First time posting, son 31, heroin addict, living at home, sober and stable for months, then not

[Copabanana]

I am indecisive too. It is not the worst trait I am finding. Deciding just to decide. What does that do?

The thing is this. Maybe there is no right answer. Maybe life has to unfold.

There is no guarantee son will learn, will grow up if he has to. Your son could. We tried that over and over again for years: to push my son to make more responsible choices. It did not work. My son got worse without our support and structure. Not all our kids are helped by just one kind of response. Yours might.

I seem to be contradicting myself. Perhaps I am.

Yes. Treatment for drug addiction is essential. Yes. Your house is not treatment. Mine either. Yes. Boundaries and clarity and communication are essential. Yes. Sometimes we have to throw them out. But will this achieve the result we seek? Only sometimes. We need to face that.

And husband's grief? My SO is deciding now for ME. Not for the welfare and betterment of my son. So that I do not suffer like I do when we do not know where or how my son is. I near die of grief. We can call people like me and your husband names. But people are who they are.

There are no easy answers here. No right answers. Yes. Everything we say is true about this and that. But there is no one right answer.

Do you think your husband might want to read here, and maybe post?

---

I want to add one thing. I am unimpressed that your son does not want to waste a year in teen challenge. Preferring to agonize his parents and to burden them, becoming their responsibility as he chooses to not waste a year....Methadone and stagnating and being self absorbed is just so preferable, and oh such a better use of a grown adult's time. End of sarcasm.

I think he needs to be told directly just what a jerk he is being. And that there are no choices here. This is not between one resort or another. This is the last RESORT. And he got himself here. Nobody else. Not you. Not his dad. And there is just one choice: drug addict equals residential treatment. He needs to man up.

I am wondering if he reads and plays the situation between you and husband, your differing responses to and ways of handling this trauma, to his own (dis)advantage. Another strong incentive for you and husband to be in synch. I know you and he can come to a common understanding.

 

[recoveringenabler]

Patty, welcome. I'm sorry you continue to struggle with your son's choices and behavior. This path with our adult troubled kids is very challenging.

I have an adult daughter whose been off the rails for years, no substance abuse, mental illness issues, no diagnosis, no medication. I've needed to learn a very different way to parent.

For some perspective and information, you might enjoy reading the article on detachment at the bottom of my post here. If you haven't already, you might contact NAMI, the National Alliance on Mental Illness, they can be accessed online. They offer parent courses which provide guidance, support, resources and information which are excellent. They may be able to help you navigate the terrain to support you and your son. What I've found over the years is that the more support I have, the better I feel and the difficult choices we face become more manageable if you have someone to talk to and work thru your own issues with.

There are a few books which helped as well, Codependent no more by Melodie Beattie is a good general resource. The power of now and The new earth by Eckhart Tolle helped me to learn how to stay in the moment and not jump into the future to worry and try to figure out how to avert catastrophe. Pema Chodron (who is a Buddhist nun who speaks to living with uncertainty and fear) has excellent books like Comfortable with uncertainty and When things fall apart. They helped me to develop a different perspective as I was learning how to live with so many unknowns.

I would encourage you to find a good support system. You seem very much alone and without support. It's unfortunate that your husband is not on the same page as you, it seems you are the only one willing to face the truth, which can be an isolating place to be. Perhaps a call to NAMI can offer you a support system and then some reasonable options for you to consider.

Many parents find solace and comfort in the 12 step groups, Families Anonymous, Narc Anon and CoDa may be good resources for you.

You matter too. Your needs and desires matter. You've been in the midst of substance abuse for a long time. You see the truth and those around you deny the truth. That's a crummy place to be.

Find a support system, a therapist well versed in addiction and mental illness, a support group, some place you can be where YOU get the support YOU need to figure out YOUR best options. As you get support and put yourself as the priority, you'll find the options you need to make healthy choices for you and for your son. There are no right answers, we all do what we can bear, however, the path eases up quite a bit when OUR concerns our seen and heard, when OUR voices are recognized.......when OUR fears, grief, disappointments, angers and powerlessness are acknowledged and held with compassion and empathy. When WE are cared for, when we offer ourselves the same kindness and compassion we offer our kids, we begin to find the answers we seek. Take care of you now. You deserve it. You've been on a long, tough, lonely journey, it's time to take care of you.......do that first.....each day do something kind and nourishing for yourself....

Keep posting, it helps. I'm glad you're here, we'll circle the wagons around you as you find your way..........you're not alone.

 

[PattyK]

Copabanana and Recoveringenabler thank you for your posts. My first response is to Copabanana. Your post brought something out that should have been obvious to me but hasn’t until now. And that is my son might get worse not better without our support. That has happened in the past. He states when he is alone and without our support he quits caring about sobriety and thinks what the hell. He feels hopeless and lost. He falls back into heavier than normal drug use and lives under a bush. I know thats his choice. I have lived with the fantasy of him acting like a responsible adult man, but as you say, that might never happen. That makes me so sad. Even though it isn’t ideal according to our traditional American culture I could actually handle him living at home IF he were holding down a job, getting to work on time, doing his job without getting into power struggles with the boss every day and getting fired for various reasons, cleaning up behind himself in the home, pitching in with home chores and just all the stuff that goes with home ownership, etc. everyone knows what I mean. But he doesn’t do any of that. And it is for that black hole of endless needs, selfishly taking, never getting enough from us but always needing yet one more thing from us, having to be asked to clean up behind himself, never trying to be helpful just because its the right thing..... That sort of thing is what I cannot overlook. He has had periods of good and helpful choices, but they are rare and mixed with months of out of control selfish existence. And maybe forcing him to be on his own will just result in a total death spiral for him. I can accept that life is harder for some than for others. What I can’t accept is his utter selfishness. And you are right about rehab. We forced him into rehab when he was younger because it frankly was what he needed. But no one can force that now. And you are right in your assessment of that matter. My husband is not the sharing type. He feels our business is not to be put out there. Because I have always done “life” ( bills, taxes, finances, family business, childcare, etc) none of this stuff impacts him. But of course he contributes to the successful home life in his lifetime of hard work, loving acceptance and deep commitment to our family and faith. But he has been depleted by a physically demanding job in the outdoors, his own addiction issues, chronic backpain and a lifetime of depression. I think frankly he wishes I would accept our son as he is and quit rocking the boat. If I would just quit expecting our son to support himself and occasionally think of others then life would be peaceful. He is full of loving acceptance and does not wish to force any issues with him. Perhaps I’m the problem here....

Recoveringenabler, thank you for the generous list of helpful resources. I have read some of the books you mentioned. And I am in counseling for my emotional trauma related to all this. She frankly doesn’t understand why I stay with my passive husband. The one thing that keeps me stable is my other son who has conquered his heroin addiction and is thriving with his own career and family. And, as a recovering addict, he concurs with my assessment of his older brother. He encourages me to draw healthy boundaries and stick to them. His take on this helps me judge whether my bubble has gotten off center. I have been involved in 12 step programs before but now we have our young granddaughter in the home to raise and my evenings are spent doing mommy things. I started reading the detachment article here and became so discouraged because I have been an enabler to the max in the past and constantly fall back into those behaviors. People don’t like it when their enabler gets healthy and starts setting boundaries. That’s probably why there is so much dissension between me, my husband and son. But my takeaway from all this is to slow down, quit fantasizing about what changes my choices can bring to pass (if anything), and keep doing what i can to read, self help and hang in there. Much like what I’ve been doing for years. Eckert Tole (sp?) believes things happen when the time is ripe. Until then we are to remain pretty detached from the drama our egos create (absolutely paraphrased from my memory of his work). And I see the sense and the peace in that. Some days I’m there and some days not!! Today is a new day. Lets see what it brings. Some small something can change the course of our family’s journey. I will continue to post about this family’s journey to sanity (or not). Thank you for your kind concern and honest posts.

 

[New Leaf]

Hi Patty, you certainly have a lot on your plate.I am amazed at your resilience.

I started reading the detachment article here and became so discouraged because I have been an enabler to the max in the past and constantly fall back into those behaviors. People don’t like it when their enabler gets healthy and starts setting boundaries. That’s probably why there is so much dissension between me, my husband and son.

You are very hard on yourself, essentially you are swimming upstream against the current of another sort of “acceptance” in your home. It reminds me of the old story about the Emperor who wore no clothes. The elephant in the room is your son, who is unmovable, and your hubs who would rather just let it be, than try to help him help himself, and help you run an efficient home. It’s a rough place to be, I know, because I was there. The exception being that my hubs had plenty to say about the kids not helping, but didn’t like the alternative. For my two, it is “sink or swim”. They were sinking in my home, they are sinking out there living “under a bush” as you say. I don’t like how they are living, but it is their choice and I won’t be held hostage to their lifestyles in my home. In that way, I suppose I have built a huge wall around my heart.

to slow down, quit fantasizing about what changes my choices can bring to pass (if anything), and keep doing what i can to read, self help and hang in there

For now, this is a good plan. It is what held me together all those years, but it was also difficult. I hope you are able to get some real
“you” time. Mine, was getting out of the house and paddling in the ocean. The hard part is that our homes are supposed to be our sanctuaries.

People don’t like it when their enabler gets healthy and starts setting boundaries.

This is so true. Please don’t see yourself as they would- selfish. It is not selfish to expect an adult to clean up after themselves, to pitch in.

I have been involved in 12 step programs before but now we have our young granddaughter in the home to raise and my evenings are spent doing mommy things.

My goodness. You are amazing.

I am in counseling for my emotional trauma related to all this. She frankly doesn’t understand why I stay with my passive husband.

You have been through so much in your marriage. Definitely not the Disney story of “happily ever after”. It was much the same for me. Hubs was a workaholic, rough around the edges and not a talker. He was different in that finances were tight and he took charge of that. Opposite of your hubs, very frugal. There were rough spots for sure. As he got more ill, he became more inside of himself. It was a pretty lonely time in our relationship. I don’t know, Patty, I think sometimes that I stayed because I saw through all of the rough stuff and just knew hubs had a genuinely good heart. Maybe it was growing up watching the “Flintstones” or Jackie Gleason in the “Honeymooners”? It is hard for other people to understand. Old fashioned? Or, do we settle after so many years and try our best to live on the memories of good times?

as a recovering addict, he concurs with my assessment of his older brother. He encourages me to draw healthy boundaries and stick to them. His take on this helps me judge whether my bubble has gotten off center.

I am glad you have your other son to at least give you an assurance of your take on his brother. I found this with my well children.

If I would just quit expecting our son to support himself and occasionally think of others then life would be peaceful. He is full of loving acceptance and does not wish to force any issues with him. Perhaps I’m the problem here..

I do not think you are the problem at all. No, no, no.
What will your son do when you and hubs are gone? That is my take on my two. I am 59. Perhaps I am selfish wanting to have peace and joy for whatever time I have left on this earth. I won’t deny that is a huge part of my not allowing them to live in my home. The other side of that is everything you are dealing with, the selfishness, laziness and entitlement.
Addiction. Ugh.
Okay, so I get it that your son has mental challenges, but how clever he is to say that when you make him leave he just figures what the heck and goes back to using. He is holding you hostage to his choice. Much like my two who defiantly told me they “were the way they were because of me”. Huh. I fell victim to that for a while, reeling those tapes and finding times I wished I had done better.
Addicts are smart, they know just how to keep their loved ones second guessing themselves.

My husband is not the sharing type. He feels our business is not to be put out there. Because I have always done “life” ( bills, taxes, finances, family business, childcare, etc) none of this stuff impacts him.

This is not fair to you. All of it. It was pretty much my lot with hubs. Except the bills part. Oh, and he complained constantly in the early years about my cooking so I said fine then, you cook.
Are you able to talk with him? Hubs was so not communicative. It was hard Patty.
We went to counseling way back and the counselor said to me “ You are an extrovert, he is an introvert, that will never change.” Boy, was she right. He was a hard working man and that was how he showed his love for his family. Everything else was pretty much on his terms. Passive/aggressive. You describe your hubs as passive, but there is the other side to that and that is an unwillingness to compromise. To see your side and come to an understanding, a plan. Something.
Passive people are not so passive in their stubbornness. Especially when their mate is suffering.
In my case, I couldn’t continue as is. It was unbearable. I felt the same as you, that my daughters came home and pretty much ruled the roost with their unacceptable behaviors. It drove me crazy. It just made hubs retreat even more. It was hard to feel alone in taking the reins.
It just made the triangulation worse.
Well. So be it. I am the biotch who said no, enough.
Sorry for my venting and if I am off base, please correct me. I see a lot of similarities in our stories.
I feel for you girl, you have so much going on. Raising a seven year old in the midst of all of this. Wow.
We had our three grands for a time or two, or more. They are with their paternal grandparents now. Both mother and father off the rails. It is tough on the kids, but they at least have more stability.
Bless you for all you are enduring. Please be kind to yourself. You are on a difficult journey. There are no easy answers, but there are ways to take some precious moments to find some peace. It is the small things that helped me, and still do. Prayer, walks, art, writing.
I hope you are able to find time to focus on you.
(((Hugs)))
Leafy

 

[RN0441]

Patty

Welcome. Just caught up with your story. I am SO glad you found us and I do think that HE directed you here. I came here when our son was 15 and going off the rails after being a wonderful child. He was diagnosed with Conduct Disorder at the time but now looking back I realize it was drug use and drug brain and all the dysfunctional thinking that goes along with that.

When he was a minor we put him in rehabs many times. Both outpatient and inpatient. We did everything in our power to "help" him but nothing helped. I had many say that he was not responding to treatment. Ugh. What does that even mean? I knew it wasn't good. I just wanted to shake him. He was making me a screaming, crazy lunatic. Husband and I were not on the same page. It took years for us to get on the same page but I KNEW that I would rather be dead than live the way we were living. That is an awful feeling.

You have gotten great advice here so I cannot add to it except to be good to yourself. Have some self compassion. You are a good and loving woman and I think that you are doing the very best that you can. I hope that your therapist can help you. If she isn't then find another one. They are all different. I don't think focusing on leaving your marriage is something you should spend time on in therapy if that is not what you want to do. Most likely you could be content if your son were not living in your home, or at least that is what I think I am hearing.

Our son is in a long term faith based program that is mentioned above. He has taken a huge turn for the better and is actually going on a mission to Montana in June to an Indian reservation. He is terrified to speak in front of everyone there and tell his story but he is facing his fears. He is growing and changing. I feel hopeful for the first time in many years. We had gotten to a place in his addiction that I KNEW the only thing that would help him is to put him in God's hands and that is what I have done. I have become much more spiritual during this process with him and I am working on myself too while he is there.

Keep posting and reading. You will gain strength and insight here and you will get to where you need to be. I honestly can say that if not for this site I don't know where I'd be right now. I had to change my thinking too and I did not realize it until I came here and read the testimonies of those that have come before me.

Hugs.

 

[recoveringenabler]

People don’t like it when their enabler gets healthy and starts setting boundaries.

That is so true. After decades of taking care of others at our expense, the "others' will usually do whatever they can to sabotage our success. Don't give up what you want or what is important to you because others don't agree with you. Trust yourself to know the truth. As I emerged from the FOG (fear, obligation, guilt) from my own codependency issues, it opened the door for many changes, some of which were challenging because I had to let go of people, thought forms, beliefs, judgements and my own propensity for abandoning myself for what others needed/wanted....change was difficult, but it was necessary. Fear of what I would have to let go of kept me stuck for awhile.

Eckert Tole (sp?) believes things happen when the time is ripe. Until then we are to remain pretty detached from the drama our egos create (absolutely paraphrased from my memory of his work).

The Tolle quote that I took to heart was this: "Wherever you are, be there totally. If you find your here and now intolerable and it makes you unhappy, you have three options: remove yourself from the situation, change it or accept it totally. If you want to take responsibility for your life, you must choose one of these options, and you must choose now. Then accept the consequences."

When I addressed my issues from that point of view, it was easier to see that accepting it was not going to work, I was deeply enmeshed with my daughter's life and it was draining me of my own life force and forcing me to continue to abandon myself for my daughter's welfare. I chose to remove myself from the situation as much as I could by setting strong boundaries and letting go of enabling by changing myself and the way I responded. I committed to change. First I looked within to determine what was inside me that was stopping me from making the changes necessary. What was stopping me was fear. I had to address my fears.

I addressed those fears in a therapy run group setting with other parents of troubled adult kids. As I did, I found out how much those fears robbed me of the ability to make healthy choices for myself and had kept me stuck. Feeling stuck felt awful so I was willing to do whatever it took to get unstuck.

As I looked deeply into my own fears and expressed them, I came to grips with different options which I could not see before. I developed the strength to make hard choices. The hardest choices were around allowing my daughter to suffer the consequences of her choices and not stepping in to save her. However, in doing that, it liberated me and I believe it liberated her as well. She still struggles in life, but she is doing it on her terms in her way. She is the master of her ship. Not me.

Okay, so I get it that your son has mental challenges, but how clever he is to say that when you make him leave he just figures what the heck and goes back to using. He is holding you hostage to his choice.

Addicts are smart, they know just how to keep their loved ones second guessing themselves.

Your son is feeding your fear for him so that you continue caring for him.

If I would just quit expecting our son to support himself and occasionally think of others then life would be peaceful. He is full of loving acceptance and does not wish to force any issues with him. Perhaps I’m the problem here....

No you are not the problem here, you are enmeshed in a dysfunctional, broken family system where the addicts or other enablers are determined to continue status quo and will up the ante if you start to change. You matter. What you want matters. Your truth matters. Your well being matters. YOU matter. What you desire is healthy. You have every right to the feelings you have. Your feelings matter.

Find out what it is you want, what it is you don't want, what it is you are willing to do and what you are not willing to do. And, what you are willing to do without resentment.

You deserve the life you want. Take it.

 

[New Leaf]

Just what I needed to read today, thank you Recovering.

Find out what it is you want, what it is you don't want, what it is you are willing to do and what you are not willing to do. And, what you are willing to do without resentment.

This takes effort on our part. It involves shedding old ways and figuring out how to focus on ourselves. If you are like me, you are the one to be a helper, to over extend yourself to others. Putting energy into self care seems foreign and selfish.
It’s not.
It’s what we want our wayward adult loved ones to do, learn how to be self nurturing and sustaining in healthy ways.
I believe that my journey here on CD has been cathartic and healing, as I write to others, I am reminding myself of what I need to keep working on. Change doesn’t come without goals, without believing we are worth it. I think that we have learned to push our needs to the back burner, while dealing with the issues we are faced with. That’s unhealthy. There is no way we can begin to truly live well, make good, sound decisions and set healthy boundaries if we are neglecting ourselves.

You deserve the life you want. Take it.

You do, we all do.
I do believe our standing up for ourselves helps our loved ones see that they can do the same.
(((Hugs)))
Leafy

 

[Copabanana]

I am reading with interest this thread and want to comment upon one thing, of so much that is profound and real.

Patty, this is to you. While I understand your therapist empathizes with you in your marriage, and it was from that place that she spoke that she does not understand why you stay....I want to speak for an understanding of relationship that is different than hers.

We seek each of this in our life to sing our own unique song, and to share it and be heard by others. From this understanding we seek not to change the other but to hear him, and to give voice and be heard.

Your husband from everything you write sounds like a tender, loving, responsible and constant man. Most of all, you have heart for him. You hear his song. As he does for you, it seems. It is this to which new leaf speaks about her own marriage.

There is a lot of wisdom in this thread.

It is a terrible ache to have an Ill child. It eats us up. Sometimes we cannibalize ourselves and our mates to rid ourselves of the torment. It does not help. We just end up missing parts.

 

[PattyK]

Recoveringenabler, Leafy, RNO - I can’t begin to express the feelings I have in reading your words to me. I believe it is absolutely true when I say I have never felt so embraced and (yes loved) and understood in all my life. I am drinking in your words as if they are living water. There is so much I want to say and respond to, so much deep gratitude I feel for you to have taken your time to share your thoughts and stories with me. It is so clear you have all been through such a dark places and have become beautiful because of it. For so many years all I’ve receicved are pat answers from people who have never lived through what I have. Their words were shaming or dismissive or miss the mark altogether. But here I have found other mothers who have grieved like I have over losing a child to insane behaviors that we can’t explain or change though we would give our lives to help (and in fact have). There is no shame here but only empathy and grace and many wise words.

RNO I thank God for your son’s transformation and the new hope and joy that is so apparent in your words. Staying the course has brought its rewards!!! Please keep posting about his experiences. When I hear stories like this it gives me hope too.
I have given my son to God (and taken him back) more times than I can count. But I absolutely know that God created him, knows what he needs and is able to work in him in ways i never can. So my hope is still in Him. I just want to cooperate and not hinder the process.

Leafy, it’s like we have existed in a parallel universe. Our stories are so much alike. It is a rare thing for two people to stay married for so long. There are plenty of reasons to part ways over a lifetime. Maybe we just knew that our men were/are truly good inside and thats something worth holding on to. So we looked deeper than just the superficial temporary problems we encountered along the way, including loneliness and a lack of understanding the needs of our female hearts, because there are worse things and God knows he put up with me. My husband has in so many ways abandoned me, but we met when I was 15. We have grown up (or not!) together. We have buried a son. We have found our salvation through deep grief in our common faith. I have endured his addictions and the way he withdraws from the family. He has supported my journey through the arts and given me the kind of personal freedom and respect i doubt any other man would have done. Our lives together have truly been for better or for worse. There have been times, if I had had the ability, I would have run away. But I couldn’t so we fumbled through all the tough times. Though I feel abandoned in this issue with our son, and in many ways I feel very lonely in this time of our journey, he is mine and I am his. Its too late to change course now, nor do I want to. Its hard to explain our commitment to a marriage that was difficult in so many ways. But I think we shared a knowledge that we were blessed in ways we didn’t even understand.

My pain with our lack of harmony in this issue comes from my fear that we are doing so much harm to our son because of our inability to take any kind of meaningful action. But in my saner moments I know that life is full of misteps and bad decisions. As it has been pointed out here, that is part of the human condition. My son can survive and thrive in spite of his parent’s dysfunction if he wants to make the right decisions. But I can’t use that knowledge as a cop out for ignoring my own responsibility to act sanely.

Recovering, you said so many deeply meaningful things. Wow. Just so much priceless insight. The quote from Tolle is a life changer if it is taken to heart the way you did. I guess even those of us who are sober and making sacrifices for our children find ourselves hitting bottom too, and are forced to rethink the way we choose to function. If we are wise we will examine the things about ourselves that keep us from joy. Seeing it from that perspective we aren’t that different from our troubled children, are we? Its just that our self hurt has a more ellusive root. We have things inside us that compel us to destructively pour ourselves out for our children. Is that less insane than our children? Probably not. Im so proud for you that you had the determination to work through and identify what you wanted, didn’t want, could live with or without. Thank you for encouraging me to do the same. I wish I knew how to use the quote function here because I want to tell you how important so much of what you said was to me. The paragraph about being so enmeshed with your daughter’s life and being drained of your life force and how you worked through that...and when you talked about coming to grips with your fears and how that opened up so many unseen options...and when you addressed my worry that I am the problem, telling me with such a life giving way that my truth matters, that I matter. All of that is so comforting.

There was so much said here today-enough that could feed my heart for a lifetime I think. So much was said that sent hope and inspiration and possibility straight into my heart that I haven’t even addressed. Please know, Recovering, Leafy and RNO that your willingness to share these many incredible insights is a wonderful gift. I have so much to think about and process. I feel I've met my best friends. I hope that, in time, I will be able to speak hope and sanity to someone else who is desperate for a place to be understood. So for now- goodnight. Tomorrow i am going to figure out how to use those wonderful text tools so I can respond more directly!! God bless you guys. Hugs and more hugs

 

[PattyK]

Copabanana i just read your comments from a fee minutes ago. So beautifully said.

We seek each of this in our life to sing our own song, and to share it and be heard by others. From this understanding we seek not to change the other but to hear him, and to give voice and be heard.

I believe what you say, though the way you have said it is so very profound. And it makes me see the deep need we have to hear each other and to be heard. Lived that way a relationship would make us soar to the heavens rather than crash us to the earth the way we so often do. And yes, in our pain we do cannabalize ourselves and each other. Like an animal caught in a trap will chew its own limb off to be free, we become desperate to be relieved of the pain. If only we can take the time to breathe and find the inner healing we need before we run amuck swinging our clubs in order to get everyone in line. What messes we are. But there is still hope when there are those who will lovingly share what they have learned the way you all do.