HE called today!

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by change, Jun 9, 2008.

  1. change

    change New Member

    Shockingly, my son who assaulted my daughter last winter called early this afternoon. All he said was "Hello, (stated his name) they told me to call because we need some of my papers." It didn't make sense because he has a caseworker who has all of his records and legal papers and more. I made them available right away and have already given them to the agency several times. (Of course, he's on caseworker #3 or something like that so who knows.) I said "You're not supposed to call here" not expecting him to hand the phone to someone else and he said hold-on, I heard an older boys' voice, and a bunch of commotion, and then for about 30 seconds just shuffling around of the phone then they hung up. I was stunned. I felt bad for my reaction the rest of the afernoon and got a headache but also sick to my stomach. My daughter is home all day with me for summer and I could have easily told her to "get the phone". Who knows what he might have said to her had she picked up or how she might be set-back if she had spoken to him or heard his voice. She said once about 2 months ago in therapy that she wanted to see him to cuss him out for what he did to her but I don't know if she truly means it. She also has nightmares about him and is afraid of him. He very violently tried to sexually assault her and physically assaulted her on other occassions and told her he'd kill her if she told. She is 12. Right now, in Residential Treatment Center (RTC), he is refusing to participate in treatment and continues to act out sexually. They already tried him for his assault on her and since it was her word against his, he did not get TYC because he would have been in the general population and not in the sexual offenders' program. Now he's already preyed on other children and still they're not putting him in TYC!!! I'm sickened. Maybe it's because these other children are in Residential Treatment Center (RTC) as well, but they could still be inocent as far as sexual stuff. Even if they're not...NO ONE AT ALL should be subjected to a sexual predator no matter what age the predator. It's something a person never gets over. I'm so angry they had him call (if that's true) knowing that we want no contact with him for the security of our daughter and for our daughter's emotional state. They really must be crazy. I know I must sound cold towards him but to give you an idea let me give you an analogy: I don't know if any of you have ever seen the fictional movie "The Good Son" but this is somewhat the kind of child that has been living in my home only we weren't blinded the last few years like the parents in that movie.

    :dissapointed:I loved these children sooooo much but I can't help him and we are doing everything we can to help her salvage her life after what he's done to her. I would trade lots of my strengths with her demons if I could. I really would. I've had a pretty good life, relatively. Hers is just beginning and it's been so horrible so far. :sad-very:
  2. Andy

    Andy Active Member

    Have you called the facility to report that call? You need to make sure that it is documented and ask what they will be doing to prevent it. I am sure he was not told to call you. If he is to have no contact, make sure they put that in BIG RED LETTERS on his chart : NOT ALLOWED TO CALL HOME. He somehow got access to a phone - the scuffle could have been staff removing him?

    I would also contact the case worker to have documented in that record and ask him/her what will be done to avoid this.

    Include the time and date of the call in your report. You can also write up a report to be placed in his facility and case worker's files.
  3. change

    change New Member

    Thank you Adrianne. I love this forum. I can always count on you SMART people for solutions. Those are good ones. At least this is one problem that I can probably start putting an end to for now. He's called before, I think. I had a message on our answering machine like that about a month ago but there was no message...just a bunch of commotion. He used to call my husband's cell phone the first month he was removed from our home but we bet he forgot that number. We're glad. All he did was cause emotional grief. He lied to my husband about how things were going and then we would find out horrible things from the caseworker about what was really going on. He never once would admit what he did to our daughter and didn't ask about her or me either. :(
  4. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    I'm with Adrianne on this one - the call should be documented. He shouldn't have been told to call you (I suspect he wasn't; or if he was, he probably manipulated the request along the lines of, "Do you think I should call and ask for the papers?"). His file should also be clearly marked with "Not permitted to call" as Adrianne suggested, and maybe even go further - get it put in place solidly, legally, with a court order.

    As you said - what if your daughter had answered the phone? I bet that was what he was hoping for.

    Another good reason for using this to the hilt - it could finally force them to see that he is totally recalcitrant, unrepentant and untreated and DO something about him and for him at last.

  5. slsh

    slsh member since 1999

    Thank goodness your daughter didn't answer the phone.

    Adrianne gave you perfect advice.

    You don't sound cold at all. You sound like you have a realistic take on what your son is capable of.

    I'm so sorry you're going thru this - it's just heartbreaking.
  6. meowbunny

    meowbunny New Member

    You've already gotten some good advice on how to deal with this situation, so I'm going to go a different direction. Please understand I am not trying to criticize with some of the things I am asking and saying. I understand your plight better than most (barring MWM and Timer Lady).

    I had the opportunity to adopt my daughter's brother as well. I absolutely refused. There is no way those two children could be together. He had Fetal Alcohol Syndrome (FAS). He was also a sexual predator. They had been in two foster homes together -- in both homes he tried to rape her and he was only 5 and 6 at the time. Even so, we kept light contact with him, seeing him about twice a year. My daughter blocked the bad incidents with her brother and I decided it was important to her well being to see that he was okay even if they couldn't be together. I felt bad for him but my priority was my daughter and what was best for her. Living with him was not good for her, nor was it good for him. So, I can understand your anger, pain, frustration.

    Are you having any contact with him? Is there any chance he is calling just to hear a voice that loved him? I do wonder if he is feeling the pain of rejection when you refuse to talk to him and tell him he can't call. Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) kids can feel -- they're just very good at hiding it. I hope this is being addressed at his Residential Treatment Center (RTC) (both the Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD) and his feelings when you don't talk to him).

    Don't get me wrong, I so understand your anger. I'm not trying to make you feel bad and I think you're doing the right thing for your daughter. However, he is still a hurt child. Whether he can ever be even remotely fixed is questionable but I'm one of those who can't give up.

    I'm sorry he is not really changing. I'm wondering if this Residential Treatment Center (RTC) is the right fit for him. There are few that will even accept a child who sexually assaults another, let alone does it on a continual basis. I'm not even sure what the treatment plan would be in a case like that. Whatever it is, it doesn't seem to be working here. You may have to do more research and see if you can find a place that is more proactive (if one even exists).

    I hate how ill-prepared adoption agencies and services leave us parents. They give us no clue what can happen and then try to force us to fix the problem with little to no help. There is no training for a truly hurt child before placement occurs. There is no warning what can happen and no suggestions what you can do to help your beloved children. There is, of course, blame, accusations and if you dare to mention disruption threats of prison for child abandonment.

    I had to beg and threaten to even get the names of therapists, etc. that could help my daughter. It took three years of battles just to get a real history of what all happened to her pre-adoption and I'm know I didn't get all the facts. I was lucky that I had some idea of what I was getting into. I was reading anything I could find before she even moved into my home. But reading didn't prepare me for some of her behaviors and they certainly didn't prepare me for her early teens. I don't think anything could have prepared me for that.

    Sorry for the vent but there is a point. You've been through hell and back. You have a long and hard battle in store for you for your daughter. For your son, it may be time to either totally disrupt the adoption and let the state do as they will with him or you may have to start having more contact with him (obviously not your daughter but you and your husband). You also need some therapy for you to help you understand what happened, that you did do the best you could, to help you let go of some of your anger, to help you be able to forgive him and find whatever good is in him.

    I'm sorry. I wish there were some easy answers. Oh, I wish so many things for our children. They don't deserve the beginning they got. We don't deserve to have to deal with this hurt, especially when we're so ill-prepared to do so.
  7. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    That is totally TOTALLY irresponsible on the RTCs part. Jeez. We adopted a child at age 11. He sexually acted out on my two younger kids the entire three years he was with us, and threatened to kill them and "burn the house down cuz I don't care if I die" if they said anything. So they didn't. And we didn't know. After we found out, he was gone THAT DAY and we said we never wanted anything to do with him again. Sexual predators do not get cured (or so his caseworker told us). They can go into treatment, but they need to be watched their entire lives. Most can not even explain why they do it. Our son does not remember being abused himself, but he obviously was. We found out he was acting out on other children for as far back as he can remember, and nobody knew--he was GOOD at acting like a nice, normal kid. He even fooled his psychiatrists who said he was "well balanced" (at least in the adoption report before we decided to adopt him. Hahahaha).
    At any rate, document it. And make sure it never happens again. And even if nobody else understands, I understand why you don't ever want to see him again. We moved and changed our phone number so that this child (now eighteen and on the prowl, I suppose) can't find us and our other kids, who are terrified of him. (((Hugs)))
  8. Christy

    Christy New Member

    You did the right thing. You have to protect your daughter and in this circumastance it requires you to distance yourself from you son. Adrianne is right, it should be BOLDLY noted in his file and enforced by the Residential Treatment Center (RTC).

    I do see Meow's point about your son feeling rejected and isolated but I'm not sure what you or anyone can do to help him. Do you have any contact with him?

    I am sorry you are in this situation; it's truly heartbreaking. My thoughts and prayers are with you.
  9. change

    change New Member

    Actually we ARE in the process of trying to relinquish rights. CPS is behind us fully on that for the protection of our daughter. Even though he has a court appointed attorney, he's fighting very hard for him and the judge has also been reluctanct to grant us this request. It's been hard. I'm not supposed to be talking about the case but has been totally anonymous for me here so I feel ok about it. I DO feel very guilty about not speaking to him or reaching out to him even though I'm also very angry with him for what he's done not only to our daughter but to other children as well. He's hurt her the most by far though. She was once such a leader at school and seemed to have such a bright future and now she's such a broken person and will take years to heal if ever. :(

    Ya'll are right too. I myself am probably suffering from PTSD from it all. He traumatized me so much over the past several years simply from the shock of the things he did that I'm afraid to have a birth child and I'm still young enough. I don't think I'd know how to parent a normal child. (I feel tremendous guilt over that too because my husband so wants it.) It's just one guilt package over another for me daily.
  10. JJJ

    JJJ Active Member


    I'm sorry for what you are going through. The judge doesn't understand. Most people don't understand that a child can be that dangerous.

    Kanga is also not allowed to speak with her sibs on the phone unless it is on speakerphone and monitored by husband or myself. We have cut her off because she has started to get inappropriate.

    I can imagine your terror of your daughter possibly answering the phone. Can you change your house number and no give it to the Residential Treatment Center (RTC)? Or, at least, like MWM did, as soon as the adoption is dissolved - change your phone number then???
  11. Christy

    Christy New Member

    Would caller ID help? Just in case Residential Treatment Center (RTC) does not monitor him the way they should, you could see who is calling and let the machine field any calls from the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) or unknown callers.
  12. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Do not feel guilty about not talking to him. Likely he has been abusing children well before you found out. We all adopt to try to help--if we adopt older/special needs kids. And, like me, maybe you felt love would be enough. And, like me, you found out it's not. Sadly, some kids are beyond saving--they are too damaged--that can happen as early as seven years old. If you do decide to have other children, you don't want an infant or toddler exposed to the danger that is this child. Child predators have a very bleak long term outcome. You can't save the world...you tried to save this boy but, for reasons that have nothing to do with you or your hub, he was already broken and may never be fixed. Please don't feel you have to talk to him. That will only give him hope that maybe he can come home and since predators are good at manipulation he may even claim remorse, cry, and get you to take him back. in my opinion it's not worth the risk. Plus he could be dangerous on other levels...you just don't know. Our child killed our dog and set little fires in the house in front of our two kids. After he left, they showed us the little patches of frayed carpet where he'd set fire to show them that he indeed would "burn the house down." He used a weapon on my kids to make them do things they didn't want (a knife that he'd stolen from the store). He was seen by adults as such a good kid that it's scary.

    Don't regret your decision.
  13. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    I only scanned the other responses, so I know that the others told you to report the call on all fronts. I wonder if you are able to get "call blocker" on your phone. You would probably have to block several numbers from the facility since there is always more than one line in a business. He will get the idea if he calls and there is a recording that "This person does not accept calls from your number."
  14. I am so sorry you had to go through this. I agree with everyone else, I would report it to the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) as well as his caseworker. I can't imagine they gave authorization for him to call. I would just make sure that it is reported and noted that he is not allowed to call.

    The state Residential Treatment Center (RTC) here has a unit for teens 12-18 for sexual offenders. I was glad to know this when my son was there, I was concerned for him to be in the same unit as offenders. That's all he needs to add to his problems.

    Your daughter is lucky that she has such wonderful parents that are doing everything they can to help her through this awful experience.

  15. LittleDudesMom

    LittleDudesMom Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I'm a day late on my reply, but I hope you have called both the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) and his caseworker. This is totally unacceptable!

    I am shocked that your son has been allowed the opportunity to abuse other children. How did you find out about those incidents? Does anyone really care for the other kids in there? As a parent of one of those other children, I would sue their pants off if I found out a known predator had been allowed access, alone, to my child!!!!!!!

    I suggest caller id. Your daughter should be instructed to only answer the phone if she recognizes the name as a friend or family member.

    Sorry that this call has brought the pain back out front.

  16. change

    change New Member

    Again, thank you for your LOGICAL and SMART solutions. Sometimes I'm in so much disbelief and initial shock that it takes me days to problem-solve things related to my kids. I've added caller-id to the phone. (We had the basic package because like most people barely use our land-line.) My daughter already pretty much knows not to answer the phone but I will have to reiterate to her not to do so unless she recognizes a number or unless told to do so from a specific phone number. I was told by the phone company we could block numbers out ourselves so I am going to block the one that I know of immediately. I do know they are looking for a new Residential Treatment Center (RTC) placement for him and they are supposed to notify us everytime they move him.
    In answer to your question LITTLEDUDESMOM, we found out about all he'd done recently when we went to court in May and heard from his caseworker in front of the judge and then recieved a written report from CPS on him after that. The single only positive (if you can call it that) is that our atty says from a legal standpoint it helps our case that he is still at it. Even so, I was hoping that I was going to hear good news. I don't know why I was so let down. In all the years he lived with us (since age 5) he was showing sociopathic signs. It was scary. They got worse and worse each year. The sexual misconduct began at age 9 (as far as we know).
    I'm about to report him to the Residential Treatment Center (RTC) facility next. I'm really stressed about it. I've already left a message for his caseworker. She hasn't returned my call yet.
  17. mama2lexxie

    mama2lexxie New Member

    I am so sorry. It seems as though the others have given good, sound advise so I am sending a big, soft hug.
  18. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    How totally sad and unfair. :(
  19. change

    change New Member

    I called the Residential Treatment Center (RTC). **Sigh!** The person in charge was nice. (You never know.) Seemed to know exactly why he was not supposed to have any contact and knew that he wasn't supposed to and said that he wasn't even supposed to use the phones and that the staff must have not been supervising him closely enough. She apologized and promised me that she would speak to the staff. I still feel bad for my son because just maybe he is missing us and was reaching out but I can't be sure. He had pretty much stopped being loving towards me since around age 10 so I don't know. He's very, VERY manipulative and both my husband and I (especially my husband) would fall for his pitiful act over and over again and think he was going to change and he would be doing really bad things behind our backs, especially to his sister. It was the typical thing of wherever he was, trouble and chaos followed. :(

    Thank y'all again. If it weren't for you people, I would still be in such a bad place right now. I used to cry EVERY DAY when the incident occured all the way up until I found this group. For me, this really has been a cathartic thing...to be able to talk to y'all and get advice and connect with people who really do get what I'm going through and have been through. I hope I can be there for you like you are helping me.:sunny:
  20. witzend

    witzend Well-Known Member

    If he really was reaching out, and he may have been as there is no reason that he wouldn't miss you, there are more appropriate ways to do so and this is something he should discuss with staff. That doesn't mean that it's safe or OK for him to be in contact, only that it's not something that he should be taking on as his own crusade.

    {{{{{{{{{Big hugs}}}}}}}}}}