Jail shows on tv

[DammitJanet]

I watch some of the real life jail shows on tv like Lockup or Cell block. I have really had an interesting education. Sort of a wake up call if you will. I think all of the public should watch these shows before they vote on referendums and money to build jails, rehab facilities, the mental health system in this country and all that other good hooha.

For instance, today on Cellbock 6 which is about female inmates in this jail system that has actual inmates coming in just arrested, those waiting trials, those already been tried and waiting their sentences and some just have less than a year sentence so they are doing it in county.

Ok, there were these 2 girls who were junkies plain and simple. Get caught over and over again for petty crimes where drugs are at the route of it. Possession, crack, heroin, soliciting, shoplifting...things like that. Well...neither of them really have much family. One of the girls family is mostly in prison, the other one doesnt know much about hers. They look to their dope boys for help. Yeah right. These girls get booked into the jail and within 8 hours or less they are released straight back out onto the streets without any bond being placed on them, just telling them to be at court the next morning at 9am. Everyone knows they wont be there because they have missed every other court date. Of course they dont show so another warrant is issued and the cops go pick them up and the wheel turns again and they are spewed out again in another 8 hours or so. Its a flippen joke! These two girls and so many more like them are addicts. They dont need to be hitting jail every other day, they need to be hitting a full blown rehab facility the first go round where they cant get out and they dont have the option of quitting. Many of these girls are begging for it but there are none available. Instead their best hope is to get a longer prison sentence in a place that has a sub abuse program and NA/AA meetings.

I do think if us parents on here ruled the world we could fix this mess because it certainly is not working well.

I sure dont think the sentences they hand down now make much sense at all. 300 years? For real? That makes no sense at all to me. I think if you commit rape or torture or kill a child that should get you the max sentence of anything. Life without parole. Sorry, dont think you can be rehabilitated. Murder 1. Premeditated. Same thing. Life without parole. Homicide. that is where we need to make allowances. I dont think they need to add everything up to make things up to 300 years. Thats just crazy.

 

[Hound dog]

OMG I actually can say I've watched this! Out of pure boredom, mind you, but I have. I'm sitting there like seriously? I realize both jails and prisons are seriously overcrowded, but booking them and just letting them loose is just well stupid. What's the point? Most don't bother to show up for court appearances because well heck as long as they aren't violent nothing real is going to happen to them anyway. A revolving door for most of them.

I'm also sitting there thinking you're showing who knows how many difficult children just what they can get away with while you're at it. sheesh!

Something needs to be done. What we're currently doing is NOT working by a long shot.

 

[DammitJanet]

amen. then what is this with deciding to ask the person when they would like to serve a three day sentence for something? Huh? Why even impose that at all? Or a week on house arrest? What the heck is that supposed to prove to a person? Slap on the wrist. I think I have done many weeks of house arrest without even knowing it...lol.

Oh we need reform in the worst way.

 

[1905]

Then there was this one woman who had a $300 fine she couldn't get anyone to help her pay, so she had to stay locked up for 6 or 9 extra months. Do you know how much it cost to keep her locked up? I don't remember what she had done.

 

[DammitJanet]

I think she had violated her probation after someone had accused her of having lice and she pushed them.

 

[klmno]

I used to watch these sometimes but since difficult child got recommitted, I can't take them anymore. I watched many of them before that though. The whole system runs like a business, in my humble opinion, - it's all about money and not much to do about common sense or rehabilitating people. The 'efforts' to rehabilitate are pitiful efforts to placate the public. The shame is that if they used common sense and went about this differently, it would cost them less in the long run.

 

[cubsgirl]

I watch these shows all the time - it drives husband nuts when there is a Saturday Lockup marathon. I don't know why I watch them, I'm just fascinated by how the different facilities are run.

 

[buddy]

I do think if us parents on here ruled the world we could fix this mess because it certainly is not working well.

Well, of course. lol

Has anyone seen drug court? That is what they need TONS more of. It is only for non voilent druggies, but still..... really much better for our world than just shoving them in and out of the system.

 

[DDD]

I watch them fairly regularly and it boggles my mind. There are so many problems with the system and evidently very few locales where there is any effort made to help the detainees become likely to have success in the real world. Pot smokers are lumped together with repeat violent offenders. I have actually seen those charged with attempted manslaughter get released before youthful offenders got out. I may be wrong but I think Florida has the largest & of citizens incarcerated. Many are convicted of the lowest level Felony charges (often possession of small quantities of dope for personal use). Sigh. Then...those people have to write Felon on job applications which leads to higher unemployment #'s. Double sigh.

On a more positive note the correctional officers that are shown seem to be quite professional. DDD

 

[DammitJanet]

Thats true DDD. I have seen very good Correctional officers on those shows. Very compassionate people who seem to care deeply about the inmates. I think it was on the Wabash show that there was this displaced southern woman who worked with some of the hardest inmates and she seemed to have a calming effect on them...lol. Also on that Wabash prison show was the one that almost broke my heart with the very young kids who had been convicted as adults and were serving their time in the adult prison. Sigh.

 

[donna723]

"I dont think they need to add everything up to make things up to 300 years. Thats just crazy."

Janet, for the really hardcore criminals, I think they sometimes go overboard on the sentences just as a safety thing, especially if they have multiple charges. If they appeal any of those convictions in the future, there's always an outside chance that they can get some of them overturned on a technicality and they want to make darned sure those people stay locked up and never have a chance to go free.

 

[klmno]

With my son's experience, not all correctional officers are that prof. I'm sure many are but let's face it, if you at work and know you are being filmed for tv, you're not likely to sure you worst side. difficult child's behavior counselor won't return calls, tells me she's going to check into something and call me back and never does. Some break rules as bad as the kids. And some really try.

 

[skeeter]

It's all about money.

There is really one reason to put someone in jail now, and that's to protect the rest of society. There is no rehabilitation anymore, most areas don't have the money for it. There is no punishment, most could care less if they are in jail or not (given a choice of 5 years community control or 6 months jail - most will opt for the 6 months jail even though it will hurt them down the road for things like jobs, loans, etc.). There definitely is no deterrent factor involved. Honestly, if someone is not a danger to society, they really don't need to be in jail.

A few years ago, we were asked by one of the county commissioners to work on an issue that was put up to a vote. Yes, it would have built another jail. But is also had many, many other items such as recidivism programs, juvenile prevention programs, job training and certification programs, mental health programs, etc. It was going to be a half percent sales tax for 7 years, then a quarter percent for 8 years, and it could not be extended.
It became know as the "jail tax" and was voted down. At the same time, we lost 800 beds due to a "temporary" jail that had been run for over 50 years finally being shut down. We also no longer have money to send folks to other county jails. We have had to let go of over 150 deputies, so programs such as house arrest with monitoring is basically a bust - there's no one to monitor and enforce. Plus no way to pay for the bracelets and phone lines required.

25% of our jail population is mentally handicapped and really don't need jail - they need HELP. We have one rehab facility, and you get one time to go there - after that it's jail. We have a handful of halfway houses (the NIMBY's constantly complain about those, too).

Our last coroner was a wonderful speaker, and we attended a talk he gave where he stated he had been keeping stats on all those who had convicted of murder since he took the position. 95% of them had not passed their 4th grade proficiency tests, and read at about that level. Their math was even lower. They basically decided their "path" when they were 10 years old! He really worked hard to get people to understand how education (or a lack of it) leads to hard criminals. He's now president of one of the community colleges in the area.

As you can tell, between this and the jury duty thread, I could go on and on about this. We do our part by being members of Court Watch and Citizens on Patrol and Problem Oriented Policing. We try to not let the thugs take over our neighborhood, at the same time we try to get help for those that need it. But it all comes down to money, and society doesn't see mental health, juvenile crime, rehabilitation or recidivism as being worthy of spending money on. They'd rather build sports stadiums (we pay for THOSE in both sale tax and property taxes). They'd rather complain about what a teacher is paid than make sure all kids have a chance at a quality education. Our values are so totally screwed up it ticks me off.

I'll shut up now.

 

[klmno]

I'm with you skeeter- that's my beef with this state I'm in. It's a political thing to get votes and voters don't 'want their money going to the criminals' and sure don't want txes raised to pay for them. They are just NOW starting to catch a glimpse that it's costing them all a lot more trying to avoid dealing with it. But that's at the state committee level- the local jurisdictions and certainly, the juvie CSU, still thinks they can blame the parents, take their parental rights for all intents and purposes, and just use the parent to sign blank checks. But now they are seeing the families busted up, they are having to pay for the families who did that until they lost everything- home, job, etc, and now are living off taxpayers while the kid went to Department of Juvenile Justice anyway. And it's not always because the kid is a danger to society- it's because 'they doon't know what else to do- they have no options left'. It's knid of a situation where one should learn to do things 'right' (or address the issues adequately) to begin with or else you dig everyone in deeper. But- those people who made those choices got their votes and won their term in office so they don't care.

 

[DDD]

Obviously everyone knows my opinions. It obviously has gotten worse in the past ten years. At one time I was an appointee for a Statewide (divied into districts) volunteer group that had tremendous power to explore and investigate human rights issues. Included in our realm was Department of Juvenile Justice facilities where we had the freedom to show up unannounced in response to a complaint or inquiry. The committee had existed for years as an oversight group. I was appointed by two Governors and it was the most worthwhile volunteer work I ever did. We made a difference as had those before us. Two Governors later the whole committee was edited out of State budgets (we only got reimbursements for travel) and the "job" was turned over to State employees. That was when I began to see the writing on the wall. Fewer and fewer citizens can make an impact and the scope of their impace is being lessened every day. Sigh. DDD

 

[Star*]

I'm kinda liking these juvenille prisons that are army bootcamps where they give the offenders a second chance to actually GET OUT and go into the armed services. IF they show potential - but what bothers me is what about the kids that are ALMOST there---really trying and they pick only THREE ----what a smack in the face again in life. I keep thinking their attitudes must be "WHY TRY AGAIN?" and hope they don't get like that but that's what I hear from SO many young men who had no chances in life....I'm not sure where Im going with this - but wanted to throw it in the conversation for consideration.

 

[DDD]

I'm not familiar with the program, Starbie. on the other hand it kinda fits with my mind gripe...or at least one of my main gripes. Ideally (ain't going to happen) there would be early personalized intervention before kids become difficult child's. From an early age they have to "fit in the box" that is designed for all kids. Alot of kids just can't fit in that box but...they could fit into a different box with positive goals. In my experience the school personnel "know" early on which kids are struggling academically, emotionally or socially and yet..duh...the efforts are to enforce conformity. Once something happens and they get off track the reaction is "oh, x has always had issues" never is it "how can be support x to reach positive goals".

Same is true in Department of Juvenile Justice (and sadly, by then, the majority of kids see themselves as life losers). I am not naive. I know it costs bucks. on the other hand...if individual goals could be encouraged we would have working, tax paying citizens which would cost a heck of alot less than incarceration cycles and welfare expenses.

We have "boot camp" Department of Juvenile Justice but the kids are assigned there. I have never heard one difficult child say "I was given a choice of doing "boot camp" or just being imprisoned." I have never heard one kid say "I love school and want to go to college and Department of Juvenile Justice has an academic fast track that I can utilize instead of the basic education." or "I want to be a mechanic and I can learn at Department of Juvenile Justice." It's all arbitrary and "boxed". How wonderful that some kids have direct access to a military career but how do they reach out to others that need a bit more time to get ready?

The high school near my work has a big sign over the door that says "The Road To Excellence". They have a new building on the property that is designed to accelerate college admission standards. They don't have vocational training, they have three underqualified counselors for hundreds and hundreds of kids. Every day I see more and more drop outs just walking the streets. Our system promotes the brightest, the cutest, the most polite. Most of our kids don't fall into those parameters. Sad. DDD

 

[donna723]

We have a "boot camp" in our Dept. of Correction system but it's not for juveniles. It's for some of the youngest ones in the adult system, the ones just barely old enough to be out of the juvenile system and in to the adult system. The ones who have committed "hard core" crimes like murder or rape are not eligible for the program. These are the drug dealers, the car thieves, the gang bangers, etc. For the ones they do accept, I believe (but I'm not positive) that they are given the choice of participating in the boot camp program for a short period of time or doing a much longer sentence in a regular time-building adult prison. It would typically be something like successfully completing six months in the boot camp program vs. doing five years in a time-building adult institution. It's conducted very much like a military boot camp and it's NOT easy. They are very big on discipline, push-ups and carrying sand bags around as a punishment. For the ones who do respond positively to the program and make the effort, it can be a wonderful opportunity to finish their education and turn their life around, and some do. But you might be surprised at how many just can't handle the rules and discipline and choose to leave the boot camp and do their full sentence in the regular prison! Or they're removed from the program because they do not adequately participate. Mostly the ones with the "attitude" and I'm sure a lot of them come to regret their choice but by then it's too late. Actually, in our system, the boot camp program is considered to be a failed experiment and is scheduled to be phased out.

 

[soapbox]

Actually, in our system, the boot camp program is considered to be a failed experiment and is scheduled to be phased out.

If I were in a position where I could do research and decide what to research...

One of the experiments I'd love to do is take a high-school population, a drop-out population and new-to-prison population... and test them for hidden disabilities and missed dxes... from Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD) to ADHD, from depression to bi-polar etc., from Auditory Processing Disorders (APD) to Developmental Coordination Disorder (DCD) to Learning Disability (LD) to whatever else we can add to the list...

And then... address the issues.

Ok, yes, I know.
There's maybe some % of 1% of a chance of getting the first one.
And zero times whatever number you want % chance of getting the second one!

And those numbers would be as true for high school as they are for prison.

 

[DammitJanet]

I thought tonights show was interesting on Miami Dade jail. 6th largest jail in the country. They have to treat so many of the mentally ill people because that is really where long term mental illness gets housed. Some of the guards said that today the housing units are far better than they were back in the early 80s right after the deregulation of asylums. Now they go in and clean up the cells twice a day. They give them medicine. In the womens side, they are teaching them how to do cosmetology. if they pass the certificate will not say they earned it from the jail. That is good. This place also has a boot camp that takes non violent offenders from 17 through 28. It is not easy and it is 6 months long. I believe 4 months of it was physical and 2 months was emotional and mental where they learned how to present themselves as non-thugs and have actual goals and feel better about themselves. To understand that there was more to life than standing on a corner all day selling drugs or joining gangs. This unit also sent out mentors every two weeks to check up on these men to make sure they were doing what they were supposed to be doing. This boot camp had an 88% success rate.