

    The psy says he is feeling bad about our private school. He loved it before he was caught doing the vandalism. Maybe we should sell our home and move to a public school? One book suggested it for the wrong crowd. I don't know about this situation though. My daugter loves it and it's a deal with me working there.

    I guess we need to put an alarm on his window anyone know how to do that? we'll need to put the deadbolt keys and phone in our room at night too.

    I keep wishing this will just blow over but it seems to be escalating and I don't want to be in denial and ineffective.
    Thanks for all your advice everyone.
    If any one else has a thought I am definately all ears!
     
  20. Arttillygirl

    Arttillygirl New Member

    Ok last question I promise!
    husband and I had him remove his remorse filled angst from his Myspace or lose it. He did.

    We didn't want to tell him we knew about the running away conversation because he'd know I can read his chatting, but husband went into his friends list and told him he didn't like the girl in question and told him to remove her. She had objectionable things on her myspace (she refers to herself as "dirty ho" which I know is a 16 year old boy's dream) but my difficult child really resisted and they got into an arguement about it. I wasnt there but apparently it as a "whatever" match back in forth like 10 year olds.

    So instead of having him hate his dad, I told him we knew about the runaway conversation. He said they were just kidding.
    He is begging us to not remove her, says she's the only one that talks to him. I told him to give me a day. Can I forbid him from talking to her on the computer? Will this just make it worse? Or is he old enough to make his own decisions as some have said? He's never met her personally, she's a friend of a friend.
     
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