How to believe and not be fooled?

Discussion in 'Substance Abuse' started by Terryforvols, Apr 8, 2014.

  1. Terryforvols

    Terryforvols Member

    Hope I can explain this!! Last night difficult child called husband from jail and told him she wrote us a 2+ pg letter. I am so anxious to read it when it arrives, but how do you read it without a lot of eye rolling? I have been reading some FA daily meditations and I just don't know how to read her ltr and not basically dissect it, believe its all the SOS, etc. Since we cant see her since she is in another state, I have a hard time knowing where she really is emotionally, etc. She has been sitting in jail for over a month and will be there a while longer till her treatment bed opens up; she then goes to a court ordered locked treatment facility for up to 2 yrs, so maybe she is starting to wake up. How do I give her a break and not get sucked in????? Im one of those believe it all or believe zero. Help!!!!

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  2. ForeverSpring

    ForeverSpring Well-Known Member

    You can't.
    As my mom used to say, "Actions speak louder than words." She what she does and take what she writes with a grain of salt.
    When my daughter finally decided to quit, she didn't tell us about it. She did it. Then she told us about it and, yes, we were very skeptical until she proved it to us.
    That's kind of how we have to live. Not fun for sure, but necessary in order to protect our own mental health and to live in reality.

    Hugs to you and hoping your dreams come true one day.
  3. pasajes4

    pasajes4 Well-Known Member

    When I get those letters from my son, I always tell him it sounds good and that I look forward to seeing his plan in action.
    This saves me from having to say anything negative and still let him know that seeing is believing.
  4. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Terry the words she writes in that letter may be her real feelings. It may be the only way she can express herself. When I got one of those letters from difficult child when she was in rehab I cherished them. It was the first glimpse I had into how she was really feeling. Her actions may show something else but those letters kept me going. I decided if she took the time to put those words on paper she had to have spent some time thinking about it. She has nothing else to do in there except think about her life. Maybe she is realizing what a mess she made.

    She will be going to rehab for 2 years. It doesn't matter what she says in that letter, it is still going to happen. You don't have the power to change that so she can't be writing with that hope. If the letter is good cherish it and hold it close in your heart and realize your little girl is in there somewhere and hopefully she will be again.
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  5. Terryforvols

    Terryforvols Member

    Thank you, thank you all! I read some more FA meditations and with these comments I have a way. I will be grateful for her ltrs, and we stressed to her when we left her in Feb, she needs to walk the walk and not just tell us what she thinks we want. Time will be the proof!

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  6. toughlovin

    toughlovin Well-Known Member

    I am with Nancy.... look at the feelngs behind the words. I think you can often tell when what is being said/written is purely for effect and manipulation and when they are really saying how they feel. So discard and pay no attention to the manipulation stuff.

    Also I would not get caught up in the things or incidents she tells you about.... those may or may not be true or may be partly true.... but listen to how she says she feels.

    And in the end you cant do anything but love her and you can write her back about memories and your love. Thats all she can do.

    A 2 year treatment program is great!! I hope they get her a bed soon.


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  7. Kathy813

    Kathy813 Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Terry, I struggle with that myself. My difficult child told some whoppers when she relapsed. At this point, I don't believe anything that she tells me.

  8. Terryforvols

    Terryforvols Member

    difficult children letter came today. It SEEMS very heartfelt, and until she goes through CTTC, I am choosing to believe her. Sitting in jail may be opening her eyes to the world. She is apparently having a hard time thinking abt her children and the damage SHE has done to them. She is also seeing there are people in this world who dont have the support and life she has/had.

    She says she wants to change. She even thanked me for getting her ARRESTED! She said she never believed she wld say that, me either! She apparently was going down an even worse road! Anyway, for now, I can choose to believe the worst or support her in hopefully starting down the right path. I choose to support her and we will see over the nxt yrs how it goes. I have come to terms with the fact that I probably will always have that feeling of unease with her life for a long, long time, but for now, I choose to live with hope!

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  9. Kathy813

    Kathy813 Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Terry, I hope this is the turning point for your difficult child. I know of several difficult children that did turn their life around after spending time in jail.

    There has to be a happy ending for at least some of us.

  10. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Terry it was an eye opener when my difficult child was in juvenile detention. She saw other girls there who had nothing, no one for support. I think it was the first time she realized that she had it much better than many others.

    As you say you have a year to decide whether she is serious about making the changes she needs to in her life. I really hope she does.
  11. PatriotsGirl

    PatriotsGirl Well-Known Member

    Jail (and her son) completely changed my daughter. I still cannot believe how much of a change. She, too, is thankful she went to jail and thankful for the judge that kept her there. When my daughter was truly done - I knew. I felt it. She had said many times over that she was done, she quit, etc but when she said it the time she meant it, I can't explain it - I just knew.

    Praying that your daughter has seen the light and this is the beginning of her change...I couldn't imagine my daughter going through what she did after grands are involved. That must be a whole other level of pain. (((HUGS)))
  12. Childofmine

    Childofmine one day at a time

    Terry, I have never gotten a letter like that from difficult child in jail. He has been there (I've lost count) about 8 or 9 times now. One time for 8 months.

    His letters and conversation is all about getting out of the current situation.

    I would take that letter as truth for today. Let's pray it's also truth for tomorrow and more days to come.

    Hugs and blessings and prayers that this is IT for your daughter.
  13. Scent of Cedar *

    Scent of Cedar * Well-Known Member

    I think writing from jail is alot like posting here is for us. The value in posting is that we get our thinking organized enough to write coherently. After we do post, there is that living wonder feeling of hearing from someone who understands, who has been where we are, who cares enough about us to post back.

    We aren't alone with it, anymore.

    We are not posting in the hope that someone will define our situations for us so much as we are posting to clarify our situations to ourselves. That your daughter wants to share herself with you at this level, that she is willing to be vulnerable to you in this way, is the beginning of trusting again, for both of you. Given that she is going to be incarcerated for some time, there is nothing you need to say, nothing you need to do for right now but love her as you already do.

    Respond as honestly as you can, just like we do for one another, here.

    No one can say what is going to happen over time. I am happy for you that she is willing to share her vulnerability with you, that she is looking to you for strength. I think the time to make plans about what will happen, about whether she will use again once she is out, about whether she is telling you the truth ~ all that kind of thing can happen in the months to come.

    For right now, she is safe, and she loves you.

    Maybe this will be the beginning of making her way back.

  14. Terryforvols

    Terryforvols Member

    Thank you for your replies. difficult child called last night and I told her I was glad to get her ltr and then I basically told her what I told you guys.

    Cedar, in her ltr, she basically said said she was getting her thoughts out and down. That is a first.

    COM, any other jail visits for her have been shorter and she spent her time plotting how to get out. This is the first time she has ever had to face no bond, no way out. Maybe that makes you really have to face what you have done.

    The only irritating thing difficult child is doing, and it is minor in the whole scheme of things, is talking to this man she spent the summer with. She used him, but apparently he loved the way she took care of him, his house, children, etc. Now, she stole from him and his parents, so I really dont get it. He is 42, she is almost 30 (abt 18 emotionally). He apparently told her "he misses her and loves her". Yuck. We have had to meet him and have contact bc he has shipped her stuff to us. He actually told husband that "no one took care of him like difficult child". one stole from and lied to him like her either! I think she talks with him to pass time and he put $$ on her comissary. He cant see her, and I really think she doesnt want to. Anyway, her decision not mine. I think in tx he will become a memory.

    Oh, one funny thing abt this guy. Over the summer when she was on meth and I had the police pick her up, I txted him (had no idea abt him, just knew his name from difficult child ex husband) and asked him to not do drugs with her, said she was an addict, etc. HE CALLED ME A LIAR! Told me she didnt use, etc. Neeless to say, I did not care for him at all! difficult children really pick people they can fool, charm, etc. I dont know what that "gift" is but I know if I forged a $5.00 check, I would be caught at the cash register! She did thousands before being caught! It seems to be some type of talent, for lack of a better word. She shoplifted a flat sceen TV at Walmart and the manager helped put it in her car!!! Craaaazy!!!

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  15. Nancy

    Nancy Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Terry it took a long time for my difficult child to give up the negative people in her life. She hung onto them until she had positive things to take the place of them.
  16. ForeverSpring

    ForeverSpring Well-Known Member

    I have a suggestion. You can take it or not.

    Do not get involved in her drama. It won't change anything and will be bad for your mental and physical health. You an not control her, her boyfriend, her drug habit...anybody but yourself. It is not your daughter's boyfriends responsibility to try to change her and...even though this is harsh...he owes you nothing. Your daughter is the one who has to change her thinking or she will not do better. I hope she backs up her words with actions. I am slow to believe words until I see actions.

    You may want to read the article in Parent Emeritus on Detachment. You may also want to pick up a book called "Codependent No More" by Melodie Beattie. These resources however are for YOU, not for your daughter. I know you have tried everything...we all the end it is up to one person...the person using the drugs.

    When my daughter went too far with the drugs, we had her leave and she did quit, but she didn't write us letters about it. She did it. At the same time, she was able to elude jail so she didn't have the time your daughter has as her brother, who she went to live with, insisted she either work or live on the streets so she worked. And she walked to and from work because she had no means of transportation. She was in a new state and had dumped all of her old friends. A real marker as to seriousness about quitting is when they no longer want to communicate with their old "friends." I quote it because they are anything but friends. Until my daughter dumped them, and she had to move to another state AND she was VERY LONELY for a long time, she could not quit the drug cycle. Many times she wanted to, but let's just say misery loves company and puts pressure on the user to continue doing so. Sometimes there are even threats. I knew nothing about any of the horrors until after she quit and told us about it. Your daughter will not share 100% with you. Part of it is that she is ashamed, part is that she loves you and does n't want you to know the truth about drug life.

    My daughter is clean ten years now. I pray the same for your daughter one day. But your own life too, in spite of your daughter's struggles Nagging her, begging her, bargaining with her...none of that will change her, as you've probably seen already. It has to come from inside of HER and your involvement in her addiction will not cure it or change it.

    No matter how much you put your life on hold to try to save your daughter, it won't make any difference in the path she decides to take and you deserve a happy, healthy rest-of-your-life even if your daughter is in trouble now. I wish you the best and in no way do I mean to tell you what you HAVE to do. These are merely my thoughts and suggestions.

    My thoughts are with you.
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2014
  17. Childofmine

    Childofmine one day at a time

    I have heard this over and over and over again in every setting for the past four years. They must have different people, places and things. If they don't, it can't last.

    Ten days ago, I heard it again from the social worker at the day shelter when my son ate breakfast and lunch every day.

    She said: "He has to leave this town."

    I told her I completely agree. As long as he is here, his chances are not good, even if he is working a program, which he is not.

    But like MWM said, there is nothing we can do about that. The value to me in the whole "friends" thing is looking at his "friends." It can tell you a lot about where the person is, regardless of the talk they are talking.

    Hang in there. I truly believe that for now, jail is the best place my son can be, since he doesn't want rehab and recovery.

    I am working to rest in this time since he is off the street.
  18. PatriotsGirl

    PatriotsGirl Well-Known Member

    I can't agree with that anymore. I used to think the same.

    My daughter seriously wants nothing to do with drugs ever again. She does not miss it, she does not crave it, if anything, she is completely disgusted with how she used to live. She does not attend meetings, she is not working a program, or anything. She works and cares for her son. She lives with us, so it is the same environment as when she used. She does still talk to old friends only because a lot of them have also walked away from that life and are now "normal" working people now. They are proud of each other and support each other. I am actually quite proud of them! She has turned away from the ones that still use, though, and just shakes her head hoping they "wake up", too.

    Everyone is different and what works for one person doesn't necessarily work for another. I have seen parents spend thousands on treatment that did not keep them clean and yet jail and a baby was all that was needed for my daughter (as well as several other addicts). I don't think there is a one size fits all and quite frankly, that is the problem with addiction. There is no standard prescription to "cure" it. No one knows what it is going to take to fix our addicts. All you can do is try everything and see what sticks. I sent my daughter thousands of miles away before for months. It didn't do anything... I think a lot of it has to do with THEIR mindset and what THEY want to be honest.

    I wouldn't say just because they live in the same town or talk to old friends means they are doomed...if they want to be clean, they will be clean and if they want to use, well, they are going to use. That is my opinion, anyway...
  19. ForeverSpring

    ForeverSpring Well-Known Member

    PatriotsGirl, we didn't spend money on rehabs either. First of all, we didn't know how bad it was. Secondly, we couldn't have afforded one. Thirdly, she would never have worked the program even if I had been able to convince her father to pay. When she quit, she did it quietly and on her own and just like your daughter did. I'm almost convinced that this is how most quit. Of course, I have no stats to back up my beliefs though.

    My daughter moved to another state and didn't let anyone from here know where she was and we didn't tell anybody. And they sure wanted to know. Eventually, years after she was clean, she was contacted by a few on FB and all of them except one other female was still using, in and out of jail, on probation, many had kids from different people etc. She did not continue contact at all. She considers them losers.She calls her life "boring. I clean, work, cook for Geoff and wait for the baby to come." She doesn't have a lot of friends and lives a pretty quiet life.

    I do think different people find different methods that work. I also think it has to be their own timetables. There is no one answer for every addict. I do know we can't do it for them.
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2014
  20. Terryforvols

    Terryforvols Member

    I agree with all of you.

    I had hoped when she had children she would wake up. She did for awhile, but relapsed. She had never experienced jail at that time, so who knows if she had experienced that early on would it have made a difference.

    When she went through her 1st long term rehab in TX, she decided not to move back here to TN bc most of her friends were drug users. Good call at that time, but eventually she drifted back to that crowd in TX.

    One thing abt difficult children is that they aim low. They pick people who basically expect nothing of them, bc they expect nothing of themselves. If difficult child is not seeing it now, Im not sure she ever will. No visitors bc all your so called "friends" are to busy drugging and you are not valuable anymore.

    I think each difficult child will make it their own way, IF/WHEN they ever decide. I wish there was a one size fits all solution for them and us, but there is not. I am slowly learning to be happy for me and husband daily-good days and bad days with that!

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