school has backed off.....

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Jena, Oct 3, 2008.

  1. Jena

    Jena New Member


    i forgot to post i'm crazy posting as of late........see i go away for a while then return with so so much to share :)

    anyway since taking everyone's advice here with difficult child's school situation ie. ms. herbal teacher (yea i know i used herbal to get her to bed past two nights) but i'm still going to keep that name for her because she was nasty to me twice so she's earned it :), then fighting iep, telling me i'm responsible for difficult child not forgetting hw books in class, etc. its' all in my posts.

    Since I began documenting and providing school with-letter every a.m. difficult child doesn't get in on time and i've cut all verbal with them, guess what my phone hasn't rung 5 times ea. morning anymore at all. they have officially stopped harrassing me for time being. yea me! i'm enjoying it while it lasts.

    I also provided teacher with a note, typed ofcourse dated and I kept copy for my file i'm learning :) gotta handle this like my business that negative comments made on tests grade papers is unnecessary, and that due to difficult child forgetting hw books almost every night it is contributing to her bad grades, hence guess what we need an iep that's a provisional thing, and that their not letting difficult child head to nurse at all is creating more anxiety in her, and a few other things. just all documented proof that their creating a level of anxiety in her at this point. i'm sure ms. herbal appreciated that greatly. just as i appreciated her two phone calls telling me i don't know how to handle my daughter.

    so proof, proof, proof i'm going to barrage them with so much documentation when this all begins their not going to know what to do other than to fold eventually and give her what she needs.

    i realized yesterday being new to the area that difficult child after next year heads to middle 8 periods a day alone in hallway trying Occupational Therapist (OT) find various rooms, locker, sorry i am hopeful that we wil grow through this yet there is no way that difficult child is going to be able to handle that how she is right now. if an iep is in place they'll have to review before than and have her set up appropriately or she'll lose it.

    thanks again!!! :)
  2. Jena

    Jena New Member

    i've also decided after speaking to several parents in the area of special needs children that this school is known to fight the ieps and 504s to a great extent. so maybe a small article in the local newspaper wouldn't hurt also. :) or would they treat difficult child badly due to mom lunging?? hmmm
  3. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    Ms Herbal? M had a Ms Quartz Chrystal, aka Ms Birkenstock who was a total idiot. Is she perhaps the same woman?
  4. bran155

    bran155 Guest

    How dare the teacher treat you that way. If I were you I would take my butt to the Board of Ed office and file a formal complaint. Then you should call The Student Advocacy Board, they are lawyers who deal with negligent SDs. They charge on a sliding fee scale. Also call the newspaper and the local news. Tell whoever will listen.

    Do not let them bully you. Your child has the right to an education specifically designed for her needs!!!!!

    Good luck. :)
  5. Jena

    Jena New Member

    lol oh that made me laugh!!!! laughing is good :) yup maybe their one in the same. i'd like to put some herbal........ok let me stop and keep it clean!

    bran - yes, she's ms. herbal/let me fix your child/i have a god syndrome/i am ms. olympian (tells kids everyday how she begins training at 4 a.m. each day), yea ok good for you ms. pyscho superwoman.

    ok have i rambled'm so bad. she's a great teacher, she just stepped over the line with me so now she's on my hmmmmmm "i don't like you so much list" :)
  6. Lillyth

    Lillyth New Member

    Miss psycho superwoman...

    That made me snort.

    You know, if you can get a couple of other parents on board, I think a little article in the local paper might be just the thing...:hearye:
  7. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    Wasn't that a song by Donovan in the 1960's?
  8. Jena

    Jena New Member

    Yes, maybe I should bring it to the next class party?? hmmm do you think she'd catch on?? :)
  9. Stella Johnson

    Stella Johnson Active Member

    OK, here is my 2 cents.

    First, take a deep breath. I don't think this teacher is out to get difficult child or you. She is just at a loss for trying to get difficult child to remember her school books.
    When you have the IEP, have it written in that the teacher needs to make sure all the required take home things are in her back pack.

    Does she have a behavior sheet that is sent home daily? My difficult child has had one for years, also in her IEP.

    I know you are aggravated with the system. It is hard. I've been through it all. Go in with the attitude that you want to help difficult child and you want to know what they can do to help also. Don't go in with a combative attitude assuming they won't do anything.

    I wouldn't start trying to contact the media at this point and an attorney probably won't take it now either. There are steps you have to go through per federal regulations.

    I promise if you try to work with the teachers and listent to them, they will do the same for you.


    P.S. If you haven't already start making a list of things you think will help difficult child for the IEP as well as any other concerns you have about her education.
  10. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    If you're prepared to use the media, keep it in reserve for a last resort.

    If you feel the school is likely to fight you on IEP or 504, keep that knowledge at the back of your mind but try to not let it show in your communications with the school.

    The way to go - keep your communications polite but firm. Try to get their responses in writing - a mob who are trying to avoid responsibility will NOT put their responses in writing, they are more likely to call you instead. In my files I have reams of letters I wrote, and NONE received from the officials. None. I do have lots of notes taken during the phone calls they made - most important that you take detailed notes of every call they make to you, from here on. Date the call, if you can remember words exactly (yours or theirs) then put them in double quote marks, also if you can get it, write the name of the person you're talking to.
    Keep it on file.

    Be prepared at all times to take your notes. The last time I had to do this, I was out shopping and the call came in on my mobile phone. I slipped into a nearby shop (to get away from the mall musak enough to hear) and grabbed some medical reports from my bag and the only writing tool I could find - a lip pencil! When I got home I transcribed my notes. Being able to quote them has been very valuable.

    A school which is trying to avoid spending money will keep trying to obstruct. They win only when parents cave in - a lot of parents do, because if they apply for something and the school says no, parents assume the school knows better (they ARE the professional educators, after all).

    Often you will win just be continuing to appeal. They're not used to persistent parents.

    So you may not need to use the media - this time. Like any big weapon, it is most effective in its non-use.

    As for your child being penalised for your activism - find out the legal situation in your area. Plan ahead so you can know to quote the right legislation immediately you need to. don't go in sooner - it will be like a surfer trying to catch a wave who paddles off too early and then finds himself getting dumped. You have to time your fast paddle to catch the peak of the wave.

    I managed to pull off a major coup when my kids were little - I had used political clout to get what I wanted, since I was being blocked by our education system at state level. I actually did say to the school staff, "I know I have made some enemies by going over your heads. I know a number of you do not think I am stable. So please bear this in mind - if I am unstable and paranoid, then I will react very strongly at even the possibility that any of my children are being disadvantaged in any way by my unpopularity. And as you know, I DO have enough political clout to achieve the impossible. You do not want me to feel I need to use that same political clout to come to the defence of my children. Even if no disadvantage to my children is intended, be prepared for the likelihood that I will take it personally and react to protect my child."

    At another point - again, only after I had had to insist against strong opposition, I also said, "I am a person who can get a lot of things done and cut through a great deal of red tape. I could use this to the school's advantage. Or not. It's up to you."

    Despite my use of strong words, I am a very firm believer in cooperation with the school where possible - I emphasise that all my efforts are as part of the Learning Team for my child, that we all have to work together to get results here; but the child should not be disadvantaged due to disability. If the school comes back with concerns that providing a high level of support discriminates against the other children, you fall back on "all children should have equal access to education - due to disability, this child does not have equal access; all this support is designed to reduce the inequity, we're not there yet. The child is still disadvantaged compared to the others in the class." Be prepared to produce medical reports to back you up.

    Schools were not designed to do a lot of the roles which have been thrust on them. A lot of older staff particularly, are fighting the changes that have come in. "These children should be somewhere more appropriate" is a common phrase I've heard. They have been shocked when I have told them that SCHOOL is the "appropriate place" and that in a lot of cases, there IS nowhere more suitable. We HAVE to make school fit the child because the child cannot make the adjustment the other way, and there often is no alternative placement.

    YOu need to be able to see the school's point of view, even if you disagree with it. Because if you can, then it is easier to argue your case (especially if you can plan ahead to counter their arguments).

    Frankly, it's like handling a difficult child.

    I've actually used the Explosive Child" methods in my dealings with school officials. I privately consider large organisations, especially our education system, to be autistic. Poor social skills, communication has to be spelt out clearly and unambiguously, they are rule followers but they also write what they believe to be the rules to fit the situations they observe. And they do not cope well with change, or challenge. Too sudden a change or too different a challenge and they go into meltdown.

    Treat them accordingly and you will have more success. And ultimately, what you want is success. Hopefully you won't have to rub their noses in the dirt to get it. It's best not to, if you don't have to - because you might need to do that later, and if you do it too often it doesn't work.

  11. Jena

    Jena New Member

    Marg - you go with your bad self!!! :) good for you!!!

    Well, when the school well over a week ago on a verbal told me that they think difficult child's ongoing problems are a "home problem", and as per ms. herbal I am not handling her correctly, and all of a sudden in the a.m. when i was handling difficult child they were calling my cell 5 times, comments were being made regarding her lateness I spoke to an attny friend. i was advised to create distance accept no verbal communication at all from them, to document everything and to write everything down.

    steph i did try the nice way for a little over a year now. yet once this new school pyshchologist came on board and watched my daughter for 5 min. in class he called me and said she's fine there's no need for an iep or a 504 the school will not be backing you. then called back and lefta message stating if i'd like to make an appointment with the school in regards to coming up with a plan of action on how to learn how to handle difficult child better at home?? lol...........

    their insane. so i'm already on defense which it's all good they put me here. her grades are now slipping, teacher is purposely not documenting missed hw's she's letting her go on paper, yet grilling her in classroom. etc.

    marg very crafty with the "unstable mom" comment i loved that!!!
  12. dreamer

    dreamer New Member

    jennifer, hvae you formally and officially written a leeter requesting an evaluation for IEP via certified mail return reciept requested? Somewhere, I think there is a sample of how to write that letter, and until that letter is written properly and sent to them properly, , it sounds like they are just going to keep putting you off, and all the while they will be speaking of you behind your back in a negative way with each other, and possibly building up some idiotic "case" against you. JUst becuz you are not hearing from them via phone these days does not mean things are all okay at school etc.

    It is very important to request the iep in the legal manner, properly. Formally. Like Marg said, you can write anything you want, and likely the school will conveniently "not recieve" those writings. The documentation many people talk about is certified mail reciepts that confirm you did send anything, and confirms yes someone at school read it.(well, no, um, it does not confirm they read it, but, with confirmation and documentation via certified mail, you can prove you sent something) Highly possible they are not calling you becuz they are now useing a different approach to handleing things. This does not mean it is the correct approach. They may be biding time and working to build a case to take some kind of action that YOU might not like.
    Please find out how to write the proper foraml letter requesting an IEP formally. ANd send it the proper formal way, becuz if you do send the proper format letter in the proper fashion, the school will then be legally bound to do certain things in a certain way in a certain amount of time.
  13. dreamer

    dreamer New Member

    worse, all those letters you are writing to school about the nites and mornings etc about your difficult child? The school might be saving those, and useing those and might bring those forward, depending on what you did try to use against you. Depending on how you write what you write, they might misunderstand it, might misconstrue it, might decide they do not like how you are handleing things with your child. Have you told them she was Rx'ed thorazine and you decided not to give it? Depending on how you said that, they might twist it and say you are not following docs orders.

    I know somewhere here, either here on general forum or over in Special Education forum, I tried to help you understand what "documentation" was about. I thought I tried to help you understand that some of what it sounds like you might be writing to school might not be a good idea right now at this time. and why it might not be. I am nervous you might be giving them a lot of ammunition not to get your difficult child an IEP but rather to have them decide it IS you andnot your childs illness......depending on what you are writing and how you are saying it. You really need the protections of an IEP and docs reports in school records, etc to support the things I am afraid you are saying to the school. Even WITH an IEP, some schools twist things, but without haveing an IEP in place yet, some of these things are NOT going to be considered in the same light by the persons at school.
  14. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    Always document, but do so carefully. The school does NOT need to know that you have great reservations about a doctor, and that you are trying to decide if you iwll follow treatment. In that case (ie thorazine) you just keep the info/rx/psychiatrist meeting results to your ownself. School should know she was absent for a doctor appointment, but that is IT until you decide to follow the doctor's orders.

    School should not know she was up all night because she ate X, or drank caffeine, or anything that can be used against you. Simply, due to her anxiety over school and her dxs, difficult child could not sleep last night. We are working with a doctor on this issue. Your patience is appreciated.

    For the homework, "difficult child's IEP states that the teacher should check her backpack to be sure all books and notebooks needed for completion of assigned work and homework are in the backpack. If this is not done at school, then it is impossible, due to difficult child's disabilities, for difficult child to do any work at home. Yesterday her backpack was not checked and she could not complete assignments X, Y and Z. If you will check that the appropriate books and notebooks are in her backpack tonight, along with the books/notebooks for tonights homeowrk, we will work on catching up on those assignments."

    Or you could have the IEP state that she should have a copy of all textbooks to keep at home, as well as a copy for school. Then she would only have to bring notebooks and worksheets back and forth. and teacher would have less to check.

    Create a sheet to use to track the week's assignments, the ntoebook (green english notebook, purple science notebook, black journal notebook, puppies Spanish notebook, etc...) and textbook and worksheets needed for each assignment. Then teacher should check the tracking sheet against the backpack, initial it, and then you initial at home when assignments are done. YOU also initial if the books/etc made it home, AND are in backpack to take to school. YOU initial they are in backpack to return to school because it shows teacher you are willing to work on this also.
  15. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    That's really good advice, to avoid unnecessary information especially if it could be misinterpreted and used against you.

    Example: easy child 2/difficult child 2 was a part-time actress/model/performer during her high school years but for every job a person gets, there could be ten auditions that you don't get. They tried to schedule appointments for outside school hours but sometimes it was unavoidable. No way was I going to admit to the school that easy child 2/difficult child 2 had an audition - that would not only have set tongues wagging in the staffroom, it could have caused ME a lot of trouble when trying to negotiate services for difficult child 1 - I'd met that problem before, when easy child was at the same school as difficult child 1 and I was accused of concentrating too much on easy child and neglecting difficult child 1.

    So although part of me wanted to shout, "Yay! She's got another audition! And it's for a TV series!" or whatever, discretion was warranted. If a change of clothing was needed, I'd bring it with me and we'd do a "costume change" in the car on the way there.

    And my note to the school - "Please excuse easy child 2/difficult child 2 from class this afternoon as she has an appointment to attend in the city. We do endeavour to have appointments made for outside school hours but sometimes this is unavoidable." I just let them THINK it was a medical appointment.

    The one time I was honest - when easy child had a photo shoot one morning during school hours - I got a terse note from a teacher telling me that it was inappropriate for her to be doing "this sort of thing" during school hours. Honestly! She WAS studying Drama as one of her major subjects, it actually was a very interesting session and actually relevant to her studies (as well as moderately lucrative).

    So keep it short, simple and conservative. This need to not give the school any ammunition that could be used against you as a parent - it's one very good reason for disguising your ID on this site.

  16. Jena

    Jena New Member

    Marg you think so? i mean changing name on it. i never really thought about that before. should i change it? wow i never thought of that before.