psychiatrist / difficult child / medication

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Kjs, Jan 29, 2010.

  1. Kjs

    Kjs Guest

    It was another awful night last night, and again just before psychiatrist appointment today.

    Yesterday also difficult child had the "electircal shocking" feeling from going off Zoloft, he couldn't handle it, things happened at school, then home.

    Soo, school called Crisis intervention yesterday. Twice in one week. (this was at the second school) If you remember difficult child's last class is at the larger school.

    psychiatrist said she got a call from crisis. This made difficult child very angry. He doesn't want anyone in his business. She said she wants difficult child to start Abilify 5mg's, and he will begin Lamictal again, as well as the intuniv. He is to cut the zoloft in half for two weeks then discontinue completely. Anyway, things were not good. She asked him and me to consider 1/2 day of school and 1/2 day at day treatment. I was not very accepting of this. She asked difficult child to step out. Then she told me if difficult child hurts himself it is on MY SHOULDERS, MY responsibility. I was quite upset at that.

    I went to pay and didn't have any checks, had to go back. When I went back I was talking to psychiatrist about all the medications difficult child takes and if they can go with each other. She wasn't very big on vyvanse. I told her that he only takes it at the end of the quarter. The past two weeks. She said she thinks THAT is what has caused the past two weeks to be awful. Not to take it.

    I didn't think difficult child would care. He says every day that he takes it how it makes him feel withdrawn and tired. But when I told him what she said, he said he wanted to take it.

    I have read the threads on abilify, and read all the side effects. I am afraid of that. Knowing difficult child he will have a bad reaction. He seems to have bad reaction to every medication he has tried, except lamictal. sigh. do we start them both tonight? start lamictal first since we have been on that before. I am just worried and scared. It has been a horrible week.

    difficult child's girlfriend is taking him to the winter formal at her school tomorrow. He usually doesn't want to go anywhere. should we start the medicine tonight, tomorrow...should we wait..I just don't know what to do.
  2. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    kjs, you should do what the psychiatrist says you should do. That's why you take your son to her. In addition, day treatment might help a lot, especially if you're concerned about how the medications might affect your difficult child. Having trained mental health professionals observing him every day as the medication changes are made will give you excellent info on how he's doing.
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2010
  3. Wiped Out

    Wiped Out Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Just seconding what SW said. Definitely follow psychiatrist's directions on the medications. I also agree the day treatment could be helpful. What did difficult child think of it?
  4. Josie

    Josie Active Member

    So has difficult child been weaning off the zoloft when all of this happened?

    We weaned my difficult child off from Lexapro on a much slower schedule and she still had withdrawal effect. She started at 20 mg and we went to 15 mg for at least 2 months. She didn't show any problems until about week 3 after the decrease. Her psychiatrist said if it didn't happen in the first 2 weeks, it was not withdrawal and she needed the medication. I ignored this and kept on because I was convinced she didn't need it. We started her on the girlfriend/CF diet so I thought she wouldn't need it any more. My own mental health had improved by this diet so I was pretty sure difficult child's would, too. Without this change and my personal experience with it, I am sure I would not have felt so confident.

    Her withdrawal problems lasted about a week or two and then she was fine. We waited at least a month before making another change and then we dropped her down another 5 mg. When we got down to 5 mg, we cut her dose in half but still waited at least 2 months before making a change. Sometimes the withdrawal lasted more than 2 weeks and we wanted to enjoy the peace before we decreased her dose again so we waited 3 or 4 months.

    The worst times we ever had with difficult child were when we forgot one dose of Lexapro. One time, she pulled a knife out of the drawer and said she was going to hurt someone. Surprisingly, I don't remember if it was herself or me. Luckily she let me take it from her.

    My point with all this is that even though my difficult child didn't even need her Lexapro any more, she had withdrawal problems that came on later and lasted longer than expected. She has been off from it for at about 3 years, so it is clear she doesn't need it. If you have already been tapering him off the zoloft, I would be very suspicious that that is the cause for his recent behaviour.
  5. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    Hope, with all due respect to your daughter's experience, there is a difference between SSRI activation and SSRI withdrawal effects. My own children have experienced SSRI activation, which means that the SSRI antidepressant is actually causing aggression, rage, irritability, depression, suicidual ideation, etc, and it is necessary to discontinue the SSRI. In my daughter A's case, we needed to discontinue Paxil quickly because she was having psychotic episodes, and she experienced SSRI withdrawal, which left her with flu-like symptoms including headache, nausea, diarrhea and dizziness for two weeks. Once the Paxil left her symstem, she was physically fine, but we still needed to stabilize her mood because the underlying mental illness still needed to be treated.

    In the case of kjs's son, there is no way we as parents reading a message board can possibly judge how her son is being affected by Zoloft. It is truly up to the psychiatrist who has examined him in person to determine how to diagnose and treat him. Kjs's difficult child has had years of serious anxiety and depression, which seems to have worsened recently. I hope kjs will take the advice of this psychiatrist seriously since it appears her difficult child needs treatment.
  6. crazymama30

    crazymama30 Active Member

    K, I agree with smallworld and wipedout. If you do not do what the psychiatrist says, then she cannot help you. The medications are scarey, I agree, but it is obvious that your difficult child needs help. Honey, you could die in a car accident tommorrow, tylenol can cause steven johnson's disorder, side effects that are listed can be contradictory. Many cause constipation and diarrhea, or can cause agitation or depression, sleeplessness or sleepiness. If you live your life by the what if's then you will never really live life.

    Self harming behavior can be the gateway for many many worse things. Your difficult child needs help now. Go for the day treatment---it has far fewer side effects--but he needs medications too. 5mg of abilify is not a large dose--your son needs help badly

    Are you still seeing a counselor? If not, it could be time to go back.

    Hugs, and I hope that you take action so things can get better.
  7. Kjs

    Kjs Guest

    difficult child has extreme anxiety..And the past two weeks he was taking Vyvanse because it was end of the quarter and he had a lot of work to get in, plus he was being weaned off of Zoloft. psychiatrist said to cut the dose in half, which he did, I was not aware until yesterday that he cut it in half (from 100mg's to 50mg's) for only 5 days then he quit all together. I was not aware of that. I put it out every morning.
    After the final grades were posted yesterday and he saw that he passed all classes (with a B and C's) he was in a really good mood.

    He was at girlfriend's house last night playing games with her family. When husband picked him up he was so happy. We put the medicine out and told him he needed to take it. I see he did not take the abilify, because that is a sample pack. Don't know if he took the others, as they are in a pill bottle. I hope he did. husband and I talked last night about the medicine and the side effects and agreed that difficult child needs to do what psychiatrist says.
    As for the Day treatment...difficult child said "that is BS" when she mentioned it. Only he said those discusting words. I am very upset about his language recently also.
    There is a lot of change right now. Pressure of finals are over, new teachers for second semester. New medication. psychiatrist said she is convinced Vyvanse caused his outbursts. Only because he only takes it the last two weeks of the quarter.

    will try to get him to take all the medication tonight. He is going to girlfriend's school's "Winter Formal". He has never done that before. Praying it goes well.
    Principal of girlfriend's school use to be principal of difficult child's middle school. She was so wonderful with him then (in his worst times). Also at one point during middle school he was not allowed to go anywhere, not even the bathroom without an escort. The escort also works at girlfriend's school. I am hoping one of them will be at the dance.
    difficult child doesn't like girlfriend's friends (or any kids). Praying he behaves.
  8. ML

    ML Guest

    I think the day treatment could help and I agree you should take what the psychiatrist says to heart. I'm praying for you and difficult child right now, sounds like a difficult stretch. Hugs, ML
  9. confuzzled

    confuzzled Member

    i feel for you. its overwhelming.

    if it helps you, i can only say that my daughter's experience with zoloft and concerta was disasterous, because we hadnt stablized the underlying mood disorder first. for us, an SSRI and a stimulatant was the absolute worst course of treatment.

    everyone is different. everyone's reaction/benefits to medications are different. and its a long hard road to take. surely, until now, the psychiatrist did what seemed to be an appropriate course of treatment for your son...and now there is a fork in the road and you need to try something new. ALL of these medications have "scary side effects"...doesnt mean ALL people who take them experience those side effects.

    i'd put in a call to the psychiatrist explaining about the dance and see if it makes sense to stay put tonight and start new tomorrow. or not. but i'd do what they tell you to.

    abilify had no noticeable effect on my difficult child with the first dose. i was told that it can potentially make you tired so we gave it with dinner to see if did. it didnt in our case.
    but its worth noting, particularly if there is a dance, and a late night planned.

    call the psychiatrist office and get your questions answered. they will be answered with your difficult child's specific needs in mind.

    and tell him i hope he has a great time tonight!!
  10. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    Kjs, you have to be strong. That means using all the information you have been given, weighing up who the information is from and weighting it accordingly. For example, advice form a paid expert speaking in his/her field should always be weighted more highly than our own preferences - that goes for difficult child as well. He can't say, "I don't want to," and go against the psychiatrist, unless he has discussed it with her and has attained her level of qualification. YOU don't have to be the ogre here, the treating doctor has given the orders and you are only the instrument. If difficult child says he doesn't want to follow doctor's orders, then get on the phone, call the psychiatrist and ask psychiatrist to explain it to difficult child in words of one syllable or less.

    difficult child doesn't like people in his business - that is understandable. It is also too bad - he chose to forgo his own right to self-determination and privacy, when he threw a very public tantrum that did physical damage to property and persons. Tell him - if he wants people to stay out of his business, then he has to MIND his business himself properly and not attack other people or things so noisily. He can't have it both ways. "YOu want this to be PRIVATE! Well, son, it sure wasn't private when you were screaming down the car park last week! That cat is well and truly out of the bag - and it's clawing and spitting. YOU want to be the one to put that cat back in the bag? I sure don't."

    Kjs, I think for too long, you've been bullied abd browbeaten by husband's passive-aggressiveness (OK, maybe just aggressiveness) and difficult child's following in Daddy's example, to be confident in taking a stand and sticking to it. ANd now you must. Someone has to. Don't let their harsh words or swearing put you off or deflect you. Even the swearing - forget it. Kids swear. You're letting it distract you from the main issues. I don't like those words either, but we do get them from difficult child 3 at times - he loves to try to shock. He uses those words to try to show us how upset he is. And if I reacted with (*shock, horror*), "What did you say?" it would give him a HUGE payoff. He would think, "Oh good, I successfully communicated my rage to her. Now, what is it that I said, that worked so well to shock her?" and he learns fast. He would do it again next time, but ramped up even more. And the real problem you were dealing with? Forgotten, or downgraded, in the reaction over the language. Boys will be boys. Kids will be kids. YOu can insist all you want tat your child does not use bad language in the home. Some parents of PCs may believe their child never utters those words, ever. They are living in could cuckoo land.
    I used to study Speech & Drama, Trinity College of London. We would arrive at class, speak proper, with clear enunciation of every syllable - then once we were out in the real world again, we talked as our peers did so we wouldn't seem too different. But one day our Speech & Drama teacher said to us, "I don't have to mark you on how you speak in class. I give most of my marks based on the echoed conversation I hear from you all as you leave and head out of the building."
    She was a realist.

    Take yourself out of the firing line, but keep difficult children nose to the grindstone of personal responsibility. He HAS to do what psychiatrist says. So do you. Any problems - get the relevant person on the phone to clarify things. That way it's them saying it and not you.

    Good luck. Stay strong!

  11. susiestar

    susiestar Roll With It

    Doctors do NOT suggest day treatment to everyone. Much of the time they don't recommend it even when it is clearly needed due to financial issues (insurance, parents, etc...). So if your psychiatrist is saying that he needs day treatment then he NEEDS day treatment.

    She is 100% right about it being your responsibility. If difficult child hurts himself then it WILL be on your shoulders. TOTALLY. You KNOW he needs help desperately. FAR more help than having a parent put pills on the counter and hope he takes them. Given all that is going on I am surprised psychiatrist did not recommend inpatient.

    Maybe she KNOWS you will not stand up to difficult child and husband even when it is in difficult child's best interest. Right now school should NOT be the bigger priority. Keeping difficult child safe and giving him the tools to stay safe when he is an adult should be your priority.

    I know difficult child does not want any of this. Who does? What person wants to feel so strange act in ways that upset everyone around him? Who wants to take a bunch of medications, much less need them? At some point the parent must step in and say that they have to take their medications, must go to day treatment, must go inpatient for a while.

    It is NOT failure to change his school. If I remember right he is ahead a grade, so spending a semester going to school half day and day treatment half day is not going to hurt him much academically. It might even HELP. It could get him to see that if he does his work when assigned then the last 2 weeks of school would not be so bad. It might even help him to cope with the hideously stressful and dysfunctional relationship you have with your husband.

    Speaking of using vyvanse just for 2 weeks so he can do all that homework. That is NOT a responsible way to medicate your child. I am quite sure the psychiatrist did NOT know you were going to do that, or didn't realize exactly what was happening. Your son is learning that speed will help him if he has a lot of work to do. It is NOT being used as a tool to help a person cope with life. Normally a stimulant will sync the patient's mind and body, let them work together in a more effective way. Used the way you are letting difficult child use it - this is teaching him that speed helps you do more, faster.

    When PROPERLY used for a child with ADHD, stims actually lower the chance that the child will later use drugs.

    When used the way your difficult child is using it, this is the way addicts use it. Using it this way is TEACHING your son that when he is in a crunch created by procrastination he can use speed to get more done. It just allows him to do more in less time. Sort of what speed does that makes it so addictive.

    What do you think he will do in a few years if he postpones a lot of stuff and has to get it all done? he will find a psychiatrist to rx some stimulant or other, or he will find a person with a prescription for stims and beg/buy/steal some of them. Then he will graduate to finding a dealer or, if he has a child, getting the child diagnosis'd with ADHD so he can take his child's stims.

    YOU are TEACHING him to do this. At the very least you are allowing him to abuse this medication. I hope you can take a step back and look at the entire situation. Maybe it would be better for HIM in the long run if you let day treatment help him iwth whatever it is that causes him to procrastinate to the point that he has to abuse a drug to pass his classes. I would think a semester of all F's would be worth it if he learned to do his work as it is assigned and to not abuse medication.

    You and/or husband need to start handing him his medications and watching him take them. Every dose, every day. Your husband will not comply with this. I am quite sure he will let difficult child handle them himself. It is DANGEROUS. It allows difficult child to tinker with his doses, skipping medications and saving them up to get high sometime (some of them will), even saving some of them up so he can kill himself when he gets to thinking/feeling that suicide is a good choice.

    I know that is not what you want. The ONLY way to prevent that is to make SURE he has no access to the medications and to make SURE he swallows each dose. It is crucial that this happens, for his safety.

    Please take some time and think about all of this. Put your feelings aside as much as you can. Look at the situation as an outsider. What do you see? Is your son healthy in every way? What are you doing that is helping? Hurting? Not helping or hurting? What is husband doing, easy child doing, difficult child doing for each of those questions?

    What do you want to see happening? Now what do you need to do to get to that point?

    It is HARD, but it is important to put your feelings aside, along with difficult child's, husband's, and even easy child's. Look at what the psychiatrist said. Why are you against it? What does psychiatrist see that you don't? Why are you so against this?

    Are you strong enough to really parent your difficult child? I know that you have very little or no in real life support as a parent. Your husband is not helpful and is harmful in many ways. You need to see if you can be strong enough to put husband's and difficult child's objections aside and do what teh psychiatrist suggests. With his bad reactions it would give you many extra eyes that know what to look for as he adjusts to the new medications.

    It won't be easy to drag difficult child to day treatment. Or get someone to do it, have school put him on a bus or in a taxi, or even in your car if you must take him yourself. Have staff at day treatment take him inside.

    Please really consider what I have said. I know it isn't anything you want to hear. There are so many red flags and signs that say your current course of action has many, many problems and ways difficult child could get hurt. You only have a couple of years until he is 18 and you are out of time.

    Sending hugs and prayers for your family.
  12. Kjs

    Kjs Guest

    Susie - wow, some powerful statements.
    First of all I would like to make clear that I PUT his VYVANSE out for him every single day. I PLEAD with him to take it every single day...He refuses. Early in the school year I mentioned on here about maybe putting it in his breakfast or something and boy did I hear an ear ful. It is HIS choice. I try to get him to take it just as the DOCTOR INSTRUCTED. But HE refuses. He doesn't like the way vyvanse makes him feel. It PUTS HIM TO SLEEP. As did Adderall. I take his medications out and I hand them to him every single morning. What do you do when they refuse?? There has NOT been a stimulant that he has reacted positive to. None, and we have tried a lot. So please do not assume I am NOT properly medicating him. I am doing exactly what the doctor tells me. So you telling me everything and anything that ever happens to difficult child will be my fault just prevents me from saying anymore or seeking anymore advice. If you RECALL so much, I hope you RECALL me saying Many, many times that difficult child is TERRIFIED of DRUGS and ALCOHOL. Also that I do have him screened, for peace of mind. When he has any bloodwork done I request drug screening also. He doesn't leave the house, or hang out with kids he use to because they "party". His girlfriend does not. That is who he spends time with. He has a lot of anxiety, Is that MY fault too? So, you are telling me because difficult child refuses to take his medication most of the time that 'I AM TEACHING HIM TO BE AN ADDICT'????? Wow ..I cannot believe the hurtful things you have said. Especially when things are so rough.

    This new information is from a NEW psychiatrist. Saw the doctor TWICE. I AM following the doctors instructions.
    Second - My husband and I have been in counseling for about a year. (February is one year) We ARE trying. He doesn't use a computer, therefore HE doesn't logon here and write posts. WE have dealt with some tremendous issues these past few weeks and they are not all related to difficult child, and they are not something we can control. His brother dying unexpectedly in another country....That is not something we can control, however it IS something that adds to the stress. about a knife in the back. Here I was going to ask about something that happened last night...don't really feel like being shot down any more. especially when I am FOLLOWING ALL of doctors advice. DAY program was what she ASKED both of us to be open to and THINK about. However BOTH of us decided we would like to see if the new medication will help first. He started one new medication 7 days ago and two more new medications ONE day ago. Doctor told us we can see how the medication works....HOW HE FEELS.
  13. timer lady

    timer lady Queen of Hearts

    Kjs, I would highly recommend the day treatment ~ you're difficult child isn't in a state of mind to learn at this point. He's unstable.

    My tweedles have been in day treatment for the most part of their academic lives - it's our reality. That daily support has helped both of them immensely. I'm not saying we're anywhere near "normal" however the daily support given kt & wm is incredible.

    I cannot address the medication situation ~ honestly medication management is a cr@p shoot. Once you hit the right dose of the right medication life opens up for our children. AND there will be a need to relearn much because by this time the behaviors have become habitual. Day treatment is a godsend in this area; medication management & new coping skills.

    Keep an open mind, please.
  14. Kjs

    Kjs Guest

    I really regret saying anything at all. I just want to be sure to set the record straight. I am following psychiatrists instructions. She suggested day treatment and asked us to be open to it. She also stated she wanted difficult child to begin two more medications over the weekend and let her know this week how he felt. It was my understanding that day treatment she suggested was to think about that option. we just started three medications on a one week period. I think we need to see how that works.

    I do not know how all of you pay for these treatments. But we do NOT have the money. Insurance, yes we have insurance. And insurance does NOT pay 100%.

    I DO put out my difficult child's medication at the times psychiatrist instructed. If difficult child refuses, or pretends to take it (Vyvanse) I don't know what I am suppose to do. So if I find a pill in his pocket, or under his pillow, or on the dresser...I know he did not take it. Or he may just straight out refuse. I give him the medication as instructed. If he takes it some of the time and not other times am I making him an addict? So am I suppose to not give it to him at all? What do you do then?

    So, for the record. I follow psychiatrists instructions. difficult child is in counseling as well as seeing psychiatrist. husband and I also go to counseling and we go seperately. So my "hideous" relationship is being worked on the best we can. And I have no more to put out. We are doing the BEST that we can.

    I am sitting here crying at work because of the hurtful things that were said. The times when we struggle the most and need advice...I can't even bring myself to ask what I wanted to ask, and to ask about something that happened last night at the dance, or seek others opinions about the new medication and even a medication the psychiatrist said she had a "plan for difficult child" but this was for the future. Something I never heard about. But, if I ask...I may be Hurting my son. And apparently anything that difficult child does is MY FAULT.

    I'm sorry. I didn't know I was the cause of all his issues. Guess I am on the wrong board.
  15. smallworld

    smallworld Moderator

    kjs, I'm sorry if people on this board have hurt your feelings. And I'm sorry that you're at work crying.

    If you want to ask about any medications, please feel free to PM me. I'll be glad to provide you with any info I know about.

  16. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    Kjs, we do what we can with what we've got. Take what you can use and try to not let the rest upset you. That is one thing that has been greatly concerning me about you - it's not just us here, it's also the things your son and husband say and do, that really seem to drive a knife into your heart. If you believe they love you, believe that we do too. If the things said here were said out of misunderstanding or misinterpretation, then of course they do not apply and should not have the capability to wound you. The fact that you DO get wounded - that tells me you are sailing close to the wind with fragility because things have been just so darn stressful for you.

    We're worried for you, hon.

  17. MyFriendKita

    MyFriendKita Member

    Most of the people posting on this board are fragile, especially when their kids are going through a crisis, and I think most posters genuinely want to help. However, there are a few who seem to enjoy being hurtful and judgmental (and the more fragile the poster, the harder those people seem to pounce).
  18. Marguerite

    Marguerite Active Member

    Yes, on some sites. As a rule, not here. We have darn good moderators. And I guess, too, because so many of us have been hurt badly in our own situations. It DOES hurt a lot at times. The problems can really escalate, when that hurt becomes stifling and crippling, interfering with our capability. Sometimes it is very hard to develop a rhino skin.

    The advantages of rhino skin - you can soldier on more effectively, not get deflected so readily.

    The disadvantages of rhino skin - you can lose your empathy and compassion, which is what we also need in order to really understand what our kids are going through.

    We need balance, and we need to look after ourselves too, in order to be healthy and effective for our families as well as for ourselves.

  19. crazymama30

    crazymama30 Active Member

    K, medications are hard. There was a time my difficult child was hiding his medications. He now takes his medications in the kitchen and either myself or my husband watch him.

    If he does not take his medications? Then maybe there should be consequences. No medications, no cell phone, no computer,no game system, whatever works for him.

    While there may have been some hard words said, I believe they were said out of concern for you and your difficult child. He is crying out for help in so many ways. I am sorry that your husband is not more supportive. There was a time when my husband was that way too, the medications made difficult child act that way, then he needed more medications, he did not act that way around me, it was all my fault. It got to where I completely ignored husband about all that, I took the responsiblity for making sure difficult child got his medications, got to his appts and so on.

    Once my husband got his own mental health issues dealt with his tune changed. If I remember your own husband has struggled with back pain and depression and maybe other things, my memory may be failing. I don't know if your husband has gotten his own issues dealt with, but if he would maybe that would help. It helped my husband and when I started antidepressants it helped me more than I ever thought it would.

    Honey, you have a lot on your plate and the stress is all consuming. Self harming many times precedes suicide. No one, NO ONE wants your difficult child, or anyone to get to that point.
  20. hearts and roses

    hearts and roses Mind Reader

    Ditto, kjs. I'm so sorry that your heart is broken and you're at work crying. Really, big hugs~

    Regarding the day program: I really think you should consider it for so many reasons. First, you will know that difficult child is with profressionals for this portion of his day = they can handle whatever he dishes out. And, especially because he is in the midst of a medication change, won't it be beneficial for you, difficult child and his docs for him to be under supervision for at least part of the day? And also, perhaps you can make his medication schedule coincide with his being at the program so the responsibility of making him take his medications is not squarely on your shoulders and you're assured he will take those medications! And also, the peace of mind for YOU during those hours he is at the can focus on something else for a change, knowing he's SAFE.

    Fifteen is a tricky age. I recall with my own difficult child that 15/16 really and truly was difficult because there are so many obnoxious typical teen behaviors coinciding with the brain disorder related behaviors. It was difficult to discern which behaviors were related to what circumstance and in turn, it created a difficult dilemma for H and me to parent properly at times. I was so busy at times trying to be understanding of her disorders and not wanting to punish her for behaviors she couldn't control, that a lot of stuff went over our heads and situations or events that likely called for a sterner parenting hand were never dealt with on the proper level....because I didn't want to upset the waters or make a matter worse or cause difficult child to lash out or have a meltdown (those could last an entire weekend).

    Then, a counselor told me - and this was crucial for us at that time - that we needed to parent difficult child to do the right thing, to follow certain codes of behavior and rules, to meet certain reasonable expectations, regardless of her disorders. He reminded us that one day we were not going to be around walking on eggshells coordinating life for difficult child; that difficult child would have societal expectations placed upon her and that it was best if she learned how to deal with those situations now rather than later. Well, wow. At the time, I felt as if he had said something that went against everything every other counselor had advised....i.e., constantly making accomodations for difficult child comes to mind first and foremost. So we slowly changed our tactics and then difficult child refused her medications. Eventually, that decision of hers led to such behaviors that she ended up having to temporarily leave our home. We had put into place boundaries that were appropriate for us (well, mostly me because H wasn't really with the program at that point).

    Kjs, in your posts you talk about following Dr's orders, which I believe you are. You also talk about your trying to force him to take his medications and you talk about him 'deciding' not to take his medications, about his choosing not to take his medications, etc. This is concerning because what we found with difficult child is that if she only took her medications sometimes, her behavior became very erratic and difficult to read - she had so many highs and lows they ran into one another - very scary! At this time, she was doing a sort of cutting thing with dull things and engaging in very risky behavior.

    If your son is only taking his medications sometimes and at the same time having his medications tweaked, both of those situations could cause the outbursts you're dealing with. I don't know how to make him take the medications, force him to swallow them. I don't know that you can even do that, especially given his age and all that other typical teen stuff. But, I do know that ultimately, it is his behavior that will force YOU to make a decision about how YOU want to live and under what circumstances.

    You have a lot on your plate, no question. And I know you've heard this all before many times from many other board friends. Take care of you. If that means putting your son in a partial day program, then do it. Find out about financing and scholarship monies. There are ways to get him into something like that without it coming out of your pocket. You may have to go through a public health agency, but find out. Speak with the director at the program to find out other means of covering the cost. And difficult child won't want to go because he is embarrassed, but so what if it means this program could keep him safe and alive and you sane? Sending many gentle and supportive hugs. This is not easy, I know.