Caught on tape and husband's response...

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by HopeRemains, Dec 19, 2012.

  1. HopeRemains

    HopeRemains New Member

    I had decided that seperate housing was in order to protect easy child. Well, husband sort of tip toed around it for a day or so, then he realized that I mean that we would be leaving soon after Christmas and full on opposed us leaving. He called me 10 times from work yesterday morning, either crying or asking to talk to easy child- just to hear his voice. While I think some of this is a tactic for guilting me, I do know that he would be hurting badly if we left. He had pretty much broken me down after the 10th call and I told him he'd better start think of some viable alternative, then. I came up with: we have to move asap to a better location, hidden video cameras, an alarm on difficult child's bedroom door and I still don't want to be alone with him. Oh, yeah, husband is fine with all of this, so he says. He's usually fine with everything until it's actually time to DO something.

    difficult child came home from school yesterday and after a bit I told him he needs to go and start reading for his 20 minutes. I know this is a trigger but I can't avoid all of his buttons all of the time, there are just too many. He goes in and reads for 10 minutes... says he's done. I tell him no, he needs to find another book to fill the rest of the time with. He comes out with a children's picture book. It wouldn't take him 10 minutes to read it, but close enough, so I told him that was fine. 10 minutes later he comes out and asks if his time is up. I say yes, but then realize he's only read 5 short short pages in 10 minutes, so tell him he needs to go and finish the book for me. I quiz him over the stories, so he knows he has to actually read them or I make him redo it. He starts jumping up and down whining/yelling, and kicks easy child when he gets too close. I tell him he will be doing a timeout. He refuses, stands in the same spot for 15 minutes, alternating a defiant stance and screaming that he hates us. I got the video camera going.

    easy child asked me if I wanted to go play with him in his room. I said yes, to get us out of the living room where difficult child had taken up residence. husband was on his way home at this point. I left the camera rolling. Almost as soon as we were out of the room difficult child grabs my stapler and begins trying to staple his santa hat. He thinks he hears me coming out so he throws it back on the desk and turns to act like he is sweetly playing with the dog. (YEAH, I guess I thought I kept an eye on him and the dog, but wasn't thinking clearly enough to put the dog in her kennel before we left the room...). In the 10 minutes before husband walks in the door, he has called the dog to him just to hit her (multiple times), lured her with a toy only to kick her (multiple times), tried to stab her with a pen as she ran by and growled in her face a few times.

    I made husband watch the tape. He said nothing. I asked... "Well? Do you see anything wrong with it?". He says nonchalantly that we need
    need to not let him alone with the dog. That's it. Well, we started doing some reading (First time he's ever taken the initative, I think, ever.) online about Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD). He agreed that difficult child meets most of the criteria except that he doesn't misbehave in school. I began to tell him how great of actors children can be and how I even see him being manipulated (even last night). He started rolling his eyes at me, being offended at everything I said about these types of children.

    I told him that I was irked that I had been alone with difficult child today. I told him since the false allegation of abuse last week, I've been forced to be alone with him many evenings after expressly saying I don't want to be put in that position. husband said condescendingly, "Well, are you really afraid for your life for one hour?". I really just wanted to smack him. And I really don't think that staying here with him and this additude is going to happen. It's the same additude that he's had for years, nothing has changed. I never said once that I am afraid for my life, but that I am afraid for easy child and for the false allegations and being targeted by him constantly. That's just his way of dismissing and trying to make me feel foolish. It's true that he made some sort of effort to get home earlier, but SO???? He didn't make it a point to actually sign up difficult child into the afterschool program and actually be there by 6, did he? The jobs he works are important, but he has leniency in both of them. If he needed to be home by a certain time, he could be with no real problem. So why is it that I'm still picking up the slack and he has never even considered that he could make sure to be home by 6? (He usually gets home any time between 6:30 and 8:30`. That's already BEDTIME for difficult child and 4 hours of possible nightmare!) No sincere apologies, only the additude that "duty calls"... This doesn't even cover his last job where he was out of town for a week at a time sometimes...

    Sorry, I know the turned into a vent... but it's just the same thing as it's been all these years. He isn't sincere.
  2. recoveringenabler

    recoveringenabler Well-Known Member Staff Member

    HR, I read your post and my first reaction is alarm. I am not an expert in any of these issues, there are many other parents here who have way more knowledge and will weight in and give you their advice.........however, I am fearful for your very young easy child and I believe you are absolutely correct in trying to protect him at all costs. If moving to another location is the only option you feel is left to you, since it seems pretty apparent your husband prefers to keep his head in the sand, I would move as quickly as you can arrange it all. Unfortunately, your husband appears to be the kind of person who needs an emergency to wake him up and that emergency will already be too late if it means harm to your easy child. If that video didn't wake him up, in my opinion, you need to go. I'm really sorry you're in this position, it's got to be so painful for you, however, all the present circumstances, including the abuse scare, would certainly push me into leaving as well. Stay strong, I think you're doing the right thing. (((HUGS))))
  3. HopeRemains

    HopeRemains New Member

    Thanks for the support, Recovering. I had mentally prepared myself to leave and face those consequences. But with as manipulative as husband himself is (he can make himself cry on cue, I've seen it many times...) I think I may just have to keep the leaving to myself until it happens. This is VERY unfortunate because I'd hoped we could work together to ease the stress on the whole family. I don't think he's going to let that happen. =(
  4. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    Sigh. Boy, does that all sound familiar.
    Your husband is definitely making it worse. At best, he's being an ostrich. At worst, he's aiding and abetting, and yes, endangering the rest of the family.
    I was doing a slow boil, reading his reaction (or nonreaction) to the video and his comments to you.
    Stay strong. Think strong. Be strong.
  5. HopeRemains

    HopeRemains New Member

    Thanks, Terry. When he said that we need to just keep difficult child away from the dog alone, he added *when he's in that sort of mood*. Really? Because it wasn't a suprise to me that he did all of this... he does it in front of us, just not to that extent and he was in a fine mood then, just normal difficult child. He behaves the same way with easy child, just walking by him he will make sure to trip or bump him and act like it's no big deal, ever. He yells at me when I call him out on it. They are such small, constant hurts that they are easy to miss or dismiss once in awhile. You know, if something did happen on my watch, husband would blame me for not watching carefully enough. (Happened before.)
  6. HopeRemains

    HopeRemains New Member

    The first question from husband when I call him in the middle of a meltdown is "Well, what started it?". REALLY? He knows that nothing big started it usually, this is just the way it is and I need some support NOW, not to take the time and rehash the beginning details right now. I've always felt that it is his way of judging if the rage is "called for" or something, to figure out if I did something wrong that caused it. For years. Same thing. Every time.
  7. recoveringenabler

    recoveringenabler Well-Known Member Staff Member

    HR, just to give you a bit of my experience, if I thing I've learned having dealt with what feels like hundreds of manipulative people, most of whom I'm related to (UGH) is to TRUST YOUR INSTINCTS. Whenever I overrode my own strong intuitive feelings or instincts, I paid a high price..............those internal promptings are there for a reason, to protect you and to protect your little guy...........follow them, and adhere to your own maternal and intuitive feelings in spite of what ANYONE else says. When you can't change the situation and you are not heard, when you feel fear and your instincts tell you to get out, then get out. It takes courage to follow that internal voice............I believe you're on the right track, keep trusting yourself............(((HUGS))))
  8. HopeRemains

    HopeRemains New Member

    Words of wisdom, Recovering... thank you!
  9. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    Contact your DV shelter. Not for shelter - for advice and support.
    The abuse is coming from a child - but it's no different, you have easy child to protect.
    They can help you PLAN your next move, etc.
  10. allhaileris

    allhaileris Crumbling Family Rock

    Huge hugs! I know how weary you are, and how hard this is. It's sucky that you husband had the reaction he did :(

    It's not being afraid of him, it's letting you have some YOU time. difficult child takes up all your energy, and it doesn't allow you to be a good mom to easy child and be good to yourself. Any way you can go with easy child to visit a relative for a couple weeks? Or get difficult child to visit somebody for part of the Winter break, to give you a break?

    He's hurting the dog physically, how much does he hurt easy child physically?

    And is it possible that a medication change is in order? Has he seen the doctor at all recently? I can't remember if you mentioned that before.
  11. HopeRemains

    HopeRemains New Member

    InsaneCdn- Good advice. I have been talking to my brother lately and he has offered for us to come stay on his couch for as long as we need to. What's funny is that I told the therapist the other day (in front of husband) that I feel ridiculous because I feel like a nine year old is abusing me/us... He told me that I was ridiculous and that I'm only allowing him to make me feel that way. GRRR....

    Allhaileris- most of the time the he hurts easy child the worst when he can catch us off guard and gets easy child into the bedroom alone for a minute, then easy child come outs crying because difficult child has punched him in the face, pushed his head into the wall or kicked him in the stomach... Of course, this is just all normal brother behavior as far as husband or the therapist is concerned.
  12. buddy

    buddy New Member

    Every single book I read on attachment said a therapist not specifically trained in the unique therapy for Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) does more harm than no therapist. Just quit. It's not worth it. Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) kids are experts at dividing adults. They can't make any progress in a home where people are divided. Check out Nancy Thomas and her books. They you.

    I'm so sorry husband went immediately back to same old once he thought he talked you out of moving. You are being so brave. And yes, a child is abusing you. Not his fault he is wired that way but you can't fix it. And your staying actually will just make him worse.

    For now, using the explosive child ideas...maybe prioritize what your battles are. Reading would be an absolute let it go (basket c) item. For now just work on safety items. Can't be alone with easy child you or animals. If you can't take the dog with you it must be re-homed.

    It all is so hard. Stay strong. Setting those boundaries/leaving is a loving act for both children.
  13. recoveringenabler

    recoveringenabler Well-Known Member Staff Member

    HR, I find it very disturbing that your husband minimizes your feelings and the abuse your younger son is experiencing (as well as the dog) My gut instinct is that you are in the middle of a really abusive situation with a husband who is basically unconscious and unwilling to face the truth. It makes sense in a warped way that he is wanting things to stay as they are since without you in the picture, HE would have to deal with difficult child. He seems to have a huge investment in that which puts the rest of you at considerable risk. Telling you that you are "ridiculous" and that you are "allowing him to make you feel this way" is certainly maddening and discounting your feelings. but it is wildly out of touch with reality and in my opinion is designed to keep you there and manipulate you into feeling guilty for what you feel so that you won't make any changes. Don't let your husband keep you and your younger son in an unsafe place. Ask yourself what the best course of action is and follow it, no matter what............I am worried about you and your youngest son. Your son is being abused.
  14. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    Get a new therapist.
  15. dstc_99

    dstc_99 Well-Known Member

    Being a Newbie here I dont have much experience with what to do but my question is this? What kind of man can turn on and off tears at the drop of a hat? If he can do that and dismiss all the stuff you are telling him and showing him then maybe he has some type of issues he needs to work out.

    The other side is you should protect yourself and your easy child from the difficult child and the husband who doesn't seem to care that his wife and child are being abused.
  16. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    Keep in mind that Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) may not be the only thing at work with difficult child.
    Many other problems have a genetic basis... and it sounds like your husband is a difficult child in his own right.
    Not that he will ever admit that, of course...
  17. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Your husband sounds almost as bad as the difficult child. Well, you heard my story. Not only should you be afraid of a Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) kid. It is insane to live with one. I advise you take easy child AND the dog (poor doggy) and leave. If he goes for attachment therapy (not other kind will do anything and even that may not work), and you see a huge improvement maybe you can try again. Right now you are taking a huge risk with yourself and your easy child. What if some social worker believes his allegations of false abuse? What if he kicks the dog too hard and kills him? What if he has molested your easy child? Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) is about as serious a problem as a child can have and your husband contributed to it by not getting his son out of a bad situation when he was a baby. What makes you think he's going to change now? Don't let his crocodile tears sway you from protecting your easy child and the dog (yes, I'm an animal lover).

    difficult child sounds like he is very steeped in Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD), not just mildly affected. He may have other issues too, but the Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) is overwhelming. Anything else is just going to make him even worse. This kid will likely never get better. And he won't for certain as long as husband refuses to follow through with intensive attachment therapy. Even then, without Mom also helping...there are other issues.
    I lived with a Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) kid. He was more dangerous than many adult criminals. I really think you should leave. I don't want you to someday find out that difficult child did to your easy child what he did to my kids. Or I don't want you to end up in jail because some young and clueless social worker believes that you abuse him. It's not worth it. I'm not sure anyone here lived with a truly Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) kid before, but I have. It is way worse than anything else you can ever imagine...and very dangerous for the entire family.

    One last thought: A Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) child is not attached to anybody, except, of course, he does put on a great caring act when he wants money or a toy or a favor. When our difficult child was lead out the door, he did want to come back and live with us again. Why not? We gave him many material things. But he got over us very quickly and according to the social worker who was keeping tabs on him, stopped asking for us very fast and was stealing, lying, and, yes, trying to molest other kids even in a jail type of Residential Treatment Center (RTC). They had cameras running all the time and could see what he was doing. Don't feel guilty if you leave him. You didn't cause this and you are not the one who let him down when he most needed somebody. Nothing about this child is your fault. Save yourself and your easy child and the dog.
  18. Ktllc

    Ktllc New Member

    No personal experience there, but just some common sense tips.
    Get a plan together and keep it to your self. YOU KNOW there is a BIG problem in your family and you fear for your and easy child's safety. No need to convince anyone else. You've tried, it did not work. Now think about self preservation (including your little guy).
    Your plan should include: housing, financial independence, daycare for your easy child.
    You might not find all 3 at once but now is a good time to have your family help you (souds like your brother is willing).
    You are traped by both difficult child and your husband. Until you achieve a good level of independence, I doubt anything will change.
    You can't change difficult child (at least not alone) and you can't change you husband. But you can change the course of YOUR life and easy child's.
    These are very hard times for you and you'll have to be incredibly strong. And moving does not mean you're giving up on your husband or difficult child. You are simply trying to recreate some balance in your life and some control.
    BIG BIG hugs.
  19. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    I think you need to take a step back and see this from an outsider's perspective. If this was a Lifetime movie, you would be yelling for the mom to take the easy child and dog and RUN RUN RUN! You would be asking the tv character mom why she cannot see how abusive both her son AND HUSBAND are to her.

    Yes. Your HUSBAND is abusing you. He is minimizing your feelings and telling you that you are not in danger and are the cause of the problem and if you just didn't upset/irritate/annoy difficult child then difficult child wouldn't be a difficult child and wouldn't hurt anyone. He is using his fake tears and fake emotions to trap you in an abusive relationship so that his life is not inconvenienced.

    Abuse isn't just the outright things we think of, and is can come from siblings, children, spouses, or anyone else. You are abused by your child and husband, and your easy child is abused by his father and brother. You are also ALLOWING easy child to be abused by not getting him out of there and keeping him out.

    I DO know how hard this is. My husband refused to think we had real problems with difficult child for years. Why should he? I was the one who did the restraints and appointments and when difficult child raged? husband kept the other kids in the other room and left me mostly alone with difficult child. He would come in if I insisted, but he pretty much was just a warm body that did what he was told, so he wasn't an active support in any way really. Even when I found Wiz choking J in the middle of the night, husband slept through it until I was in the doorway screaming for him to help me. By then I had Wiz attacking me and I was trying to be sure J was still breathing. To this day J has tough time trusting husband because he mostly ignored or was oblivious to what Wiz did. husband was actually shocked when he read the list of things Wiz had done to J after I brought it home from the psychiatric hospital. He told me he thought Wiz made it up to sound like a tough guy and J heard him say that. It was one of very few times she ever yelled at him and she totally freaked. She thought husband was going to bring him home. That was the day I realized that she honestly expected to be killed by Wiz before she was 12. THAT was enough of a shock to help snap husband out of it. Of course 1 1/2 yrs later when I pressed charges of assault, husband thought I was being overly excitable, though he didn't go against me at all. He just kept saying eh wasn't there and didn't know what happened.

    YOU must take control and refuse to be alone at home with difficult child. Tell school to call his father and not you, that only his father will be picking him up from now on. Take your easy child and dog and RUN. Get OUT before irreparable harm is done to you and to easy child. Wiz does not have Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD), and he was very dangerous. we did learn that the problems when he was found choking J and ended up in psychiatric hospital for 4 mos were aggravated and spurred on by a crazy sp ed teacher who did all sorts of unethical and downright illegal things and knowingly spurred him into psychosis and delusions and magical thinking. We found a notebook where she was helping him plan to run away to Japan to go find the real, live pokemon - you know, the ones the cartoons are about. They looked up how to get a passport for someone not your child, plane fare, etc... I don't think it was a serious plan, but she sure fed into his delusions. she also encouraged a belief that J and I were demons and he was supposed to 'vanquish' us. this was NOT creative writing and she is a crazy witch and the school was hit with a large class action lawsuit because she did this to more than just my child - usually 1-2 boys per year got this 'help' from her.

    With a Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) diagnosis, the child is even more dangerous. GET OUT NOW. I know husband will cry, be upset, etc.... But you KNOW what your instincts are saying, and you NEED to follow them. The times that we regret the most are usually the ones where we ignored our instincts because someone made promises or laid a bunch of guilt on us. Who would you rather see cry? husband or easy child? By giving in to husband and staying because he cries, you are allowing difficult child to have far mroe access to easy child and this causes easy child a lot of pain and tears. As a mom, your primary job is to protect your child. When one child s hurting another, you must protect the one being hurt. You might want to look at it as working to keep difficult child out of going to prison for killing his brother or you. Yes, it CAN get to that point. If you don't take BIG steps, it actually MAY get to that point.

    We spent several years not ever leaving Wiz and J in a room alone. I took J to the bathroom if husband wasn't home AND in the room AND paying attention, and husband took Wiz if I wasn't doing those things. husband never even had a beer unless the kids were asleep because we couldn't afford to have any senses dulled because that was when Wiz hurt someone, usually J. It was AWFUL and no way to live. You CANNOT maintain that level of vigilance if your husband isn't home every evening and esp if he does not agree and work wth you. The way he blames you, your husband is not going to help in any meaningful way.

    I am sorry, and I know I sound blunt and maybe dramatic. But reality with a kid like your difficult child IS blunt and dramatic and dangerous. You would never let a stranger treat you or easy child or even your dog the way your husband and difficult child are treating you all. Think about that long and hard. then do what is needed to protect your child because that is what moms are supposed to do.
  20. DDD

    DDD Well-Known Member

    No advice. I don't think you need advice. You know in your gut what to do and how to do it. I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers. Hugs. DDD