Forums
New posts
Search forums
What's new
New posts
New profile posts
Latest activity
Internet Search
Members
Current visitors
New profile posts
Search profile posts
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Forums
Parent Support Forums
Parent Emeritus
Update: Detachment as Spiritual Practice, and an Update
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="recoveringenabler" data-source="post: 613682" data-attributes="member: 13542"><p>I've been reading everyone's posts and I find myself wanting to say, quite loudly and with force, Echolette, Cedar and anyone else who has an adult kid who has gone on some other road then the one we had envisioned..........and is not participating in life as a functioning, contributing, connected adult...........<u>.YOU DIDN'T DO ANYTHING WRONG!!! THERE IS NOTHING ELSE YOU CAN DO!! </u></p><p></p><p>Pardon me, but during my stint in difficult child hell, I surrounded myself with people who would say that to me, like every day, 5 times a day, until one day I believed them. You guys didn't do this to them. They made choices which lead them where they are, no one held a gun to their head, they all went quite willingly. Perhaps happily. While you are suffering, your kids are out panhandling, manipulating, using others, whatever they are up to, but they are not suffering, you are. They chose this, you didn't. </p><p></p><p>Without a constant supply of support, it is so easy to fall into that FOG I keep mentioning,<em> the codependent FOG</em>, which is this............difficult child asks or demands something, or you see them looking grim...............you immediately slip into guilt or "there must be something I can do to change this"....................I have the power to change this..................If I only do this one thing, it will be different.................this is all my fault and I must pay for this..............This time will be different..............I can't allow this...................I am a horrible parent...............and the biggest bugaboo of all, <em>I can't handle this anxiety that doing nothing brings, so I will take some action, any action to make this horrible powerlessness, this utter lack of control, this remarkable sense of vulnerability, go away. For now. Temporarily, until the next powerless moment arrives and then I will repeat this whole cycle once again.</em></p><p></p><p>The only way out of this cycle is to tell yourself the truth of what is. Our kids are exactly what you see. Be angry. Be sad. Feel all of that, it's real. This is a long process to get through effectively and it goes all over the place, all those feelings surface continuously and with a vengeance as Echolette expressed. It's part of the way through.</p><p></p><p>As my very wise therapist told me repeatedly Cedar, "you do not have to stay on the phone listening to all of the antics your kids go through." <strong>That is abuse</strong>. They drag you into their world where you don't live and don't understand the language or the landscape and they terrorize you with it. Stop it. My therapist actually showed me the hand motion of holding the phone by my ear, saying, "thank you for sharing, I have to go now" and quickly putting the phone down. She said, "get really good at doing that." That was my practice for awhile, to just stop listening to stuff I had no control over and couldn't change, so why listen to it? I stopped completely. That was an important step.</p><p></p><p>Cedar, you guys are in the trenches now, yes, the snake pit, both your kids have surfaced now and are putting you through the ringer..............here is the opportunity to change the patterns you all set in motion many many years ago. Stop listening to your sons abuse. Say to him, "I will talk to you if you are respectful, however if you begin to be disrespectful, I will hang up. And, your father and I have decided to stop giving you any money or help at all until you show signs of helping yourself. " Once he begins his attack, calmly say, " I am hanging up now." Do not listen to his assertions about his present life being your fault, that is complete BS, it is <u>his fault.</u></p><p></p><p>Your daughter has no right to involve you in her beatings, her insane lifestyle, what can you do other then send money? Don't stay engaged with her when she is drinking, you are talking to a substance, not your daughter. Set a boundary about that, 'we will talk when you are sober, otherwise do not call me. If you are not willing to help yourself, I am not willing to listen to you destroy your life.'</p><p></p><p>Your kids are not as unhealthy as you think they are, they are simply very good manipulators and they are very good at getting what they want and need from you and your husband. I would venture to day they are masters at it. As my daughter is too. As you are getting clearer about who<em> they</em> are, their masks are getting thinner and pretty soon the real people show up and show you their true colors and then you can make entirely different choices about how your life is going to go from now on. As we stop our enabling, they begin to stop their negative behaviors<em> towards us</em> but usually after some escalating bad behavior which allows us to really see the truth. Like with your sons recent bad behavior. Don't condone that treatment of you by giving him anything but a boot in the rear. </p><p></p><p>So, while this step is so devastating Cedar, it is also liberating..............it is the truth............so really keep your eyes and your ears opened to what is being said, stay very alert and if you go into the Fog, say, "I"ll have to get back to you on that." Once off the phone, post here, call a friend, or someone who can talk you out of the Fog. I am completely available to do that for you if you want to PM me. It takes a lot to get out of that fog, believe me. I watched myself slip in to that place over and over and over again. But, each time a therapist or my SO or my best friend, or someone was there to pull me out. </p><p></p><p>Just as I wrote that I thought of those old Tarzan movies from our youth, you know, the ones with Johnny Weissmuller? Well, remember the quicksand? They would slip into it and it would take monumental effort to be retrieved from it, if even possible............it sucked you down into the earth...............yuck...............that's just what the fog will do if you allow it, it's an extremely powerful force and we need help to stop going there.</p><p></p><p>Cedar, here's my unsolicited advice, don't take your daughter or your granddaughter in..........stay off the phone with your kids, stop giving them money or anything, stop giving them time and energy.........turn away from this as Scott said, like watching a TV show with odd characters, but you can turn off the TV. Turn it off now. This is so very hard, God, I know it is, I do, face this truth now and move away from your kids...........let them go into the lives they chose and accept it. It will set you free to do that, I promise. But you have to walk through this fire first, this recognition of who your kids are and your powerlessness and complete<em> lack of responsibility.</em> They both have their own karmic journey and all of this is a part of it, but in order for all of you to be free you have to stop allowing them to blame you, hurt you and in any way do you harm. Love yourself enough to stop allowing them to treat you unkindly. </p><p></p><p>It's a trap to ask how did this happen. We don't know. Trying to figure it out presumes there is someone or something to blame or some way to fix it. But there is not. Stop asking that question and start asking yourself "what do I want?" in reference to YOUR life, not your kids lives, they have to ask themselves their own questions. </p><p></p><p>As always, sending you lots of love and compassion for your journey home...............</p><p>Hang in there Cedar, you're right there on the precipice hanging over the edge .......right before we tumble into surrendering...................</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="recoveringenabler, post: 613682, member: 13542"] I've been reading everyone's posts and I find myself wanting to say, quite loudly and with force, Echolette, Cedar and anyone else who has an adult kid who has gone on some other road then the one we had envisioned..........and is not participating in life as a functioning, contributing, connected adult...........[U].YOU DIDN'T DO ANYTHING WRONG!!! THERE IS NOTHING ELSE YOU CAN DO!! [/U] Pardon me, but during my stint in difficult child hell, I surrounded myself with people who would say that to me, like every day, 5 times a day, until one day I believed them. You guys didn't do this to them. They made choices which lead them where they are, no one held a gun to their head, they all went quite willingly. Perhaps happily. While you are suffering, your kids are out panhandling, manipulating, using others, whatever they are up to, but they are not suffering, you are. They chose this, you didn't. Without a constant supply of support, it is so easy to fall into that FOG I keep mentioning,[I] the codependent FOG[/I], which is this............difficult child asks or demands something, or you see them looking grim...............you immediately slip into guilt or "there must be something I can do to change this"....................I have the power to change this..................If I only do this one thing, it will be different.................this is all my fault and I must pay for this..............This time will be different..............I can't allow this...................I am a horrible parent...............and the biggest bugaboo of all, [I]I can't handle this anxiety that doing nothing brings, so I will take some action, any action to make this horrible powerlessness, this utter lack of control, this remarkable sense of vulnerability, go away. For now. Temporarily, until the next powerless moment arrives and then I will repeat this whole cycle once again.[/I] The only way out of this cycle is to tell yourself the truth of what is. Our kids are exactly what you see. Be angry. Be sad. Feel all of that, it's real. This is a long process to get through effectively and it goes all over the place, all those feelings surface continuously and with a vengeance as Echolette expressed. It's part of the way through. As my very wise therapist told me repeatedly Cedar, "you do not have to stay on the phone listening to all of the antics your kids go through." [B]That is abuse[/B]. They drag you into their world where you don't live and don't understand the language or the landscape and they terrorize you with it. Stop it. My therapist actually showed me the hand motion of holding the phone by my ear, saying, "thank you for sharing, I have to go now" and quickly putting the phone down. She said, "get really good at doing that." That was my practice for awhile, to just stop listening to stuff I had no control over and couldn't change, so why listen to it? I stopped completely. That was an important step. Cedar, you guys are in the trenches now, yes, the snake pit, both your kids have surfaced now and are putting you through the ringer..............here is the opportunity to change the patterns you all set in motion many many years ago. Stop listening to your sons abuse. Say to him, "I will talk to you if you are respectful, however if you begin to be disrespectful, I will hang up. And, your father and I have decided to stop giving you any money or help at all until you show signs of helping yourself. " Once he begins his attack, calmly say, " I am hanging up now." Do not listen to his assertions about his present life being your fault, that is complete BS, it is [U]his fault.[/U] Your daughter has no right to involve you in her beatings, her insane lifestyle, what can you do other then send money? Don't stay engaged with her when she is drinking, you are talking to a substance, not your daughter. Set a boundary about that, 'we will talk when you are sober, otherwise do not call me. If you are not willing to help yourself, I am not willing to listen to you destroy your life.' Your kids are not as unhealthy as you think they are, they are simply very good manipulators and they are very good at getting what they want and need from you and your husband. I would venture to day they are masters at it. As my daughter is too. As you are getting clearer about who[I] they[/I] are, their masks are getting thinner and pretty soon the real people show up and show you their true colors and then you can make entirely different choices about how your life is going to go from now on. As we stop our enabling, they begin to stop their negative behaviors[I] towards us[/I] but usually after some escalating bad behavior which allows us to really see the truth. Like with your sons recent bad behavior. Don't condone that treatment of you by giving him anything but a boot in the rear. So, while this step is so devastating Cedar, it is also liberating..............it is the truth............so really keep your eyes and your ears opened to what is being said, stay very alert and if you go into the Fog, say, "I"ll have to get back to you on that." Once off the phone, post here, call a friend, or someone who can talk you out of the Fog. I am completely available to do that for you if you want to PM me. It takes a lot to get out of that fog, believe me. I watched myself slip in to that place over and over and over again. But, each time a therapist or my SO or my best friend, or someone was there to pull me out. Just as I wrote that I thought of those old Tarzan movies from our youth, you know, the ones with Johnny Weissmuller? Well, remember the quicksand? They would slip into it and it would take monumental effort to be retrieved from it, if even possible............it sucked you down into the earth...............yuck...............that's just what the fog will do if you allow it, it's an extremely powerful force and we need help to stop going there. Cedar, here's my unsolicited advice, don't take your daughter or your granddaughter in..........stay off the phone with your kids, stop giving them money or anything, stop giving them time and energy.........turn away from this as Scott said, like watching a TV show with odd characters, but you can turn off the TV. Turn it off now. This is so very hard, God, I know it is, I do, face this truth now and move away from your kids...........let them go into the lives they chose and accept it. It will set you free to do that, I promise. But you have to walk through this fire first, this recognition of who your kids are and your powerlessness and complete[I] lack of responsibility.[/I] They both have their own karmic journey and all of this is a part of it, but in order for all of you to be free you have to stop allowing them to blame you, hurt you and in any way do you harm. Love yourself enough to stop allowing them to treat you unkindly. It's a trap to ask how did this happen. We don't know. Trying to figure it out presumes there is someone or something to blame or some way to fix it. But there is not. Stop asking that question and start asking yourself "what do I want?" in reference to YOUR life, not your kids lives, they have to ask themselves their own questions. As always, sending you lots of love and compassion for your journey home............... Hang in there Cedar, you're right there on the precipice hanging over the edge .......right before we tumble into surrendering................... [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Forums
Parent Support Forums
Parent Emeritus
Update: Detachment as Spiritual Practice, and an Update
Top