Ohhh- I have royally

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by klmno, Sep 24, 2008.

  1. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    ticked off this therapist. We went to the therapist the afternoon that I refer to as "Mr. go-in circles". He did his typical "how are things" and I repsonded that there are some frustrations and issues. I said difficult child has his own but mine have a lot to do with not being further along in therapy. He asked why were were there. I said we were there to deal with mood cycling. He said something about "do we know wwhat the diagnosis is?" And I tried hard to keep my cool as I reminded him that yes, we do, and we discussed it on the phone last spring before I ever made the first appointment and he's been asking that question and I've been answering for 4 mos now. So, did he think he might know of someone who could help us a little more on these issues? He sent difficult child out of the room and WENT OFF on me for telling him how to do his job. He asked what I do for a living- I told him and then told him that if someone hire me to do a certain job, I wouldn't tell them I was going to do that, then not do it. Let's just say things went down-hill from there.

    At one point, he said he didn't know that difficult child even needed therapy and why was he there. I said, "well, then would you write a letter to that effect so I can give it to PO?" He said he would, then I said I would still be pursuing answers to my questions anyway because there was obviously a big void but if tdocs weren't the place to get my questions answered, I would look elsewhere. I told him I was venting, that it wasn't him personally, that they all do the same and that I was looking for something different. He started his spill about what a good counselor he is and how he works with addicts (we're always hearing this from him) and the "protocol" for treating addiction. I said yes, I understand, and how well did traditional therapy work before the protocfol of the 12 step program was commonly used?

    And, I tell him they are developing a more updated protocol for adolescent BiPolar (BP), too, I believe, and that is what I'm looking for. Oh, they are, where where do you think you're going to find it around here, he asked. I said apparently they don''t have it around here. So he asked if I was going to move and I said I might. Then, he described the traditional family therapy and said the kid was supposed to learn that the mom is going to come in and tell the therapist everything the kid has done and then he describes the typical problems in households with boys with single moms. I said yes, I understand that, too, but I did not come here for traditional family therapy and in the studies being done for BiPolar (BP) therapy, they are looking at working on family issues from the other direction- as in dealing with psychoeducation, then triggers, then specific family dynamics.

    I asked him if he had any idea what life raising a BiPolar (BP) kid was like, and he said no. I asked if he knew what BiPolar (BP) was like for difficult child or for me trying to raise him, he said no. I asked how could he help us if he had no idea what was involved with BiPolar (BP). He said he could help- it's all the same. I said that's what I thought- I can tell- and I am more comfortable with a therapist who has some idea of what the typical problems are so that difficult child and I are in there re-hashing them all trying to get the therapist to understand what our lives are like. I told him I was looking for someone to help with the BiPolar (BP) issues, not the "it's all the same" issues. I said "you counsel all these people with addiction problems" Yes, he says. How well do you think an addict would relate to a counselor who had no idea what addiction was really like. He said it would be incompetent, but he would never do that. He said 30% of his patients were BiPolar (BP) (Oh, BS) I said if they are, my guess is they are here for you to treat addiction and not the actual BiPolar (BP). he asked how I found him to start therapy with. I said I called that office and asked specificly if they had a male counselor available that did CBT and who had experience with mood cycling in adolescents.

    Then he started twisting my words around, more po'd than ever. I said well, are you going to write a letter saying my son doesn't need therapy and he said no, because I had just said that we still did need help. He told me to bring in what it was that I was looking for from therapy. I didn't say anything because I figured if he was aware of the new approaches for therapy for adolescent BiPolar (BP), he wouldn't need me to bring them in. But I did say that I didn't write them, they are all over the internet and in the books and the psychiatrists know what they are. He asked what the psychiatrists say, I said the psychiatrists, particularly the one that did the MDE said we need psychoeducation, then identifying triggers, then difficult child needs to learn coping skills and problem-solving. He said would I sign a release form for him to talk to psychiatrists- I said I gave him a copy of the MDE psychiatrist's report detailing the treatment plan which specificly lists the type of therapy recommended the first visit and I signed a release form for regular psychiatrist communication the first time we came here- it's been in difficult child's record the whole time. he said well, maybe difficult child didn't need this, so what he's been in a little trouble- what's he been in trouble for? How many times has he been in trouble? I just looked at him. Then, he just kept looking madder and madder, so I left- time was up anyway and he had spent the previous 5 mins packing his brief case while we were going at it like this.

    I realize that I've been in a crappy mood all day and have not been happy with him for spending four mos asking about the diagnosis, what medications difficult child is on, telling us about his work with addicts, and rescheduling appts (he calls a 4:00 appointment "evening time" and says he doesn't want to work that late), but I think I have every right to ask him to recommend someone else, especially when it's more than obvious that the guy hasn't looked at anything, isn't keeping up with anything pertaining to difficult child and doesn't seem to really care if this is progressing or not. He brought up that he gives counseling to thos mandated by the courts a lot, so my guess is that he's just not used to someone actually expecting him to deliver anything other than the typical "going through the motions".

    They always say to discuss things with the therapist if you aren't happy about how they are going or progressing and they tell you if it isn't a comfortable fit, then asked therapist to recommend someone else. He refused to recommend someone else. He just kept saying that he was very good at what he did.

    Boy, I can't wait until tomorrow when we see PO and I get to explain this to her!
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2008
  2. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    Wow. This is the same guy you had problems with-b4, right?
    Lose him.
    He's wasting your time. Seems to be on a big ego trip.
    Why do you need a referral? Can't you choose someone and deal with-the ins company yourself?
    These people never get anyone who questions them so you are surely a surprise in his life! :surprise::tongue:
    I'm glad you stood your ground. You mission is to help your difficult child, not to inflate some dr's ego.
    Best of luck.
  3. Superpsy

    Superpsy New Member

    Wow, he took that pretty personally. I've had clients challenge my way of doing things in a session and it actually helps to clarify things...if you don't let your ego get in the way and don't feel threatened. Don't be too surprised if he actually doesn't know the most recent therapies for a particular population; especially if he doesn't work with them very often. "Trickle-down" is often pretty slow from academia to practice.

    My 2cents? Change tdocs. After going through this it's going to be difficult to get on track. I would be aware that the therapist was probably right when he said that you may not find what you're looking for where you live. Unfortunately metropolitan areas often get the most recent research-based services and often better professionals. It sounds like you are looking for a very specific type of therapy. You may be able to find a therapist who is willing to learn...

    Good luck with this. It's tough to find what's right for difficult child but keep at it!
  4. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Yes, Super- I know. i guess I was dreaming when I thought with all the new diagnosis's in BiPolar (BP) in adolescents and young children and so many people realizing that maybe adhd was way over-diagnosis'd, that at least some of the tdocs who have been advertising they treat "ADHD" might actually do a little research on therapy for BiPolar (BP)- real research- and I don't mean a clinical study, but if I can read about it and research on line what approaches are more effective, then they can, too.
  5. Wow! What a headache. The guy is a royal jerk. I hope you are able to find a therapist who will work with you in the way you want.

  6. Superpsy

    Superpsy New Member

    I think it comes down to most tdocs probably don't feel competent to treat difficult child with that form of therapy. It would be nice for them to tell you that tho' :confused:
  7. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    yes, it sure would- but time and time again, they say they can and will do it, but then give the same ole- that is what upsets me. that is why I told him that if he hired me to provide "XX" service, I wouldn't give him "YY" service. When they do that, and he hasn't been the first, I feel completely betrayed.

    I don't think they expect me to have a clue what they are doing. He said himself that most parents come in and are just fed up or upset with their child and they don't care, it's like "here".
  8. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Still venting here- and then there was this part of the conversation where I said I had to asked myself what we were getting from therapy if all my information is coming from reading books, researching on the internet and "talking" with other parents- why am I not hearing any of this advice or guidance or knowledge from any therapist? He said, then why would we need to be there? I said then why don't you put that in writing?
  9. meowbunny

    meowbunny New Member

    Ugh! I do feel for therapists. There have been so many, many changes in the past 5 years it really is hard to keep up on everything. Even so, you should at least keep up with your area of expertise. So, if you work with young children, you know the best play therapies for BiPolar (BP), Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD), etc.; adolescents, the newest theories, etc. There's no excuse. It's part of the job.

    Here's hoping you can find a new therapist ASAP. Both you and your son deserve better than a defensive jerk.
  10. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Thank you MB! I know I wasn't the most pleasant person in the world today. But I really think this guy has an ego problem- in addition to the stuff I've already mentioned, he kept bringing up how he teaches a mandated class for drunk drivers, but "obviously I was looking for a cadillac so I shouldn't settle for a Chrysler".

    Ohh, pleeeease.... Did he mention even once that maybe he should or could brush up a little on BiPolar (BP)----NO.
  11. flutterbee

    flutterbee Guest

    I think it's very unethical for him to refuse to recommend another therapist to you and would probably report this to whatever organization oversees his profession.

    Although, you may not want anyone that he recommends. But, on the flip side I had a truly horrid GYN refer me to someone else and she was amazing. She didn't think so highly of him, though. :rofl:
  12. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Good point, Heather. I did kind of wonder if he acted the way he did because there have been other complaints about him. He works for a group and one of the psychiatrists there (not difficult child's regular psychiatrist) is a psychiatrist at the psychiatric hospital, which is why I called there to begin with.

    I just don't get why pediatricians and psychiatrists and neurologists, etc., keep parents in the loop but don't put them through the "only the dr knows what's going on" cr*p- it's only tdocs who do this and they are the least educated of the other medical professionals. I used the analogy to this therapist that I wasn't a psychiatrist and don't want to tell psychiatrist how to do his job, but if my son has a diagnosis of BiPolar (BP) and psychiatrist prescibes lexapro instead of a mood stabilizer, I am going to ask psychiatrist why. He understood that- then why the h**l can't he understand that I am questioning what he is (or should I say "isn't") doing?
  13. flutterbee

    flutterbee Guest

    Oh, I've had a pediatrician pull that cr@p. He said, "You're the Mom, but I'm the doctor." I replied, "You don't trump me."

    I don't think he liked that very much, but it's true. Needless to say, we don't see him anymore.
  14. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    what I find really amazing about this guy - he acts offended when you show a lack of confidence in his ability to help your child; says he's a professional who does a good job and can help here - then asks you (again) basic information he should already have at his fingertips, if he's doing his job properly (and reading the file)!

    He may as well have asked you, "What's his name again?"


  15. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    That's the way I see it, Marg- let's just hope the PO sees it that way this afternoon when I have to explain it to her.
  16. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    I'm heading off for our meeting with PO, but just keep having this other statement that the therapist said yesterday run through my mind...

    He actually said that mothers come in there all the time with their sons and a lot of them are single mothers, and he chuckled and continued "they always seem to have some mental incestous thing going on between them that I have to break through".

    I was wondering what others make of that statement..
  17. KTMom91

    KTMom91 Well-Known Member

    Hope your meeting goes smoothly!

    Tdocs like that are why I'm not a big fan of therapy. Hope you find someone who is able to understand your difficult child AND do some research on his/her own to find the best way to help. Many hugs.
  18. Jena

    Jena New Member

    I am so so sorry, that is all i can say after reading all of that. i cannot believe. i cannot believe you reframed yourself from hitting him. yes i have anger issues lol for sure.

    what a J*rk at the end of the day. it's astounding that these people consider themselves doctors, specialists or are capable of helping others.

  19. janebrain

    janebrain New Member

    That statement therapist made is really sickening--what a pompous a**! Please update us as soon as you can after meeting with the PO.
  20. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    Shoot! If I had known all illnesses were the same before, I would have bought stock in Bayer, because Aspirin cures everything, right?

    I'd get bleeped if I said what I thought of this guy. Something tells me you aren't the first that has questioned his expertise and it was one time too many.