step daughter!!!

[Marguerite]

OK, now I understand why she would have been screaming at him in the driveway.

Next time, let her.

Regarding his daughter - you back right off, say nothing. If he is saying nothing, then you say nothing. Your son is setting you the right example here, do not engage. Stop trying to win her over, stop trying to be a better parent than he is. It will cause you too many problems. Do your utmost to not react. BUT - take quiet notes.

Then next time your husband tries to tell you how to parent your son, tell him that you have stopped telling him how to parent his daughter and he should do the same courtesy for you.

Next time your husband criticises you or your son for not engaging with his daughter, tell him that you will engage with her only after HE steps up and takes personal responsibility for her.

Frankly, this sounds to me like a train wreck in not-so-slow-motion. His ex sounds desperate to get him to step up also; why is she the ex? That is always a valid question to keep in mind, and to form your own conclusions on, not simply repeat what he has told you. Think things through for yourself - what do you remember about how he explained his family to you? What did he tell you about them? And what have you seen in your experiences with them, that match with what he said? What doesn't match?

Now think some more - picture yourself as a fly on the wall at the local watering hole, your husband talking to the bartender about his problems. How would he describe his problems? How would he describe his stepson? How would he describe his ex-wife? How would he describe you?

You need to really get into his head, in order to understand a lot of what is happening around him. Unfortunately, when you married him you married more than just the man, you married his baggage as well. You also are now part of his baggage.

Now try to put yourself in the position of his ex-wife. Think about the dynamics of it. Think about how he handles conflict (or doesn't). Think about how desperate his ex-wife must have been in trying to get him to pay attention to the growing problems and try to get some help.
A thought - can either parent get help for this girl? Or does it require both parents to agree, on medical treatment? If it requires both and he won't come to the party, I'd be feeling very sympatico with Tiger Woods missus about now... it sure would explain a great deal.

The aim of the mental exercises above, is to give you as much advance warning as possible, of what he is likely to do or ay in various situations. He sounds to me very emotionally immature. I'm still not sure tat there's anything wrong with his daughter that good, consistent parenting could not have prevented. But she's sure a mess now.

The whole family sound like they use the passive-aggressive approach to communicate. Really, really bad way to raise kids.

The best way to handle a passive-aggressive is to not let yourself get hooked in to their psychodrama. Don't engage. So when he chipped you about your son, right after totally ignoring problems with his daughter, you said, "Hang on, that's not fair," or whatever and he calls you a baby - that is immature and is using insults to deflect you form the point of the argument. And how do most of us react in that situation? We get upset at the insult. We ALLOW ourselves to be deflected. AND he has won, he succeeded in distracting you, yet again, from his own lack of action.

You need to be pro-active in such comments and not reactive. So let's replay this.
He calls you out on your son, tells you to make him do X or Y. You say, "He's my son, not yours. I am no longer trying to tell you how to raise your daughter; lay off me and my son."
He then comes back with insults or follows you into the next room, clearly (to me) trying to goad you into an emotional backlash. DO NOT REACT ANGRILY. Instead, turn and say, "Deal with your own problems first, then I will consider you qualified to advise me in mine.

You have just given him an instruction. If he fails to obey the instruction, he has forfeited the right to tell you what to do with your son. EVER.

Hold that thought.

And it sounds to me that you also need to hold on to why you married him in the first place, if you are going to make this marriage work. Right now it doesn't sound too good for any of you. But I suspect, from the sounds of the fighting with his ex, that he does not ever deal with his problems, he just lets them accumulate like mud on the car tyres until he's skidding all over the road as a result, collecting a great deal of collateral damage.

Frankly, if you could bring yourself to do it, it would be insightful to arrange to meet his ex-wife for coffee somewhere (neutral ground) and compare notes. Its in BOTH your interests to find a way to get help for this girl, and this way ex-wife can hear from you that YOU are not the problem.

Marg

 

[susiestar]

I can tell you from personal experience that marg's method in this works. My aunt, M, was the ex. Her husband, father of my cousin, was a passive-aggressive, immature idiot, we will call him A. After many times of having visits cancelled or cut very short because of the "new wife" excuse, my aunt called and invited her out for coffee. NOT on either of their turf's. My aunt learned that the new wife, R, thought that she (M) was a vindictive, money-grubbing witch. ALL because A said so. R learned that M thought that she (R) wanted to keep A from paying support or having ANY relationship with my cousin. R learned that in reality M had cut the child support to less than 1/2 of what the court ordered because A said that he couldn't afford it because R spent too much. R also learned that A used her as an excuse to not see his son, and that A has sent a school photo of my cousin back to my cousin - torn up inside the valentine that my cousin sent with a note signed by R to not send anything to A again!! A said R was mad because he didn't get a bigger photo, or that was what he told M. A larger photo had arrived the day BEFORE the valentine came and R had no idea that the photo and valentine had even come. She did NOT send it, though A said she did.

If you can get the ex to sit down with you it will be in the best interests of your step child. I know you don't like her actions, but they may largely be the result of your husband's parenting, or lack thereof. If you can do this it will also be in your son's best interest, because you may learn how to help your husband either get off your back or step up and become a real parent to his own child and a good stepparent to your child.

Lots of hugs,

Susie

ps. This thread is really long. Would it be possible to start a new thread? We usually do not keep threads going this long. Each new occurrence usually is the start of a new thread, or at least we group those of a few days' time into one thread. Not meaning to be picky, it is just hard to keep track in a thread this long. Thanks!

 

[ann1930]

Marg, I considered the fact of speaking to her mom and my husband threw a fit. Told me if I did that him and I were over. Today we are fighting again. He has made plans with his daughter and wants me to watch his younger child..said to me that I enjoy it. I told him that I work full time and have kids that need to be places and he needed to spend time with both kids. That I was going to spend quality time with my kids and that it was his visitation not mine! My counselor disagreed with me and told me that I need to spend time with his child. I do not want to. I can't go anywhere I need to go when I am watching his kid because he has ADD and is very hyper and does not take medication for it. Also his ex does not work and she has more time than I do. I told him he was taking care of his kid. My kids are feeling like they are being left out. I told him that it was time to get a divoce. Nothing is changing and I am tired of it. My kids are not perfect..no one is. But he needs to take action with his daughter. He refuses and told me that it is not his daughter;s fault!

 

[Marguerite]

Marg, I considered the fact of speaking to her mom and my husband threw a fit. Told me if I did that him and I were over.

Extremely interesting. That does fit with what we conjectured - why should he feel threatened by this? And why did you feel you had to talk it over with him? Maybe this is a cultural difference here (I'm an Aussie and I do keep tripping over some big cultural gaps where you wouldn't think there are any) but I wouldn't have thought you would have needed to tell him of such a plan. Not that you would be going behind his back, necessarily (well, you would now, because he has forbidden it - but does he really have the right to tell you who you can and can't talk to?). But then - I also can and do tell husband everything so again, I can see why you keep your partner in the loop.

But in this case, your relationship is already shaky. You know a lot of problem revolve around his inconsistency and his double standards as well as him not actually doing anything to 'fix' his daughter but instead enabling her. All you know about the problems are what he tells you, and frankly based on what you have shared with us, I wouldn't consider him to be a reliable source of knowledge on this score.

But he needs to take action with his daughter. He refuses and told me that it is not his daughter;s fault!

It may not be his daughter's fault, but that doesn't mean action doesn't need to be taken. Interesting again - this has once more snapped back to a blaming game. And sometimes bad things happen and it is not a blame issue. Or if it is, it helps nobody to try to assign blame because while people stand around pointing fingers, more problems happen.

I don't know why your counsellor said you should watch his son - without actually being there, I can't tell you whether you are right or not, although you seem to have such a strong feeling about this yourself, that seems to indicate that your husband is wrong and you aren't going to enjoy it, at least not this time, if you are instead worrying about your neglect of your own kids.

He should not have married you in order to get a replacement parent for his kids; especially not if he's going to undermine you at every turn. If you were a hired nanny, hired to help his children, he would be behaving as a very bad employer to undermine you in front of the children.

The tragedy is with the daughter's behaviour - he says it's not her fault (implying it's yours?) but your presence is definitely a catalyst for her bad behaviour. so if/when you split up, her behaviour will improve and he will feel vindicated in this opinion, at least. And he will crow about it and it will make him even less likely to change.

If you are going to separate, bear that in mind. also bear in mind that I think you need to continue with your counselling (maybe get a second opinion if you feel this counsellor is too conciliatory - I feel you need a strong counsellor to challenge you and make you really think).

Your husband is not getting a clear picture of the problems while he continues to put all his attention into one child only. I agree with you - he needs to be sole parent of BOTH kids for a weekend in order to get a clearer picture of just how difficult she can be. I suspect difficult child is perfect for daddy because he ensures he gives her one-on-one attention, without annoying little brother along.

If you're going to divorce him anyway, then I would go talk to his wife (meet for coffee). If he accuses you of undermining him, ask him how that could be undermining him, when all you're trying to do is get a different perspective on the children he's been trying to force you to value. He should not be the sole conduit for information - frankly, to insist on all knowledge coming through him is worrying; it is very similar to the isolating tactics of an abuser. You are an individual with the rights of an individual; you should be able to come and go as you please, you should be able to see whosoever you choose to (unless it is being unfaithful to the relationship).

For example, husband knows that there have been times that I have met with various male friends of mine. I tell him everything. One of my male friends used to make passes at me and I didn't like it (and told him so). I was wary of telling husband in detail because I wanted to handle the problem myself, and I did. However, husband did know in broad.
At other times I have had dealings with people that husband didn't/doesn't like and he has been concerned for me, worried I'll get "burned". But at no time would husband ever forbid me to see someone, or utter such a threat. He will advise me, he will tell me he doesn't trust a person, he may even want to come along to make sure I am safe (legally as well as morally) but in this sort of situation, I'm sure husband would let me meet up.

I must admit though - this has never come up between us, I am only guessing. We've never been married to anyone else; but he had a serious relationship before me, as I had before him. If either one of us wanted to meet up with the other's ex, I doubt either of us would try to forbid. His ex-girlfriend was actually a friend of mine from school (before I had met him). My ex-boyfriend when I was at school was someone husband also met and got along with, I believe.

The situation with you and your husband seems to me to have turned into him being the parent to all of you, and you being the parent of none but expected to take the responsibility for all. He is Lord and Master, in other words. So what has happened to partnership?

Unless you can sit down and draw up some rules in the presence of an independent mediator (such as your counsellor) - rules such as "each of us to be fully responsible for our own children; each of us to stay out of any discipline issues concerning the other's children; we communicate politely and calmly with one another; we respect one another's autonomy - then this pattern of him dictating from On High will continue.

If this relationship continues to crash and burn, you need to also do your utmost to work out your own part in this. Not the "fault" angle - remember, this is not about blame. But why did you choose this man? What was it about him that drew you to him? Because if you don't work out what it is you were looking for, you could end up in the same situation again. You need to find your own strength and perhaps now more than ever, because he is draining your strength, your independence and your confidence out of you. That I find really concerning.

Maybe his daughter's behaviour is, at some level, making him feel out of control and to try to salvage some control he is asserting his strength on you instead. Because if he can control other people, then it's not him who is "to blame". He really is blame-focussed. But you are allowing this, so it's either because he has imposed this on you (at least partly) or you actively (although perhaps subconsciously) sought this out.

My sister J when she first married, was emotionally still a child. She was the vulnerable one in the family, the one who had always needed a bit more TLC because of her early problems (physically and emotionally). The bloke she married was handsome (had all the girls swooning, he looked and sang like a young Elvis) and physically strong. She found a Protector. It was exactly hat she needed. The problems however, were due to him not really being the Protector he seemed to be; he was, in fact, very weak and needed a wife he could rely on to lead him. So when she really needed a strong shoulder to lean on, Sir Galahad had feet of clay and didn't know how to comfort her or support her emotionally. Result - she learned to become strong in her own right. Over the years, she finally grew up. It took until her kids were in their teens before she realised one day that she had grown up, and her husband had not. she didn't need another teenager and although she was fond of him, she realised she had outgrown him. He was in shock - he hadn't changed, so why had she? But the change had been happening all the time, influenced by his own lack of change.

They split and divorced and for a while it was very unpleasant as he was still in love with her.

They are now good friends, both remarried. I personally have never really liked him (other than baby sister infatuation in my pre-teen years) because to me, he's a mindless football jerk. But apart from his lack of anything between the ears, he's actually a decent person.

My point is - her original reason for getting married was not a mature one, but nobody realised it at the time. His reason for marrying her was also not a deep one - it was typical early adult lust. Underneath it all, neither of them really knew each other. But he never changed, so when he remarried it again was for looks and for having a docile and malleable pretty girl on his arm. J on the other hand has remarried someone who respects her abilities and who is a great support. However, he is also a control freak which is that part of her, the uncertain little girl, still showing through.

All the best with what you decide to do from here.

Marg

 

[ann1930]

It gets better!!!! My step daughter has a dance contest and my husband added my name on the list to work the booth without even asking me and told my kids they were going! I asked what he ex is doing that night and his response was..she works. She will be at home! Well...I work too! I told him to remove my name..I will not work the booth and now he is mad at me

 

[Marguerite]

He has no right to be mad at you. But by reacting to him (as if his being mad at you is anything unusual or a concern - really, why should you take on board his bad behaviour? It should be so commonplace as to be laughable) you are actually giving his tempera tantrum more validity than it deserves.

Rather then get mad back (although you are entitled) it is better to stay calm and point out that if he wants HIS kids to be involved, it is a WONDERFUL idea for them to have a parent to do it for them, and it is really great that he has shown an interest in this; so he should have HIS name down there. I strongly suggest you either put his name down, or calmly tell him to put his own name down as he IS the bio-parent, plus you will be at work that night and SOMEONE has to bring in a wage...

Do your best to not sound sarcastic.

Really - he's been getting away with salami tactics for so long, that he feels he can pull a stunt like this and then get angry when his plans don't pan out.

You really need to have a written contract with him, and I think you are going to need professional help to get it worked out. You both would need to stick to that contract and it would have to cover areas of responsibility, each for your own children.

My concern about this now - frankly, I think he's past caring about your relationship. Either that, or he married you fully expecting you to be a replacement mother for his kids, an unpaid nanny/housekeeper/sex slave. And you're not doing what he wants you to do.

I really feel sorry for his first wife, as well as for you.

Marg

 

[ann1930]

I appreciate that and totally agree with marrying me for those reasons. And his ex has been texting him 6 x a day asking him what time he is picking up their daughter for dance, ect.
Even on weekend we don't have his kids..his ex is still sending texts asking him for favors. I read them and it is insane. We don't get anytime alone, no dinner dates. She calls whenever we have plans. and now..where ever we go..her and her husband shows up!