today difficult child's therapist will get an earful...

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by ksm, Feb 28, 2013.

  1. ksm

    ksm Well-Known Member

    because it is just me going to the appointment. difficult child doesn't even know I have an appointment. I have about a 5 minute audio of one of her rages a couple days ago. I have some notes she has posted on her door telling us that she hates us and we are all jerks. I have a photo that shows how she wants to dress provacatively. She is 14 and is pushing every envelope that she can. Luckily she hasn't been in trouble - but I think we get the credit for that - as we keep a tight rein.

    We are on trimesters (instead of semesters) at our schools, and this week starts the new trimester. She now wants to drop the special choir that she is in (you have to audition to be in it). It is 36 girls, most who are 10 to 12th grade. Only 4 freshman were put in the choir. We were so proud of her when she tried out as an 8th grader - and started out in this choir when 9th grade started. She says none of the girls like her. She also says the kids in the youth group don't like her. I have talked to little sis, and she says she understands why people don't like her - as she is mean and rude and very annoying. The bad thing is, difficult child doesn't have a clue why people don't really like her. Of course, she has a small group of friends (mostly difficult child's in their own right) who she says thinks she is fun to be around.

    THis week at dinner, she just blurts out "can we go shopping for lingerie?" I was a little taken back - what 14yo says lingerie? Turns out, she wants new bras. I have bought 5 new ones since school started. But she only likes one of them. Two were ones she tried on and liked... but turns out they were "push up" type bras and she has nothing to push up. So when she wore them with a tank top, the upper part of the bra was about 1" away from her chest. And it held the tank top away from her chest, so you could look all the way down her top. Little sis told her several times "I can see your nips!" Even when I told her over and over that she should only wear those two bras with tshirts or tops that came up higher. It is winter time and there is no need to be wearing skimpy tops. To me "lingerie" was something you bought when you got married or were old enough to be in a serious relationship.

    I don't know if I can take 3 more years of this. The morning after her major meltdown, I tried to talk to her calmly that her rage was over the top and she needed to talk to her therapist about it. That almost set off the next rage. She told me "I know you are my legal guardian, but you are nothing to me, you are not my mom, you aren't my grandma, you are nothing to me. And I can't wait to leave this house. I hate it here. My friends know how horrible it is here, and Cxxx and her mom said I can go live with them" Ha. C's mom and 4 kids live with C's dad who is pushing 80. C's kids all have caseworkers.

    I hope I get answers today and referrals to people who will take me serious. The therapist only sees a subdued attractive teen who makes decent grades. They don't have a clue. KSM
  2. TeDo

    TeDo CD Hall of Fame

    Wow. Good for you for taking the "evidence" with you. It might be a big eye-opener. I really hope the therapist doesn't just dismiss it or try to justify any of it. That is always one of my fears but then again, I do tend to plan for the worst and hope for the best.

    Do you have a back-up plan? What will you do if you still don't get the help? She really is under the influence of her friends isn't she. Any way you can use "loss of friend time" as a consequence? Seems like she needs to take a break from them. Have you checked with your local social services agency to find out your options? Taking your evidence to them might also open some doors. Of course, it would be even stronger if the therapist backed you up to them.

    Good Luck! I hope things proceed the way you want.
  3. buddy

    buddy New Member

    Good for you! I think it's really important to state your concerns and if you're not taken seriously find someone else.

    She does sound like she has a communication disorder either caused by or causing other issues. The use of lengerie for the category of underclothes could be a language concern or media influencing her vocabulary since that word is used for catalogs that sell undergarments and thats the name of store departments bras, etc. Does she often use words that are close but a little off? Her pragmatic language (social ) is clearly an issue. She doesn't recognize appropriate choice of words, tone, social rules, etc. She doesn't see how it affects others.
    I hope you can get more help in figuring out what is underlying this and it sounds like regardless of the cause, she needs social skills training.

    So, really praying you get the support you/she need. I hope she doesn't quit her activities, I wonder if her advisor for the choir (director/teacher? ) could be clued in and help her? Take her under her wing? Quitting and isolating is a sad sign.

    You're a great mom. Sending you tons of good juju for your meeting today!
  4. ksm

    ksm Well-Known Member

    The last couple of appointments the therapist has talked to difficult child and asked if she would feel more comfortable with a different therapist. difficult child said it isn't her, she does not want to talk to any therapist. Doesn't think she needs a therapist. She doesn't have any problems... we do. We changed to this therapist because the other therapist attended our church. When she was in early grade school she was fine with it - and it was probably a good fit. But as she ages and her behavior increased, she didn't want to admit it to the therapist as her persona at church was like a completely different person.

    Socially, she is what I would call "awkward". She seems to "attach" on to someone and doesn't give them space. Like hugging and hanging on to them. Being overly silly. Little sis says a few months ago, little sis was hanging out with two classmates (male) and difficult child took off her shoes and started chasing the boys. One word fits her... ANNOYING.

    She never takes responsibility for any of her actions. It is always someone elses fault, or it is her period... or before her period... or everyone hates her...

  5. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    Stupid question, probably already asked it more than once, but...
    Any chance she might be Aspie?
    The whole social thing... plus the therapist interactions not really working for her...
  6. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    Very good. I am so glad you have the tape and the writings. That will help. She DOES need help.
    Many hugs.
  7. buddy

    buddy New Member

    That social piece is a big deal and may not be a choice as you know. When was her last comprehensive evaluation? (Overall development, communication, adaptive behavior scales, etc.....)
  8. ksm

    ksm Well-Known Member

    To tell you the truth, I don't think she has had a thorough exam. They (sibling group of 3) started therapy several months after being removed from home and placed in foster care. They were in foster care for a year before we got custody. The therapist did order testing for ADD - and it involved a couple of hours of testing that I believe mostly involved the computer. He had us see an eye specialist regarding a possible "tracking" issue. That specialist tried bifocals... but they didn't help, and she constantly broke or lost them. Her vision is 20/20. We have her eyes checked yearly. She has always been a handful. When she was little it was much easier to control and she just seemed to be more active, but also more stubborn than most kids. She has never made and maintained a group of friends. She is very attractive physically. She is of above average intelligence, but struggled in school with organizational skills and finishing assignments.

    Last year we had an IQ test done by the school psychologist. They felt it didn't fall in any problem range. Just that "in middle school, many kids struggle before getting on course." She can lie with the best of them. When she was younger, if we disciplined her, or lost our temper at her, she would just laugh. But, she can cry at the drop of a hat. She always seems to be in a state of irritation or agitation. You never know what is going to set her off. Not letting her get her way is the biggest way to set off her short fuse.

    She will lose it and tell you how much she hates you, you mean nothing to her, she can't wait to leave home... and the next day, she will sweetly ask "will you drive me and my friend to the mall?" As if nothing had ever happened. Biomom is bipolar, biomom's aunt is bipolar. And another aunt is "off". We have no real contact with her moms side of the family as they live in another state, and biomom is on the run.

    Biodad - we don't have a clue as biomom can't narrow it down or remember... KSM
  9. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    She sounds a lot like my son. I cannot tell you the difference in personality, once that veneer of agitation was removed. There IS a good kid in there. Don't give up the good fight. :)
  10. buddy

    buddy New Member

    Well, maybe that is the next step? an iq test looks at ability. only one piece of the puzzle. when you go into an evaluation only for one thing (the add evaluation) they often stop there. many kids meet criteria but have other things going on orthe adhd is a symptom of another or a bigger issue.

    she's getting pretty old. this may be one of your last chances to dig deeper. She sure has a strong genetic history. Hop I don't ask when I want an evaluation, I usually say I need X.

    I hope you can find some help. It sounds no fun for anyone! you deserve support!
  11. greenrene

    greenrene Member

    Goodness, ksm, she sounds SOOOOO much like my difficult child!!! I'm glad you have the appointment alone, and I'm glad you have evidence to her behaviors.
  12. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    and she came to you at what age again?
  13. ksm

    ksm Well-Known Member

    we always considered her our granddaughter. My son was there when she was borm. She was five when she went in to foster care and 6 when we got custody of her and little sis was 4. We also got custody of her older brother who was 8 and a couple months later he went to live with his biodad about 4 hours away.

    Just got back from therapy appointment - which consisted of mostly "tea and sympathy" but she said for me to try to make an appointment with the neuropsychologist we had one consult with about a year ago. At that time the health insurance would not pay for any testing. We were able to get the girls on our BCBS policy now, so hoping we can go forward with appointment and testing now. Will be calling the neuro in a few minutes.

    I think the therapist was a little surprised with how big of a rage she was in. KSM
  14. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    what were those first five years like?
  15. ksm

    ksm Well-Known Member

    I would say that her first couple of years were pretty good... It seems like her mom cleaned up her act and my son was doing pretty well. Then when she was about a year old, the mom got custody of difficult child's older brother who was about 2.5 years old and had pretty much been in foster care since he was born adducted to crack cocaine. About 6 months later my son and biomom married. Then she got pregnant with the youngest about 6 months after getting married. When youngest was about 4 to 6 months old, my son hurt his back and started having problems... on pain pills... needed back surgery... everything seemed to fall apart by the time difficult child was about 3. I'd say the last year and a half, both parents were having addiction problems. The house was always cluttered and filthy, the kids seemed to be fending for themselves a lot, with the big brother (about age 6 at the time) fixing the little one cereal or PB sandwiches.

    The parents were neglectful due to the pain medications and street drugs, but there was no known abuse. difficult child seemed to be biomoms "golden child" who could do no wrong. But the older brother sometimes got the brunt of the blame when difficult child broke something, or lost her shoes. Little sis was pretty much ignored by mom... with my son doing most of the hands on. He was a pretty good dad to all three, but was overwhelmed, esp after the spinal fusion surgery and was put on oxycontin for pain. But I know that the kids mom was "sharing" his medications. DS was the one who told his doctor that things were bad at home and started the SRS being involved. He wanted to leave and get better, but didn't want to leave the kids with their mom. And he knew he couldn't do much about the two step kids.

    I have often wondered if difficult child might have been abused by someone outside the family... but there is no proof of it, and difficult child has no bad memories of her time with her mom. KSM
  16. InsaneCdn

    InsaneCdn Well-Known Member

    Up to age 3 is when normal attachment develops.
    It does not require horrendous abuse for there to be attachment issues.
    Chaos, neglect... all can add up.
    And attachment issues are a whole spectrum, like lots of other things are.

    She was young enough to be affected ... and yet had enough base stability that it isn't necessarily severe. Insecure attachment can be harder to handle when they become teens, because teens are naturally struggling with the whole dependent/independent change. Not that this explains ALL of her issues... just, might be part of the mix.
  17. SomewhereOutThere

    SomewhereOutThere Well-Known Member

    You should have them also checked for attachment disorder. This takes a special therapist who is familiar with adopted children who lived unstable lives. I'd get that in the works.
  18. buddy

    buddy New Member

    OH I agree, with a history like that. Wow, even if they were not "abused" they likely did not get their needs met as a young child really needs if the parents were using. If they had to fend for themselves, that means parents were pretty checked out so if they were hungry or hurt or whatever, that cycle of child needs parents, parents provide care/food/etc, trust is built...cycle is not consistently completed. That does damage at any age, but especially when personality is developing between zero and three. I'm glad your son saw fit to get help. It's lovely you took them in.

    AS MWM said, the issue is that it takes a specialized person to assess and provide treatment for attachment problems. People who do not really have a lot of training and experience specifically in that area can do more damage than no treatment at all.

    Hang in there! Glad the psychiatric supported a neuropsychologist evaluation.
  19. TerryJ2

    TerryJ2 Well-Known Member

    I'm glad that the therapist was able to listen to the rage. And that your ins is structured, I hope, for the upcoming neuropsychologist exam. Lots of appts, lots of waiting.
    Lots of questions.
    Take care.
  20. ksm

    ksm Well-Known Member

    when I got home from work, I noticed that the neuropsychologist's office had called and left a message. But difficult child is watching tv in that room so I don't want to listen to it you. Even though husband and I had seen her once, and she had us and difficult child complete some forms before the appointment, the office wouldn't make an appointment without speaking to her as to what type of appointment. I guess over one year, we might have to start all over. Crossing my fingers. difficult child is in an OK mood this evening. KSM