What behaviors do you think...

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by whatamess, Dec 18, 2010.

  1. whatamess

    whatamess New Member

    What behaviors do you think are worthy of sending a six year old to a different school and into a self-contained classroom for emotionally/behaviorally disturbed children?
  2. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    That's a really broad question. Can you give us a little more info on what's going on?
  3. whatamess

    whatamess New Member

    I don't want to give too many details yet. I just wonder what behaviors others might think justify a complete separation from typical peers at age six.
  4. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    This is just off the top of my head, but aggression of the child, extreme social withdrawal of the child, inability of the child to sit still and attend to schoolwork, inability of school staff to keep the child safe from harm, inability of school staff to provide certain services such as counseling or social skills groups.
  5. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    I don't think we can tell you without more details. We need to know the context. Most kids can be taught in their home schools. Some have to go to special education classes or some, if they are harmful to others, behavioral disordered classes. If the kid sets the school on fire, I'd say he probably needs a psychiatric hospital, not a different setting.
    This is hard without knowing more.
  6. toughlovin

    toughlovin Guest

    It is hard without knowing more... I would say if other kids are not safe and the child is really aggressive... I don't mean somewhat aggressive because plenty of kids show aggression at that age, but if he is really beating up other kids or being physically aggressive to the teacher. I would say a kid who is totally withdrawn from other kids, again not a kid who is just shy but a kid who does not interact at all with other kids, or a kid who interacts totally inappropriately for the age. That however can be somewhat subjective. If you give us more details I am sure we can give you some opinions. :)
  7. SRL

    SRL Active Member

    I think any of these in extreme forms--plus acting out sexually. Especially if the child isn't responsive to a reasonable amount of services in the regular classroom setting.
  8. whatamess

    whatamess New Member

    Last edited: Dec 20, 2010
  9. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    A placement is based on needs, not on disability coding. However, do you believe that your son has an autism spectrum disorder? Has he been assessed privately for Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD)? If that were his diagnosis, the school district might not be talking about a placement for emotionally/behaviorally disturbed children.

    Forget the other kids in your child's classroom for a moment. Do you feel your child is having his educational needs met in this classroom setting? In other words, is he getting an appropriate education in the current setting?

    In your shoes, I'd recommend locating an educational advocate in your community. To find one, you can check these websites:
  10. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Actually, he sounds like he has some spectrum issues himself. If it walks like a duck, it's a duck! Has he ever been assessed by a private neuropsychologist? If not, I'd set up an assessment ASAP. An ED/BD label is not appropriate for a child who may be on the spectrum. Also, the spectrum does run in families, but can appear very different from one child to the next, even in the same family. He can get help in his home school, but in my opinion he has not been assessed well enough for the school to know what to do. A lot of spectrum kids get violent when they freak out and have to transition or go into a situation they can't handle (like maybe 22 kids). My daughter is in a class with a very high functioning Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) child who is brilliant, but he probably needed a smaller classroom. He hit his teacher when he got frustrated (normally he is a very sweet boy) and now he has been sent to a school for ED/BD. It's too bad because the boy has a lot of potential and will not do well with kids who act out. He will fight back. And he spits too!

    I'd look into another evaluation. NeuroPsychs can be found in university and children's hospitals and they do extensive testing. A regular therapist, even a psychiatrist could easily miss Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) and give it a title with a lot of labels that, when put together, actually mean Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD).

    Good luck, whatever you decide to do :)
  11. whatamess

    whatamess New Member

    -Ok, so he has sensory issues- mostly hypersensitive to textures, foods. At school he is seeking out deep pressure.
    -He uses repetiitive phrases and makes noises. I think this is learned from difficult child, but it is really evident at school. He will often stop if reminded/rewarded to stop. He is very verbal though. Only a very borderline expressive delay that he got services for at age two and resolved.
    -He CAN BE very resistant to doing fine motor work (writing, drawing, cutting), but is ok with it at other times.
    -He is anxious in large groups if he is asked to perform.
    -He is anxious entering large groups if he is alone/coming in late.
    -He can be very cute/charming.
    -Great eye contact.
    -Very affectionate (almost too affectionate with teachers).
    -Is definitely capable of engaging in pretend play, especially led by neurotypical bro, but left on his own he usually seeks out computer or just kind of wanders around. He collects things, but then doesn't do anything with them (they sit on a table or in his room).

    To me this just sounds a little deviant from typical, but not screaming autism spectrum. Maybe I'm in denial. Maybe my older son is sooooo affected, that this seems very close to 'normal'.
  12. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    I disagree. My son is a lot like yours, especially he was at your son's age, and he is definitely on the spectrum. He is very verbal.

    in my opinion the noises he makes are not learned. Kids don't do that in school particularly if they have any social skills because they know it's going to cause them to be teased. My son has also never screamed. Not all Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) kids do...those are more the lower functioning ones, I believe. My son would not strike anyone as a spectrum kid just by looking at him...perhaps he is just higher functioning than your other son. A diagnosis. would get him supports.

    But do what you think is right and good luck!
  13. DammitJanet

    DammitJanet Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Maybe having him pulled out to an autism class would help him?

    He does seem to have intense anxiety in school. Maybe a much smaller classroom would help him relax and give him the accomplishments now so he can build upon them so he feels like he can conquer learning and eventually transition back into a mainstream classroom.
  14. JJJ

    JJJ Active Member

    I wish my son would have had the option of a self-contained class at age 6. The school refused because he was academically ahead/on target and the only self-contained room they had at the time was filled with kids with significant delays. They have since added more self-contained rooms and have become quite good at blending (individualizing each child's schedule, placing them in reg ed for whatever part of the day that child can handle).

    Your son sounds like mine did at 6. My son is 100% autistic and in a completely different way than his brother who is also autistic.
  15. SRL

    SRL Active Member

    A few observations-
    First, in listening to parents with more than one child on the spectrum through the years, they almost always say the second one is quite different than the first--more social, more verbal, different obsessions, more affectionate, etc.

    Second, there are a group of kids I call "spectrumish", in that they show a lot of Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) traits, but not enough of them or not strongly enough to land an Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) diagnosis. Often these kiddo will be atypical in that they break one or more of the "rules"--they develop speech fairly typically or have mild delays or have advanced speech (such as with Asperger's), OR they may engage more, OR they show a lot of other traits but not have transition problems. Often they compensate well in the home and other familiar settings, but school really throws them since they're being challenged on so many fronts and have no parent around to automatically make adaptations for them. Frequently they benefit from the services used in the Autism camp and it's helpful when parents can get a doctor to recognize the borderline or atypical Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) status, as it can be tough getting services for this group unless they tank in one area (like anxiety).

    Third, when a second child comes along with some recognizable symptoms, parents are usually quick to recognize and provide accomodations and guidance. An insightful parent can provide a lot of "life is therapy" that helps a younger child out early on, and may make a difference diagnostically.

    Fourth, some of the things you have listed sound like speech/social/pragmatic issues--too affectionate with teachers, anxious entering groups, repetitive phrases--and with an IEP could be addressed through speech therapy. If his repetitive noises increase when he's anxious I wouldn't bet on those being learned either.

    In my district, a child with the above list would be in a regular classroom with individual and group speech, Occupational Therapist (OT), accommodations in place to address problem spots and possibly an aide to help with the anxiety. It would be very rare for such kids to be in a self-contained classroom here, especially those who could be served in a regular classroom with support because it would be a violation of LRE. Even a part time aide to meet him at the school door and get him settled into the classroom for the day and give classroom breaks and/or Occupational Therapist (OT) breaks could go a long way. If it were my kiddo and I felt he had a chance to succeed there at the school, I'd probably be fighting it if they hadn't tried using an aide in the regular setting plus accomodations to address anxiety along with speech and Occupational Therapist (OT).

    Hope this helps.
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2010