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<blockquote data-quote="recoveringenabler" data-source="post: 587538" data-attributes="member: 13542"><p>Barbara, it takes us mom's quite a while to see the truth when it involves our kids. A therapist I know described it as a FOG we go into when they interact with us, a fog which keeps us safely in the dark, not knowing, not wanting to know and from his point of view, it is part of codependency, allowing another's reality to not only infiltrate ours, but to trump it. Even when we are trying to believe them, there is a part of us that really knows it's "creative truth" at best and of course, it makes you angry, it's insulting and violates our own code of integrity. But to actually admit that our kids out and out lie, manipulate, deceive, demonstrate such poor choices that it defies reason................that's a lot to ask of us. So, we have to lift that lid of our unwillingness to see and look directly in the eyes of someone whom we recognize, but actually don't know..........</p><p></p><p>It took me a long time to be able to see the manipulations my daughter directed at me. I realized it had been going on for most of her life, it was our life script, it was the way we interacted. I would look at that now and call it codependency, enabling, rescuing, whatever words you want, but it was not a healthy connection, it was essentially me giving her everything she needed without demanding accountability. It was the opposite of how I grew up in a punitive and fearful environment, I thought if I did the opposite, that would be healthy. But, it wasn't, it is equally as unhealthy. And, my daughter also has mental issues, although not diagnosed, so I wondered about that too, how do you put a challenged person out there on the streets when they need guidance and direction? But, then a person on this board, a mother who is bi-polar said, "mental illness doesn't give you a pass on being responsible for your actions," I started to look at that very differently. Mentally ill folks can be highly intelligent and manipulative so allowing that behavior just serves their illness, it doesn't support the real person. </p><p></p><p>You're in a very challenging place, it takes an amazing amount of strength and commitment to be able to see the truth of the situation. It sounds like your daughter is self medicating and is abusing drugs in which case any involvement you have with her will be crazy making and stressful for you and she will use whatever means possible to continue her rampage without you knowing. You both have an investment in not seeing the truth and that is what keeps you stuck in your anger, because you know it's not the truth and yet you allow her to continue. I'm not judging you, I'm just stating what I believe to be the truth because I've lived it. When the masks come off, and the truth is revealed, that's when you both have a possibility of health. But, for you, you can only control your own responses, you cannot control her or her choices, your work is with you, not her.</p><p></p><p> In my opinion, the task for you is to take the focus off of your daughter, your grandkids, your husband, everyone else, and put it on YOU. You have the power to change your responses, but that will take work on your part because you have created a groove, a path which you and your daughter just slide on into. Changing that groove will take a commitment because it's hard to do. You will need tools to change into a different groove because the pull to stay in that one is tremendous. Part of that groove is believing her when you know in your heart it's a lie, so you are going against your own truth and that is a spirit killer. Lying to ourselves has consequences, it keeps you up at night, it makes you angry, it brings out lots of resentments. </p><p></p><p>I've done ALL of this and more, I think it comes with the territory we live in. It sucks. But, it is what it is. It's the acceptance of that, the knowledge of that deep in our souls that will set us free. I think we accept that one bite at a time because it's all we can tolerate as mothers..........as you once said, it's a personal devastation like no other. It is. But there is a light at the end of the tunnel and it is TRUTH, telling yourself the truth and facing it and accepting it, inch by miserable inch. That adage, the truth will set you free is absolutely true. And, conversely, the lack of truth will keep you in your own prison of deception. Get yourself out of there Barbara.........she is who she is..............you can't change her..............but you can change your responses to her.............I wish you so much peace and surround you with many many hugs.............</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="recoveringenabler, post: 587538, member: 13542"] Barbara, it takes us mom's quite a while to see the truth when it involves our kids. A therapist I know described it as a FOG we go into when they interact with us, a fog which keeps us safely in the dark, not knowing, not wanting to know and from his point of view, it is part of codependency, allowing another's reality to not only infiltrate ours, but to trump it. Even when we are trying to believe them, there is a part of us that really knows it's "creative truth" at best and of course, it makes you angry, it's insulting and violates our own code of integrity. But to actually admit that our kids out and out lie, manipulate, deceive, demonstrate such poor choices that it defies reason................that's a lot to ask of us. So, we have to lift that lid of our unwillingness to see and look directly in the eyes of someone whom we recognize, but actually don't know.......... It took me a long time to be able to see the manipulations my daughter directed at me. I realized it had been going on for most of her life, it was our life script, it was the way we interacted. I would look at that now and call it codependency, enabling, rescuing, whatever words you want, but it was not a healthy connection, it was essentially me giving her everything she needed without demanding accountability. It was the opposite of how I grew up in a punitive and fearful environment, I thought if I did the opposite, that would be healthy. But, it wasn't, it is equally as unhealthy. And, my daughter also has mental issues, although not diagnosed, so I wondered about that too, how do you put a challenged person out there on the streets when they need guidance and direction? But, then a person on this board, a mother who is bi-polar said, "mental illness doesn't give you a pass on being responsible for your actions," I started to look at that very differently. Mentally ill folks can be highly intelligent and manipulative so allowing that behavior just serves their illness, it doesn't support the real person. You're in a very challenging place, it takes an amazing amount of strength and commitment to be able to see the truth of the situation. It sounds like your daughter is self medicating and is abusing drugs in which case any involvement you have with her will be crazy making and stressful for you and she will use whatever means possible to continue her rampage without you knowing. You both have an investment in not seeing the truth and that is what keeps you stuck in your anger, because you know it's not the truth and yet you allow her to continue. I'm not judging you, I'm just stating what I believe to be the truth because I've lived it. When the masks come off, and the truth is revealed, that's when you both have a possibility of health. But, for you, you can only control your own responses, you cannot control her or her choices, your work is with you, not her. In my opinion, the task for you is to take the focus off of your daughter, your grandkids, your husband, everyone else, and put it on YOU. You have the power to change your responses, but that will take work on your part because you have created a groove, a path which you and your daughter just slide on into. Changing that groove will take a commitment because it's hard to do. You will need tools to change into a different groove because the pull to stay in that one is tremendous. Part of that groove is believing her when you know in your heart it's a lie, so you are going against your own truth and that is a spirit killer. Lying to ourselves has consequences, it keeps you up at night, it makes you angry, it brings out lots of resentments. I've done ALL of this and more, I think it comes with the territory we live in. It sucks. But, it is what it is. It's the acceptance of that, the knowledge of that deep in our souls that will set us free. I think we accept that one bite at a time because it's all we can tolerate as mothers..........as you once said, it's a personal devastation like no other. It is. But there is a light at the end of the tunnel and it is TRUTH, telling yourself the truth and facing it and accepting it, inch by miserable inch. That adage, the truth will set you free is absolutely true. And, conversely, the lack of truth will keep you in your own prison of deception. Get yourself out of there Barbara.........she is who she is..............you can't change her..............but you can change your responses to her.............I wish you so much peace and surround you with many many hugs............. [/QUOTE]
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