Aarrgghh! Dealing w People...!!!

[DaisyFace]

I have just come from difficult child's school...



I had to pick up the "Behavior Assessment / Teacher Rating Scales" questionaires that I had dropped off at the school in preparation for difficult child's upcoming psychiatric evaluation. The psychiatrist had asked me to choose two teachers for these questionaires.

I decided that I would choose a man and a woman...and because difficult child has a history of snowing her teachers, I tried to choose two teachers who really seemed to pay attention. I chose the English Teacher and the Science Teacher.

Remember how I had emailed the English Teacher in regards to difficult child's research project? Well, she emailed back letting me know that she was well aware of difficult child's approach on this assignment and she wondered whether I had any tips or advice for getting difficult child more on track. After reading her message I was SOOO happy that I had asked her to complete the questionaire--she really seemed to be on top of difficult child's behaviors.

After picking up the questionaires? -- pfffttt!!!!

Neither teacher completed the questionaire correctly. They did not fill out their own name, date, sex and class they taught.

And they did not pay attention to the answering system for the questions. Questions were to be answered "Never occurs, Sometimes occurs, Often occurs, or Always Occurs"....

The English Teacher marked that difficult child was very bright and creative and then marked "Never" for everything else.

Q--Gets upset when routine is changed? A--Never
Q--Adjusts well to changes in routine? A--Never

Q--Joins group activities? A--Never
Q--Refuses to join group activities? A--Never

So the questionaire is useless.

Arrgghh!!!! I'm so frustrated!!!!

It makes me wonder why I am always trying so hard on difficult child's behalf when clearly difficult child does not care....and evidently--neither does anyone else!!!!

O, and incidentally even though difficult child currently has an "F" in this English class? On the question "Does child earn failing grades?" the teacher answered (you guessed it) NEVER.


Serentity NOW!!!!

--DaisyFace

 

[klmno]

I think you should let someone at the sd know this- maybe the principal. See if you can pick up another couple of forms and have other teachers do them. This is probably just an attempt to make sure she doesn't qualify for an IEP- either that or they just went straight down the "never" column because they didn't want to take the time to do it.

 

[totoro]

Obviously you just don't know your child! PPPPHTTTT is right.

Seriously how can people live with themselves and not even think that they can be ruining someone's life or future.

N is 5.5 and we are just now addressing her speech issues after getting these same kind of sheets back for years!!!
You go back and argue and they act like you are crazy and looking for a problem.

DO OVER?!?!?!?

I am sorry, I wonder if you can talk to psychiatrist or Nuero-psychiatric? Our Nuero-psychiatric was very understanding about these things.

 

[totoro]

KLMNO has a point. N was denied by SD last year and wow now that EVERYONE sees her issues and can't deny them they are evaluation'ing her again. But I they are maiking it hard because they are overwhelmed and under funded.

 

[SadDad]

What I've learned is that children present different symptoms depending on environment. My son is very manipulative at times as well. I don't let anything slide now and I've made it a point to share as much info as possible between all of the people involved with my son's care. Persistance eventually pays off as far as getting everyone on the same page. Early on when school problems started the school seemed to "blame" the home environment for causing the "bad day" for my son. They said "he's fine" when he's here. Well yes he was/is fine when the transitions are over and he's engaged in something. Eventually though things have changed and now they're concerned his violence will carryover into school as he becomes more comfortable in the environment. Now that he's been at this school awhile the environment becomes "more like home". Kids often act out where they're most comfortable (not always). I guess I'm lucky I got my son designated special we and he got a special teacher assigned. She gives good feedback on his behavior in class. At times you have to get a little tough with the school. An advocate might be a good thing.
Chris

 

[DammitJanet]

I would walk the papers back into the school to those teachers and ask them how opposing questions could both be never? And how she could have a failing grade in a class but never be failing?

Then I would ask them to redo the paper and sign the paper saying they redid it.

 

[DaisyFace]

N is 5.5 and we are just now addressing her speech issues after getting these same kind of sheets back for years!!!
You go back and argue and they act like you are crazy and looking for a problem.


I am sorry, I wonder if you can talk to psychiatrist or Nuero-psychiatric? Our Nuero-psychiatric was very understanding about these things.

Yes, I am going to let the psychiatrist know...

After everything else that has happened this year I have ZERO faith that going back into the school will accomplish anything but make me look like a crazy person.

 

[DaisyFace]

they just went straight down the "never" column because they didn't want to take the time to do it.

I think you are correct.

 

[DaisyFace]

I would walk the papers back into the school to those teachers and ask them how opposing questions could both be never? And how she could have a failing grade in a class but never be failing?

O yes, that's rich! LOL! Remember one is the SAME teacher who asked me for ideas on how she could get difficult child to be more focused and motivated to do a good job.

 

[ML]

How frustrating!

Maybe you could bring some cookies or other such thing that you know teachers like and see if you can just get a few moments of their time. Kill them with kindness. Tell them you realize how busy they are and are sorry to ask for even more of their time but if they could just look over the assessment one more time and point out the discrepanices nicely, you sure would be grateful.

Just a thought. I've been known to make chicken soup for a sick teacher and bring brownies to a PT conference. I've usually been lucky but I haven't found the thing with the 5th grade teacher this year. I started out on the wrong foot and let my frustration get the better of me. See they're frustrated too and we have to approach them as if we assume they are on our team and that we are there to help them help us.

I sure hope you get better answers. We care too!

Hugs,

ML

 

[TerryJ2]

Oh, dear, how useless.
And they expect their students to follow directions on tests?
I'm so sorry.

 

[klmno]

I'm of a frame of mind anymore that a lot of these people in sd's and the juvenile court system are aware of a lot more than they let on. They play dumb sometimes and try to treat the parent in a condescending way to get the parent going along with less, in my humble opinion.

 

[Marguerite]

Call them on it. Be sweet about it, say that perhaps dealing with difficult child has been so challenging and time-consuming that they missed some of the obvious checks for "are you paying attention?" when the filled in the forms.

But I would also talk to the psychiatrist about this, because I think to ask the teacher to do this over, when they have been caught out not doing the job properly, will put the wrong sort of bias into the assessment.

I would definitely talk to the psychiatrist, point out the conflicting responses coupled with emails from the teacher. Print those, show them to the psychiatrist and help psychiatrist see that no way could a teacher honestly fill in the questionnaire with those answers, yet be the same teacher who sent those emails.

Then go back to the school, talk to the principal, talk to those teachers also, and ask for some names of other teachers you could ask to have a go. Before you hand the forms over, make it clear - if they are too busy or don't see this as important, to please say so now and save everybody some time and trouble.

Because to accept this responsibility and then do a half-baked job is EXACTLY the same as your child not following through with turning in her work properly.

And how can a teacher be critical of a child for doing exactly what the teacher has just done?

I wouldn't read this as teachers trying to avoid an IEP being put in place. I think ultimately, it's sheer laziness. Consequently, dishonesty (like lying about whether the dog ate the homework).

Don't simply accept this without challenge. But you can challenge nicely. Simply letting them know that you have caught them out in the same behaviour they don't condone in your daughter, will be embarrassing for them. And this is NOT acceptable!

Marg

 

[susiestar]

How much time do you have before the assessment? Do you have enough time to ask for an appointment with the teacher? Ask for just 15 minutes. Offer to buy coffee and a snack/dessert away from school if they want to meet in the evening at a coffeehouse or restaurant.

Tell the teacher you are aware she is just swamped and she probably had another child in mind when she did the questionnaire. Ask if, after thinking about the report and the other issues, she would pretty please go though the questionnaire while you sit and are quiet or go to another table.

Be sure that you pay. This is for the English teacher.

She problem will NOT want to meet you away from school. That is fine. Take a drink (if she drinks those energy drinks take one, if she is a coffee drinker take that or maybe one of the canned coffee energy drinks.) Also take a snack, some delectable goody. Even a fresh cinnamon roll from a bakery or a fresh bagel or whatever.

Sit down, chat about the problems then do the pretty please.

With the other teacher, ask to meet him. Take a nice snack - male teachers will NOT want to meet away from school. Esp not a female parent because it leaves them open for accusations. Make it a more guy-oriented snack, though homemade cookies/muffins go for everyone.

Whatever you do, place the blame on yourself. It may gag you, cause you KNOW they just didn't bother. give them the out of thinking of another child and of having to fill out several of these at a time.

Take a different colored ink. For $1.24 you can get a 10 pack of different colored Papermate pens at Walmart. Orange, red, green and purple. This will let the doctor see the changes. If you have a handy picture of your child, take it with the form. Let them know that with over 100 students a day it is easy to get them confused.

If they say that they got it right the first time, then point out the contradictions. Discuss problems and then ask how she can be no problem with those things happening.

I HOPE they will fix them. If they do not, make a copy of them (on your scanner at home if possible, so you can give the principal a copy and keep one for your records) and go talk to the principal. Let him know that you are trying to find ways to support the school and help your daughter but having a teacher just answer the same thing on every question is a way to put up a very effective roadblock to keep that help from happening. Ask him to remind teachers that their first job is to teach students. If there is a problem and the teacher actively works to keep the student from getting help, well, the student is not going to be able to learn.

If the principal will not help I would call the superintendent. Cause this is NOT something the SD wants a rep for. Imagine the news coverage (if it happened) if they covered a parent's struggle to get help for a mentally ill child and the teachers would not take 5 minutes to help give feedback that is crucial to getting help.

I am sorry the teachers were idjits.

 

[DaisyFace]

Thanks for all the suggestions!

I have been mulling over how I will handle this...

When I had brought them to the school originally, I had sent them along with a very polite note and a request that the forms please be completed by the end of the week so that I could pick them up Friday for our appointment on Saturday. The guidance counselor was aware of this and made a point to remind the teachers that the questionaires needed to be completed by Friday.

So on Friday, when I went into the school--the guidance counselor had not retrieved the completed questionaires. She told me I needed to come back sometime next week.

But--what about the appointment tomorrow? O yes, that's right. The teachers had the whole week to complete the questionaires...so where were they?

So I think that the questionaires were filled out while I was standing there in the office waiting for guidance counselor to "pick them up".

One teacher saw me in the hallway as I was leaving and explained to me that the questionaire didn't apply because a lot of the questions were obviously for very little kids. [Hmmm...thanks for the explanation. I guess that's why these were called "Adolescent Behavior Evaluations".]

So it is clear that neither one of these teachers gave the questionaires the time and consideration that was necessary.

THEN--the psychiatrist rescheduled the Sat appointment to the NEXT Saturday.

So I will have to bring the forms with me and see if the psychiatrist wants to give me new ones. (these are the kind that whatever you mark goes through to the next layer where the answers are scored--so pen color or whatever makes no difference.)

Yes, on the one hand, I would like to meet with these teachers face to face and ask for an explanation for their contradictory answers and have them re-do the questionaires.

But on the other hand--what the heck? They really couldn't find the time during their whole week to answer these questions for the sake of a student that is obviously troubled???

It makes me feel like if they couldn't be bothered before--what can I possibly say that will make them care now?

I hate dealing with this kind of nonsense!

 

[Marguerite]

What if it's not just the teachers? What if the guidance counsellor was the one to SNAFU? What if he/she didn't deliver them in the first place?

Don't be too critical of tis person or that, until you get the chance to really sit down with them and find out what happened, in order to ensure it doesn't happen again? I would in the meantime take this up with the principal and/or someone at district level.

Alternatively - arrange a face to face formal meeting with Guidance Counsellor and ask for a no'BS explanation of what happened. POint out that failure to give a good explanation (the truth will suffice, as long as it won't happen again) WILL result in you taking it higher up.

This must not happen. Not anywhere. Not ever.

Unfortunately, it happens all the time.

How much does the appointment with the specialist cost? What about THAT person's time being wasted, having to deal with nonsense responses?

You have every right to be angry.

Marg