Heartbroken and Frustrated *Updated**

Hound dog

Nana's are Beautiful
Steph

I have flashbacks of meetings like that. I think every meeting we ever went to with Travis went that way. :tissue:

A new IEP meeting is desperately needed. And new neuro psychiatric testing. She's older now, I would imagine it's going to pick up on issues far better than one done in kindergarden. And with her problems it sounds as if something has been missed.

Glad to hear she is at least doing well socially.

Don't even get me started on our sd.

I know this is killing your Mommy heart and you've got to be seething with frustration.

((((hugs))))
 

susiestar

Roll With It
Steph,

If S can type, an alphasmart is only $200 or they were when we looked at them 4 years ago. The alphasmart didn't help with organization when the teachers wouldn't let him into the bldg before school to go print his work off, we didn't have the right cord to hook it to our printer (and they wouldn't take work printed at home because of course, if it was printed at home that means mom or dad did the actual work), he could only print in one room that was locked and off limits all day, except for 15 mins before school.

Alphasmarts can be very helpful, if S can type. It sounds as though she learns better from pictures? Then alphasmart would be a waste of your energy, better spend the energy getting hte accomodations the teacher recommended.

If the teachers won't provide written copies of the notes, would they put the notes online? our teachers put all assignments on classnotes. we get them from the SD website. I could say I like them, if this teach would actually put anything on them.

I know this has to be hurting you.

Hugs,

Susie
 
Steph,

As you posted on my post, our girls are twins once again.

I haven't read the other's replies, so forgive me if I am repeating what already has been said. Yesterday was Aly's "conference" as well. There was a substitute! I have YET to meet her gen ed teacher! She spends most of her day with the resource teacher who I am in constant contact, so that is good.

The sub went through Aly's math and reading folders and I could tell she was trying to put on an encouraging face since Aly was with us and oh so proud of her math pages. She is doing K-1 work. She gets it, sort of, she doesn't get when addition and subtraction are mixed up on the same page. Has to be reminded each and every time. Reading is rough, but a little bit improved. Probably reading at the 1-2 grade level.

She loves being with the Gen Ed for Science and Art and PE and Social studies. Sub teacher said that Gen Ed teacher said she is "as involved as she possibly can be" whatever the heck that means!

Socially, she is crying every night, no friends except for my sisters kids and they are grades 3, 2 and K.

I cannot wait till our IEP, have been keeping a running log of all I see as MAJOR issues.

Sorry your mommy heart is hurting, I can relate. Giant cyber hugs to you!

Love ya,
Vickie
 

Marguerite

Active Member
There are practical things that can be done. But you will almost certainly have to nag to get what is needed and to fine-tune it until it's working.

We have some people on this board who are teachers and who often find what we say hard to accept as really being that bad - the trouble is, the teachers on this boards are the ones we wish were teaching our children. There ARE good teachers out there, but all it takes is a school with a slack attitude high up, and trying to get functional support becomes almost impossible.

I just found an old copy of a note I wrote for difficult child 1's old high school (when he was in mainstream). It expresses very similar frustrations to your own concerns, only for us it was at a much more senior level. difficult child 1's personal organisation was so bad that any set work, homework, assignments - were supposed to be written down on a sheet of paper and left for his aide in the school office. For a lot of his teachers, this was literally only steps away from their own offices, and yet it was clearly too difficult for them. I told them that if THEY couldn't do their homework, then difficult child 1 should not be penalised for the inability of both his parents and his aide to support him with his poor organisation skills. On top of that, difficult child 1 was told he could do his final matriculation part-time - he could drop this subject, or that, and pick it up the following year. The trouble was, NONE of the teachers talked to each other and so ALL his teachers were telling difficult child 1 to drop the subject they were teaching. The end result would have been difficult child 1 having dropped everything - which I think the school wanted.

We tried out best to help him get organised, but were badly let down by the school's inability to make the slightest concession. Finally a teacher was appointed to replace the aide, and to personally go round to every teacher difficult child 1 had, to get copies of all the notes and assignments he should have. And even though she worked in the place full-time, even SHE had trouble getting the material! And they were her colleagues!

And I still was getting no copies posted home; I had to continue making a 1 hour round trip just to CHECK to see if any new work had been put in his folder held at the school office. The quality of what WAS left there - it was virtually useless. One teacher had handwritten, "Do exercises in Ch 6 in the textbook, from 6.22 to 6.49." No date, no teacher name (just a scrawled line and dash as if s/he were a celebrity giving an autograph) and no subject name. difficult child 1 & I went through each subject textbook looking for exercise numbers which matched the numbers on this sheet.
I was making one of these drop-in visits to check the folder, when I saw difficult child 1 sitting head in hands outside the office - he had just been suspended. He had been sitting there for several hours and I had not been telephoned. He thought I had arrived in response to a phone call and was glad to see me (a suspended kid, glad to see his mother?). For me, it was a clear end result to ongoing, long-term lack of care and support. That was his last day in a mainstream setting. The VP was t he big problem here.

I wrote a letter addressed to the principal ("eyes only") and the VP opened it in front of me. In my letter I claimed that difficult child 1 had felt unsupported, he had felt at times harassed by one member of staff in particular (the VP, although I did not name her, I had suspected she would waylay my letter) and that the teacher/aide had done the best job she could, in the face of her colleagues' lack of support and apparent disinterest in exerting the slightest extra energy. First the VP leaned over the desk towering over difficult child 1 and shouted at him, "WHO's been harrassing you?" to which he eventually said in a tiny voice, "nobody," at which she glared triumphantly at me. difficult child 1 at this point was in a fetal position on the chair, almost on the floor. He was 17 years old, terrified of his VP who was clearly bullying him.
The darling VP then showed my letter to a number of people, especially the teacher aide, with the words, "Look what this ungrateful woman has written about you, after all the help you've given this boy." I was not present for that, but found out when the teacher/aide came up to me and said, "I'm very distressed and disappointed that you would write what you did about me, after all the work I've put in to trying to help your son. You knew just how hard I've been working, too."
I told her what I HAD written and how I had made a point of saying she had done an amazing job but had been undermined by her colleagues. I explained I had nothing but praise for her and the letter said so. I told her to go read it again, but without the VP telling her what to think and only showing her the negative stuff I'd written about others. She then told me exactly how she'd been told.
I did meet with her several times over the next few weeks, as she did a very thorough handover for difficult child 1 into his correspondence school. I gave her a thank you gift as well - she had again read the letter and now had no problems. Clearly that VP was poison on progress and morale at that school.

Some teachers are less interested in helping individual problem kids, and more interested in keeping the school ticking along smoothly and making them look good enough to keep climbing the promotions ladder. For these teachers, a difficult child rocks the boat. They would rather not put themselves out for a difficult student, they want things back to where they were before schools were forced to try to teach the unteachable. The VP had already said at an IEP meeting for difficult child 1, "Why are we coddling this child? If we don't make him do things for himself, he will never be able to cope in the real world when he finishes school."
I had a representative from Autism Australia with me, who answered that question. "He is autistic. We know he won't cope - yet. One day, with ongoing support, he will."
Teachers like this VP would rather difficult children went to school somewhere else. So they try to just let things run their course. It's easier to do nothing and eventually the parents of the kid will get the message, and of course the child would be much happier with his own kind. Somewhere his needs can be catered to. Some nice, comfy institution somewhere.

Only for us, there ARE no such places.

When we were testing the local high school to see if difficult child 3 would be a good fit there, the VP there was very similar. He finally said, "I don't think this boy is suited to our school. Why are you trying to send him here, and not somewhere more suitable?"
I explained that I valued his honesty - better to find out this view BEFORE enrolment. And that no alternative placement existed. This VP went on to make a number of suggestions which were very sensible (although designed to keep the VP's problems and involvement down) but which I had been told were simply not possible - suggestions such as partial attendance. Again, I thanked him for his input and asked him to share this with the education authorities who do not permit these options.

Steph, I don't know if your daughter is at a school like difficult child 1's, or a school which wants to help but just doesn't know how, yet. I would suggest you follow the ideas you've been given, try and get them into an IEP but also plan in some extra meetings for 'tweaking' the plan into something that difficult child can work with. Keep nagging if you must; keep working WITH the teachers if you can. You have the chance to turn this into something that can help not only difficult child, but the teachers too, so they have a better idea of how to help other difficult children that come through their doors, and not simply try to squeeze them out of the system.

And no books!??! In our area we are constantly being asked to raise n=money to buy schoolbooks to be sent to third world countries. So if third world country's schools see books as a high standard, then what is wrong with your state?

Marg
 

Stella Johnson

Active Member
Daisylover,
I sent a long letter to the teachers and the VP last night. The VP is having the school diagnostician set up a new IEP meeting. Hopefully soon!

Susiestar,
I didn't realize they were that inexepensive. I will have to check into that. How long did it take your difficult child to learn how to use it though?

They don't put elementary assignments on the school website here. Only middle school and up.

JustKeep Swimming,
Sounds almost exactly like our meeting only I didn't have a substitute. I don't think I would bother to go if it were a sub that barely knew my difficult child.

Marguerite,
You just wrote out my worst nightmare. I can see my difficult child in the same place yours was in. :sad:
Just seems like the more I nag, the worse the teachers get. I'm so sorry for your difficult child. Poor guy. I just don't understand why these ppl are even in the education field.

Steph
 

Stella Johnson

Active Member
Here's a copy of the letter I sent to the school last night

On Monday, I had a conference with Sabrina’s teacher, Mrs. W, about her progress in 5th grade. It appears she is struggling greatly in the general education classes. To say the least I am very concerned. I believe a new ARD meeting is in order. I will also be arranging a new Neuro-psychiatric evaluation and a psycho-educational evaluation.

I noticed that her notes that she is able to write in Science and Social Studies are very illegible and incomplete. I don’t believe she has enough time to write them and with her reading disabilities she does not understand them. It is more like she is just copying symbols she sees. The comprehension of what is going on in class is not there. There are a few notes in the front of the notebook, middle, and end. It doesn’t seem advantageous for her to simply copy something when she has no comprehension of what it is she is supposed to be learning. Mrs. W also mentioned she is having problems with her shutting down and refusing to do work in regular education classes. Sabrina usually “shuts down” when she is lost as to what is going on. Hopefully some of the suggestions in this letter will help with this.

I spoke with a few friends who are elementary teachers and parents of special needs children. I have a few suggestions to help Sabrina succeed in 5th grade.

1. Give her a hard copy of notes for every class and let her highlight as
they cover the material and/or let her draw a picture of what they are talking about. (IE talking about plant having roots and leaves, have her draw that in the margin.) Also have these taped or glued in the correct notebook for the class. Sabrina should bring these home with her each night to be reviewed as part our nightly routine at home.

2. In all of her notebooks for class someone should help her make sure that she is using the correct page and not skipping around in the notebook. (I noticed that she had worked in the front, middle, and end of her notebook for Science) Her organization skills are lacking but I think this can be helped with a little extra instruction.

2. Reduce the appearance of the content. Life cycle is the life cycle. Work should have larger print and not wordy. Let her color the picture with the correct stages. That should be her test along with what the work looks like. She needs to learn the basics, not the extra higher order stuff.

4. Add extended tutoring to her IEP and add a 1:1 Aid in the regular education classes. I know that the regular education teachers have a full class to attend to and can’t give Sabrina the one on one help that she needs in class. I think an aid being there to work with her will help with this. This aid could help explain the subject being discussed in class better and guide her in her school work in the classroom. This will help with her “shutting down and refusing” to do work. I know that some of her classmates try to help but it isn’t fair to them to have their attention taken away from their assignments either.

6. I think the use of a "Five-Star" binder that zips up could help with the organization problems she is having. Each section is for a different class and includes a spiral notebook, loose-leaf paper and is divided by dividers with a pocket on each side. At the front of each five-star is a large pouch that holds pens, pencils, glue, ruler, highlighter, colored pencils, etc. As she goes through her day, everything that is loose - handouts, etc., go into that binder.

7. In Sabrina’s Resource class daily a progress sheet is sent home that tells what she worked on and how her behavior was. I noticed that apparently she is doing well in the Resource room but not in regular education. I was unaware of some of the behavior issues Sabrina has been having in her other classes until last Monday. I would like a daily report of how her behavior is in the other classes as well. I can’t help correct it if I am unaware of it.

I hope that the suggestions above will help Sabrina succeed as a student and move beyond the situation she seems to be in at this time. It is clear to me that Sabrina is in need of extra help. Hopefully we can all work together so that she can receive the excellent education that we all want for our children.

Thank you for your time,

Stephanie
 

Stella Johnson

Active Member
It just doesn't stop. :thumbsdown:

Today about 2:30 I got a call from difficult child's Social studies teacher.
The teacher said she refused to do work. Then was standing behind her chair.

Teacher tried to move the chair and sabrina jerked it away.

Then she called the assistant principal to come and "get her".
She said Sabrina banged her head on the door on purpose as the VP was trying to get her out. I'm not to sure I believe her though. I'm honestly wondering if she didn't push Sabrina into the door.

I know Sabrina has done that type of thing before but the way the teacher said it.... something just seemed wrong.

I think that call was more about covering their butts than informing me of a problem with Sabrina.

So what do you think? Try to make this school help her or move her back to the class she was in last year that is located at another school?

I'm wondering if it is all worth it to try to get them to help her.
 

Marguerite

Active Member
Steph, a couple of things.

First, I told you some of difficult child 1's story, to show you that writing a letter AND following through is worth the effort; but sometimes you just need to throw in the towel, if you're running out of time (as we were - difficult child 1 at that time was only two months away from his final high school exams and his notes were in the same state as your difficult child - I kid you not. With THAT, he was expected to pass? BUT (and that's a big one, not unlike mine - ha ha) - with what we put in place instead, he not only passed his final exams (although he took another two years to do so, but this is perfectly OK in our schooling system) but he got his confidence back. He slowly matured, he has slowly made progress and is turning into a really decent, loving, caring human being. He's been on a disability pension since he was 16, is currently trying to get a paying job which will automatically stop the pension. He's at two job interviews, as I type this.
difficult child 1 is, in my opinion, a success story - first, because I fought for him in the school system and then was able to support him through correspondence. The day he was suspended, I pulled him out. The issues surrounding the suspension told me this VP would stop at nothing to get him out of her school, or failing that, make his life a misery. The VP then tried to bully ME and say that it was too late to transfer to correspondence and they wouldn't take him anyway - while sitting in her office, correspondence school rang to tell me his enrolment was confirmed. Very sweet indeed. Then she got upset - because the school was going to have to hand back six months worth of support funding.
So take heart - our kids can recover, they can do more than the school sometimes lets them.
Your aim now - to help difficult child do as well as she can, within her limitations. If the most she will be able to learn is how to read and write her own name, then so be it. But if she's secretly capable of nuclear physics - those doors need to be open and available to her.

Do not be afraid of what the school will think, of if the school will take their resentment out on your child. If you suspect this is happening then it is time to REALLY make the school afraid.
I actually did say to the local school where easy child & difficult child 1 were enrolled, "You know I was able to lobby my parliamentarian to get special permission for easy child 2/difficult child 2 to be accelerated into school. So you know I have the ability to make things happen. I am very happy to use this to the school's benefit, if you ask me to. But please be aware - you have also claimed that in my family we are emotionally unstable. Therefore feel free to believe that I am a very paranoid person. If I even suspect that either of my children enrolled here is being victimised simply because of my actions then I will react and use every political influence I have to make sure my children are not victimised again. I will always assume my child is right and you are wrong, because that is what mentally unstable, paranoid people do. So the safest course for you is to guard my other children enrolled here as if they are made of glass. You treat my kids right, we all will get on fine."

I know I was being a bully, but I was really concerned that my political activism would rebound on my other kids. And it never did.

Now, to other things in your message - you have a really great wish list there. Use it. Every skerrick, every iota, do your darndest to put it in the IEP. difficult child needs it. And frankly, the teachers will benefit. If difficult child has work at a level she can handle, with support in place, the teacher will find things much more uneventful in the classroom.

As for difficult child's head banging into the door - I'm going to get really nasty here. Remember my alleged paranoia? Time to use it as a weapon.
That child was in the custody of the school. They have a fiduciary duty of care to ensure she is not damaged in any way while in their custody. because the law says the child must attend school, the school then is a de-facto parent during school hours. A parent turning up to the emergency room stating that the child deliberately banged her head into the door frame just as the parent was muscling the child through - that parent would be rapidly talking to CPS.
Let's say difficult child DID bang her head deliberately. Why did the VP and the teacher allow this? There were TWO teachers present, not one. And one of those teachers actually had their hands on that child. How could the child have succeeded in banging her head?
Now let's say difficult child did not do this deliberately. When you are muscling someone through a door, you are trying to control not only where your own body is going, but where the other (often resistant) body is going. It COULD have been an accident. But even so, the VP is responsible, because she did not take enough care.
Now let's sat the VP was so frustrated that she momentarily lost her commonsense and deliberately banged difficult child's head into the door frame. Yes, it can happen. You're trying to deal with a struggling kid, you're feeling she is slipping from your grasp (in more ways than one) and the door frame is handy and it is SO satisfying... and the class teacher may have heard the thump and heard the VP say, "You did that to yourself, you silly girl!"
Who is going to say otherwise?

Regardless of what you privately believe, I don't think you can come out and say, "VP did this on purpose." But you CAN come out and say, "This happened in VP's care, and she should have prevented. Besides, I do not believe difficult child would have done this on purpose. If she did, she must have been worked up into such a state - and who is responsible for that too, if not the VP?"
Whichever way the VP tries to argue it, you should be able to throw it back at her. She took on the responsibility, she has to wear it. And the more you press on this, I suspect that at first she will try to REALLY blame difficult child and even maybe say, "difficult child made me hurt my arm/head/leg too," but difficult child is not responsible for VP, it's the other way around. Then VP is going to try the following: "Well, it's all over now, we'll agree to forget about it, shall we? I will agree to not punish her for banging her head deliberately, if you agree to drop the matter and let us move on to more productive issues."
Don't let her get away with that one either. Think about the trigger in the first place - difficult child was standing behind her chair and refusing to work. Why was this? Why has nobody even explored this? If there was a problem unaddressed which needed to be dealt with before she would work, then it should have been dealt with. To try to first move the chair, and then remove the child, is using force which could well have been totally inappropriate. In letting things get out of hand this way, the problems can escalate to the point where the original issue is totally lost. To punish for something that has occurred due to mishandling of a situation is wrong. It needs to be backtracked and worked on from the point of origin.
If a building is on fire and the firemen come to put it out, they will not succeed if there is, somewhere deep in the building, an active source of combustion still burning fiercely. A good fireman will investigate to determine what is the origin of the combustion (chemical? electrical?) and use appropriate mans to first shut off the initial combustion, and THEN deal with the rest of the fire more effectively. Otherwise it's like trying to hose down an oil well fire, without trying to cap the well.

This VP, from what you have indicated, has not been doing her job correctly. Feel free to be the outraged parent, extremely distressed because your child was hurt on school time and in the hands of the VP. Use this as extra leverage to get the cooperation you need in other areas. Scare them.
Try to not enjoy it too much, power corrupts.

Now, to the Alphasmart - they're easy to use. Very easy. She would need to know how to type, and would need some capability with computer files and "don't save over a saved file unless you want to erase it" type of savvy, but I think the issue here is, she shouldn't be taking her own notes at all. An Alphasmart instead of writing TASKS - yep, good idea. difficult child 3's school bought one for us, it came out of his funding. It technically belongs to the Dept of Ed and they will get it back when difficult child 3 is no longer a Dept of Ed student.
With teacher support especially in the beginning, difficult child should be able to handle an Alphasmart. But I don't think it's the answer here, she needs a heck of a lot more support than that. I like your list. Go get it.

Never worry about the school and what they will think of you. If you behave appropriately and do not make wild threats or rip your clothes off and run through the corridors, your behaviour as a parent putting her child first should be seen as natural and understandable. Anybody who refuses to recognise this does not have an opinion worthy of your notice.

And I say this as someone who has to live in the same very small village, as teachers I have dealt with in this way. And we get on fine, we stop and chat about the kids, about their work and all sorts of things. Teachers worth caring about will understand. The teachers who will resent you are the ones who are doing the wrong thing anyway, and you have called them on it.

If you let this pass unchallenged, it will happen again. Eventually, difficult child will stop telling you about it because what's the point? I know, because this is what happened with difficult child trying to tell teachers.

And before teachers on this site get upset at me, please realise that you are the exception to the rule. If this VP were not so determined to get rid of a problem child, there wouldn't be any issue here. If you were VP instead, I doubt Steph would have any issues with you.

There are good teachers. Often they're lurking in schools where senior staff are control freaks. Adults can be bullied too.

Marg
 

DammitJanet

Well-Known Member
Steph...

I have one thought about the notes that Sabrina would be getting from the teachers to be highlighted and drawing on. Instead of being taped into a spiral notebook, why cant they be hole punched and dated and placed into a binder? That way you have them by date without all the mess of glue.
 

Stella Johnson

Active Member
Marguerite,
Holy cow you are good! Mind if I plagerize part of your post and use it in my next letter? :doctor:
Very good ideas on turning the tables. This might just work.

Janet,
I thought about a binder, the only reason I said to use the spiral is that the rest of the class have to take all their notes in the spiral. I was trying to keep it more uniform with what the rest of the class is doing. If it gets too messy I think I will go to the binder.

You guys are all wonderful!

Steph
 

Marguerite

Active Member
Steph - go for it. Just remember, whatever you start, you have to follow through on. If you stop halfway, they win and are not accountable when they should be. Even if you start and agree to walk away - make it clear to them that you are making that choice, never let them think you have just forgotten about them. They need to know you are constantly vigilant. Maybe then they will be, too.

Good luck. And yes, it IS possible to be friends with these people and work as a team, even after you've planted your size 5s right in the derriere.

Do let us know how you get on. And remember, you are a mother - you don't have to play by official rules. So if t hey say, "You shouldn't have rung the superintendant, you should have spoken to the principal first," or whatever (just an example) you simply say, "I haven't been trained in your protocols. This is MY child, I want HER needs met urgently because as things are, she is not learning a thing. Surely you are not happy that your efforts are being wasted? Or would you rather we set in place a system to make her life easier, and yours as well?"

I also think you need a Communication Book, pronto. Things are happening here and daily communication (or almost daily) would help you get a better all over picture.

Marg
 

Fran

Former desparate mom
Steph, my difficult child was issued an alphasmart, hard copy of notes, verbal testing and total accomodations to any standardized testing. I'm pretty sure he did not take a TAKS test but some rendition for Special Education.
Of course, he didn't have all the credits to graduate with a typical diploma from h.s. He was never going to take a language class or anything but basic math. He graduated 50 from the bottom of the class of 900. I was the proudest mom in the crowd. It was a miracle that he got that far. I couldn't have helped difficult child if his school, teachers and support staff all had the same goal. Get difficult child to function as best he could instead of like everyone else. None of us were going to be able to make him into something he wasn't able to be. I didn't expect teachers to perform miracles just as I don't expect medications to perform miracles. We want our kids treated with dignity, be as much a part of the group as possible and to learn in a way that is meaningful to the difficult child.

I know you have hopes of difficult child being more mainstreamed but she is struggling to keep up. Eventually she will become frustrated and stop. Can you imagine how boring it is if everything the class is studying or talking about means nothing to her?

I hope the services and the staff all work together with you to help difficult child get to a place where she is stretching to improve without feeling like she failed or is lost.
 

Stella Johnson

Active Member
I think I would have to put my child in a private Christian school. sigh

I have looked at several Christian schools in the area. They just don't have everything difficult child needs. I like the way most of them are set up and they have great staff, just not Special Education.

I'm looking at two special needs schools for next year. I can't bring myself to sending her to public junior high next year.

Steph
 

dirobb

I am a CD addict
my difficult child went to a catholic school in mid 6th and 7th grade. He learned how to manipulate the system. This school is used to having the kids from an early age. My older kids had gone there. So they accepted him based on our history with them. They kids grade their own papers. Guess who's was graded and miracously started getting 100's.(you could look at the work and know the answers were not right) I confronted him and the teachers. We finally decided it was not worth our money to have him there. He wasn't learning anything ( he passed most of his classes by 1 pt ) He was doing poorly in PE (would not suit out) this year we are trying something different. We have moved to a charter school. max class size 13. So far so good. Lost of class tutoring and very little homework, almost non-existant.

He has requested that we send him to boarding school. HAHAHHAHAH

Sometimes we have to be creative...not everyone fits into the same box.

Don't get me started on the binder and spiral....ours seldom make it to class.
 
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