It's Been So Long - But Nothing is Better

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Transparent, Aug 21, 2011.

  1. Transparent

    Transparent New Member

    Hi all. I haven't posted in quite a long time. I was diagnosis'd with breast cancer in late 2009, had sx and chemo and then was diagnosis'd again, same breast in late 2010. Mastectomy this time, chemo again and 33 radiation tx's.

    difficult child showed his butt at the most inopportune times for me (down with sx, down with chemo) knowing I couldn't do anything. His defiance continues and he's becoming more bold. He will get in his dad's face now and yell his demands. If there are any effective punishments out there, we've yet to find them.

    Since my last postings, we've dealt with him threatening my son's life, beating my 4 year old daughter, chronic lying, defiance at school and at home and the latest is stealing. He's been sneaking into my husband's and I's bedroom and stealing our money - stealing my son's money. He'd even take from husband's quarter stash, come to husband, tell him he'd "won the quarters playing bingo at school" and ask if he'd give him dollars for the quarters. :grrr:

    He was reprimanded at school for not completing his homework. He was given 2 chances by his teacher to complete his work and turn it in or face Saturday detention. He ignored her requests, threw away the notes she'd written to us explaining what was going on and lied about having his work done. I got an email one morning from his teacher wanting to know why we hadn't signed his Saturday school slip - Well, because I'd never seen one! Come to find out, the Saturday he was scheduled for Saturday school was the Saturday he was supposed to go with the church to a youth function in another city. Needless to say, he was then told he couldn't go because he had a responsibility at school. He said he'd already told the youth leader he was going and HE WAS GOING NO MATTER WHAT. I was on the couch trying to recover from chemo and knew things were about to get ugly because difficult child was in my husband's face at this point. I moved off the couch and walked out the back door to the deck - in passing difficult child, I told him he would have to call his youth leader and tell him that he won't be going on the trip. I ended up having to call the youth leader myself because difficult child, of course, refused. As I was trying to tell the leader that difficult child would not be in attendance on the trip, difficult child lunged at me, grabbed my arm and was trying to wrestle the phone away from me. husband had to pull him off and I went back into the house at that point for my own safety.

    As for the stealing, difficult child says he was stealing our money because he was mad at us. Punishing us because we didn't let him go on this trip and because we told him he couldn't travel to Europe to study over the summer. (???) That was never an issue and he was told as soon as he brought that packet home that we would not, under any circumstances, send him out of the country alone.

    difficult child told my son that he would kill him in his sleep and "make it look like suicide" so he wouldn't get into trouble.

    Our 4 year old sleeps with us and I have a deadbolt on my bedroom door. I've become a prisoner in my own home.

    His psychiatric tells him "You know, these pills aren't going to stop your behavior. There is no magic pill to make you stop. You have to take responsibility". Yeah, right. He's never taken responsibility for anything he's done. All the **** he's done over the years, everything he's put us through, he's never once apologized and the only thing he's ever said he was sorry about was getting caught. And of course everyone and everything else is at fault for the things he does. Don't get me wrong, we love him very, very much - we're just exhausted.

    I had to take his iPod away (again) the other day. He'd taken a trip to his gramma's back in January and was told to leave the iPod at home because his cousins are good at tearing things up. Well, he took it anyway and then "forgot" it. I'd asked for his gramma to mail it back. 4 weeks later, no iPod. I had to jump several hoops and finally found someone to go over to her house to get the iPod and mail it for me. He has it back 2 days and I catch him throwing the iPod across the room like a Nerf football. I confiscated it again and kept it until last week. husband wanted to know if I'd think about letting difficult child have it back so he could play some apps with the rest of the family. My instinct told me "don't do it, he'll bite you in the butt" - but after a few days, I let him have it. It wasn't 24 hours and he was making in-app purchases using money I'd raised to pay my cancer bills to pay for them. He was told ahead of time "No purchases" and then lied about doing it even though he knew I knew. I had to take the iPod away and his response was that even though he used my cancer money to buy the app he deserved to have it back. *sigh* He expressed his anger towards me the next night by urinating on the bathroom floor.

    psychiatric still says he's "bi-polar". 2mg Haldol BID.

    I still think there's a lot more to what's going on in this child's head than that. We're setting up for second opinions. He'll be 13 in November, starts Jr. High this year.
  2. TeDo

    TeDo Guest

    oh, Transparent, I am so sorry you are dealing with all of this. How are you doing now?

    I agree that there might be something else going on since the behavior seems to be all the time. Haldol is not a bipolar medication from what I remember from medication training. I would look for a different psychiatric if that is all the current one is doing.

    It also sounds like your husband is only making things worse on some issues. Does he generally give in to difficult child earlier than you do? Does he ever undermine what you are doing/saying?

    Since he is so violent, have you ever had him in a psychiatric hospital? Have you ever called the police when he gets physical? You also need to have the school personnel inform you of important stuff personally, not in writing transported by difficult child.

    Many {{{{(((HUGS)))}}}} to you. My heart goes out to you.
  3. JJJ

    JJJ Active Member

    You can enable parental control on his ipod and prevent him from being able to make any purchases.
  4. Transparent

    Transparent New Member

    Thank you. Doing "ok" as far as we know. I'll have a PET scan next month to make sure there isn't any metastatic activity. I'll have to be scanned yearly and see my oncologist every 3 months for blood work, tumor markers, etc.

    I told difficult child that one more violent outburst and the authorities would be involved. He doesn't listen to me, he doesn't listen to husband, he does whatever he wants to do - so, he can try and pull that **** with the cops because this mama isn't going to tolerate it, in any capacity, any more. He's been in psychiatric hospital on numerous occasions.

    Haldol is NOT a bi-polar medication, it's an anti psychotic. The words we get from his psychiatric and psychologist are that he's too young to be given a specific diagnosis. They don't want to "label" him. I'm starting to wonder just how old does he have to be or what does he have to do before SOMEONE wakes up and tells us what's going on with him? We're hoping for something a bit more definitive with the second opinions.

    I keep in contact with his counselor and teachers at school and always let them know when he has his outbursts at home. Sometimes he will transfer his behaviors at school and sometimes his behaviors at school transfer at home. Usually only when he knows he's been caught though. Otherwise, he had "a good day" at school. Know what I mean??

    husband doesn't let difficult child get away with things, but he does handle things a bit softer than I do. However, he won't undermine me. If I tell difficult child he's taking on certain punishments for certain behaviors, husband backs me up. With the iPod, you'd think 6 months of not having it would be enough to teach him a little respect for when he got it back. I knew it was going to bite me, but I was hopeful it wouldn't. husband thought for sure he'd learned his lesson. Didn't take difficult child long to prove husband wrong. husband is beside himself over it and just disgusted, really. It's not that he took $1 - we'd be just as angry if he'd taken $100. It's that he took that money from account that I use for the sales of jewelry I make. That money I use to pay my medical bills with. And difficult child had zero remorse. Ever. *cry*
  5. Transparent

    Transparent New Member

    I have it password protected, but he figured out the password. Is there another way? Will that prevent him from downloading free apps? He can download free apps all day and I wouldn't mind that - he's just determined to do what he's not supposed to do.
  6. keista

    keista New Member

    ((((HUGS)))) Sorry you have so much on your plate on top of your difficult child.

    Any chance you can change psychiatrists? I'm more concerned of what will happen with your son if he's NOT "labeled" I'd rather have a wrong label and get good help. Right now with out the benefit of a diagnosis 'label' he's getting labeled anyway - as a bad kid. A diagnosis 'label' would at least give those dealing with him a frame of reference.

    Aside from not 'labeling' him, haldol still seems inappropriate for a mood disorder diagnosis (unless he's also experiencing psychosis). Still seems like there are many other medications that might be worth a try in addition to the haldol.
  7. Transparent

    Transparent New Member

    If we can get a solid second opinion from someone, you can bet we'll be changing docs. I'm tired of this "tiptoeing" around a diagnosis. We were told in the very beginning that he had mood disorder and then we were told that he was showing signs of bi-polar disorder. The only thing that I can see that the haldol has helped with is the sleep walking. difficult child used to sleepwalk something terrible. He'd get up at 2 and 3 in the morning, fully dress himself and try to head out the door for the bus stop. I caught him doing this on several occasions and had to convince him to go back to bed. He was completely unaware. We ended up having a home security system installed so that if he did open any of the doors or windows in the night, the alarm would go off. Isn't that something? We have a security system to keep people in - not out.

    I'm not sure how deep his psychiatric thinks out the "psychosis" thing. difficult child has grandiose delusions and in my opinion and also husband's, he's narcissistic. I have no doubts that difficult child is antisocial and it hurts me so much to type/say/admit that. I've told his psychologist that I feared he was antisocial and at the time, she said that she agreed that he did demonstrate certain characteristics of antisocial behaviors but that he was too young to be diagnosis'd as such and she certainly didn't want to label him with that. They still don't. Who are we helping here? My difficult child was 6 years old when he told my DS that he'd "blow his head off so that he could go to hell and burn with the devil". He was 10 when he threatened to go home, get a gun and come back to school and kill a fellow student. Now he's tried to slip a necktie over my DS's head to choke him with it, he's pulled knives on him, he's threatened to kill him in his sleep. Add stealing to it now.

    What else does he have to do?? Obviously what's being done isn't working. Now it's a new school year and he's in Jr. High - more changes for him, more stresses. I'm extremely nervous and I can see that there is a major disaster here just waiting to happen.
  8. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    Hi. I'm glad you're feeling better and you have my prayers that you will remain healthy.

    I have to agree with kiesta. I would be running for another opinion. And Haldol is such an old antipsychotic? Why use it when it can cause such bad side effects? On top of that, I'm concerned for your safety and that of your other children. He DOES sound antisocial and dangerous and nobody knows how much he means the things he says he'll do. I would probably be thinking of an out of home placement for everyone's safety and so that he can get more intensive help. Your fifteen year old should have a good lock on his door and use it every single night. A twelve year old could still hurt him if he wanted to.

    I am also surprised he has an IPod. My easy child is very spoiled and has almost everything she wants, but an She is fifteen and behaves herself and she will still have to wait until she has a part time job for the ipod. I wouldn't even trust him with a cell phone. Heck, I'd be worried about a computer unless he was monitored all the time.

    With the careless way he treats the I-Pod, I'd be lobbying for him to lose it forever. Maybe you can sell it. If my kids threw around expensive items, they simply would not have them anymore. Just don't have the money to waste.j

    Does your husband or his ex-wife have any psychiatric problems on their family trees? bipolar? Schizo-affective? Schizophrenia?

    Hugs and keep us posted!
  9. keista

    keista New Member

    Sounds like a case of CYA (cover your a**) on the psychiatrist's part. I'd fight harder for effective medication than any label. I so strongly believe that, that it's permanently in my sig. Essentially your son is NOT being treated for anything but sleepwalking. Without treatment NOW, he will more than likely end up with ALL the dxes psychiatrist doesn't want to "label" him with.

    And when I suggested another psychiatrist, I wasn't talking about a second opinion. I mean just change docs. in my opinion you're wasting your time and money (or the insurance company's money) with this one. Unless the next one you try is a clone of this one, you'll probably be much better off.

    The second psychiatrist I was taking my kids to (he replaced the first one in the clinic we were using) refused to even consider that DD1's escalating behavior was due to her medications. He insisted that it was ODD (no ODD before she started the medications) and I should come to his seminars. I dropped him like a hot potato. The one we're currently using is OK but not perfect. Right now I only have one other option so I'll stick it out with this one as long as I can because at least she's working with me instead of against me.

    I hope you can find someone else to take him to because, yeah, middle school can be a nightmare.

    You'll be in my thoughts.
  10. keista

    keista New Member

    And I didn't even stop to think of the Haldol side effects until MWM mentioned it. Is his behavior same better or worse since he started it? That could be a big contributing factor. Please, please, please find another psychiatrist.
  11. Transparent

    Transparent New Member

    I'm going to try to answer y'alls questions without quoting everyone. Forgive me if I get scattered.

    difficult child doesn't have a computer. He's had one in the past and couldn't keep from infecting it over and over with malware. It wasn't something we went out and bought for him, his gramma had upgraded her home easy child and gave this one to him. After cleaning it up and repairing it numerous times, I finally told him that when it crashed, it was done and he wouldn't be getting another one. That was over 2 years ago. I always monitored his activities on the easy child and the majority of the malware and bugs he picked up were from websites with game cheats on them. That's another issue he has too - he always has to be 1st, always has to win - no matter what. The iPod is a dead issue now. He complained the other night because I expressed my disappointment that he would use my account to purchase apps and then have no remorse. He said "I don't want to have to hear about this forever. I simply made a mistake and I deserve to have it back". I stated that this would be the last he'd hear about it because he was never getting the iPod back. I told him that the next time he had an iPod would be when he was old enough to get a job and buy his own. The iPod now lives in my car, sync'd with my car stereo with MY music on it. It's mine. Period.

    He does have a cell phone. Both of our sons do. I'd rather he not have a phone at all but husband feels more comfortable with him having one. The boys walk to the bus stop every day and then home again and you can't see the stop from our house. We live in a quiet neighborhood but I think husband just likes that added security that difficult child could get in touch with us if something happened. The boys take the same bus first thing in the morning but being in different schools, one drops off at one school and then takes a different bus to another school, so, they're not always together. I had a block put on his phone a while back because he was buying subscriptions to different things related to Disney, Nickelodeon, etc. Ah the patterns...

    difficult child's mother is deceased and this is huge. She was a prescription drug addict and suffered from depression and also bipolar disorder. Her mother is also a depressed bipolar and from what I've heard, her father was a violent, mean person. husband has no mental issues that I'm aware of. He's never been on any medications or seen a psychiatrist for anything. The fear that husband has is that he doesn't know for sure how long she was a prescription addict. She was getting medications from her regular doctor for "migraines" but she was also filling out credit card applications in her mother's name and racked up $40,000 in over seas narcotics purchases. All of which were unknown until after she passed away and husband found empty box after empty box buried in the back of their closet. He doesn't know if she was taking things while she was pregnant. She didn't have a job, so, she was always at home to intercept the mail - no one knew.

    We thought we found an outlet for difficult child at one point because he'd gotten interested in origami and was doing well with it. Then came the knife threats and we had to confiscate his scissors. He was told then that he could only do origami that didn't require him to have to cut the paper. So, what does he do? He makes guns with the paper and aims them at DS. Take the paper guns and then he makes throwing stars. Come on!! Do you know how many times I've wanted to take everything but the mattress out of his room? And that's being lenient..
  12. Transparent

    Transparent New Member

    On the haldol, I haven't noticed any SE's, but I haven't noticed it helping either. He was on something else when I first joined this forum, an antidepressant that completely hollowed him out. I hated that drug and can't remember the name of it now.

    I need to add that for years he referred to our daughter as "the girl that lives in my house".

    He still doesn't call her his sister and he can't stand for her to be anywhere around him. He does everything in his power to avoid contact with her.
  13. MuM_of_OCD_kiddo

    MuM_of_OCD_kiddo New Member

    I think you made a good decision in "rehoming" the ipod - well done!

    I think you need to change your passwords on anything that has a password or code on it though. Starting with your debit/credit/atm cards, your bank accounts, paypal, email, anything! If he is this slick to order stuff with your cards and access online banking info, then you need to override that. If you have not installed a safe in your home, maybe you should or get a deposit box in a bank to keep important financial information and paperwork in.

    I can't remember who suggested out of home placement, but you owe both your other children a safe place to grow up in, and you need the peace and rest to recover from your bouts with cancer. You owe the later to yourself and your other two children. The stress you are living under is no good for your lasting recovery - please take care of yourself first, so you can remain strong for your family! Heartfelt hugs!!!
  14. Transparent

    Transparent New Member

    difficult child went to the psychiatrist last week which is when all of the stealing issues were brought up. husband just pulled his copy of the receipt from the box and lo and behold he's got 2 diagnosis's circled. Bipolar and atypical psychosis. First we've seen the atypical psychosis on there. Hummm. I wish husband would have noticed that last week and asked if doctor could elaborate on it. At least it gives us something else to pass over to the new potential psychiatrist.
  15. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    It is time to start researching bipolar and if nothing else pushing the current psychiatrist to actually medicate it. haldol is a really strange medication to give a child wtih a bipolar diagnosis esp if you are giving no other medications. PUSH HARD for mood stabiilizers. REFUSE to give ANY antidepressants - they make people with bipolar much much worse. Get a copy of the Bipolar Child by Papalous and read it. Take the section about medications to the psychiatrist and insist she follow it. Have a fit at her if needed.

    Your son is NOT SAFE to be in your home. I would start calling the police when he was physically violent and insisting on a transfer to a psychiatric hospital. If he wants to hit you, wrestle a phone from you when you are so sick, then he is a HUGE danger. You need to be SURE that he is NEVER in a room alone with your daughter. I know how hard it is - been there done that with my own difficult child.

    This has to be taken to the next level and that is psychiatric hospital admission when violent. You may even want to talk to the psychiatrist about admitting to get him stabilized on medications so that he is not a danger to you or anyone else. Given your fragility, it would be very easy for him to do serious harm to you.

    The psychiatric hospital won't always admit him when you have him taken there. You have to keep pushing it so that you have a paper trail to use to justify getting the courts and social services involved.

    Be VERY aware that if he hurts you or daughter or anyone else that you CAN file charges against him - domestic violence, etc... You can also push for therapeutic foster care for him - where he would be placed with someone who maybe could help him or at least he wouldn't be in your home as a danger to the rest of you.

    IF he hurts your daughter, YOU AND husband could be charged with child abuse/neglect for "letting" it happen. So you NEED a written safety plan to keep everyone safe, with procedures for everyday and for when he is in a rage - who does what, when, and where each person is to go. THIS is what will show child protection that you are doing everything you can to keep everyone safe.

    I am so very sorry things are this rough.
  16. Liahona

    Liahona Guest

    I agree that out of home placement would be best while he gets stable on medications. He isn't safe (you know that already.) I wish things were easier for you and your family.
  17. Transparent

    Transparent New Member

    I was going back through my older posts from 2008 and found the other medications that difficult child has had. Celexa and Risperdal. If memory serves, Celexa did nothing and Risperdal was the one that hollowed him out. He was like a zombie. You'd look at him and there'd be absolutely nothing behind his eyes. I hated that medication.

    husband and I have an appointment with a psychologist on the 31st. (earliest we could get in) I suggested the appointment be made for just husband and I to go in and talk to the counselor without difficult child. I have to express my fears and the last thing I want is for difficult child to hear what they are.

    I've convinced husband to get a slide lock for the inside of DS's bedroom door. difficult child can pick the existing lock with ease and enters DS's bedroom at will and often. Most recent time being at 6:00 this morning because difficult child thought DS needed to be out of bed. No knocking, just go on in. This is a major violation of house rules unless there's a fire or you think someone is in danger, we respect each other's privacy. Well, all of us with the exception of difficult child who feels he's entitled to do whatever he wants, whenever he wants. I'd asked difficult child to go downstairs and tell DS to come upstairs, so he heads down. A few minutes later, difficult child comes back and there's no sign of DS, so I asked difficult child if he was sure DS heard him and he said "yeah, he was sitting on the bed like he was about to get up". I asked if he knocked first or was told to come in and he said that he'd just walked in. Unusual really since DS always locks his door but when asked, difficult child said the door was already unlocked. Yes, because difficult child had unlocked it earlier. Of course, he didn't offer up that information, DS came up and told me. Hopefully the slide lock will put an end to this and difficult child won't go into a major meltdown about it.

    Lately it seems difficult child has to do something every day, at least one thing to get under my skin. Mama is not in a good mood today.
  18. Liahona

    Liahona Guest

    I'm praying for you and your family.