now son wants to leave country....!

Discussion in 'Parent Emeritus' started by rebelson, Feb 21, 2016.

  1. rebelson

    rebelson Active Member

    His father has been in Medellin, Colombia for a few months now. The father's older brother (son's uncle), owns a condo there. Which he visits on occasion, he lives in south FL...owns 2 hair salons there (in FL) and I guess the condo (in Colombia) was for vacation. Apparently, the dad is living in the brother's condo and now it's being used for tourists to stay there, on 'AirBnB'. The dad speaks English, obviously. So, the premise is that Americans, etc, that are visiting Colombia, will want to stay at that condo, with an English host--->my son's father.

    Will son have his own room there? Sleep with the dad? Who knows. I saw today that the dad posted on his FB page, a picture of him with a 'girl' who looks the age of my son! His caption was: 'my baby'. On HER page, she has pics of her and a little, I guess he's dating a girl who is the age of his own son, who has a little boy. :thumbsdown: Not surprised.

    Son's bio dad is an alcoholic, relies on 'his' mommy, still. He owns nothing. She is in her mid-upper 70's. Ugh. Does son think that going there will be a nice 'break' from life? Beautiful spanish women for him? I can see this swirling in son's head. Also the temptation of 'spending time' with his father, which he's always yearned for a healthy relationship from him. It will never happen, I am afraid. My son is wishing for something that is not going to happen. It is sad.

    I think the family 'sent' him there (bio dad), to live in brother's be 'rid' of him. Doesn't that sound horrible? Anyways, now, my son wants to 'go be with my dad for a few months, spend some time with him'. He is (understandably) still yearning for that 'bond' with his bio father, which never did happen. Since bio dad was missing for his growing up, even though he was in the same town. Sad. If any son ever needed his father, growing up, it was my son. Some sons are totally 'ok' with a missing dad while growing up. Not my son.

    My son is tending now towards 23, his father, at 46, 'IS' an alcoholic. The 2 of them together, for an extended time...has NOT ever turned out well. It's like the blind leading the blind.

    One Thanksgiving, maybe 6yrs back? When my son and father were in grammy's house alone, got in to a verbal 'fight'. Either the dad or dad and my son...were intoxicated. Somehow, it escalated into an all out physical fight...and one thing led to another. Bottom line, my son ended up hitting his father in the lip. Or eye. I cannot remember. Anyhow, the father called 911 on him. Father ended up releasing charge.

    Do you see now, why I am freaking out that my son wants to go to a foreign be with his father?

    Son has been talking about this for around 3 days. He's been asking me for his birth certificate. I told him yesterday I will take no part in supporting him going to Colombia. I told him I will NOT give him his real BC, in order to get a passport. That he can do that on his own. He acts like in a matter of '2 wks' he can have a passport and be on his way! I told him he's running from life and responsibility.

    Some things I mentioned: What would he do with his car when he's gone? Where would he live when he got back to FL? Told him I didn't think he could work in a foreign country not being a citizen. How would he go to a foreign country with NO $ and then come back to the US with NO $? He responded: 'just're thinking too hard'. I said: 'No, I actually think about things and have foresight, foresight is kind of important, you cannot just wing this.'

    Didn't hear from him the rest of yesterday afternoon, till last night. He called and then started berating us again.

    Then, today, as if nothing happened last night (berating), he texts me a song from Alice in Wonderland, saying: 'sup mom:) you'll love that song, show the boys...that's my generation movie from when I was a kid lol.' That was this morning at 11:40. I have not responded.

    My head is spinning. Advice with this latest?
    IT never ends....
  2. rebelson

    rebelson Active Member

    I didn't edit quickly enough.
    Needed to add: I am scared to death that I would never see him again. That what if he was in public and was intoxicated and they arrested him, & he was put in jail and I will never see him again? Don't these countries treat foreigners harshly?? Isn't it dangerous being in a foreign country such as Colombia? Granted it's a large :unsure:
  3. TheWalrus

    TheWalrus I Am The Walrus

    My daughter also did not have her bio-dad in her life and has not been one to be ok with her dad out of her life. (It was his choice and he virtually abandoned her.) Since she has become an adult, she has "re-connected" with him. He is a drug addict, an alcoholic, and I believe also suffers from the same mental illness she does (only undiagnosed). The way my therapist explained it is that when children finally meet a long absent parent, children will naturally look for similarities between themselves and their absent parent and one of two things can happen. (1) The child is old enough and matured enough to be confident in who they are as a person to meet the parent and see him or her objectively. (2) When the child suffers lack of confidence, maturity, mental illness, addictions, etc, they have an "OH, now I see where I get it from" and it becomes an unhealthy bond where the adult absent parent may actually reinforce those negative behaviors and choices. That is exactly what happened with my daughter. Her first meeting with bio-dad had them drinking and doing drugs together.

    Unfortunately, there is nothing you can do now that he is an adult. He has to see it himself. He probably won't. He will probably be blind to his father's negatives in his need to be loved and accepted by him. Keeping his birth certificate will do nothing except create resentment toward you. He can get it so you do nothing by withholding it except give him a reason to be angry with you. I would do nothing else, however. Passports are expensive, there is a lot of paperwork to fill out, and NO, you cannot get it in 2 weeks. Chances are, the process of it, if he has to do it on his own, will weigh him down before he gets through it. And he will have a lot of things he will have to figure out: money, his car, his belongings, etc. Let him get bogged down in the totality of how much work it is going to take to "go hang with Dad for a few months." It isn't just a suitcase and a few hours drive.

    I would in no way help him, either, but I wouldn't disparage his dad (it will come back to bite you no matter how true it is) or try to treat him like a child. Make him be the adult and do the work, suffer the consequences. When he asks you to handle something so he can get started on his "getaway" just politely say, "I'm sorry, son, I can't do that for you. This is your business and you need to take care of it. I wish you the best." That is all you can do.
  4. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    There is no way to stop him at his age. Overtalking about it with him may just make him more determined to go. Id stop giving feedback. Hes not listening and, like many dysfunctional loved ones, is not one bit worried about the future. Seems he only thinks of what he wants to do right now.
    On the other hand, scattered, risktakers change their minds day to day. Today he wants to see bio. Dad. Tomorrow he may meet a hot girl and want to stay right where he is.
    I love the idea of letting go of outcomes. We are powerless to control our grown kids and powerless to control our childrens life outcome.
    Try to relax. You cant contro him. Focus on your oen peace, knowing you have done all you can. Your own suffering doesnt help your son and could make you sick...and you matter.
  5. rebelson

    rebelson Active Member

    His dad has 'been around' for his life, but not ever consistently. He missed all the summers our parental agreement assigned him to son, he missed all the 'assigned' weekends with, birthdays of son, he missed a lot. Most. Though I never let son know that his dad was missing. He just 'was'. I used to fax copies of son's soccer game schedules to grammy's house (son's father's mother) in hopes that bio dad would show up to one. HE did show up to ONE. For that one, he brought a 'bimbo' looking girl, she must have been 18 to his 30....and they sat far away from field, not even paying attention to game. That was the ONE game I ever remember he showed up at.

    Son lived with him for almost a year, maybe when son was 16ish...when he (bio dad) was doing well with a pool business he had started. He was doing very well at that time, had a condo on the beach, nice sports car. He and son were a hot mess together. Son was bringing girls in and out of there, drinking, while in high school! Would call me and tell me dad was hitting on one of them!

    The dad is a mess. Now, son wants to join him, for a 'few months'. I'm sure son seeing the pics of beautiful Colombian women, on dad's FB page, is a temptation.

    I think my son is the #2 that you referred to, TheWalrus. "OH, now I see where I get it from" and it becomes an unhealthy bond where the adult absent parent may actually reinforce those negative behaviors and choices. That is exactly what happened with my daughter. Her first meeting with bio-dad had them drinking and doing drugs together."

    As I said before, they are a hot mess when together. Competing for young women, drinking together, watching football together like young buddies, it's unhealthy. Your dtr needs her father, and my son needs his father. Both fathers are UNhealthy for them. What can we do? Nothing.

    I need to stop saying negative things about his going to Colombia. Because if it doesn't work out, he will BLAME ME for not being supportive, right? Isn't this what they do? Blame. Blame. Blame. Everyone but themselves. I'm not even actually really saying negative things, just realistic things. Like the questions that I posted above. But, he doesn't appreciate reality. It's moment by moment.

    I told him that I would not give him my original copy of his birth certificate. But, that he could obtain one on his own. That satisfied him. How he will do this? No idea. He has NO $. NO job. My husband is like 'how is he going to get the plane ticket there? It can't be cheap?' I have NO idea. I do know that he said the dad told him how and where to go to get a passport. So, likely the dad is on board with this plan. I have not spoken to or texted son today. He texted me that message that I posted in original thread above, here. But, I did not respond. He was very rude to me last night on the phone. More personal berating of husband and me. And pumping up of the bio alcoholic father and HIS dysfunctional family. Unbelievable.

    I just looked online and one can fly round trip from Miami to Medellin for under $400. I wish it were more expensive!

    I got off the phone and husband told me, 'if we are so horrible, why does he keep calling us instead of them?' You know? That was a great question......
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2016
  6. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    He doesnt think youre that bad. He just wants to make you feel guilty for not doing what he wants you to do. Please dont take it personally.
  7. TheWalrus

    TheWalrus I Am The Walrus

    I love what your husband said. It is SO true. Our daughter is so hateful, rude, disrespectful, and blaming toward me and my husband (who adopted her when bio dad ditched her) and never has a rude or terrible thing to say about bio-dad. He gets a pass on everything and she doesn't have that sense of entitlement with him that she does with us. He is just Mr. Wonderful. But it is ALWAYS us she calls. Your husband is right: if we are so awful, why does she keep contact?

    Oh...I know...because bio-dad won't give her squat, won't support her, won't rescue her, won't try to reason with her or help her go the right direction. He is just the one to go party with and tell her all the things she wants to hear. But when she is in trouble, needs help, money, advice, a ride...that's OUR job. Gosh, we are just the worst! ;)
  8. nlj

    nlj Well-Known Member

    There is a saying here:

    'Let your grown children leave and they will always come back to you.
    Try to force them to stay and they will leave you for ever.'

    I think there's some truth in that, however tough it may feel.
  9. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    I agree nlj. Very immature and bullheaded young adults do not like to be wrong. The more we outwardly oppose something, the more many of these lost men and women will feel a need to stick out a bad situation so that they dont have to admit you were right. If he even goes, it is likely to be short term. Dont give him a reason to stick it out by fighting against him. You cant stop him anyway. This is assuming he even goes. I still think it may just be an idea that came into his head and wull quickly leave.
  10. Childofmine

    Childofmine trying to do this thing one day at a time Staff Member

    Hi Rebelson, I hear your terror for him in every word you write and I so understand that.

    They have no idea, and we do, having lived a while.

    I think you are getting good thinking here from those who have posted. It's good for you to write and dump it all out here. We understand what you are saying and feeling because we have walked the very same road.

    It sounds like you set a boundary with the birth certificate. So, that's okay. The odds are he won't get to Colombia because there are multiple steps to take, and it will take time. our DCs aren't so good at sticking to something long enough to walk through the steps.

    But let's say he does, and he goes to Colombia. The good part of this is that being face to face with his dad, who he likely has on a pedestal at this point, it sounds like, will be a bucket of cold water. He will be living with the reality of who his dad really is right now, and either it will be a good thing or a bad thing.

    I do believe our DCs have to ***experience*** reality. We can't tell them about reality. That doesn't work. They have to live it in full living color.

    Yes, bad things could happen there, but you can't control what he does and where he goes. That time is over, as you know.

    I know he doesn't make good, adult-like decisions, but he is still considered to be an adult. That is such a hard thing for us all to live with.

    He will have to learn inch by inch. Most of our DCs learn it all the hardest possible way because that's who they are. My own Difficult Child even can laugh at himself a little bit today about that, and he acknowledges that is usually how he does life...the hardest possible way.

    Hang in there. This too shall pass, one way or another. And something good really could come from it if he does go.

    It just may be the next step on his own journey in life, to go to Colombia.
  11. rebelson

    rebelson Active Member

    Welp, son was intoxicated last night. I called him (sorry I did) and he was pretty much on the borderline of incomprehensible. Then, a minute later, he'd say something completely understandable. Eventually, after much silence on his end, no answers coming from his side..he hung up. I immediately went in to panic mode, he is drunk and 'where is he?' Is he out about town in car? So, hub told me, 'there is NOTHING you can do about're just going to have to let it go, and pray.'

    So, I did. I put his phone # on 'silent' so if he called/texted, my phone wouldn't make a sound. And, I read my trusty 'St. Anne' novena. She's never failed me! And, went to bed.

    This morning? 14 texts on phone from him starting at 8:14am. All rambling. In between the ....'s, was a new text. So they added up.

    Here they are: 'I know your husbands everywhere......this is strictly between you and stole my story.....I'm getting a cat today where do I get a kitten......Or should I get a dog or bird......Some women don't know they had the whole world right in front of their nose.....I didn't steal that story.....I don't think that's the difference between me & you.....I miss your constructive criticism I really do.....

    I said: 'you sound like you did last night, intoxicated. You can call me when you're sober.'

    He said: 'thanks for your permission.....(insert father's name here) is supreme to big b*'re just indecisive and unreliable your proximity wreaks......I want to see you.....I never did before'

    I said: 'You're way too angry, resentful to see Let me know when you're ready to talk to someone, a therapist.'

    He said: 'you're just dumb.'

    I said: '^^^^^^^^ dumb? Perfect example'

    He said: 'Sucks to suck. I'm done playin checkers take your time.....don't think too simply cannot fathom'

    I said: 'fathom what?'

    And then nothing since.

    He totally sounds still drunk. Lovely. At 8am in the morning . The part about him wanting to 'see me', scares the hell out of me! I cannot see him in the condition he's middle of alcoholism. It's SO sad. This is the most horrible feeling for a mother to be feeling. NOT wanting to welcome her son in to her arms for a visit! Just awful........

    Ok, guys. Can any of you even slightly decipher what in the world he was thinking, trying to get across in words to me? Maybe I'm too 'in' the situation to read in to him...and you guys (fresher to situation) might be better at this? Does it sound like a girl shunned him? What's up with the 'you stole my story...' comments?

    Any insight would be awesome!
  12. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    On some substance abuse rant. Alcohol but maybe drugs too. Next time suggest you not engage him when he is impaired or abusive. There is no hidden message in his rantings. He is just wasted. Pointless to attemp to communicate with him so out of it. Unless he is talking, while sober, about going to rehab if it were me I would not even waste time talking. I believe"less is more," punish wasted behavior by silence. Reward talk of getting help by engaging and offering help.