Hopefully just a bump...in the road

Discussion in 'Substance Abuse' started by RN0441, Apr 22, 2016.

  1. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    So my son has been at sober living for a month. Seemed to be doing well, working 35 hours per week. Attending IOP three days a week, seeing therapist weekly. Didn't want to do NA or AA but if he's sober we're ok with that; it's not for everyone.

    He told me the other day he was using cbd oil on his tongue to help him fall asleep rather than taking Seroquel at night. He is on Efexor for anxiety/depression and has trouble falling asleep. I was ok with the oil, it's legal etc. Well then he said he bought a vape from his roommate for $40 which I thought was a scent diffuser (I've been to those oil parties) but I guess I was wrong. I did read online the oil was from stems etc. from marijuana but had no THC.

    He called me yesterday on my lunch hour to say that his house manager (Kyle) would be calling me because he tested positive for THC and they wanted him to go to inpatient house for a week or two. He was NOT happy, didn't do anything wrong, is doing well blah blah and he was NOT going to do that. Of course it was that or OUT.

    I talked to Kyle and he confirmed the THC and although vape is okay for them to do and it's all the rage in Delray right now, he felt that Jake did too much causing a positive reading so is on a slippery slope. Also just plays game on phone in his free time and shuts everything out with headphones. Not healthy living. He said that even some guys that don't test positive are sent to other house, which is very structured, to get back on track.

    Late last night my son said he was going to stay with a guy from work at his sober living which I was not happy about but I did tell him it was his life, he's an adult and to make good choices for himself. After all that he did decide to go back to original place. It was his decision and I did not force him, I couldn't. We will get to see him for a visit on Wednesday while we are in Florida as planned.

    I am glad he did the right thing but am very upset that he obviously was vaping to get high and is in denial about it. He has been sober for 2 months. Forge on I guess. What other choice is there?
  2. GoingNorth

    GoingNorth Crazy Cat Lady

    CBD is usually made from hemp grown in Canada or the EU where it is legal to grow for industrial purposes.

    Industrial hemp contains NO detectable THC, but does contain CBD. It is available as an e-liquid for vaping.

    I tried the e-liquid as I vape nicotine, but found out that it fouls replaceable parts VERY quickly, running into some money, and tastes horrid.

    I have a oil-based CBD to be used orally that I use occasionally. I don't find it very effective, but that may be due to the medications I take for the bipolar.

    There is NO way he could drop dirty for THC if what he was vaping was pure CBD. Sounds to me like he's trying to put one over on you.
  3. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    Hmm you could be right but he swears up and down he didn't smoke weed. His house manager felt if he vaped enough of it he could test positive but who knows.

    I have never vaped anything. I used to smoke cigarettes but quit many years ago. I smoked a lot of marijuana in high school but it was a different time.

    He asked me if I thought he was dumb enough to do something when he knows he gets tested. I really didn't think he was dumb enough. He had been sober for 2 months. I have never seen him so adamant about being innocent.

    Either way this sucks!!
  4. UpandDown

    UpandDown Active Member

    I am sorry RN. This must be hard but you sound good - like you have the right mindset to deal with the inevitable ups and downs that part of this "journey". It sounds like you are being supportive yet not getting all caught up in trying to fix things. Its so hard.
  5. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    Relapse is part of recovery.

    If I remember right, THC can be stored in body fat - and come back into the system, and show on drug tests, later when body fat is burned?
  6. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    Thanks guys. It's amazing how much better "we" get at this. Still bawled my eyes out last night from the stress of it all (hubby asleep in chair arghhh) but could have been the wine.

    And what a journey it is. Somehow the word "journey" sounds like it promises something good......

    Certainly a club no one wants to belong to.
  7. UpandDown

    UpandDown Active Member

    Yeah, I dug around for the right word. Trip from he** might be more fitting. ;)
  8. Kathy813

    Kathy813 Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I can't even count the number of times that my daughter swore that she was sober when she really was using. Of course, I wanted to believe her so I would start to doubt myself even though I knew better. They can be very convincing. Unfortunately, I was usually right that she was lying.

    I looked up the oil you mentioned when I first read that post. It sounded iffy to me but then I saw that it didn't contain any THC. So it doesn't make sense that he tested positive because he used too much.
    That sounds exactly like something my daughter would say. In fact, I asked her recently that very question. I asked why she would use knowing that she would be tested and her answer was that she didn't think she would get caught.

    It is a good sign that he agreed to go back to the house. Did he go to the inpatient house? I think that you handled it well.

    One other thing, many sober houses ban vaping because it is often used to get high. I am surprised that he was allowed to have one.

    Last edited: Apr 22, 2016
  9. rebelson

    rebelson Active Member

    How was your visit yesterday with son?
  10. DarkwingPsyduck

    DarkwingPsyduck Active Member

    I couldn't even count the number of times I swore that I was sober within 20 minutes of snorting 60mg of IR oxycodone. I could not count the number of times I was "getting clean" only because my supplier didn't come through. It is a VERY easy game to play.

    I only use a vaporizer for nictone. Smoked a pack a day from 16 years old until 24 years old. Started using the vaporizer right around the time I finished a Suboxone taper. I am aware of the non-THC oil, although I have never done it myself. Weed wasn't my drug to begin with. Not the kind of high I liked. I would smoke it if I was out of pills, but that was rare in itself. Having said that, as far as I understand it, testing positive for THC is not possible from vaporizing that oil. Not that it is unlikely, or rare. But impossible.

    Just about EVERY lab who does the testing set an actual minimum limit on their tests. Meaning, it is possible to have very small amounts of a substance in your system, and still return a negative test. In order for CBD oil to return a positive THC result, the amount ingested would need to be ludicrous. Around 2000mg a day. Even then, it is unlikely to return as positive, but theoretically might. As far as the research I have done shows, somebody using that large amount has never happened.

    THC can be detected for a long time, especially when compared to other :censored2:. Like my drug of choice. Has a half life of around 24-36 hours. So, even with a heavy build up, I would pee clean after 5 days, or so. Maybe sooner, with my incredibly fast metabolism. THC can be detected in hair for months after last use. But you say it was a standard UA, NOT a hair test, correct?

    For reference, here is a site I found about the oil causing false positives:

  11. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    I'm back! We visited with our son on Wednesday. He had a fresh haircut and gel in his hair. Fresh shaven. Clean clothes. Clean teeth. Wow. I was happy to see this. Like others on this forum, my son has had major issues with showering, etc. and I find it disgusting and don't get it and it has been a sore spot with us. I would try so hard not to let it bother me....

    We took him shopping, saw the beach, to a nice lunch of his choice, saw the boardwalk. Saw where he works (he told them he was going home for a week to get off work so couldn't go too close). Saw where he lived. All very nice. Well above a college dorm I'd say. I met with his house manager and loved him. He told me that my son's test was a false negative! So he was telling the truth all along. Oh well. Who can believe someone who has lied to us so much? House manager also said that he was not making healthy habits and that is another reason they send them to a more intensive program so it was find with me. I'm no expert. Not even at novice level! It didn't hurt him. He got out and is back at work.

    After we left he sent me a nice text saying thank you for what we bought him and he is grateful and loves us. We told him we'd be back in November and he said why so long so we may try to go in July for a weekend.

    He called today and asked to stay in our condo til school starts which is about 150 miles away from where he is and that is a big NO. No idea why he would even ask. He needs support and sober living and we're calling the shots if we're paying the bills. He has only been there five weeks so I guess I can't expect major changes overnight but this snail speed of progress is tough.
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  12. ColleenB

    ColleenB Active Member

    Actually I think it sounds like he has made progress!

    I'm sure it feels slow, but just what he has accomplished so far is all positive.

    Heck... If my oldest would shower I think it would be a win!

    Hang in there!!!
  13. DarkwingPsyduck

    DarkwingPsyduck Active Member

    That is good news. I am happy for you. He is making REAL progress, and that is great.
  14. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    Thank you. But then I think OMG will he ever not need all this support - which by the way he doesn't think HE needs. He still doesn't get it. I just hope and pray that this continues. His phone calls still totally stress me out. I feel the only reason he is sober is because he is THERE and has to be. He hasn't said anything I really want and NEED to hear.

    I am glad I got back on here after vacation. I needed a boost of detachment parenting from you all. I still feel I need to detach even though he is being sober. If not, he can easily manipulate me. Not his dad but me. I don't want to go back "there". It was a horrible place to be. Second guessing everything.

    I feel bad when I think about November and December holidays. I DO NOT want him home for either. I am not sure what will happen between now and then but I just want him to stay put and work on his "stuff". Maybe we can go there for a visit but it's very expensive that time of year.
  15. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I agree he is making steps forward. I remember the first time I saw my daughter with washed hair and clean teeth in rehab. Her eyes were clear and she looked like I remembered her looking in better days. Good that you said no to the condo....way too much temptation and big red flag.
  16. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    He said he doesn't like living with these guys.

    They are messy, want him to clean their mess (ya right), fridge too full, blah blah. I told him he needs to be with people his own age. Addicts or not. He cannot live alone for a very long time and hopefully I'll know when that time comes.
  17. DarkwingPsyduck

    DarkwingPsyduck Active Member

    Does he accept that fact? That he needs to be around his peers?
  18. RN0441

    RN0441 100% better than I was but not at 100% yet

    He knows he has to stay there because that is his only choice.

    He isn't used to living with others like this - comparable to guys his age that are in a college dorm I guess. My older son got super annoyed with his roommates mess etc. too so I get that. But it's more important for my youngest to not be alone and have some accountability for a very long time. Last time he took 2 college classes living at home and started using benzos and drinking but still pulled an A and a B. We ended up having to send him to rehab (or he was going to have to move out) and now he is 1500 miles away in sober living and doing as well as can be expected I guess.