I can't eat the Heart Cereal!!!!

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by totoro, Jan 9, 2008.

  1. totoro

    totoro Mom? What's a GFG?

    OK so I haven't really posted about K too much because well, she isn't doing well... same old story... she is up to 100mg Topamax, and still at 200mg Lamictal.
    Yeah I know I don't think these are the medications for here or the right combo. I would like to revisit Trileptal maybe with Abilify and the go for the big guns... Oh NO the Ones that require Blood draws!!! But we will wait until we get to Tucson...

    Anyway I am waiting my talk with psychiatrist this week, or not... she is starting to lie, to take things... very oppositional. She is changing again. So far I don't really see much from the Topamax... besides her acting dopey.
    So her sensory issues have been getting worse for about 2 months now, pre-Dopamax.
    So this I bought them this cereal Annies Honey Bunnies!!! It is yummy!!! and cute!!! the box has puzzles... she loves it. Oh but it has hearts in it!
    So I poured her a bowl of it... with her usual medley of various other cereals in it... she doesn't sugar cereal... unless they are organic and natural.
    So she starts yelling at me..."I can' eat this it has hearts in it"
    Well who knew...

    I seriously could not talk her out of it, she will not eat it. Had to get her a new bowl, sans Honey Bunnies...

    She has also been Obsessing about "Animalia" they had a wonderful cartoon based on the book the other day... from Australia...
    Well she got the book out and wrote a not to the Lions asking if she could come live there...
    Now she has been yelling at me this morning saying I did something wrong because they have not come to get her...

    So she is trying to draw a hole so she can go through it and get into their world and leave here.... she keeps talking to them in the book.... she is very mad.
    When I tried to "reason" LOL with her she got more agitated at me.
    Now she is cleaning 2 wrenches with windex and Happy as can be, mad 3 minute ago.....

    But she is perfectly normal!!!!
    So now I do the eggshell walk about school,,, she is supposed to go in about 1 1/2 hour.
    I am giving her her space right now. if I am in the room with her but not engaging her, it seems to help. We are in my "new" office, I stole husband office!!! He has one in town and one in Chicago!!! Uh what about me and all of the bills and the kids medical stuff etc...
    Oh no.... she is back to the "Animalia"
    Gotta go we are on a journey upstairs....
    I will update later... we also have Horse therapy later. N is at school, husband is gone for the day. So just me and K.

    We are looking at the Complete medication wash if the Topamax doesn't start working soon.... for our visit to new psychiatrist in Feb/March... This would be under a doctor's care.
  2. SRL

    SRL Active Member

    Sigh...sorry for resurgance of troubles.

    Was this the Animalia book by Graeme Base?


    The illustrations in that book so creeped out my kids when they were little that they asked that I take it away. This just wasn't difficult child with anxiety--oldest easy child too.
  3. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    T, what can I say except I'm sorry. I hope you are able to get K some better care soon.

    For what it's worth, my son is in a day treatment program at a local psychiatric hospital. His attending psychiatrist is reputed to be one of the best psychopharmacologists in the Difficult Child metro area. He told us that Topamax does not work to stabilize moods in kids. He never prescribes it. I'm wondering if that's why you're not seeing a difference.

    Kids with BiPolar (BP) generally need two first-line mood stabilizers with an atypical antipsychotic for effective symptom relief. Do you think K is hearing voices again? I forget -- did she ever try Seroquel? It can help with anxiety, depression, mood stabilization and sleep.

    Hugs to you.
  4. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    Gosh, Harold and the Purple Crayon could have been written by K. Too bad she's too young to write all that stuff down. Or is she?

    Did she flat out refuse to eat the cereal ... or could you remove the hearts? I know when you're rushing, or even when YOU are all excited about a new cereal, it's hard to deal with-that kind of arbritariness.

    When my sister and I were little, we liked Lucky Charms for opposite reasons ... one of us like the marshmallow charms and the other liked the regular cereal part. We separated all the pieces, then poured the separate piles on the floor; the regular cereal was dog food--we were the dogs--and the marshmallow charms were treats.
    Not that you should get down on the floor to entice K to eat her cereal, but maybe another sibling could help?

    What happens if you enter her "World"? Does she continue on for a reasonable length of time and then get bored? I'm wondering about your trying to reason her out of talking to the characters in the book.

    Which Animalia book are you talking about? Who is the author?

    Sorry so many Q's ... I'm trying to figure this all out.

    Good luck.
  5. totoro

    totoro Mom? What's a GFG?

    Yes it is Animalia by Graeme Base
    She has all of his books and has loved them since she was very little...
    That is the thing with her, she loves very odd fantastical things.... she loves his books and will sit and look for him in the books and find the hidden things... she loves the very well drawn books like Pinduli, Stellaluna, Crickwing... she has all of her books

    She loves the Miyazaki movies... hence my screen name... we have had to be very careful about witch ones we let her watch. Just a handful...

    She can be scared of something in the beginning and then once she has grasped the story line she is OK... some she is never OK with... I don't know why.
    With us not having cable or TV for years I don't know if this made her imagination "more intense"??? All we did was read... and then when we did get TV it was with TIVO ... so NO commercials.... this past year has been the first time this kid has been around commercials. hence her obsession with KABOOM!!!

    As far as the cereal... it is and always has been hit or miss as well, sensory and then some. She went through a NO red food, nothing showing on the bottom of the bowl... I could not take out the hearts because she has me mix a bunch of different cereals together... N will eat it... so it is no big deal. It is just one of those BiPolar (BP), Sensory... Special Needs weird things that a lot of us deal with.
    Tomorrow she may love them, but for now she believes she can't eat the hearts...
    We did make it to school...
    I know what medications I think she needs... Of course psychiatrist has his own opinions... I am tired of arguing with him. "Topamax is great for kids"
    Yes I have asked him about 5 times about Seroquel.... weight gain, not that great... blah blah blah.... "but, I read" There I go arguing again.
  6. meowbunny

    meowbunny New Member

    When my daughter was little, she wouldn't eat hearts, either. It took some digging but it turned out she thought she was really the hearts of an animal. I had to show her pictures of what real hearts looked like. Course, then I had fun trying to explain why we drew hearts in such WRONG shapes. lol

    Hope you can convince the psychiatrist that you know what you're doing about the medications. It really does sound like that what she's taking isn't doing the trick.
  7. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    "She can be scared of something in the beginning and then once she has grasped the story line she is OK"

    difficult child is like that. Animé seems to have helped him. There are some gentle stories. He's a bit older, at nearly 14. easy child 2/difficult child 2 is trying to get him to watch "Fruits Basket".

    We used to have an Animalia frieze on the wall (same as the book, but in mural form). We stuck it up in the hallway, the kids would huddle over it and look for the hidden bits, then they did the puzzle (last page). "Find Graeme" was the first game they played with it.

    She likes the lion - how is she with "Lion, Witch and Wardrobe"? Or would it be too much for her? There was a BBC made-for-TV series, should be available. Not quite as graphic as the recent film but still very well done.

    A line from CS Lewis that might help you: (about Aslan) "He's not a tame lion."

    And my favourite Discworld books - there are picture book versions, comic book versions and children's books (although until they come out in comic book version, they are for older, pre-teen GOOD readers and later). That is also fantasy, but fantasy satire. Sometimes it's subtle but it's a good segue into satire at a gentle level. You would love it. Two cartoons also made (series) - "Wyrd Sisters" and "Soul Music". The first is slinging off at Shakespeare, the second is full of Elvis stuff.
    No lions anywhere in them. Trolls and dwarves, though. And GOOD witches, and a bad king (in the first one).

    It's got to be so worrying for you, when she's all over the place like this.

  8. totoro

    totoro Mom? What's a GFG?

    I have read her all but 2 of the Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe series... I found she loves to be read to when she is semi stable. Right now is not so good. Now that she is reading she wants to have books that she can begin to read herself. Thanks Marg I will look into them...

    Well I just talked to psychiatrist, We go in next Tuesday...
    He wants us to increase the Topamax... and use the PRN more, which is Clonidine. Of course we don't have to do any of this... we can use our own judgement.

    Big sigh... I am tired.
    I am in my happy place... OM.... I will remain calm inside, until we find a new psychiatrist.
  9. Wiped Out

    Wiped Out Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I'm sorry K is struggling so much and that the medications don't seem to be helping. medications are such an individual thing-for us Topamax has been one of the best mood stabilizers for difficult child.

    I'm really praying for some improvements soon. Hugs.
  10. Steely

    Steely Active Member

    Wow, I was just thinking about little K this morning, and wondered if things had improved. I guess not. So sorry. :frown:

    FWIW, Topomax did nothing for my difficult child either, except make him dopey.

    I like the medication wash idea still..........but I am glad you can do it with a new doctor. Sounds like you cannot get to AZ soon enough. I am praying this new doctor is not a ding dong, and realizes the severity and urgency of finding the right medications.

    I wish I had helpful suggestions, but only hugs. Hang in there.
  11. aeditha17

    aeditha17 New Member

    Watch out for Topomax - my 11 y/o was on it for months for his Tourette's and while it was very effective, he ended up with pancreatitis. After much digging, we discovered that pancreatitis is a possible side effect. I'm not doom-and-glooming Topomax at all, just be keep your eyes open for tummy issues.
  12. Big Bad Kitty

    Big Bad Kitty lolcat

    Oh T.

    Scoop her up when she will let you. Give her a bunch of kisses from Auntie Big Bad. I am so sorry.
  13. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    It took some digging but it turned out she thought she was really the hearts of an animal.

    Ooh! I hadn't thought of that. Good point.
  14. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    So sorry you have to argue with-your psychiatrist, Totoro. That, on top of it all.
  15. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It


    I went through the literal interpretation thing with difficult child. When he was about 3 we were walking through the grocery store. He pointed to a box of chocolate chip cookies and asked me (loudly, of course) why they had famous "body parts" in them. Of course, he did NOT use body parts, he yelled ANUS. He pestered me for the entire day about exactly what famous person died and let his body part be used for cookies.

    It took a LONG time to get him through this. It did give me a stash of chocolate he avoided like the plague though.

    OK. Hope you got a chuckle, sounds like you needed one.

    I do totally know what it is like to have a child want to go into a book to get away from us mean people. difficult child was SO like this. But, to a certain extent so was I. I still remember being frustrated that I couldn't have sleepovers with Dorrie the Good Witch. (Only title I can remember is Dorie and the Pin Witch, but there were lots)

    Maybe if you explained the hearts are just made to LOOK like animals, the way a sugar cookie cut out to be a bell doesn't really ring, to help find healthy ways to help live animals? Does this make sense, or just to me? We often worked this way with difficult child.

    It never ceases to amaze me when docs think we should not have input, and the sense to know when something is wrong with our children. Or ourselves.

    If at some point you want to put a Lion on the wall, my mom had a great technique for this. She used an overhead projector to put a picture of a wooly mammoth on the wall of our den when I was a kid. She made a transparency and then projected the image to do the pencil outline. Took a long time to paint (I was maybe 4 and wanted to help SOOOOOO badly! Poor mom!) mostly because my dad was working 2 jobs and I wasn't in school. Anyway, after you get all settled (not sure if you are planning to move or not), this can be a GREAT way to do inexpensive murals. Esp if you have my level of drawing/painting ability, which is none.

    I hope you get a break today.


  16. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    Famous Amos Cookies? OMG, LOL!
    That's precious.