6 year old son keeps getting kicked out of school

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by kim75062, Sep 1, 2016.

  1. AppleCori

    AppleCori Well-Known Member

    Hi Kim,

    Contact your local university for help locating the neuropsychologist. You may have to jump through some hoops first, before the insurance will pay, but don't give up.

    I think you should stay in the classroom with your son and observe for at least a full week. You need to see for yourself what goes on in the room and what stressors cause his behaviors. This will give you a better understanding so that you can be a better advocate.

    In the mean time, since he is not actually learning anything at school, you might consider having him do school work at home (if they don't send his school work home for him to do). If he likes computers, look into Khan Academy for math. It is free and very good. I am not sure where he is on reading, but SpellingCity has a fun spelling and vocabulary program online. There are plenty of 'learn to read' programs online for little or no cost.

    Keep posting and good luck. I hope he has a good day today!

  2. kim75062

    kim75062 Active Member

    I'm sure the paras do cost quit a bit of money to the district. If they had a place to put him besides a regular classroom I'm sure they would of by now. But they have no other options here. As far as him being distracting to the other children I agree that its not fair for them to have their class disrupted by whatever hes doing. That's why he gets removed from the room constantly. He may spend 1 hour a day in his actual classroom. And that's usually breakfast, and reading. Which he excels at and is usually reading to the entire class. He does not get a chance to go back to class after he messes up once that morning. I completely sympathize with with teacher and the staff that its not fair to them to have to deal with him and 15 other kids etc. I spent way to much time worrying about the rest of the class last year. He is my only concern at this point and it is their job to figure out how to deal with the unfairness and the rest of it.

    He is spending his day between the counselors office and the front office doing "busy work". He is supposed to be doing what his classmates are working on but they just give him a bunch of nonsense worksheets. Last week when I was in the office with him he had a stack of practice writing sheets in front of him. one for every letter in the alphabet and 10 math work sheets with 30 problems on each side. Is that really what the class was doing that day? every letter of the alphabet and 600 math problems at 2 weeks into 1st grade? I doubt it. They have also been told he HATES writing. He is being evaluated for that so we can figure out how to help him. so they give him nothing but writing to do and expect him to quietly sit there and do that for 6 hours.
    I guess it never occurred to them to give him a book on feelings and how to manage stressful situations from the school library. That might have been a better use of the day.

    Today I was called up there again at 930am this time. Because he refused to do his work and was wondering around the back of the classroom with a pinwheel from his fidget box. After I got there I get told that he was refusing to do his work but was sitting there playing with the pinwheel. not bothering anyone because he was secluded to a table by himself with the para in the back of the class. The teacher decided it was time to take his pinwheel away and his fidget toys because he was playing and not doing any work. I told the principal and the para that in his plan we made he is to have access to that box of toys/fidgets at all times. He knows when he feels overwhelmed or the need to run off that's what he should do instead. The fact he was still in the classroom and hadn't run off was not mentioned once. Or the fact that he was not kicking or hitting them. His problem was he has bad handwriting and didn't want anyone else to see his work. The installation of a "shield" (open folder on the table) solved that problem.

    now its 11am. I was called again to come pick him up. This time because he refused to LEAVE the classroom for lunch. Because he wasn't following the rules at 930 his teacher decided he had to be the last one called for lunch and be at the end of the line. (i thought grown ups knew better then to hold a grudge?) anyway he refused to leave the room so they had to call me. I asked them why exactly he couldn't eat his lunch in the classroom? they do eat breakfast in there. And his para is with him for lunch anyway. she gets her break while he is in specials. (music, art etc). No one had a answer for that. He said he didn't want to be last and he was sad so he just wanted to be alone. Not an unreasonable request from a kid that was kicking them last week instead of verbalizing his feelings. The counsler just came in for the day and was begging me not to take him home. I told her that they aren't happy with him running off and having to chase him (understandable). They don't know how to deal with aggression (not an issue today). And now they are not happy with him staying put in the room. I'm not sure what they are capable of handling because at this point it seems like nothing.
  3. kim75062

    kim75062 Active Member

    oh and the neuro psy I found is the only one covered by my ins and the appointment is in Feb of next year. Ironically I am paying $400 a month after my tax credit for the same HMO type coverage that goes along with medicaid in the state I live in. But I buy it through the marketplace because I do not qualify for medicaid. So I have the same coverage from the same ins company but the plan itself is a little different as in I have co-pays and medicaid does not. Also I have less doctors to choose from because with medicaid if the doctor doesn't participate with the HMO plan and its necessary the regular medicaid part picks up the bill. Rock and a hard place.....
  4. MommaK

    MommaK Member

    Well it seems he is making progress even if the school isn't. I'd be super proud of that. Teacher has to understand that just because she thinks he shouldn't or doesn't need the stuff in the fidget box doesn't mean she can take it. It may look like playing but I can bet while he is fidgeting with the stuff in his box he is paying attention to what she says. Have them look into dysgraphia. My son is 10 and has hated writing since small. He still does, because he has dysgraphia. It's an Learning Disability (LD) that affects physical writing, putting thoughts on paper, lining up numbers, spelling and more. My son dictates his homework to me and I write it. He takes oral tests at school and is allowed more time for assignments that require writing.
  5. kim75062

    kim75062 Active Member

    Ive told them a million times that he can do the work if they would let him type it. I even offered to bring in his laptop and was told how unfair it is to the other kids.
  6. ForeverSpring

    ForeverSpring Well-Known Member

    I had to call the State of Wisconsin s District of public Education for my state to get our district to give my son a free and appropriate public education. I also got hooked up with a school advocate to help. Every public education state office has a list of free parent advocates. We just don't know it. The school districts don't like them so they don't tell us.

    Since the advocaye had taken school districts to court on their dime and won, we got him what he needed fast once the dept. Of public ed and advocate were poking their noses into my son's business.

    Sons schoool had to send him by bus at their own cost to another public school that was suitable to teach him adequately. I'm sure that his placement and help with coping and socials skills and school work are big reasons why he today is a kind, caring, hardworking, independent young man...and so happy!!!! He is the happiest person I know...my other kids all comment on his easy going stability...and he did not start out that way.

    We adopted him at two. He had cocaine in his system at birth and a case of syphillis. He had open heart surgery (extremely successful) at five days old. He was a screamer at first and got a wrong diagnosis of childhood bipolar. At the time, childhood BiPolar (BP) was the newest flavor of the day.

    Son is actually on the autism spectrum, very high functionong. I can't diagnose, of course, but your son has many red flags for autistic spectrum disorder, which can get much better with time. It oten takes time to get an autistic diagnosis and it gets mistaken for ADHD or bipolar...

    Oh, did my son fidget. He still does, but at 23 is more apt to fiddle with his phone or hand held video system. He is smart and talks in big words. He did not go to college, but has a steady job along with some social security. He has learned to socialize and sit and be quiet when he needs to. And the best yhing, as zi said, us that he is so content and happy in his skin.

    Everyone loves him.

    It is not easy to buck the school district but unless you go over their heads, often the kids are victims of their school's cheapness and laziness. Kids like ours are not for the faint of heart. We need to be warrior mom's who don't take NO from scary sounding school beaurocrats who don't have our differently wired children's best interests at heart.

    I couldn't afford private school but actually believe the public school my son ended up at was great. He never got teased, even being in some special classes at first and being one of a few African American children at school. He had friends. He was mainstreamed by high school.

    Our kids are helpless. They need us to fight for them
    I pass my sword to you :) Good luck!!
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2016
  7. Sister's Keeper

    Sister's Keeper Active Member

    You said something interesting, that caught my eye. That he didn't like writing and didn't want the other kids to see his work. That was the same with my youngest. She was born addicted and has some fine motor delays. She didn't think her work was as good as some of the other kids, so she didn't want to do it. Of course, her answer to everything is cry. (Speech delays, too) But it is interesting that he is very good at reading and loves to read aloud. This is my kid, she can tell you all her letter, number, colors, etc (She's only 4) but she hated it when it came to crafts and coloring and writing.

    We had an advantage, though, because we knew what we might be facing since birth, so we started earlier. We have her, mostly, caught up at this point.
    I don't know if anyone has suggested this to you, but we were told to do play at home that worked on her fine motor skills. Coloring, playing with clay, (gawd I hate Playdoh) Lego (I hate them, too LOL) different crafts using scissors. Craft kits, etc.

    Another thing, and, again, forgive me if you have tried this, but have you tried a reward system? I have a friend whose son had behavioral problems in school (High-Functioning Autism (HFA) and ADHD) and her reward was if he didn't have any "red" days (they use green, yellow, red here for days) all week they would go to Golden Corral for dinner on Friday night (the kid loves that place) I'm not saying that, particularly, but maybe something on a daily basis that is his "currency?"
  8. kim75062

    kim75062 Active Member

    yes mine has always hated coloring and anything that required fine finger movements. I had brought it up to the peds a few times but they weren't very concerned about it. He loves legos and plays with them daily. He was very much into Thomas the train and hot wheels cars and spent a lot of time playing with them and arranging the tracks etc. I'm sure that has helped some. As a baby he also didn't like play dough or anything with a gewy texture in his hands. he would mash all the colors together and throw it away saying it was poop. I haven't tried giving him any in a long time, maybe he will play with it now. As for a rewards system I am completely for bribing him to behave at school. We have a chore chart that he does at home to earn either coins or minutes to use on his electronics, its his choice how he wants paid for them. Most of the time he chooses minutes over money. he gets 0 minutes for free and must earn all time on electronics. He gets bonus coins or minutes for the color he is on at school. And at the end of the week we will take him somewhere special is he has no red days as well. Ive even tried going day by day this year. I told him if hes not a red I will take him to the movies that day or to MacDonald's etc. It hasn't happened yet this year. Which is why I really think he cant help most of the things he is doing.
  9. Malika

    Malika Well-Known Member

    If I may say, you seem confused about whether your son is being naughty and defiant or whether he cannot help himself and needs help. I understand this confusion! I have suffered from it for most of my son's life. Sometimes the lines really are not clear, and the behaviour/attitude of schools, etc, does not help clarify them.

    From what you say here, judging on meagre evidence from the outside, I would say it is totally pointless expecting your son to conform and behave like all the other kids at this point. He clearly cannot and is expressing something rather graphically and with a great deal of insistence and, one might even say, "character" by continuing to behave as he does. What is your plan? To await the IEP and get further assessments and then keep him in the school system?

    I think you have to take a decision: who do you support - the school system or your son? If the former then you need to do everything to try to make him conform and be "good". If the latter, then you need to find a place where he is understood and accepted as he is. And that, as I know only too well, is as easy as finding four-leafed clover.
  10. kim75062

    kim75062 Active Member

    I'm not confused as to he cant help some of the things he is doing. I have seen the petrified look on his face while hes hiding behind a chair or under a table when he has run out of class. I also seen the fear through the aggression when they had him backed into the corner of the hall when they finally caught him. That I know he cant help. I have seen the frustration from not being able to deal with all the handwriting they are requiring of him. The refusing to move or talk to anyone including me after hes been sitting on a beanbag in the counselors office for an hour that I believe was a mixture of giving up because he was overwhelmed with trying to behave and part "how long can I stay here and get away with it". He is still 6 and testing his limits in school just like any other 1st grader but like everything with him it to the extreme when he is there. I am having a hard time trying to tell the difference between him testing limits at school and the after effect of behaviors he just cant help. At home when he is told no he may whine about for a minute or 2 but he gets over it quickly and easily and its usually something he already knew the answer was going to be no to anyway. Even when he is doing homework that requires writing if he "messes up" he will get mad at his paper and scribble it out or crumple it up and throw it away. He does it very angerly but he self regulates and gets a new piece of paper and starts over. In school there is no self regulating and one backwards letter will cause a meltdown.
  11. ForeverSpring

    ForeverSpring Well-Known Member

    I personally don't think most kids test the limits. I've raised five kids. Even my autistic son did not misbehave. I believe Malika post was perfect. Good one, Malika, and she has gone through a lot of what you have. I believe he can't help it and I'd evaluate him ASAP. Something stops him from being able to comply. Please don't punish him.
  12. Malika

    Malika Well-Known Member

    Well, thanks for the vote of confidence - but just to be clear, I have never actually gone through a school situation like this. My son has never behaved like this in school, although we have certainly had a few "incidents" at school, some of them serious enough. But at the age of 6, J was going to school happily every day and most of the time behaving well, more so in the classroom than in the playground. I say this simply to reinforce the notion that each child is unique and that we really don't know what the "problem" is that is making this little boy behave the way he does.
  13. ForeverSpring

    ForeverSpring Well-Known Member

    But I agree it's not the child's fault it's huge and hard to understand this
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2016
  14. Sister's Keeper

    Sister's Keeper Active Member

    I was going to say just because a child has certain issues doesn't mean they also can't misbehave at times. All kids misbehave from time to time. Having a neurological difference doesn't stop that. It's just a natural art of being a kid. Kids test limits, it's what they do.

    Out of interest I looked up our fine motor skills activities. I don't know what kind of things your son enjoys, but here are the things we were told to try.

    Painting, finger and with brushes
    Coloring, Particularly with broken crayons
    using tweezers
    Using eyedroppers
    using tongs
    using scissors
    beading or making macaroni necklaces
    weaving things
    cat's cradle or string games

    Now I love to bake, so we also did things like decorating cupcakes and cookies, if you don't mind the potential for mess.

    and Jello jigglers. They stimulate all senses as you can touch, taste, and smell.

    I believe the dog has eaten his weight in lego and Barbie shoes.
  15. Malika

    Malika Well-Known Member

    Of course all children do test limits and do "naughty" things. But the behaviour that is being described really isn't naughty, is it? It is a signal of a child being unable to cope with things - on a sensory level? Too much stimulation, too many people, too much noise? Is he undiagnosed Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD)? We really don't know and can't know from afar. But it clearly is something different from a child "acting up".
  16. Sister's Keeper

    Sister's Keeper Active Member

    I'm not saying that there isn't an issue and I'm not saying that some of the behaviors are beyond his control. I won't go so far as to say why, because I am, certainly, not qualified to make any type of diagnosis, but I am sure, Kim, as his mother, knows his signs of being overwhelmed and also knows when he is just trying to push boundaries.

    I, too, have a child with issues. I knew when her crying was frustration when she couldn't do something or make herself understood and when she was crying to get her way, or because she didn't get her way.

    I'm just saying that the 2 things aren't mutually exclusive.
  17. kim75062

    kim75062 Active Member

    the psychologist was very helpful. She said she can see the anxiety in him from across the room. She does believe he has adhd because he is all over the place in body and in mind. She did say that she does not see autism and attributes the eye contact issues with sensory processing problems. Which had I actually thought about that it makes way more sense. Good thing there's people out there that can tell the difference. Her suggestion was to remove him from the school which I cant say is a bad idea. But he wants to go to school so Ill give them a few weeks to try and figure it out.

    I am beyond pissed at the school at this point though. after his doctors appointment I was up at the school for an unrelated matter that had nothing to do with my kid. And there was all the important people from the school board and school having a meeting in the conference room about my kid. They said it wasn't an IEP meeting and called it a crisis plan meeting. Its an IEP with a different header. Now they all knew he wouldn't be there today because i told them ahead of time (last week) so no testing time was scheduled and wasted. They insist they were not trying to exclude me from the meeting and gave me a copy of their plan. I do not agree with half of it. and there's almost nothing in it on how to prevent the behaviors from happening only what to do if it does happen. theres also no mention of his "fidget box" and how they are NOT allowed to take it away as a punishment. or that they should be breaking up his writing work into smaller segments. and not putting full sheets in front of him because he becomes overwhelmed so easily. uggg this is a ridiculous up hill battle that shouldn't even have to be fought.
  18. Sister's Keeper

    Sister's Keeper Active Member

    Is a half-day or shorter day in school a possibility? I don't know if that is possible, but maybe starting with a shorter day, since he seems to want to go so badly, and maybe working up to eventually a full day?
  19. mof

    mof Momdidntsignupforthis

    What are you suppose to do when you remove him?

    Not everyone is equipped to home school.
  20. ForeverSpring

    ForeverSpring Well-Known Member

    There are homeschooling curriculums and online public schools. Sadly not all kids fit into school. If he acts out in school, scaring and disrupting other kids, he will end up being put in a program for "emotionally disturbed" kids and his peers will be like him.

    Kids who constantly disrupt their classmates are removed, especially if they hurt them.

    I would rather my kid be home schooled with a curriculum than in a classroom where none of the kids have much self control. Anyone can follow a curriculum that is already made or guide work from online schools. There are groups of other homeschoosing parents and their kids. That helps too.