When Grandparents get Angry with difficult child Autism Behaviors

[Farmwife]

"Anyway, do you have thoughts about setting boundaries in this situation? Am I just being overly sensitive?"


Suggestions on boundaries? Pain is a sign something is wrong. I think the same goes for emotional stuff. Are you being overly sensitive? No. You are entitled to feel how you want. If you really hate brussel sprouts and someone makes them knowing you don't like them and insists you eat them because "they aren't that bad" does that make them any less yucky? No. If you were scared of clowns and a friend thought it was irrational would that make it less scary even though they like clowns? No. you are perfectly entitled to be afraid of clowns and avoid them. You don't have to go to the circus to make anybody happy. Your senses and feelings ARE perfectly VALID regardless of how others feel about it. You can feel any darn way you please and not have to explain or justify it to anybody. FEELINGS are deeply personal, no one has a say in it but YOU. You want to feel sensitive because something hurts then by all means be sensitive!


I let my Dad see my difficult child but with supervision. My Dad had a bad habit of jokes that really are teasing and pretty mean. I know my Dad loves my difficult child and my difficult child likes to see him. I also am old enough to know how the "jokes" have a way of hurting and a kid may not say so because they want so much for people to like them and love them. If my Dad gets too "funny" during a visit I tell him to stop. If he doesn't the visit ends quickly. At one point it got so bad he and I had harsh words over it. We didn't speak for a year. The next time he called and every time after that he has been on his best behavior.

I'm all for grandparents being a huge part of kids lives. My next door neighbors are my husband's grandparents. Across a field is my Mom in law. I get a lot more grandparents than I can handle. lol Loving interaction is always healthy for a child. Abuse isn't okay under any circumstance and regardless of how kids respond it still isn't right. Abuse is abuse. No excuse for abuse. Occasionally losing your cool with a difficult child and letting a naughty word accidentally fly is normal I think. Belittling, overly criticisizing and intimidating isn't so okay.

 

[WearyWoman]

Wiped out - I would LOVE to find respite services, but have no idea where or how. We live in a rural area, and what would be the criteria to qualify?

Marg - I hope you're healing well, and I'm a whimp compared to you with radiation treatment. It must be a lot for you to deal with. How do you avoid feeling overwhelmed? I agree that difficult child should not be with my parents without me there. They will probably ask to have him over again, and if I say no, they will likely feel hurt. I wonder if they ask to see him out of duty and then end up resenting that he's there. I don't know. Short, frequent visits surely would work better, but we do live an hour away. We've literally told people that it's time to leave our house if they've stayed a long time and difficult child is having a rough time. Honestly, I don't think most people really get the extreme and prolonged stress levels involved. Most of the time, I'd rather not visit or have anyone visit us if difficult child is around.

farmwife - I have finally grown to learn more that my feelings are in fact just as valid as anyone else's. That's not how I was raised, though, and it's taken most of my adult life to get to this point. I still supress how I feel a lot, especially with my immediate family. When I've tried to be assertive (and that's not my expected role), I'm quickly bullied into my place. It's tough. Does my dad's swearing in the presence of my difficult child rise to the level of abuse? How about severely scolding him and huffing around? Where should the line be drawn?

 

[Marguerite]

OK, I'm back. Can't stop for long though - in-laws waiting!

First - "I'm a whimp compared to you with radiation treatment. It must be a lot for you to deal with. How do you avoid feeling overwhelmed?"
Seriously, what helped was knitting. In the Cancer Centre are some baskets of yarn and knitting needles, with instructions on knitting squares for "Wrapped With Love". Instead of sitting and fretting, or fidgetting, we have the option to knit a little. When we're leaving we put the knitting back in the basket for someone else to add to (or not). Daily treatment meant I had a lot of follow-up on the same pieces of knitting. Knowing that the completed squares are sewn into blankets and given to various poor people around the world, made me feel as if someone was going to benefit form my time spent t the Cancer Centre. I've also been knitting my own blanket to donate to someone - it takes 28 squares and I'm just completing No 19. Each square I have knitted, has a different emotion and problem attached to it. It has really helped me emotionally.
We each do what we need to, in order to cope with emotional pain and life stress. Linda (Timer Lady) paints. She used to play piano and I believe it is her aim to get back to playing.

Regarding respite - we have never used it for difficult child 3. I never felt comfortable trying to organise leaving him with someone who, even if they were well-trained, still did not know OUR kid. But we did use more conventional services available, and simply educated them on our son's needs. We used the same babysitting/child-minding services generally available for "normal" kids.
I would suggest you find someone, perhaps a college student or a senior high school student, someone who you feel can cope with him and understand but doesn't have to have any formal training (they need instinct and to be prepared to follow your lead) and train them up. Get them to come and help you, to watch him while you are home (perhaps while you are on a cooking binge or study binge) so you are within coo-ee if you're needed by the sitter, so she can get confident in handling him and you can also learn to trust them, also to help teach the sitter on the spot. Make it clear that you are moving towards the sitter having him unsupervised, possibly taking both child and sitter away with you if necessary (hey - free holiday!) and that this is an ongoing, enlarging job with perks projecting into the future.

Swearing is not on with an autistic child. The message to get across to everyone, your parents especially - these kids learn by imitation. So you MUST behave towards this child as you want the child to behave towards you and others. The child should not be punished for dishing back what is dished up to him. So if grandpa gets sworn at by difficult child ho uses grandpa's words back at him, then both are in the wrong but frankly, the adult who behaved badly first, is the problem and has zero rights to punish.

Read "The Explosive CHild" by Ross Greene. Go to Early Childhood forum for some discussion on tis book (there's a great sticky).

You need to become more assertive in a positive, productive way and you also need to really work on expressing your emotions. We used to play an emotion game with difficult child 3 - we would say the emotion and then put on that face. We increased his vocabulary and his range of facial expressions in tis way. But it was a fun game. We had faces for PUZZLED, HAPPY, SAD, ANGRY, CONFUSED, and so on. We make the face then get the child to make the face. Add to the range as you get ideas or words are suggested. We found it gave difficult child 3 tools to express himself and his feelings in more recognisable ways. You might find it helps you too.

See if you can find an assertiveness-training course for you. You will need it if your son is not to turn into a bully as well. It can happen in your situation, you need to be strong enough to stop this in the correct way.

Marg

 

[Farmwife]

"It's tough. Does my dad's swearing in the presence of my difficult child rise to the level of abuse? How about severely scolding him and huffing around? Where should the line be drawn?"

As the parent only you can decide that. I really feel for you and am trying hard to offer support and still remain as neutral as possible. It's hard to be neutral because I do have strong feelings about your situation because of my own experiences. It is YOUR situation though. I feel that when trying to support you it is good to encourage you to have your own feelings, you know? I don't want to be another assertive voice in your head...know what I mean? I sense a sort of sadness in you but it really is something you have to process for yourself. I read your posts and I get such string feelings from you but you quickly try to dismiss them and seek opinions that maybe sound good or mirror your desires perhaps?

I don't know. I'm not a pro. Just been down the hard road long enough to know what works for me and it isn't always the easy way out. In my case growth through these trying things comes with a huge effort and huge step that can be scary. In my case I needed to assert myself, all situations are different though. It scared the heck out of me. After I did it I was filled with such a sense of peace, invigoration and felt like a lifetime of something lifted off of me. I was scared I may hurt, anger or run off people who were a part of me but it actually improved my relationships with them. If they had ignored my boundaries they would still be hurting me or I would have had to make some hard choices to cut the pain loose. That's just me though.


I know when I read things like this "I'm quickly bullied into my place", I have to wonder how that must be for you and your difficult child. So maybe I can help you more by asking you your own question.

"Does my dad's swearing in the presence of my difficult child rise to the level of abuse? How about severely scolding him and huffing around? Where should the line be drawn?"

Take a few days to think about that, no rush because you don't visit often. Think about how you feel before, during and after visits. I am confident you have the best answers to your own questions for yourself and your difficult child. You are capable of making your own decisions and you deserve for people to respect those regardless of what they think about it. It's all about you baby and no one else...

 

[WearyWoman]

Farmwife - I've been thinking a lot about what you said and how I feel before, during, and after visits with my dad. Before visits, I generally feel very anxious, because I know difficult child will have a hard time managing himself and that my dad will have zero patience. I find myself feeling responsible for difficult child's behaviors. During visits, I am not relaxed, because I am always watching what difficult child is doing, trying to keep him out of trouble, and generally sitting on the edge of my seat in case something goes wrong. If, during a visit, my dad starts swearing under his breath about difficult child's behavior, I feel sad (that my dad seems to hate his grandson at times), angry (that it's happening and I have no control over any of it), and anxious (that things will escalate further) all at the same time. Complicating things further, of course, are my own memories and experiences growing up with a parent who has severe anger management issues. While difficult child certainly acts like himself in the presence of my mom too, I know she loves him and that she doesn't blame him or me for the problem. She understands that difficult child has disabilities, and she doesn't exhibit anger. So, I don't experience the anxiety around my mom.

In reflecting on all of this, I have come to see that I'm negatively affected by my dad's behaviorsl, before, during, and after visits. And you're right, these feelings are valid - just as valid as those anyone else experiences. Over the years, the rest of my family has encouraged me to stuff those feelings in favor of keeping the peace. I really don't want to do that any more, and it is about time that I assert myself to protect my own well being and that of my kids' and hubby too. It's not okay to swear at, about, or in front of my difficult child or to become excessively angry with him either. For heaven's sake, I'm frustrated regularly too, but I don't allow myself to behave that way. And, I wouldn't tolerate anyone else treating me or my difficult child that way, so why am I allowing him to do it?

Once, when difficult child was about 4 years old, he was refusing to get in his car seat, and my dad, apparently trying to help, basically picked him up and slammed him in the seat so hard, I was shocked. I was handling the situation, and I hadn't asked my dad to step in. I left in tears, and difficult child was in tears too. Later, I told my mom that I would not tolerate my dad getting physically aggressive with difficult child - period. She knew I was upset, but of course, tried to make excuses for my dad's behavior. I hate that! My sister thought I was overreacting too, yet I can't see her allowing my dad to do that to her easy child son - no way! So, it looks like no one else is going to stand up for me. It's about time I do it for myself.

I've been stressing about the skin cancer surgery, and I'm worried about how long this spot has been unattended (9 mos.) and how extensive it is under the skin. So, the appointment is scheduled, and my hubby insists that I should not be driving myself around afterward and that he wants to come. But between the actual surgery and follow-up reconstruction on the same day, we probably will need childcare for longer than the 10 hours our daycare is available. This means, of course, that we need help from family. Although our 16-year-old could babysit, it would be a very long day for him, especially if difficult child refuses to listen. We're thinking of having my mother-in-law come and stay for the day alone with difficult child (allowing our older son to visit his grandpa (my father-in-law). This would separate the boys and prevent arguments between them. Also, the in-home therapists will be here for part of that day, which should help my mother-in-law.

In the long run, we're going to need more options than family for childcare. So that's something we should work on, for sure. We don't need childcare very often, but once in a while, especially in an urgent situation like this, it's crucial. It just makes everything so much harder to not have help from somebody. In an ideal world, family would be the perfect solution, but it's not a perfect world.

 

[TerryJ2]

Hi Weary, you've gotten some great answers here. Definitely, with-your dad's issues, having him and your mom watch difficult child again is out of the picture. I agree--find a sitter who can occasionally stay overnight. You can do a web search for care in your area. Save up some $ and it will defintely be worth it.
I can see that your mom has been living in denial for so long, that she has no intention of getting your dad into therapy and on medications. What a shame. He must be miserable.
My parents weren't that abusive, but still, with-my mom's drinking and my dad's lack of skill/interest in little kids, I never let the kids spend the night at their house. It was pretty much a non-issue, since we had moved out of state and had no real reason to leave them alone at my parents' anyway. Once I left my easy child with-my parents when I attended a biz mtng, and they were so stressed out I never had them do it again. (They didn't know that you could insert a round easy child of plastic inside a baby bottle inside the nipple, to keep it from leaking, and were supposed to take out the plastic to feed the baby. She screamed and screamed every time they tried to feed her. My dad finally took the bottle apart and figured it out. That was 19 yrs ago!)
I have no idea how they managed to raise 5 kids of their own. Maybe that's why my mom drank ...

 

[Farmwife]

Weary - I am very proud of you. I really hope you were able to think and feel freely because that is so important. This kind of moving forward in life is super scary. I hope processing some of this stuff has brought you some peace even though it has no solutions.

Just a word of caution. Families have an odd way of getting very defensive when someone rocks the decades old boat. Interrupting the status quo has a way of getting people fired up and often it is not in the right direction. You aren't out of the woods yet sadly. I suspect that Mom and Sis will stay true to their assumed roles of telling you that everything is fine and that you are exagurating. They may even get angry and decide you are the bad guy. It seems crazy but it is so typical. Just don't want you to feel blindsided and even more let down.

You don't have to spend hours explaining yourself or justifying yourself. You and your feelings don't need to go on trial. Sometimes the easiest answer is "I'm sorry you feel that way" or "These are my feelings, you are entitled to your own" etc. etc. and cutting the conversation short. People have a way of badgering and dead horse beating that really serves to undermine going against the grain or being your own person. People seem to get unerved when someone ventures away from the herd mentality. Happens everywhere in life.

Do know that your relationship with your other family members does not have to revolve around or include Dad unless you want it to. Though I suspect they may pout there is no reason why others cannot be a part of your life in some way. There is no reason why Mom can't visit you without Dad. Though they be married they do not have to be a package deal. It rarely works out like that in these situations though...it hoovers but we all grow at our own pace and sometimes we have the regretable choice to make of moving on when others just haven't come up to speed yet, some never do.

Just feel good knowing you are doing what is best for you and your child first and foremost. People will always find fault with something. You just can't please everyone anyway so why bother trying? If it isn't your parenting people knock it may be your job, the house you buy, the way you do your hair or goodness knows what else. In the end you are only responsible to yourself and your kids as far as pleasing people goes. Spouses come in at a close second but they can be replaced a lot easier than you or your kids.

This really couldn't have come at a worse time for you. Have you considered some cancer support forums or groups? My mom had breast cancer and found the groups to be very helpful. It is a scary time and you sound like maybe you need some new and healthy systems of support on your new path.

I'm sending you all the warrior woman vibes I can. I am confident you have everything you need to get through all of this even if you don't think so or feel scared. Being afraid is normal, fear won't stop you from getting through this though. I am rooting you on and I bet lots of people will along the way!!

by the way - Just in case, difficult child may have behaviors due to the stress load in the family right now. Don't want to jinx you but these kiddos of ours are remarkably perceptive and show it in all kinds of exciting ways.

 

[WearyWoman]

Terry - It's a good idea to find an overnight sitter - that would be a tremendous help. This is a wake-up call, for sure, that we need to think about finding someone. Yes, my mom has dealt with this for so long, she probably has lost touch with how dysfunctional the situation really is. But the same is true of my sister. They just excuse his angry outbursts, like they're no big deal, and move on with the day. I don't do well with angry people, and I can't seem to move on so easily. The hurt is just too deep.

Farmwife - Thanks so much for taking the time to post again. You have helped me see more clearly the situation in a realistic way. If I just allow myself to acknowledge my true feelings, without censorship, the truth emerges. I know my dad's behavior is very unhealthy for me. It causes me considerable distress, and sadly, he doesn't know or necessarily care. No one has really held him accountable over the years, and I suspect that he is somehow getting something out of this angry behavior - some type of payoff (at everyone else's expense around him, of course). I feel like I'm in the twilight zone, though, since everyone else in my family views his behavior as benign, when I perceive it as toxic. Since my dad retired, I seldom get to spend time with my mom one-on-one. As I mentioned, she doesn't drive, and she has scoliosis, so she's not that mobile either. My dad is with her all the time. I miss our mother-daughter talks. When I call to talk with her on the phone, my dad often picks up on the other line (without announcing he's there) and listens to our conversations. I think that's terribly strange, and it makes me uncomfortable, but again, my mom doesn't make anything of it. What planet am I on anyway?!!! I know it's not a good idea to cut my dad out of my life completely, but I think I can finally give myself permission to spend less time around him, especially with the kids.

I'm doing alright coping with the skin cancer. We're making arrangements for my mother-in-law to come and stay for the day at our house with difficult child. I think that will go alright. The last thing I need right now is more worry and stress. I probably will seek out some support in the online cancer forums.

Again, thanks for posting your support. It is appreciated so much.