Stories of parents and estranged grown kids...wow.

Discussion in 'Parent Emeritus' started by MidwestMom, Dec 15, 2014.

  1. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    tons of them. One story after another. Anyone with a child who refuses to see them and is abusive, YOU ARE SO NOT ALONE! To me, these parents are lost and clueless about how to handle this horrible situation and many get offended at the idea of therapy, but they are still feeling the emotions we feel. I wish they could learn what many of us here have learned, but they do mirror our experiences, if not our emotions.

    For anyone interested in reading the stories, here's the address:

    http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/parents/msg070136435631.html?87
     
  2. Scent of Cedar *

    Scent of Cedar * Well-Known Member

    Wow, MWM.

    This is such good information for us to have.

    Thanks, thanks, thanks.

    :O)

    Cedar
     
  3. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    It is new that we talk about spurned and abused parents. It used to only be parents who could abuse, never the grown children. It is validating to me to see that this old fallacy is not true. I am thinking of Scott, who said good-bye after having been given a good life. And I relate to the woman in this thread who said she didn't want her adult children back in her life at all unless they realized they had been terribly abusive. I feel that way about Scott.

    I also related to the woman who was upset about her sister's estrangement. However, I feel she wasn't listening to her sister, who made some good points and was trying to tell her "I can't keep up with your lifestyle. It's too hard." In this case, I took it upon myself to judge her post ;) and decide her sister had a point, but she did too. Just made me feel more strongly about DNA not meaning love/understanding/a bond/somebody who will always be there for you no matter what.

    Lots of good reading there. Not so much help or good advice, like here, but tons of sharing.
     
  4. 2much2recover

    2much2recover Well-Known Member

    Just started reading but this just jumped out at me: "That's what all Narcissistic people do - push you until you think you are the crazy one, or everything that has gone wrong in their life, is your fault, never theirs." And: Yes, this is how they behave and they never take responsibility for their actions. Someone will always make excuses for them and they will exclaim, "I didn't intend too." One will never hear a heartfelt, sincere apology. At times they may sound sincere, but they will tell you to get over it and accuse you of being unforgiving. Then they will continue to act and behave as they always have and learned. Why? Because it works and there are others who will always make excuses for their behaviors. AND: Yes, this is correct people do not act grateful nor do they appreciate when everything has been handed to them. It will not matter how much you try to tell them what you had to sacrifice. You will need to learn to stand up for yourself and to set boundaries and limits on her behaviors.
     
  5. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    2 Hard, I have had the fortunate experience of raising not just a difficult child, but three PCs. It is the difficult children (in my case my oldest son and my DNA collection of relatives) who behave that way and think everything that was done to them is somehow bad and your fault. My easy child kids are wonderful and generous with their praise of us and do appreciate all they've had.

    It is the personality-disordered who feel everything is upside down and inside out and reality is not reality and wrong is right and the world is a game of "let's do it backwards." I am grateful and feel blessed that I do have adult children who appreciate us...I especially get that from both Sonic and Jumper. Julie's life was harder...ex and I did not give her as good a life as the youngest two had because we did not get along well. But she is understanding and kindhearted. Ex was not an involved father to her or 37. He only seemed interested in Scott.

    difficult child is not that horrible this way either. He does not think his upbringing was bad. He just does very questionable interactions with his father and me, but has stopped stealing and conning, to the best of my knowledge (this could well be wrong, and I know it and accept it). It just seems he is not as afraid of the cops coming to get him as he used to be...lol.

    But, yeah, all personality-disorered adults sound the same. It's your fault. I'm this way because of you. You don't love me because you don't give me enough. You never gave me enough. You did (a made up incident) and that ruined me for life (even though it never happened). You are an unfit parent. Blah, blah, blah. It's like listening to a lying machine. I can understand why some people feel more peaceful when their adult children are not in their lives, as awful as it sounds. I do not miss Scott. Hoever, I think Scott would have een a normal young adult had he been raised in a home early on rather than an orphanage. I think his problems are more attachment disorder related, but it still is not tolerable to be around him since he judges all of us except my ex to be inferior and sinful.
     
  6. 2much2recover

    2much2recover Well-Known Member

    I agree and it is especially hard when your child is an "only" as it is hard to make sound judgements about what the difficult child is saying and doing to you.
     
  7. TearyEyed

    TearyEyed Member

    I agree 2much,

    My difficult child is my only child. Its very confusing to hear him tell me how horrible I was. I start to think maybe I was. It makes me lose all trust and faith in myself:(
     
  8. nlj

    nlj Well-Known Member

    Heartbreaking stories.
    So hard to read some of the posts.
     
  9. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    My parents could have written one of those stories.
    The problem is... I know the other side of the story.

    I don't hate them. I simply have too much on my plate to deal with their dysfunctional, undermining behaviors. I just can't afford to be around them.
     
  10. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    in my opinion...unless people who try to love you obviously abuse you, there is no good excuse for totally cutting somebody out of your life. Low contact is not the same as pretending the other person doesn't exist. It is the ultimate cruelty when a family member does it to somebody else if the person it is being done to does want a relationship with that person. It breaks hearts and minds and souls. Setting boundaries is not cutting anyone out. Saying, "You are dead to me. Don't call. I won't tell you where I live. I won't give you my phone number. You can't see me for any reason" is cruel and gives the other person no option.

    If somebody is unsafe to our mental health or physical safety, yeah, we have no choice but to do it. But this happens sometimes when a differently-wired loved one decides we are everything evil that exists on earth. And sometimes a narcissistic or antisocial or borderline loved one does a cut off simply because you refuse to do something they want you to do. It is a form of blackmail. Then we are gone to them until/unless we comply. And that is not setting boundaries. That is just plain cruel. JMO.
     
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  11. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    So what do you do when the narcissist is the one who feels wronged by not having a relationship? There is no limit setting for this person. Everything is about THEM. I don't even think this person really cares about having a relationship with me, but DOES care about how they look in the eyes of their friends if they don't have a relationship with their kids.

    I lose either way. I just don't care any more. There is no support, from anywhere. So, not fitting in with narcissist doesn't result in less support... just more wrong being spewed around.

    (and the other parent backs this one 100%... probably has learned not to cross their spouse - so it costs me a relationship with that one too)
     
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  12. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    I agree, IC. My dad is a narcissist and it doesn't bother him not to be in contact with me unless I kiss his you-know-what. In that case, you aren't hurting anyone. You are protecting yourself, right?

    I don't care either. Join the party ;)
     
  13. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    It BOTHERS mine to not be in contact - because it makes my parents look bad (we live in the same city, have the same circle of friends, tons of relatives here). So, in protecting myself (and husband and the kids), I am in fact "hurting" them. And I really don't like having to hurt parent #2... but I can't even see that parent without the other one. Narcissist is that controlling.
     
  14. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Well, if it doesn't hurt them because of YOU is it relevant? That's not hurting them, really. It's making them feel embarrassed maybe?
     
  15. 2much2recover

    2much2recover Well-Known Member

    Easy to say unless you are immensely more intelligent and have all the wisdom and energy to deal with the mind-effing they do anytime you have contact with them. I wish we could drop this subject of "how hateful it is to go no contact" as it is extremely hurtful , I'll say to me, (it seems personal to thosw who have had to make this choice) which it is, because there are no other "right" choices to make. I know that you don't want to make this seem like it is personal, but when one is forced into living this way to protect their own health and mental health, seeks support and is told they are a rotten person because they will not even consider "low contact" well it just hurts. For those of us that have had to go with this option, there is a reason and it is not me that wants this situation to be what it is but again IT IS WHAT IT IS AND SHE IS WHAT SHE IS. For me, I always check with my therapist if I am making the right decisions for me. I don't need someone on this board or anywhere else to judge me or my situation. You have to walk a mile in someones shoes before you can understand why someone would go NC with their own child. There are VERY GOOD EXCUSES for going NC, like if you difficult child steals from you, manipulates you, tries to control you etc. Setting boundaries does not work with ALL difficult child'S and going NC is not a HATEFUL - "you are dead to me" It is pain and suffering on the part of the person that, for their own good - is forced to make this choice.

    Unless you have been there/done that I think it's cruel OF YOU to say that a parent MUST at all costs continue a relationship or they are somehow evil or there is something wrong with the parent who makes that choice! My daughter had plenty of "OPTIONS" but they all ended in manipulation and control.

    If it can not be accepted that SOME people need to go NC I will have to leave this board and go NC with it. I feel when the subject is raised and repeated of how mean/cruel NC is - once it has been said it is enough.
     
  16. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    2much...
    I don't think that was the intention of this thread.
    Yes, some of us have had to go NC - with difficult children of any generation.
    As you say... it is always "last resort", and done to protect (ourselves or others) rather than to harm the one we go NC with.

    There will always be cases where kids go NC with parents for reasons that are not at all obvious. Ditto for cases where parents go NC with kids. And then there are cases where... its just sad, didn't need to go that way.

    If you need to be NC..., you still have the support of this board.
     
  17. 2much2recover

    2much2recover Well-Known Member

    Thank you - I HAVE TO go NC because my difficult child is a high IQ Sociopath. I don't have the mental or health to constantly tangle with her. Even "low contact" is viewed as one foot in the door - GAME ON!
     
  18. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Head2, I don't think it's hateful to do a cut off to a heinous person who hurts you. I've done it.

    I would cut any sociopath completely out of my life.
     
  19. 2much2recover

    2much2recover Well-Known Member

    It just hurts when I read things like this because having a sociopathic child is isolating enough - they try hard to isolate you. I have kicked myself hard enough with the cruel and hateful labels..........
     
  20. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    No. If I had your daughter, she would not be in my life for all the reasons you mentioned. They don't have any feelings for anybody and are dangerous. You need to protect yourself. Sadly, this is not as rare as we think.

    On the other hand, there are people we love who are not sociopathic, but are narcissistic and borderline (which is bad enough) who cut us off for virtually no reason and, boy, it hurts.

    I think most of our difficult children here in PE have personality disorders, which is why they are so similar and so hard to rationalize with. You do not have the only sociopath here. Some just do it other ways...steal, lie, hit you, con you, abuse you...we have quite a few here who could probably get the diagnosis and a few who actually have.
     
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