Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Wiped Out, Mar 16, 2008.

  1. Wiped Out

    Wiped Out Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Sorry I haven't been around much. I've been reading but feeling too down and too exhausted to respond.

    This whole hospital stay has us thrown for a loop. I posted that we were going to bring difficult child home Wednesday afternoon for school and then he would spend the night and probably end up staying since the psychiatrist at the psychiatric hospital seemed to thing he was ready (that and the insurance company). We didn't feel he was ready based on some of the visits we had with difficult child and the fact that they really did little changing in the medications. They added a .05 Clonidine at his 4:00 time and that was basically it (they did move around the timing of some of his other medications but not the amounts).

    We bring him home and Wed. evening while not horrible wasn't stellar and he did get physical at one point when asked to take his evening medications. husband called the next day and the psychiatrist said try another 24 hours because she felt it was just because difficult child didn't want to leave the hospital.

    Thursday night he was verbally aggressive and almost got physical at one point. Friday at school he started posturing with the boy he had punched before (although this time unprovoked) and then was kicking the boy's sleeping bag (must have been a read in day) with the boy in it but not the boy himself.

    To husband's credit he kept trying to get in touch with the doctor on Friday to say he didn't feel difficult child was ready to be home. He never did get to talk to her but finally asked to speak to someone who could tell him what we should do. They said they were expecting us to bring him back in. Would have been nice to tell us that.

    We took him back in late Friday afternoon. By this time, of course, he didn't want to go back which made it harder on us. Once he was there he was fine.

    Finally tonight, the doctor on call (who was difficult child's psychiatrist the last two times he was in the psychiatric hospital) called and had some ideas of some things to try.

    So tomorrow (two weeks and a day after he was first admitted) they are going to try a new medication. It is one that is used for high blood pressure and something else with the heart. They will need to do an EKG (I think that's the test). They will be stopping the Clonidine.

    The name of the medication is Verapamil (I think that is how it is spelled). It is supposed to help with his moods-although not a mood stabilizer.

    Anyways this whole thing has been very frustrating. husband and I are both feeling like they didn't do much for a whole long time. We know they don't see his anger there, they didn't the other two times either but really worked hard to get a medication combo that worked.

    I know it's not all about the medications and I'm actually very nervous about trying this.

    Sorry this is long and that I haven't been responding to many posts lately. Thanks for listening.
  2. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    I am so sorry it has been this frustrating. I know how hard the psychiatric hospital stays can be on the whole family. ESP when they want to send him home and you KNOW it is not a good idea.

    Verapimil is a calcium channel blocker. I know because it is used to help prevent migraines sometimes. I am not sure what psychiatric effects it is supposed to have.

    Has you son shown his "true colors" at the psychiatric hospital, or is that limited to to times when he is alone with you all or when he is with peers? IF he has not shown the extent of his behaviors, maybe what I did will help you. I warn you that this is HARD, it may make you as physically ill as it did me. But it DID result in my son being held in the psychiatric hospital until he actually got some help.

    Here is what I did:

    I went into a therapy session, having warned the therapist first, and pressed EVERY button my difficult child had, until he showed what he REALLY was like. I did NOTHING violent, just didn't let him waffle on anything. Made him face me with the attacks on his sister, with the violence to me. I didn't let him get away with "I don't know" as an answer. Ther result was UGLY, in the extreme. But so was his behavior at home - at the psychiatric hospital he was an angel. I learned all sorts of things I hadn't known, and found the abuse to his sister was FAR more extreme than I had any idea of.

    This isn't for everyone. It is HARD on everyone involved. My husband was totally not on board, but difficult child never beat HIM up. And husband NEVER admitted difficult child's problems were as bad as they were. He just wanted to hide them. But it couldn't happen if my difficult child (and hte rest of us) were to have futures.

    It may be something to think about, esp if your son is cooperating at the psychiatric hospital.

  3. Wiped Out

    Wiped Out Well-Known Member Staff Member

    He hasn't really shown his true colors at the hospital. In the past we always felt believed but this time even though they say they do we're not so sure. Fortunately I know difficult child's psychiatrist and therapist out of the hospital know what he can be like. The psychiatrist has seen him in action (though not the worst).

    I think it's good you were able to make them see what your difficult child was like. It is something for us to consider.

    The new medication is supposed to help with his moods. I forgot to put that in the original post.
  4. Fran

    Fran Former desparate mom

    I would, very specifically ask, what other options besides medication change are available or that they have seen work on other children similar to your difficult child?
    I would,very specifically, ask what sort of behavior modification plan would be effective for a child who is exhibiting the level of violence that your son has shown?

    I would ask,very specifically, what options are open to parents who have a child who is functioning within the school system and at home as yours does?

    I would ask, very specifically, what the professional staff feels the natural progression of your difficult child behavior to be?

    Ask if there is anything that you, as parents, can do that you already aren't?

    Then ask what their recommendations would be?
    As a side note, I usually ask "is that what you would recommend if it was your nephew?"
  5. Fran

    Fran Former desparate mom

    I'm assuming you have volumes of school reports of behavior in addition to the reports of behavior at home.
    Video tape one of his episodes if you can.
  6. tiredmommy

    tiredmommy Well-Known Member

    I agree that you need to press for specifics. I'm sorry you are so frustrated and discouraged.
  7. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    Sharon, I'm so sorry it's been so rough for all of you. I hope the psychiatric hospital now understands what it needs to do to make things better for difficult child.

    In these times of managed care, it is often the insurance companies and not the hospitals who are dictating how long patients are allowed to stay. Sometimes the only way the hospital can prove "need" is if the patient is discharged and then needs to be readmitted. I'm guessing that's the bind your family got caught in.

    Sending many supportive hugs your way.
  8. Big Bad Kitty

    Big Bad Kitty lolcat

    Sending hugs. So sorry for your frustration.
  9. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    You're kidding, right? I know you wish you were... Smallworld may have hit upon the right reason there.

    I agree with the others - document and ask for specifics.
  10. Hound dog

    Hound dog Nana's are Beautiful

    Sending many ((((hugs)))). The others gave great advice.
  11. timer lady

    timer lady Queen of Hearts


    Fran & the others are right. You need to ask for specifics.

    You need interventions for difficult child & his continued level of violence. It's no longer an option for him to keep going at this rate. You & husband are most likely on your last nerve.

    As you love your son - you cannot tolerate his behaviors. So the need for specifics. A well written treatment plan. Who will step up to the plate & be willing to not only write this plan (not bandaids) but help implement it & make sure it's being followed. (I don't know if you've contacted county mental health; I'm assuming you have. Our mental health CM is in charge & makes sure everyone is on the same page & the treatment plan is followed. He does an exceptional job - has even met us at the hospital ER a few times to speed up admissions.)

    Shine up that :warrior: armor!
  12. Wiped Out

    Wiped Out Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Thanks everyone! I do appreciate all of the advice and support. On Wednesday husband and I will be meeting with this agency that provides support to families (they have relaxed their access in that families no longer need to have CPS involvement). They will meet with us and decide if they will send difficult child's case to this review board. If they do difficult child's therapist and my therapist will go to argue that difficult child needs these services. It will involve wraparound services and I think more respite.

    We went to see difficult child tonight. It was his first day on the new medication and off the Clonidine. I have not seen him this HYPER in a long, long time. I do have to say he was in a very good mood. I'm guessing that this medication won't last if he continues to be this hyper. He would be way too impulsive and it wouldn't be safe. I know I need to give it more time but you should have seen him! The staff at the hospital also noticed the change.
  13. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    Sharon, I hope the psychiatric hospital didn't discontinue the Clonidine suddenly. Without gradual weaning, Clonidine withdrawal can cause a spike in blood pressure.

    Maybe the Clonidine was doing more than you thought in the hyper department. Or maybe the new medication just hasn't kicked in yet.

  14. Wiped Out

    Wiped Out Well-Known Member Staff Member

    SW-They did discontinue it suddenly because he couldn't be on both medications. The doctor mentioned yesterday and said they would be monitoring it closely. I think the Clonidine must have been doing more in the hyper department than we thought. I'm not sure this one is supposed to help in that area as much as it is with his angery moods.
  15. jannie

    jannie trying to survive....

    Well Sharon--
    It sounds like like now things are moving a bit more in the positive direction. Is he going to school this week or is he staying in the hospital full time? Fingers crossed that things work out for wrap around and/or respite services. Your family definately needs these supports.
  16. Wiped Out

    Wiped Out Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Thanks Jannie! He is staying in the hospital full time this week. We are on spring break so it has been unusually quiet around here. I feel a tad guilty saying it has been so peaceful.
  17. Steely

    Steely Active Member

    Sending many hugs..........I wish I had more advice.
    Hang in there.
  18. flutterbee

    flutterbee Guest

    Sending hugs.
  19. mrscatinthehat

    mrscatinthehat Seussical

    Violence is so scary. Sending many hugs and positive thoughts they this new medication will help and that you will get the services to help difficult child.

  20. SearchingForRainbows

    SearchingForRainbows Active Member


    I haven't been around much lately. I'm so sorry things have been so rough for you!!! I think the others have given you great advice. I just want to let you know I'm thinking of you and hoping that the meeting on Wednesday goes well!!!

    Try to get as much rest as possible while difficult child is in the psychiatric hospital. Hugs, WFEN