Today's incident.

Discussion in 'General Parenting' started by Shari, Sep 24, 2010.

  1. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    After Wee chose not to go to music he joined Sub SpEd at the table wiith 4 other kids where she was teaching. He kept interrupting. I asked him to please be quiet and take his turn. He got on the floor and spun coins around - very distracting to everyone. I asked him over and over to move until he coould be quiet. I finally told him to go to the time out seat to get himself together, he looked at me and said "no". I tried to reach principal and secretary suggested other sped teacher. I left to get her and when I got back to the room, Wee said he and the others were going to play cards. I told him the others could play but he would not be rewarded for bad behavior and took away the cards. He tried to grab them back. When that didn't work, he started to hit me. Mrs XXXXX walked in (no idea who that is) and restrained his arms. He tried to kick her. I was trying to hold his legs, then he tried to spit. I took him to the hall and principal showed up and he walked with her down the hall to her office.

    Today's incident report from the para. I'm so glad we wasted all that time writing and IEP and BIP.
  2. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    Oh yeah, they aren't suspending him (at least not that I know of yet), but they reported him to juvenile authorities for assault.
  3. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    What is going on as far as getting him into a more specialized school? I really think that neither him or you are going to have any peace or education until he gets into one. I'm sorry. ((HUUGS))
  4. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Ok, he's really too young to be sent to detention for something like this in any jurisdiction i've read about (true- that isn't a lot) but Shari, they CAN get the juvenile courts involved and you do NOT want that. At his age, you would end up being the one ordered around, being told how to raise him, people coming to your home a lot, etc. IOW, they will take over how he's raised, the family's lives, the IEP, etc. In some situations that might be a good thing but I'm not so sure in yours. How do you feel about it? Can you get him out of that school?
  5. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    I dont see many options right now besides pulling him out and suing.
    For that exact reason.
  6. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Wasn't there a school in a neighboring county that was more specialized for kids with problems? What happened to pursuing that? I don't think you can win the fight that he can stay in a mainstream school. I do think you have valid legal argument that the sd has not done what they should. But if they can and will send him to a specialized school and you are fighting against that, I think you are going to have a problem, especially with legal authorities now getting involved.
  7. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    I have been trying to get to get him somewhere that can handle him. Either appropriate support at this school or send him somewhere else. I don't care where, except NOT at home. I am NOT fighting that in the least.

    I took the incident report and the IEP to the top of the food chain today, and the superintedent claims they've tried to get him placed at that other school, but that school won't take him. I have no reason not to beleive her, but this is news to me, and I've asked them about it several times before and have never been told that they were pursuing that. EVER.
  8. svengandhi

    svengandhi Well-Known Member

    Ask to see the paperwork from the other school and call there anonymously to see if they have space. I don't put shenanigans past any SD.

    How old is Wee?
  9. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Well, it's up to the sd to find an appropriate place for him. The only other option- which would be better if you can do it- is for you to find one that can help him and you are comfortable with, even (preferably) a private school and given that his home sd can't find one, they will have to foot the bill.
  10. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Do you think there is any chance that an overhaul of your family's approach to him and behavior modification will help him reach milestones? (I'm not saying I do, just that now is the time to resolve that question beyond a shadow of a doubt in your mind.) If so, then getting the jurisdiction's other agencies- what is our local "team" here, might be worth a shot. That is probably where this is leading with the sd calling in juvenile people. Also, rest assured, the sd is getting legal authorities' involvement because it will carry more weight if/when you take them to court. Once the issue becomes "safety of others" or "violation of another's rights" your child's rights take a backseat as far as a judge is concerned.
  11. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    I am tempted to call his old SpEd teacher for info on other options. I don't know of any. It took forever to leran about the school in the next district.

    WEe is 8.
  12. klmno

    klmno Active Member

    Call the person and see if there are any suggestions- also google private schools in your area and look into any that might be able to help him- and I mean call, visit, etc. I could be wrong but I seriously doubt at this point that there can be any happy ending with Wee staying where he is.
  13. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    No, I dodn't either. I think the best I can hope for is them funding and alternate placement.
  14. LittleDudesMom

    LittleDudesMom Well-Known Member Staff Member

    please explain to me what his BIP would have called for in this instance. Going over it point by point I begin with the fact that he didn't want to go to music so he joined the Special Education teacher as she was teaching four other children and became obnoxious (sorry) and disruptive therefore not allowing the other children to learn. I'm not blaming Wee, I'm asking what should his para have done at this point according to his BIP? What is the plan when he does not want to comply with his class schedule?

    Second part of this incident is he was then asked to go to a time out space (which was also in my son's BIP which he actually liked to do because it removed him from a frustrating or anxiety producing situation) at which time he did not comply. What happens with noncompliance to a BIP calming measure?

    Then para (obviously knowing things were escalating) then attempted to contact a person in more authority. She left the room - is that allowed? Obviously the para is going to have to "visit the facilities" or something at some point. Not rewarding him with a card game may sound harsh to you, his mother, but he made three consecutive bad choices - not going to class, disrupting another class, and defying his para. Is his para or teacher not allowed to hold back rewards?

    Then finally third, upon finding out he can't play cards, he gets physical.

    Obviously this is a place everyone is trying to avoid. Once it gets to this point, what does the BIP direct para or teachers to do? I would imagine they "clear the classroom" of other children?

    Just curious as to the specifics in this situation where the BIP was clearly not followed. I think knowing the plan can help us give you some suggestions.

  15. whatamess

    whatamess New Member

    Questions to be answered: why didn't he want to go to music? What are his options if he chooses not to participate? Sit in spec. ed. room? Instead of telling him to stop playing with the coins, could para have taken him for a walk or someone suggested another activity? He probably thought he was doing a fine job of occupying himself with the coins and then he was ready for some nice social, card-playing interaction with peers and now the interventions (negative) start? Your signature says severe adhd, sensory issues, anxiety, hyper, Pervasive Developmental Disorder (PDD)...they gotta have better options for wee than what was presented today.
  16. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    Yes, they are allowed to withhold rewards.

    And music is optional for him. That was not a refusal. And the safe seat is a punishment place. Its a chair at the side of the room that kids are put when they aren't behaving. For a typical, yeah, great. For Wee, who's already losing it? Really dumb idea.

    Beyond that, the IEP/BIP states, bacially, CPS from Ross Greene - express empathy, try to understand the problem from Wee's perspective, and restate the problem as he perceives it back to him; invite him to brainstorm alternative solutions, use emotioonal regulation for him to tell you where he's at on the how the engine runs scale

    If he is not distracting others divert attention, (such as when he hides under ths chairs) allow him space, speak briefly with encouragement to return, but do not dwell. Say it once and walk away (paras have a habit of getting in his face and repeating it over and over and over)

    If he is distracting others, divert attention, offer an alternative sensory activity (walk, swing, heavy lifting)

    In the event of a meltdown, ask him to leave with you, attempt to divert attention, if he will not leave, clear the room of all but the adults supervising, call the office and the parent.

    They are also supposed to use the how the engine runs with him and frequent sensory breaks. I have no data of sensory breaks.

    Its not a good plan, by any means, but its what is written right now, while waiting for the FBA to be done.

    And yes, withholding rewards is fine and I dont think its harsh at all. But as his para, she should have known by now where that was goiing to lead, given where he already was. And I saw none of these interventions mentioned in the report.
  17. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    And music has always been an issue becuase of his memory issues and inability to read. He has not attended music since the incident last week in music (he crawled under a chair in the back of the room because he was embarrassed that he couldn't read the new song and the teacher decided to make an issue of him being under the chair instead of on it.)

    He is not required to go, and usually has an alternate activity in the sped room, but the teacher was gone today.
  18. whatamess

    whatamess New Member

    So, what alternatives or sensory items was he given when he came back to the spec. ed. room? Does he have 1:1? If so, that person should have been actively engaging him in an activity.
  19. Shari

    Shari IsItFridayYet?

    You read what happened, as written by his 1:1
  20. whatamess

    whatamess New Member

    His aggressive behavior in the end could have easily been prevented if strategies had been implemented, but instead it is presented as everyone else being victimized by Wee 'choices'.