Help me figure out the differences between autism and antisocial personality disorder

[DammitJanet]

Terry I could give you a whole lot of examples of things that I think oppose the theory of some form of autism. I also would run screaming from any diagnosis of him being a sociopath. I remember when Cory was 12 and a psychiatrist looked at me and told me to find a placement for Cory and just walk away because he was going to be a sociopath and I might as well wash my hands of him right then and there. WTH? He was 12! Yes I think many of the therapies we did with him were completely useless and wrong and if I had it to do over I would make different choices but he is not a sociopath. He has empathy. He loves his family and he adores his daughters. He cares about strangers. In many ways he wants to do the right thing and he has learned from his mistakes. It took him quite awhile to learn that but it is finally sinking in. I wish I didnt have to do some of the difficult things I had to do to make him learn but oh well, such is life.

Cory is still impulsive and has problems with being quick to anger but he is working on those things. He knows he doesnt feel like other people. He is not a sociopath. He doesnt plot out how to kill for fun and amusement. I wont say he could never kill because I think any person could be pushed that far given the right circumstances. For him that would be if someone attacked one of us or god forbid he found someone molesting his girls. I dont think they would have a prayer. I dont think that is so abnormal though.

 

[buddy]

Its nice reading Janet's reply. Your difficult child is kind of a combo of her difficult children in some ways. Her boy's stories do offer hope. They have their challenges but they are kids who try and have good hearts.

 

[DaisyFace]

I wonder and wonder which open window I missed during his early development, but then again, he was so adept at faking it that he even flew under my radar. Sigh. He wouldn't have admitted anything because he knew enough to know he was different, Know what I mean?? Very sad but totally understandable. So in many ways, we have to go back and teach him what he should have learned to begin with.
It makes me dizzy.

Well, who knew you were supposed to be looking for deficits to fix??? I certainly didn't. And too many people were around too offer excuses (Oh, it's just a phase....or...oh, you're worried about nothing). And when even the "experts" have a hard time seeing these issues - what is a parent to do?

Fix what you can. Support what you can. That's the best you can do.

 

[TerryJ2]

DaisyFace, that's for sure! If I had a dollar for everyone who said, "He's just a boy," I'd be rich. There is no way my brother would have left bruises on my mom.
Or screamed in her ear or spat on her.

 

[TerryJ2]

Well, Buddy, from what little I saw of Quin, he was too sweet and unaware to be a thug. Let's hope that sweetness stays with him.

I agree that my son is totally self absorbed and hope that is part of Asperger's or at least something understandable to me. I still don't get the anger issues. All we can do is experiment with-medications and perhaps place him in an Residential Treatment Center (RTC) at some point.

Janet, I'm still confused about your note. Were you saying that you think my difficult child might be bipolar and Aspie? Or not Aspie at all? Or something else? Just wondering.

 

[buddy]

daisyface, that's for sure! If i had a dollar for everyone who said, "he's just a boy," i'd be rich. There is no way my brother would have left bruises on my mom.
Or screamed in her ear or spat on her.

amen

 

[trinityroyal]

Terry, your difficult child reminds me so much of mine at each age and stage of development.

Mine is both Aspie and Bipolar. It's a difficult combination, because you have the mood cycling, impulsiveness, dysthemia, anger, mania and all the other bipolar stuff, layered on top of the Aspie lack of social awareness, and difficulty understanding others' point of view, etc.

So...your difficult child leaving bruises on you, spitting at you, etc. is possibly a combination of a BiPolar (BP) meltdown + impulsiveness + a complete lack of understanding as to how any of those things would make you feel because of the Aspergers. I think it might be worth investigating it as a possibility.

For years, my difficult child's psychiatrists and tdocs focused solely on treating the Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD). The explained the mania etc. as ADHD and had him on Concerta and a raft of other stims, which caused absolute CHAOS. Finally, we found a forensic psychiatrist who identified the BiPolar (BP) as BiPolar (BP). His plan was to get the BiPolar (BP) under control first, and then once difficult child's moods were stabilized, to work on the Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD). And it has made a world of difference. When difficult child was at his worst, I couldn't stand to even be in the same room with him for 10 minutes. Now, he has been staying with us all week and he and I have been getting along very well. A wonderful change from the bad old days.

He still has major issues, but rage and violence, irrational anger, mania, paranoia, etc. are far less of a problem than they used to be.

 

[TerryJ2]

Thank you!

 

[TerryJ2]

Hmm. Look what I just found: http://www.jaapl.org/content/34/3/374.full

 

[DammitJanet]

I dont mean to confuse you...lol. I havent met your son obviously but I do know the things you have posted here. The whole things about him blocking you into rooms to get into rooms to at his computer and hurting you to do it. Breaking into rooms also. Sneaking out and skipping school while we were at the beach. The whole pot use thing and staying on the phone all night and juggling girlfriends things. And the stealing the credit cards several times to use them online to buy things, especially after he knew exactly what it meant. And then the whole cell phone issue.

All these things point well away from aspie to me and I think your son is aspie if he is on the autism spectrum at all. And he may be. I would actually think he could have some form of attachment disorder that isnt true Reactive Attachment Disorder (RAD). Or how much do you know about could his birth mom and could she possibly have had a drink or few during pregnancy? That could have caused something. Even if something like slight Fetal Alcohol Effects (FAE).

I dont know about bipolar but have you read about the Temper Dysregulation Disorder? That could be something to look into or it could just be mild conduct disorder. I dont think he is a severe case though. I think with some pretty some heavy discipline you can get this under control. He needs strong limits and some pretty severe consequences for his actions. These need to be in all areas of his life. Everyone across the board in his life has to take the same roll with him. No matter where he does the behavior, he has to get the same consequence. He has to get called on the behavior.

I dont want you to think there is no hope for your son. If you think he is anti-social, that is almost like a death sentence to a parent because there is almost no treatment for a person with that unless they truly want to change and most people with anti-social pd dont think they have anything wrong with them, its everyone else around them. I think you can turn your son around before he hits his adult years if you put things into place now but if you let it get until he is in his twenties, well, then it may be much harder.

Good luck, I really am pulling for both of you.

 

[TerryJ2]

Thank you.
I am making an appointment with-our therapist to have difficult child take a couple of psychiatric personality tests. Now that he is almost 16 he should be able to fit into a few of the guidelines and categories. We have not had him tested for 4 yrs so it's time for an update.
I'm also thinking he may end up with-a diagnosis of Asperger's, Mood disorder not otherwise specified, and Narcissism. We'll see.