Two is just too much at times

[Wiped Out]

I am tired of two difficult children living under one roof (especially one that makes it difficult for and pushes buttons of the other). easy child/difficult child has really been pushing things with difficult child lately. She knows she can get under his skin and is nothing short of mean with him. I'd use a stronger word than mean if I could think of it. She doesn't ever want him to speak to her. Even when he is trying to be nice she is vicious with him.

I know that she is depressed, I know that she has had it, but right now I am really upset for her. She has seen her therapist and sees her psychiatrist monthly (will now also be seeing therapist at least once a month). therapist says she is very depressed-not suicidal but very depressed.

She isolates herself from everyone at home 5-6 days out of 7. Mostly when she is around she is screaming at us about something.

The other night she pushed difficult child's buttons until he said, "Can I stab her or hit her over the head with my bat?" He even went so far as to get a knife (to which husband calmly told him he would then need to call the police. difficult child put the knife back. He then went and got the bat. I calmly told him if he wanted to keep the bat it better be put away immediately. He put it down right away.

I know what he did was wrong but seriously even a super stable person might have snapped with the way she was being to him. Grrrrr!

difficult child is doing well for difficult child (still driving us nuts, still a major difficult child but at least not violent right now). easy child/difficult child continues to push and push. It's like she enjoys getting him angry.

Nothing we do for consequences works for easy child/difficult child. She just doesn't care about anything. It is so frustrating.

This weekend should be interesting because weeks ago husband asked easy child/difficult child if she wanted to go to a college basketball game in Michigan with the whole family. She did and we are all going this weekend. To put it mildly I'm not looking forward to the car drive with the two of them in the car. Thankfully difficult child will sleep most of the way there and some of the way back. Still if he even looks at her, or even if he is bothering us, or says something he thinks is funny she jumps all over him!!

Thanks for listening and letting me vent! I just want to run away to a tropical island!

 

[Blissful_Betty]

I'm so sorry... I completely understand. My two difficult child's are 13M and 16F and defiantly, frustratingly, miserably and maddeningly the same. I don't have much in the way of anything that works at this poitn...we often use the term acid tongue for a descripter of the meanness that 16F can impose on 13M difficult child... I hope your night/day gets better...and know you're not alone.

 

[crazymama30]

I so get this, It seems like everyone is just pushing buttons. When one is off it triggers the others. You have my sympathy. Take your ipod for the trip, maybe even split them up so one of them is in the front seat and they are not sitting next to each other.

 

[rlsnights]

Are you sure you aren't talking about my easy child/difficult child#3 and her twin brother difficult child#2???

 

[LittleDudesMom]

Sharon,

as far as the car ride this weekend, the parent that is not driving - sit in the back with one of them and then one can sit in the front. Or let easy child/difficult child do the driving. It'll keep her occupied!

You know, there has to be a point where her anger, attitude and spiteful words are not excused because of depression. You just don't treat family that way. It's not the way adults relate. If she is so depressed and has not responded to therapy or medications, why are the docs not more concerned? She is not far away from when many kids go out on their own. You know what I think I would do? I wonder if you would be able to record, audio would be easier and cheaper and less "in her face", her outbursts and just the general tone and words? It would be more effective is she didn't know. 't you could do that for a week and then sit down and play it back, I wonder what her reaction would be?

Sharon, I am sorry that easy child/difficult child is making life so much more stressful.

Sharon

 

[timer lady]

Sharon, I so know that feeling & kt & wm do not live under the same roof. The buttons keep being pushed thru "friends".

I agree with LDM about basic decency when it comes to easy child/difficult child. I put my foot down with the tweedles when it came to their antics & terms of endearment toward me. Just not acceptable. I let the both of them know the real world isn't going to care about xyz in their lives ~ they still had to live up to social norms. easy child/difficult child must do the same.

Does loss of privilege help? What is easy child/difficult children currency?

As to torturing her little brother that is just plain wrong. The reality is that she has a seriously mentally ill sibling; no different than if he had cancer or something of that nature. While she may feel "shorted" we all know that isn't the case. easy child/difficult child has more privileges & takes advantage of them at her whim. Either easy child/difficult child is as seriously ill as her brother & shouldn't have those privileges or she should see the situation as it is ~ she's in a better place.

Sharon, sweetie, I know I'm preaching to the choir. Maybe easy child/difficult child needs hospitalization herself. If therapist & psychiatrist are that concerned it may be time to take care of business. Being a verbal bully to her difficult child brother needs to be addressed as well. Have you all tried family therapy with difficult child included. A good therapist will lay down rules & boundaries.

Major ((((hugs)))) this morning.

 

[Fran]

I don't get why you would add fuel to this family dynamic by locking the two of them in the same car and forcing you and husband to ride along. I know you want to have normal family outings but this is torture or maybe self abuse for you and husband.
If things don't improve you may have to consider separating them. Neither of them are functioning from a healthy spot. Daughter held it all together for years but she has been really dysfunctional for the last 2 or 3 yrs. It's unfortunate that there is not a therapeutic person who can be there everyday to arbitrate so that you and husband didn't have to be therapeutic in addition to the job of parenting.
There is no doubt that you have a really difficult situation.
If you and husband decide that your family time in the car has to happen, I would put difficult child in the front seat with husband and you sit with daughter in the back seat.

As a side note, any chance she can get away from everyone for spring break? Maybe visiting an aunt or uncle for a week will give her time away from difficult child and her parents. She is a teen after all.

 

[rlsnights]

Further note on car seating plan -

An adult should sit behind the child in the front seat. You do not want the two of them seated one in front of the other.

Trust me on that one.

We have even/odd system where one gets the front seat on even and the other on odd days of the week. When things are really bad we transport them separately because they will fight in the car even seated in the front/back seat.

We have really clamped down on easy child/difficult child 3 about this stuff and she is really, really angry at us. Until she got a phone this year there was almost nothing we could take away from her that she really wanted. Now we can take her phone away. If she doesn't stop screeching at all of us and refusing to do her chores when she is home she's going to lose computer access too and she has become a FB fanatic.

Unfortunately so far these loss of privileges only seems to be making things worse. But I figure if we hold firm there will be a change at some point really soon.

Patricia

 

[Wiped Out]

BlissfulBetty-It does help to know I'm not alone. A friend at work also has a difficult child and we were talking the other day about sibling fights and another teacher was there and told us she doesn't know how we do it because she goes crazy over regular sibling rivalry.

CM-I sure wish they would stop with the button pressing. We will try lots of distractions.

Sharon-I actually was just given a small voice recorder today (to try for something with difficult child) but I think I will tape easy child/difficult child with it first. husband and I totally agree that her behavior is unacceptable even with-the depression. Our biggest problem is her apathy and passive aggressiveness; nothing we say or do seems to have any sort of impact.

Linda-We are looking for her currency and haven't found it. Most days (after school and on weekends) she just lays around. When we take away tv she reads books or just lays there. She doesn't go anywhere, she doesn't use her cell phone, and she is hardly ever on face book. I agree that she may need hospitalization. The problem is she isn't violent, nor considered a danger to herself.

Fran-Yeah, husband is rethinking. He is thinking about asking easy child if she still wants to go. He is so dreading the ride. I'm torn because I don't want her to feel like we don't want her along. Knowing husband he will word it in a way that won't come off like we don't want her to. He is very good with words (most of the time). If we do all go we will definitely be splitting the two up. I love your idea of having her go somewhere over spring break. The problem is she doesn't want to go anywhere or do almost anything ever. Still maybe we can work out a way that she will go regardless.

Patricia-Yep we know not to sit them one in front of the other. Most of difficult child's hospitalizations have been preceded by car incidents. Right now we hardly have anything to use as leverage with easy child/difficult child. She truly doesn't care. She rarely will ask for anything and just lies around.

Thank you everyone! I don't know what we are going to do yet for sure. I do know I'm tired of all of this and the other day when the two started at it I could literally feel my back tightening up!

easy child/difficult child turns 18 on July 23rd. We have been telling her things have to change or she will need to move out. We don't want to have to do that at all but living like this isn't healthy for anyone.

 

[Jena]

hey

i have the same issues in my home as you know. i have pushed both of them now difficult child and my easy child turned difficult child to get past the nasty words and get to the heart of it. it is working slowly very slowly. it hurts my head i need aspirin later yet its working.

maybe you could try that when their calm? easy child has alot of issues it sounds like towards difficult child. she needs to learn how to express them, she began therapy now and it seems to be unearthing alot for her.

just an idea. or have them both make a list what they love about eachtother or why they love eachtoher. what upsets them about eachother. or write letters to eachother expressing how they feel. have one read to the other and vice versa

either way good luck just some things i'm trying here that seem to be getting improvement and i too wont' be putting my two in a car together anytime soon

 

[timer lady]

Sharon, maybe, just maybe, easy child/difficult child needs to know that because of her "antics" she isn't welcome on the trip. You want her along but her choices make her unwelcome.

I know this isn't the same but wm, because of his choices, "antics", isn't allowed in my home or my car. AND he knows that he is loved & wanted just not welcome.

 

[TerryJ2]

Best of luck making a decision on the trip. So sad that PCgfg at one point actually wanted to go, and now may have "acted" her way out of it.
Fingers crossed!

 

[Wiped Out]

easy child/difficult child ended up staying home. difficult child slept most of the way there and most of the way back. At the hotel he was a major pain but at the game itself he was actually pleasant. As for the rest of the weekend once we were home both kids were in full difficult child mode! (Of course, that would have to be another thread).

 

[Star*]

WO,

I was thinking - I mean everyone has already offered great advice about the car thing, and it sounds like your son is doing better. He's got a sport and is obviously participating and interacting with others outside the home which is great! Congrats on that.

Daughters level of depression is a curiousity though. For her NOT to come out of her room THAT much? Red flag to me. I wonder if it's not maybe either time for a medications tweak or to add a medication? (Not huge on adding more medications, but there are so many out there now that boost AD's performance)

Also - was just thinking......If there was something you could get someone to get HER interested in and let THEM have her for the Summer. Like a big Sister? Do you have a local chapter of YAPS, Mentor, or Big Sisters? Could you ask your therapist for some help with her? I get shes a teen but 5-6 days locked in a room is not healthy even for the darkest teen. I think she needs to get out, get a hobby, and get a friend - an older Mentor. What kinds of things does she like to do - she may even have a talent she could build on that she has NO idea she enjoys doing things from. Dude was going to go dig dinosaur bones in Charleston, until.......they found out he was a difficult child. I think he would have made a great palentologist....no one gave him a chance.

Hugs -