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A month in the hospital and no sign of improvement
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<blockquote data-quote="slsh" data-source="post: 58828" data-attributes="member: 8"><p>I think it really depends more on the kid than the program (assuming it's a therapeutically sound, consistent program). Some kids are just really tough, and I've also come to believe, at least for my son, that timing and maturity had a *lot* to do with it. </p><p></p><p>I do think that if she is not participating in group or school, off grounds privileges should be held. Will staff work with- you on that?</p><p></p><p>I understand the family therapy issues. We spent years of thank you kind of sliding on the unit, with intermittent explosions, sliding in school, and then family sessions that were just horrible. Blame, deflection, diversion, smoke screens on his part, frustration on ours, and a bit on the traumatic side for the siblings. And this was after years in therapy before his first Residential Treatment Center (RTC). </p><p></p><p>Have to ask.... does she know that it's only a 6-month program and that she will be discharged regardless at the end of that time? My beloved son, who is the king of manipulation, actually had the nerve to say "See, Mom - I knew I'd get out of here without having to work the program" when we pulled him from Residential Treatment Center (RTC) #2 (due to abuse issues). I think he only figured out we were not fooling around after he'd spent a solid year in Residential Treatment Center (RTC) #3. </p><p></p><p>I still subscribe to thank you's therapist's theory that kids won't change until it becomes too expensive to stay the way they are. Unfortunately, thank you has a whopping tolerance for an incredibly limited quality of life. It's only been in the past year that it's finally clicked for him, thankfully - and he's been making progress by leaps and bounds since. (See last paragraph.)</p><p></p><p>We were in much the same situation in 2002. thank you had been in Residential Treatment Center (RTC) for 2 years and just wasn't doing a doggone thing treatment-wise. We did a "no-contact" program, after much soul searching and a lot of discussions with- staff. It was kind of a last ditch effort, really. I still don't know how I feel about it. Don't regret it, but it certainly didn't have the desired effect with- thank you. He spiraled into a *massive* depression when it first started, and after about 2 weeks he recovered and went on, same as before. After over 6 months, we had a staffing and the general consensus was that he was as good as he was going to get until possibly puberty/maturity kicked in. We brought him home about 8 months after that. He lasted 3 months before completely falling apart again (violence, suicidal threats and a solid plan, etc.)</p><p></p><p>Sigh, I don't know. I think treatment depends so much on the kid. Some of our kids don't mind getting boxed in by their choices, and it's a real bear trying to work with that. I think the contact issue needs to be separate from the rest of the perqs, but absolutely I would (and have for my son) work with staff to make sure that she's being held absolutely accountable for her choices. No way can she be close to off-grounds privileges if she's not participating.</p><p></p><p>I say the contact issue is separate because, in my humble opinion, you don't want it to be a punitive measure. Family isn't a privilege, it *is* a right. When we instituted it, we presented it as "thank you, you've been here 2 years, you're no closer to coming home than you were the day you arrived, you're not working on your issues, and we feel that family is a distraction (again, family sessions inevitably ended up being all about how it was all our fault, or him exploding when we tried to hold him accountable, or just plain silliness/distracton that was a waste of time). We are going to step back and let the professionals do their job, let *you* do what you need to be doing, so that we can be a family in one home again. Staff will let us know when they feel we won't be a distraction anymore." </p><p></p><p>I feel for you. It's incredibly frustrating dealing with- kids who are such chameleons and at the same time who really are not internalizing a doggone thing. While I'm cautiously optimistic about my son truly having made a change, I'm not 100% sure. Time will tell. But it's been a very long road, a lot of waiting him out, and I think in the end it was simply him deciding that he didn't belong in Residential Treatment Center (RTC) anymore and being willing to prove it consistently over a fairly long period of time. </p><p></p><p>I don't mean to be discouraging. I think absolutely one of the keys to thank you finally getting it was consistency on staff's part, on our part, and him being held accountable 24/7 every single solitary day. There can be no free passes, in my humble opinion. </p><p></p><p>Edited to add: I wanted to clarify on this because for a kiddo with- a mental illness, it's about so much more than applying pressure to change behavior. There's no question that thank you's disorted reasoning played a huge role in his capacity for what would be for most people a really miserable existence. In his skewed thinking, it makes much more sense to exert incredibly amounts of energy to avoid getting anywhere near the hoop than it does to simply jump through it. That's part of his illness. So it's a combination, in my humble opinion, of holding them accountable, having consistent consequences, as well as a lot of incredibly repetitive therapy and an artist psychiatrist for medication management. Our kids are not like pcs - ground a easy child for lying (as a simplistic example) a couple of times and they're going to get it. Ground a difficult child, in my experience anyway, and the degree of lying escalates because they just *know* one of these days they'll get away with- it and there's the payoff. It's worth the grounding. Hope that makes sense.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="slsh, post: 58828, member: 8"] I think it really depends more on the kid than the program (assuming it's a therapeutically sound, consistent program). Some kids are just really tough, and I've also come to believe, at least for my son, that timing and maturity had a *lot* to do with it. I do think that if she is not participating in group or school, off grounds privileges should be held. Will staff work with- you on that? I understand the family therapy issues. We spent years of thank you kind of sliding on the unit, with intermittent explosions, sliding in school, and then family sessions that were just horrible. Blame, deflection, diversion, smoke screens on his part, frustration on ours, and a bit on the traumatic side for the siblings. And this was after years in therapy before his first Residential Treatment Center (RTC). Have to ask.... does she know that it's only a 6-month program and that she will be discharged regardless at the end of that time? My beloved son, who is the king of manipulation, actually had the nerve to say "See, Mom - I knew I'd get out of here without having to work the program" when we pulled him from Residential Treatment Center (RTC) #2 (due to abuse issues). I think he only figured out we were not fooling around after he'd spent a solid year in Residential Treatment Center (RTC) #3. I still subscribe to thank you's therapist's theory that kids won't change until it becomes too expensive to stay the way they are. Unfortunately, thank you has a whopping tolerance for an incredibly limited quality of life. It's only been in the past year that it's finally clicked for him, thankfully - and he's been making progress by leaps and bounds since. (See last paragraph.) We were in much the same situation in 2002. thank you had been in Residential Treatment Center (RTC) for 2 years and just wasn't doing a doggone thing treatment-wise. We did a "no-contact" program, after much soul searching and a lot of discussions with- staff. It was kind of a last ditch effort, really. I still don't know how I feel about it. Don't regret it, but it certainly didn't have the desired effect with- thank you. He spiraled into a *massive* depression when it first started, and after about 2 weeks he recovered and went on, same as before. After over 6 months, we had a staffing and the general consensus was that he was as good as he was going to get until possibly puberty/maturity kicked in. We brought him home about 8 months after that. He lasted 3 months before completely falling apart again (violence, suicidal threats and a solid plan, etc.) Sigh, I don't know. I think treatment depends so much on the kid. Some of our kids don't mind getting boxed in by their choices, and it's a real bear trying to work with that. I think the contact issue needs to be separate from the rest of the perqs, but absolutely I would (and have for my son) work with staff to make sure that she's being held absolutely accountable for her choices. No way can she be close to off-grounds privileges if she's not participating. I say the contact issue is separate because, in my humble opinion, you don't want it to be a punitive measure. Family isn't a privilege, it *is* a right. When we instituted it, we presented it as "thank you, you've been here 2 years, you're no closer to coming home than you were the day you arrived, you're not working on your issues, and we feel that family is a distraction (again, family sessions inevitably ended up being all about how it was all our fault, or him exploding when we tried to hold him accountable, or just plain silliness/distracton that was a waste of time). We are going to step back and let the professionals do their job, let *you* do what you need to be doing, so that we can be a family in one home again. Staff will let us know when they feel we won't be a distraction anymore." I feel for you. It's incredibly frustrating dealing with- kids who are such chameleons and at the same time who really are not internalizing a doggone thing. While I'm cautiously optimistic about my son truly having made a change, I'm not 100% sure. Time will tell. But it's been a very long road, a lot of waiting him out, and I think in the end it was simply him deciding that he didn't belong in Residential Treatment Center (RTC) anymore and being willing to prove it consistently over a fairly long period of time. I don't mean to be discouraging. I think absolutely one of the keys to thank you finally getting it was consistency on staff's part, on our part, and him being held accountable 24/7 every single solitary day. There can be no free passes, in my humble opinion. Edited to add: I wanted to clarify on this because for a kiddo with- a mental illness, it's about so much more than applying pressure to change behavior. There's no question that thank you's disorted reasoning played a huge role in his capacity for what would be for most people a really miserable existence. In his skewed thinking, it makes much more sense to exert incredibly amounts of energy to avoid getting anywhere near the hoop than it does to simply jump through it. That's part of his illness. So it's a combination, in my humble opinion, of holding them accountable, having consistent consequences, as well as a lot of incredibly repetitive therapy and an artist psychiatrist for medication management. Our kids are not like pcs - ground a easy child for lying (as a simplistic example) a couple of times and they're going to get it. Ground a difficult child, in my experience anyway, and the degree of lying escalates because they just *know* one of these days they'll get away with- it and there's the payoff. It's worth the grounding. Hope that makes sense. [/QUOTE]
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A month in the hospital and no sign of improvement
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