She says she's ready how do I help?

Discussion in 'Substance Abuse' started by Elsi, Nov 19, 2018.

  1. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    I found this on the Southern California Salvation Army website. (It seems like some but not all of their programs are State-certified addiction treatment programs. See below.)

    The Salvation Army's Adult Rehabilitation Centers (ARCs) comprise the largest residential rehabilitation program in the United States five of which are located in Southern California. Locations include Anaheim, Canoga Park, Long Beach, Pasadena, Santa Monica, San Bernardino, San Diego and Perris. ARC’s are free to the public and financed through our Salvation Army Family Thrift Stores.

    Adult Rehabilitation Centers are probably the most widely known of all Salvation Army services. They provide long-term, social model, and residential recovery programs for individuals seeking to deal with substance abuse and other addictions. They seek to help participants regain self-worth, learn how to build an orderly and disciplined life and become contributing members of society. Each program participant is provided with a clean and healthy living environment, nutritious food, group and individual counseling, spiritual direction, work therapy assignments and recreational activities.

    Other Addiction Treatment Services
    In addition to the Adult Rehabilitation Centers, The Salvation Army runs three state-certified addiction treatment programs. The Haven, Hope Harbor, and Bell Shelter all provide assessments, medical and psychological assistance, transitional housing, group and individual counseling, educational services, employment assistance and recreation and leisure time activities.

    Programs That Fight Addiction (somehow this part didn't get copied.)
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2018
  2. Tired out

    Tired out Active Member

    I am hoping and praying you hear from her and she still wants to get help.
  3. Smithmom

    Smithmom Active Member

    Like I said Copa, I don't know what's available in your area. They say they have 3 certified addiction centers, that's great. It's all a question of what services are provided and whether those meets the person's needs. My point I guess is that rehab is a broad term. People recovering from a stroke go to a rehab center. Addicts who have been clean for years still do "rehab counseling" in the form of NA meetings. But I think that what yesterday's active addict needs, in today's treatment model anyway, is a locked door facility with 24/7 addiction counselors and hours of individual and group therapy. That doesn't include transitional housing, job training or placement, time for job searching, educational assessments and so forth. Those may be available in the same location. I'm suggesting inpatient and outpatient services are often available nearby. But what I'm suggesting for yesterday's addict is inpatient.
  4. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    I recall the programs I called describing that there was an initial period where the resident could not leave, but I have to say I do not know the particulars beyond this. I know that they did not expect sobriety upon admission, and certainly I am unprepared to say what kinds of facilities would benefit Elsi's daughter or any other person.

    What I do know is that these facilities follow the social model and that is a model that from my reading, is well-thought of. But I can't defend it and won't. Thus far my son is not into hard drugs as far as I know and I hope that remains the case.
    Nobody is talking optimal. I am putting forth one idea about one resource that may or may not fit for any particular person. Elsi had described a situation in her area where there is a dearth of resources. I only provided this idea based upon my own experience which is admittedly very limited.

    I will say that most prisoners become abstinent only with NA and AA meetings and a large dose of chapel and volunteer bible study. There are drugs and alcohol in prison. And some of those prisoners upon release do maintain their sobriety. I believe that if we confine ourselves to accepting only the optimal, which is unavailable and we refuse or reject the good enough, this presents the greater risk. But that is only one person's point of view. My own.

    Many private addiction doctors, as I understand it, supervise detox and withdrawal on an outpatient basis, which may also be an option for Elsi's daughter, if she is motivated. But I cannot say one way or another.
  5. Smithmom

    Smithmom Active Member

    I agree certainly there is no one answer.

    But in my experience the best way to get treatment is to get the sub abuse evaluation. That gets the referral and their job is to find the bed. They know all available programs. My experience anyway.

    My son tells me that in his federal prison there is no option for AA or NA mtgs. They exist but with a long waiting list to get in. Whether this is true or not I wouldn't know. In some ways it makes sense to me Certainly its an easy way to get out of a cell for an hour with no effort required. Same as religious services. My kid told me he went to Muslim services for awhile. To convert? No, something to do, curiosity. I assume also the only service with an open slot. Also, religion and sub abuse mtgs are presumably lifelong interests. With long prison terms there aren't going to be vacancies often. And with budgeting more groups aren't likely.
  6. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    In any prison I worked (8 of them) there was always a list and who was on the list could go. It is not so much that there is no space in the groups but the prisoners need custodial escorts to bring them back and forth and to supervise them in the group area. So there is that. I never heard of, in any California prison, the inability to get to a group (and I was in Psychiatry so I would have heard). It might take a couple weeks, but not much longer. The only restriction is in Reception Center where they are locked down almost all of the time.
  7. Elsi

    Elsi Active Member

    Thank you both for your perspectives and advice. I think right now it makes sense to pursue all avenues and see what is available and what she is willing to do.

    The good news - she just called me. And she called the local SAMHSA helpline number I gave her, which provides referrals for substance abuse assessments in our area. They gave her two place she can call tomorrow for assessment and intake. She said she is somewhere safe tonight and promised she will call them tomorrow. We also talked about Salvation Army as another alternative and talked a bit about what she did and didn’t like about each option.

    So now I wait to see what tomorrow brings. I’m afraid to hope too much. But I think it’s a good sign she actually called the referral hotline on her own. And she gave me an address for where she is staying tonight, which makes me feel better.
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  8. ForeverSpring

    ForeverSpring Well-Known Member

    This is very positive that she followed through.
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  9. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    That's great!
    Wow. That is incredible! That she listened and chewed on each one and actually stayed in the conversation enough to assimilate it. I am so impressed.

    Maybe she will come up with more options on her own. Would that not be fantastic? If she had a smorgasbord of options? Or even one, that she wanted?

    This is amazing. I wonder what is in the water today.

    The vet called and Stella's labs improved for both her thyroid which was not the worry now, but her KIDNEY numbers were better (which does not mean she is better. I get that. But she is NOT worse.) The doctor tried to talk me down from my elation, but her Creatinine fell substantially. The doctor says all it is is the disease is not progressing. And that each lab blood draw draws at a particular instant in time and the numbers are not stable. But we can go 6 months without another blood panel. She has DOUBLED her weight! She loves the dry KD Chicken and refuses all of the wet varieties.

    We have worked so hard to stabilize her health. And she has tried so hard too. To eat. And she is even cooperating better taking her pill, by swallowing it instead of cheeking it. (That's what the prisoners do with their medications.)

    Elsi. I will look if I can find another program.
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2018
  10. Elsi

    Elsi Active Member

    That’s great news on Stella! My Stellaluna lived for several years with this kidney/thyroid balancing act. She was NOT good medicine taker - I once ended up having to get a series of shots for a badly infected thumb she sank a fang into while pilling. They ended up doing something I rubbed in the ears for thyroid and specially compounded liquids for everything else she needed. Pills were not an option!
  11. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    I am taking antibiotics now. She has started to bite us if we stop petting her. Serious bites.

    We did that too. That was a piece of cake. But now she is taking a medication for her heart and her kidneys. We have to stick it down her gullet.

    I have found my hope. I believe she could live out her normal lifespan; I hope that. Whether she can or not, G-d knows. She doubled her weight!!!
  12. Tired out

    Tired out Active Member

    HALLELUJAH! Another step in the direction of recovery.
    More prayers said.
  13. Littleboylost

    Littleboylost On the road unwanted to travel

    Please let us know how you make out. I do hope she gets the help she needs.
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  14. Smithmom

    Smithmom Active Member

    Great news that she took the step of reaching out and also moved out to someplace safe. Both equally good news! Did she say if she used today? Detoxing is hard. The fastest she gets into detox for help with that the better. Prayers for her.

    I call it evaluation, they call it assessment, same thing. First step. If they use assessment and intake in same sentence its probably detox. Great start. Detox can last 3 to 10 days. But they know all the rehab programs and will help her find a rehab bed. Some places do detox and rehab. Two programs in same place. Just different focus. Detox is medical. Watch blood pressure, on alert for seizures, physical pain, medical stuff. Lots of drug and blood tests assessing physical health, vitamin deficiency, STD, etc. Assessing her honesty in effects of drugs on body vs what she says she's been on and what test results say. All assessments to see how ready they think she is to take rehab seriously, how much further medical stuff she will need to do, ... Lot more to it than it seems. No visitors. Unlikely will even let you talk to her. But you can call and ask her caseworker her condition if she signs release. Couple of days before she's ready to move to rehab they'll present her with rehab options. Ask if you can be there for that. Maybe not. They prefer less outside influence on her cause they don't spend time figuring out who you really are and what your perspective is. That's rehab counselor job, not detox nurse job. So be prepared for a wall of silence. Just know that they're caring medical professionals. Sadly, if she does sign herself out they probably won't call you. So you need to call daily.
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  15. Smithmom

    Smithmom Active Member

    One other note.. I'm more than a warrior Mom. I won't let "the system" mess with my kids. These places can be busy. And one of the games is to tell her not today, appointment in 3 days or something. A game to see if she's serious? No playing games with my kids. If my kid agrees to rehab he's on their doorstep when they open the door in the morning. With me pushing him in the door and telling them we'll wait. And I will sit there until they get the message that we're not leaving. This is me, not everyone. Yes, I practice tough love but if I see a glimmer of hope I'm exploiting it. Again, just me. But if it gets my kid to the top of the line, that last available bed, that's fine. I don't give a hoot what they think of me.

    This is really about what is in my control. I can't make my kid go or stay. His life is not in my control. But for that one hour, that one day that I can do something I do with every ounce of strength I have. This is how I cope. I let go and then charge in when I can. Knowing that the moment they say "we'll see you now" to my son my moment is over. I am back to no knowledge or control of his life. I walk out that door and I'm back to detachment.
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2018
  16. Tired out

    Tired out Active Member

    Hoping for an update. Fingers crossed she called today.
  17. ForeverSpring

    ForeverSpring Well-Known Member

    Smithsmom, you remind me of me but I never had to go as far as rehab and jail. I admire your strength, wisdom and unending love for your family so much! One day I pray all your kids realize what a blessing you are. What a good heart you have.

    You are a warrior mom hero.
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  18. Elsi

    Elsi Active Member

    Well, it looks like the answer is no. She did answer my text around 1 when I asked her how things were going and if she had learned anything yet. She sent me a non committal ‘everything’s fine, feeling better, I’m just weighing my options right now.’ I asked if that meant she made some calls and she said no, she wants to wait and figure out Medicaid enrollment first, she’ll get around to it once she has that done. (I’ve been trying to get her to fill out Medicaid enrollment for years.) But since she doesn’t have an address that will probably have to wait.

    I told her the places she was calling don’t require her to have insurance and can probably help her with enrollment. Silence. I asked if she wanted me to help or come down and do it together. Silence. I asked if she’s in a safe place. More silence. I can see in the messaging app she’s read them all so she’s just choosing not to reply. I feel the momentum on this slipping away. She’s changed her mind.

    My guess is she’s back with the coke dealer and doesn’t want to tell me. And clearly I’ve pushed too hard so she’s going to go radio silent on me again.

    This is why I hate Hope sometimes.
  19. Copabanana

    Copabanana Well-Known Member

    You have planted seeds. She sounds very smart. Not wise, but smart.
    Her main motivation might have been to connect with you, and she knows the magic words. She needed you, a dose of you, because she felt vulnerable and afraid. Like my own son, she knows that the most powerful magic word is "treatment." Now she does not, for whatever reason need another fix of you. But she will again.

    I think this is very, very hard. Because I wonder if she ever really contemplated treatment. She needed a fix of you, of mother. That may have been all she needed. It was momentary and transient. I think this will be important for you to remember. Because it is all too easy to feel like we are responsible for the result. And we are not. She may never have wanted treatment, not even for two seconds. What she wanted was you.

    But one day she may not want treatment, but have no other option, and she will do it.

    There were still positives that came from this, I think. I think you will remember for next time. There will be a next time. You have a list. It will be a more mechanical procedure next time, because you have thought it through and you have a toolbox. You will prompt her to her options, and you will know that it has not one thing to do with you and what you do. But you will have thought through what you could do, and what you are willing to do, or not. But you will not put forth the same degree of wanting on your part, because it is to expose yourself to hurt and disappointment.

    I have hope for her. But it sounds like she will not come to this on her own. She will have to be dumped. Or worse, jailed or something else. Her lifestyle seems to be working for her. How very, very painful.

    I am very sorry. But I am not sorry she called you. I am not sorry she has you. I am not sorry you were there for her. I am just sorry it did not work. This time.

    Who knows when next time will come? It could be tomorrow. It could be next week. We really do not know.
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2018
  20. Tired out

    Tired out Active Member

    Big sigh. I am hopeful she will take another positive action.
    Hugs and good wishes for you and her sent your way.