Don’t understand

Discussion in 'Parent Emeritus' started by Idon’t-know, Oct 3, 2019.

  1. Idon’t-know

    Idon’t-know New Member

    ok so I’m new to this forum. I have four boys and all are great kids but one stands out more than the others. He has always had difficulty in school not wanting to complete work, not wanting to go to school, not wanting to get ready on time, then when he landed an apprenticeship job he was always making his dad wait for him to drive him to work. Then one day he was told to stay gone from work. This went on for a month until I told him to ask for his EI papers and to go on unemployment. He did, and he has been on short term seasonal layoff for 37 weeks. In the mean time, he does not shower regularly, you have to force him or he is in his pyjamas all day. He plays his computer games all day. Ever since he was a kid I would find booger’s under the couch on the wall, but he would always say “ that’s not me.” But now I find them all over his desk. His dirty clothes sit in the floor, he will tell me he has no dirty clothes, I will ask him to wash his bedding and it takes st least ten times to get him to do it, he is gaping in his room, and I have asked him to do it outside and he doesn’t do I took the vape stuff out of his room, he refuses to join in family gatherings to the point you have to force him, daily he has glasses and dishes in his room and you have to ask and ask until there are 19 glasses in his room and you blow up and then he brings them down. I recently found a gym bag in his room full of S&M stuff in it and I found dresses, and girls night shirts and banana hammocks in his drawer. He never leaves his room, he does not have a girlfriend that I know of. I’m so confused. He is very smart and mostly incredibly sweet.
     
  2. BusynMember

    BusynMember Active Member

    Hi. I am sorry you are worried about your son. I have a very troubled daughter so I get it. I welcome you and will offer my two cents. Then you can take what you need from my words and disregard anything that you don't find helpful.

    I don't know how old your son is, but if he is willing, I would take him to be evaluated by a psychiatrist or neuropsychologist. I am very sorry I didn't evaluate my daughter when she was a child and by age 13, when we wanted to do it, she didn't. In our state she could refuse psychiatric evaluations by then. We dropped the ball by waiting so long. She is 33 and never went for treatment and has long been out of our house, bit it has been a nightmare.

    These are my own thoughts about your son. Now I am sort of a prude, but I would be upset if any of my kids had S&M stuff anywhere. To me that would mean that they perhaps want to harm a person during sex. The girl's clothes would not upset me as much. I am very religious yet I know that some men like to dress as woman or feel like they are women. It would break my heart and it is not in keeping with my beliefs but I would support him. It is also possible that he likes to masturbate into girls clothing. I think he is disturbed on many levels. I hope this doesn't hurt you. It is not meant to do that.

    At the same time I would hope the child would get very serious therapy to help him reflect on what he really wants to do and who he really thinks he is. If my son were over 18 and did these things, along with the laziness and lack of socializing, he would either have to have therapy or not live with us. Is he using any drugs, even pot? Vaping can kill him. I would forbid it in my home. Completely.

    You need to find your own comfort level with all of this. I am not you. As a mother, all the issues you brought up would concern me. I would check his computer. I don't like to snoop, but I would do it if I was trying to see how troubled my child was and how badly he needed help.

    Since you have other children you know that this son is not typical. It is up to you and his father if you decide to set boundaries such as telling him he must see a psychiatrist and forcing the issue. We never did and our daughter is a mess. We are sorry we didn't have higher expectations of her.

    If God is in your life, accept my prayers. I hope you can come to some agreement on how to handle your beloved son. He can't sit in his room forever. He seems very sad, maybe depressed. My heart goes out to him and yourself too. Be well.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
  3. WiseChoices

    WiseChoices Active Member

    Welcome!
    You did not state the age of your son, but I assume he is an adult at this point.

    He sounds depressed. I would talk to him and see whether he is open to go to therapy. State what you observe about his lack of personal hygiene, staying in PJs, and computer game usage, and express concern and compassion.

    It is my opinion that your son deserves privacy as an adult. I would not go through his things , I would not address his sexual orientation, or the S&M items you discovered. It's highly personal. His sheets and his laundry are personal and are in his room, so again, it's of a personal nature.

    The room is in your house, so you can ask for 1.rent or a financial contribution to the household 2. No vaping, cigarette, alcohol, or drug use in your home 3. General maintenance for the longevity of the room like floors / carpets 4. Contributions to household chores
     
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  4. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    Welcome.

    This is all very hard.

    I think that you have a right to be comfortable in your own house and if your son is engaging in behavior that makes you uncomfortable you have every right and even the obligation to set limits within your home. He or any other person can engage in a spectrum of behaviors legal or not wherever they want, but they can't do it in my home.

    There is a gray area if our children have tenant's rights. I am careful to not obligate myself with my own son, who I do not completely trust.

    You are his mother. You are not a treatment center. If your son does not want to seek treatment, and he is in distress, with this, too, I think you have a right to ask him to leave. I have always felt with my own son to allow him free rein to not seek treatment, in my home, is to enable him.

    All of this is not easy. Because when we set limits with our children we cut open our own heart. I am the one who bleeds most.

    I am not saying that your son does not deserve privacy and autonomy about his private, sexual behavior. But you have an equal right to be comfortable in your home.

    I think you also have a vote about the vaping in your home, and hygiene issues.

    The way I try to handle all of this is to speak the truth. (I try to stay calm but I don't necessarily succeed.)

    I am assuming you went into his room and found the concerning stuff, while cleaning up. (As opposed to searching his stuff.) The thing is this: the horse is already out of the barn. You can't un see what you saw. By not saying anything, it's kind of a lie. You are his mother. If all of this is going on, he's living a secret life. This alone could be causing depression and distress. You don't have to condemn him. You can support him. Not this behavior, but his extremely difficult position. He must be filled with self-hatred and shame.

    I was reading about sexual proclivities. People don't choose them, they discover them. The thinking now is that the origin is pre-natal!! Before birth!! Your son must be so confused. I feel such compassion for him.

    You can't have a vote about what he does, but you can choose how you respond. It would take courage on your part to let him know that you know. But from my way of thinking there is NO 100 percent GOOD way to deal with this. Every option is complex and indeterminate.

    I would try to tell him the truth. That you discovered the stuff. I would also tell him about the vaping. I would tell him about the hygiene and find ways to support him to change. I would tell him you need this to be dealt with. That you're uncomfortable. He sounds like a kind and caring person. A good person.

    About the clothes, and S and M toys, I would tell him about your concern and even your discomfort. He's not stupid. He knows who you are. Being honest is not to condemn him. All you are saying is you don't want it in the house. (You can't stop him living the private life he needs to live.) But I don't think it's wrong to have a response to it, and to have a voice.

    I am an older woman. I don't judge anybody. But for reasons involving my personal history I feel very uncomfortable with unconventional sexual behavior. I am not conventional in any other way. I would have a very hard time with this in my face. Your son either exercised poor judgment bringing this stuff home, or he wanted you to find out. Either way, I think it would be a mistake to NOT SEE the elephant in the room. I think he wants you to know. He may need your help.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
  5. JayPee

    JayPee Sending good vibes...

    Welcome,

    Sorry that you find yourself here but you will find comfort and strength for sure.

    I am with the others on this one with regards to your sons' hygiene. It's your home and I think you should implement some boundaries on his own personal cleanliness and that of his room. It is not an easy battle and I surely did not win them all on this one but I kept trying. My older son, when living at home would collect dishes and dirty cloths and then after a month he'd bring them all up to the kitchen and all his dirty laundry to be washed which then took like 3 days to do. Not the system I would have wanted but at least he eventually reached a point where he knew it needed to be done.

    There are so many things I wish I could have done differently. For instance, my oldest, who is now 30, is gay. My ex husband is an alcoholic and unfortunately the way my sons' coming out was handled was horrible. My ex was fixing older sons computer per his request (when he was 18) and found gay pornography on it. Because of my ex's drinking and his own behavioral issues he made such a huge scene and ended up demanding my son leave that day from our home. To this day I shutter when I recall the manner that this all happened. I too played a part which I'm ashamed of. First off, I could not and did not stand up to my alcoholic husband at the time. I was too afraid but also weak. My own faith and beliefs and the reality of what we'd learned shocked me too. That night, once my ex sobered up we called every friend looking for my son. We were sorry for how we handled it but the damage was done. To this day, although I have sat down and whole-heartedly apologized for the horrible way that I handled it, my son still blames us for all he's unable to accomplish and attributes it to how this all played out.

    I would only suggest to be very careful and respectful of how you approach your son, if you so chose to discuss, his sexuality "issues". I do think, in my humble opinion, you will be doing your son a favor in the long run to get this out in the open. I feel like I must have had blinders on to not see my son way gay. I suppose my life was pretty insane with the alcoholic and my full focus was on surviving that life. However, my son lived in the lonliness and fear of being different and not being able to share that with us. He knew the outrageous behavior of his alcoholic father and he knew my religious beliefs and was not able to come to us and discuss his sexuality freely. I feel he was a prisoner in his own body for many years. He now has many psycholigical issues, anger towards me etc. I can only think that maybe we could have prevented some of this if we had addressed it earlier on.

    I would suggest praying that God be with you and guide you as you approach these issues so that your son will be open to hearing you and you will be able to express yourself in a manner that is respectful to both yourself and your son.
     
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  6. Blindsided

    Blindsided Face the Sun

    Welcome to the group.

    You will find varying thoughts here, but in the end, it's up to each of us to decide what points fit best in our situation, which can change over night.

    Obviously, this is very concerning for you. I too will assume your son is an adult, in which case he should be on his own. The rights afforded adults is our right to privacy. That said, adult responsibilities include living independently. If your son is in transition from adolescent to young adult, there are behaviors that send up a red flag, such as those that concern you. You are right to get started on this now.

    Maybe inspect what you are doing, because that's the only thing you can control.

    Is what you are doing or allowing... helping your son get a foothold on his life path, or enabling him to continue in behaviors that keep him stuck?

    It can be a scarey time in life or one the person couldnt wait for.

    If I had it to do over again, I would make getting help a provision in my daughter returning to live at home as an adult. I would stick to the rules, which admittedly I failed to be consistent with. I would let her fully experience the consequences of her actions.

    Copa's thoughts are parallel with mine.

    Again, welcome. Keep us posted.
     
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  7. BusynMember

    BusynMember Active Member

    I want to clarify one thing.

    Sexual orientation is NOT a behavior problem and in spite of my religious beliefs I think the church misinterpreted being gay. This does not bother me at all and I think your ex's reaction, JP was shameful
    .
    Gay or straight I don't want any S&M sexual items under my roof. THAT would make me feel creepy in my own house and it's my house. Period. What he does outside of my house is his business. I don't ask my grown kids about their sex lives.This poster has a right to be comfortable in her home. Her boundaries are up to her. She may be okay with this in her home.

    I get to choose what I accept in my home. All of us do.

    Being a regular young man who happens to be gay is in my opinion normal (and I take flack from certain church friends but I don't care). S&M is not in my opinion and that stuff would have been thrown out. This kid would either go to therapy or leave even if I felt I had to pay for him to stay elsewhere. .

    It is not just the S&M either. The poor hygiene, chaotic bedroom, smearing boogers on the desk at his age, not working, lying etc. are very serious issues too. It doesn't serve him to just let him deteriorate with no attempt to get him to get help. If he wanted to lounge around all day it would not be in my home. And I'm sure some parents are okay with this. There is no right answers, just feelings.

    Now we bought our daughter a house to give her a place to stay without living with us. We found her other shelter after she lost the house and paid for years. It hurt her and us, but at least she didn't live here. She crossed too many boundaries to live with us.

    Just wanted to explain. The S&M stuff in my opinion is a different issue from sexual orientation. A tinge of violence there. in my opinion scary.

    God bless.
     
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  8. JayPee

    JayPee Sending good vibes...

    Busy, thank you for your clarification. I obviously didn't explain what I was trying to get across very well. I do not parallel S&M with being gay. I do, however, do not agree with the pornography he was viewing, whether it was gay or straight.

    What I really was trying to do was use it as a comparison insofar as it was a very personal, intimate "secret" that my son held and the way we dealt with it (for each of our own personal reasons) was dishonorable to him.

    I love my son, whether he is gay or straight, that is for certain.
     
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  9. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    Welcome.

    You have come to the right place where you can journal and get other's advice and opinions. As one poster said, take what you need and leave the rest. However it does give you some thoughts from many parents that have been through a LOT with their adult children and have nothing but love and compassion for all.

    I think you have already gotten great advice and I agree that it sounds like something is not quite right with your son and I think you feel it too or you would not be here. He sounds very lonely and could be depressed. No one would want to live like that if you ask me.

    My son was using drugs (pills) when he behaved that way - holed in room, not cleaning himself or his room - but that does not mean this is the case with your son. My son is doing much better but still can be a bit lazy with that. Some guys are. Nothing else that you mentioned though thankfully.

    I agree that you should have an open and honest discussion with your son about what you think, feel and found. Many say that there can be no privacy if they are living in OUR homes and I think that is right but ONLY if we feel something is not right - as you do. If they are working and doing normal things, I would not invade privacy.

    I also agree that if you live in my house you bathe regularly and practice good personal hygiene and your room is kept clean. I am very anal about my house and I will not allow it. I think you have to create some firm boundaries with your son because I do believe boundaries/rules will help him. I also would insist that something is done to get him moved out of this rut. I do think a therapist even if just for you to sort this all out would be helpful.

    At least you'd feel like you're doing something. I always NEEDED that.

    I also would pray a lot because I sure did for my son and it did work for him and it helped me tremendously.
     
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  10. Idon’t-know

    Idon’t-know New Member

    Thank you so much everyone for taking time to respond. I didn’t mention but my son has just turned 20. I have taken his vape away and I gave him an ultimatum that he had to clean his room with a deadline or I would be going in. He told me he vacuumed but it was clearly not true so I went in and cleaned and dusted. I had warned him if it wasn’t done I would be doing it and I followed through. I have had him at a doctor several times when he was younger because of his dyslexia and sensory processing concerns. He went to a special school where he learned to use Dragon software and got lots of one on one. He has also suffered from a sensory issue related to clothing etc. Which he seemed to work through. He use to be fairly social but now refuses to see his friends. They ask about him often. I recently took him back to the physician and spoke with her with him present related to his gaming and isolation and hygiene and She felt he should see a psychiatrist but because of his age he refused. I got him to sign up for his 2nd year apprenticeship course in plumbing and he attended his first class yesterday. He says he doesn’t want to go out with his friends because they drink and twice he was sent to the hospital via ambulance because of passing out. I told him I was glad he doesn’t want to drink but maybe to encourage his friends to go to dinner or a movie. He said no thanks. I don’t care about his sexual orientation as long as he’s happy. I just don’t agree with the S&M. I went to see a counsellor yesterday and spoke about everything and I go back next week. I told you earlier I have four boys. Two are twins and 18 and have stage 3 kidney failure and hearing impairment . One is getting a cochlear implant on December 23rd. The same boy has CP on his left side. They both are going to school for electrical engineering. My other boy is a physician and is 30 but has moved back home as he was shot two years ago and has been suffering from PTSD. So as you can see I have a lot on my plate but the 20 year old I worry about the most.
     
  11. BusynMember

    BusynMember Active Member

    Wow. I am so sorry.

    I am no expert, but I meet tons of people at my business and some become friendly and talk to me. Your 20 year old old with sensory processing seems to fit adults I have met who are autistic. They tend to be very sensitive to noise and socially isolated per their parents who have been with them. You may want to look it up and see if you feel it fits. If so, you can also search online for the best way to handle it.

    God bless.
     
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  12. Blindsided

    Blindsided Face the Sun

    You do have a full plate. Thay said, it looks like your 20 year old is the one who needs attention for now. Just be careful with distinguishing enabling from help. It's difficult when the tirm that magical age. With his right to make his own choices as an adult also means he is the one who should enjoy or suffer from the consequences of his behavior. You are right to get on this now. I am thinking of you.

    Love and light.
     
  13. louise2350

    louise2350 New Member

    I am new to this place.

    I have a 39 year old daughter who has cut me out of her life and I don't know why. She was speaking to me until I fb messaged her over some post she posted. I realize now that I shouldn't of done that but I don't understand why she has cut me out of her life 4 years ago. She invites her two sisters to events she has but does not include me. It's a long story - many problems with this daughter while she was in her teens. She is an alcoholic but won't get help. Also I'm upset or don't know what to think where her older sister won't tell me what is going on for fear of "getting involved". I feel somewhat betrayed by her too unless maybe I shouldn't involve her but at the same time I'd like to know why my middle daughter is having nothing to do with me.
     
  14. BusynMember

    BusynMember Active Member

    Hi and welcome. You may want to start your own thread to get more responses. I am very sad for you.

    I have no wise words, but my own opinion is that Al Anon may help you. Also if this more me I would not involve my other kids in this and as hard as it is I would force myself to not look at her FB.

    FB is a bully pulpit with certain people.

    Sounds like this daughter has been a problem for a long time and it's not your fault. She is an addict like one of my daughters. You didn't cause it, you can't cure it and you can't control it (from Al Anon).

    We had to detach with love.

    I wish you peace and God bless you. If God is a big part of your life, maybe let go of this outcome and give the problem over to God. Hugs.
     
  15. louise2350

    louise2350 New Member

    I can't find where to start a thread
     
  16. WiseChoices

    WiseChoices Active Member

    When you are in the forum you wish to list to like this one "Parent Emeritus", there is option a top of page "Post new threat".Welcome!
     
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