when do you just let them do what they want?

Discussion in 'Substance Abuse' started by guest3, Mar 23, 2007.

  1. guest3

    guest3 Guest

    I normally am on here
     
  2. CAmom

    CAmom Member

    Well first of all, he probably doesn't hate YOU but your rules. He sounds SO much like my son at the same age. I don't know about letting them do what they want because, at least in CA, we're responsible for them until age 18.

    In my son's case, we were checking into sending him (involuntarily) to some sort of Residential Treatment Center (RTC). As it turned out, he WAS using pot (by the way, the kids can get together and each contribute $1 to get four or five of them high) and comitted a crime. The court took things out of our hands by sending him to the exact same type of place we were looking into. My son had no prior record. If your son has already been arrested, he may very well end up in the same situation.

    If my husband and I had it to do over again, we would have had him declared an "out-of-control juvenile" by the courts, although the end result would have probably been the same, EXCEPT he wouldn't have a crime on his record until it's sealed.
     
  3. guest3

    guest3 Guest

    thank you for the advice, I am sure he has access to drugs via the type of kids he hangs out with. Plus he has this mentality that to be a "great rapper' he has to have a "rap sheet", how do you fight that mentality? Prayer is my only option, prayer before i go to war that is, which is every time I speak with the kid..sigh.............
     
  4. mom_in_training

    mom_in_training New Member

    He does not hate you, He just hates having to abide by rules. I think its pretty safe to say that the majority here have had the same issue with their kiddos disrespect. I suppose its just a matter of what you allow him to get away with. He will continue the behavior so long as he is getting away with it. Think up some consequences for bad mouthing you and stick to it. As far as drugs? My difficult child lost interest in school along with the normal everyday things that she once enjoyed including her horses and low and behold I discovered that she was smoking pot. She was out of control, Leaving whenever she wanted blowing me off, Disrespecting me like she had never done before, Not abiding by her curfew and coming home at her convenience sometimes drunk. I put her in a program that Teen Challenge offers that includes a tour of Juvenile Hall and she went through counceling. I also started random drug testing screening at home for Pot, Opiates, cocaine, Heroin. You can purchase the drug testing kits at Wal-Mart. They have one that will just test for pot but I opted to get the 4 panal that tested for the drugs listed above. They also have a 7 panal that will test for all of the above plus Methamphetamines (Meth), Ecstasy, Amphetamines, Phencyclidine (PCP). I just learned too that they now have a 12 panal test kit as well at http://www.firstcheckfamily.com/

    Just a thought, I never thought that my difficult child would get into drugs but she did and unfortunately has gone onto the bigger drugs. Put your foot down and know that you do not deserve to be treated with disrespect in your own home. I drew the line for my difficult child based on the fact that I would never allow a stranger to disrespect me in my own home, Just because she is who she is (My Daughter) does not justify it either and its not acceptible to me. I absolutly refuse to walk on eggshells in my own home. As far as providing all of the tools, I did the same, She was willing with some but not others. Its like the parent is grasping for straws in the hopes that your difficult child would grasp on to the tools that are given to make a difference. Its all an individual choice as far as changing any behavior. You are doing what you need to be doing. I hope it improves for ya. I will pray along with ya. :)
     
  5. Mikey

    Mikey Psycho Gorilla Dad

    I'm pretty new to all this, but I didn't find out that my easy child was difficult child and smoking pot until he was nearly 17. He had no money, no job, no car, but his friends supplied him with whatever he needed. Such pals...

    After reading the stories here, though, I can honestly say that if I had found out about his problems when he was 15 instead of almost 17, I would have been much more aggressive in seeking help.

    I don't know about where you live, but in my town we have a very "robust" juvenile crime/support system. I just caught on too late to make use of it. Now, I'm hoping to make some kind of positive difference on him in the few months left before he goes to big boy jail if he screws up.

    My advice is to get active, and do it now. The longer you wait, the older they get, the less you can do. Check with your local DSS and Juvenile Court system (anonymously, if you want), to see what help is available. When I checked with my local town, they said they'd rather put money into correcting problems when the kids are young than have to put them in jail when they're older. Kinda cold, dollar-and-cents approach for them, but I guess it makes sense.

    Start now. Do not pass go, do not collect 200$

    Also, I agree that he probably doesn't really "hate" you. I've found with both of my difficult children that they are masters of verbal manipulation. They've learned what to say (or not say) to get what they want. In my house, if my kids said they hated me then it would only spur MY anger response, and they wouldn't get what they were after. So they don't say that. They do, however, have their own other ways to get at me.....

    I have another post out there somewhere where I talk about my recent visit to the my therapist (who is also difficult child 1's therapist). The session was really bad, but he said "don't take anything he said personal; it was all about him and what he wanted, and he was saying whatever he felt would get to you".

    Don't want to play psychiatrist from afar for you (don't have a license), but I'd guess it's much the same for your difficult child as well. If you haven't done it already, you may want to get some help for yourself. Kids, like dogs, can smell fear, anger, and other emotions, and use that against you. I finally had to get medications to control my anxiety attacks, which took away one of the weapons my difficult child used against me. Just my two pennies, but it may be worth looking in to.

    Best wishes for you and your family.

    Mikey
     
  6. SunnyFlorida

    SunnyFlorida Active Member

    There is something called a CINS/PINS petition. That means (child/person in need of services) basically an out of control teen/child. I used to recommend that. Then I had a mom PM me and ask me did I really know what they did? I found out that basically in my town, a CHINS petition just puts the kiddo in the system and the Jr. PO's fill out all sorts of paperwork, demand that you take the child to counseling and jump through classes and hoops. My town/state will not do what CaMom's did and put their child in Residential Treatment Center (RTC). It's just too costly. Outpatient services is all there is. Sometimes there's a partial program but unless the kiddo buys into it....they won't complete it.

    The gist of this is check out what your area has to offer.

    Stick to your gun and don't allow a driver's license until difficult child shapes up. Use the Do To Get philosophy and stick to it. It's ok if he hates you....that's your job to get him where he needs to be. If he makes it to adulthood and is able to be a productive citizen....he can come back and build a relationship with you later.

    Don't cave. :warrior:
     
  7. Mikey

    Mikey Psycho Gorilla Dad

    SunnyF, re: "Stick to your gun and don't allow a driver's license until difficult child shapes up. Use the Do To Get philosophy and stick to it. It's ok if he hates you....that's your job to get him where he needs to be. If he makes it to adulthood and is able to be a productive citizen....he can come back and build a relationship with you later."

    Truer words were NEVER spoken. My difficult child's therapist and I have a three step plan: 1 - get the kid working on life skills again so he doesn't starve when he hits the street; 2 - get him some help with his drug/pot problem (although nearly dying from an asthma attack puts a new spin on this objective; 3 - work on getting him more plugged in to a mutually beneficial relationship with the family.

    Life skills is most important; I've known several potheads and drunks who were still able to hold a job. Drugs are a close second, but only because he's not into anything "hard" (random drug tests keep him honest), and good relationship with us is last. I can take being hated if I know he's able to take care of himself. :slap:

    Also, my Dad and I never had a good relationship until I was out of college and an adult. Only then could I approach him on somewhat equal terms, and allow the bridge to be built. So I'm not too worried about my kiddo hating me now, since I can hope that when the testosterone poisoning and acting out subside (fingers crossed) we can figure out how to get along.

    Mikey
     
  8. rejectedmom

    rejectedmom New Member

    My son also had no money and no job but got the dope somehow. To this day I do not know how. I know he stole from us. I know he probably stole from others too. He may have been a mule. I really don't know anything for sure other than he got it and he used it. -RM
     
  9. mom_in_training

    mom_in_training New Member

    Stealing and pawning and allot of loser friends that don't mind sharing the drugs.... :-( Just recently found out that my difficult child pawned an antique ring that belonged to my deseased mother. Uhhhh no I am not happy to say the least but do have an idea where it is and am on a mission to get it back.
     
  10. CAmom

    CAmom Member

    Apropos of not much...I've only recently begun to appreciate how much and to what extent California goes for in-trouble juveniles such as mine (thanks in large part to Sunny...).

    I'm not very politically minded, although I could talk for HOURS (in a not very nice way) about certain presidents and a certain governor of our state.

    Nonetheless, I will be always be grateful for the powers-that-be that took my out-of-control son and put him into a state-funded program that, HOPEFULLY, will help turn him around--something which we were unable to do--so that, again, HOPEFULLY, he doesn't end up in, as DDD would call it, "big boy prison."
     
  11. Mikey

    Mikey Psycho Gorilla Dad

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rejectedmom</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My son also had no money and no job but got the dope somehow. To this day I do not know how. I know he stole from us. I know he probably stole from others too. He may have been a mule. I really don't know anything for sure other than he got it and he used it. -RM </div></div>

    In high school, from what I understand, the easiest way to get drugs is to be a "middle-man". Someone wants drugs, they call you. You call the dealer. Dealer says where to leave the money and pick up the drugs. You call the buyer back with the info. Keeps the dealers separated from the buyers, and the middle-men either get to tack on a "commission", or they get paid in drugs.

    Very, very common these days at the high school level. Again, from what I can gather, most dealers will have one middle-man for each 3-10 buyers. Sort of like Amway for the narcotics trade. Makes it hard for the cops, too, since they can't focus on lots of purchases from one or two people.

    Mikey
     
  12. TYLERFAN

    TYLERFAN New Member

    Hi Ianav:

    As a parent who has previously done the PINS Petition and gone the way of the juvenile justice system, I wish you luck. It usually is a very efficient way of making sure that your difficult child has contact with worse difficult child's and learns new ways to get around the rules. Sorry to have to say that, but in our case, that's what happened. I am not saying not to do it, in many cases it is necessary for the safety of the child. That was our situation.

    Blessings,
    Melissa
     
  13. guest3

    guest3 Guest

    It usually is a very efficient way of making sure that your difficult child has contact with worse difficult child's and learns new ways to get around the rules

    with both my difficult child's I am afraid of this, my youngest difficult child is in
    a support group of 12 kids with similar problems like his, bad bad combo, I was truly nuts in thinking this was a good idea. 2 kids have gotten kicked out so far for physical aggression and my son is on "probation"

    Luckily oldest is in Upstate NY on a church retreat with Youth group, you don't know what it took to get him on that bus, sigh......... but he's there, and I think he is too afraid to do anything to get himself kicked out, because his Youth Pastor is a "take no cr@p" kinda guy, we'll see....
     
  14. hearthope

    hearthope New Member

    I sought a CHINS petition for my difficult child, my feelings are the same as TF.

    The counseling was a joke. We then had a family intervention team for 16 weeks of in home counsel, he ran away from home and was gone the last 6 weeks.

    The threats made by the PO on the CHINS are empty. The kids know exactly what they can and can't get away with. They learn all the facts from the others they meet in the same boat.

    Looking back ~~ I would have found a different route
     
  15. Sunlight

    Sunlight Active Member

    I am in awe of all the info here. I too had all the above experiences in a lot of ways. the system can help or hurt, CHINS can help or hurt, all the RTCs and programs in the world do not help til the kid wants help.
    what makes them want help? for ant it was him being put out of the home and learning there was no one out there who could help him. he had to see older difficult children still getting stupid, he had to want to be clean, fed and comfortable.

    God bless and be with you.
    Prayer was and is my biggest weapon.
    Janet
     
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